Number26 launching free mobile-first bank account in Ireland (Revolut alternative)

Delta2113

smilgy wrote: »

If they send out a Mastercard credit card, does that mean that when you're renting a car somewhere where a debit card is not enough, this would suffice ?

To what extent is my money accessible if I rent a car or book a hotel in advance?

If a merchant holds a security deposit from you – for example, for a rental car – this amount is not available on your NUMBER26 MasterCard® until either (i) the merchant unlocks the deposit or (ii) seven days have gone by and the money has not been claimed by the merchant in the meantime. Your account balance is adjusted accordingly, which means that during the time in which the deposit is held, your account balance is reduced by that amount and it is not accessible to you.

Delta2113

Alot of stuff is explained very well on number 26 website. People will come across issues from time to time e.g. with some companies and direct debits.

It's not what us Irish,English,Americans would call a Credit Card and personally I think they should make this clearer but when I did some research i found out why they refer to it as a Credit Card.

hognef

Delta2113 wrote: »

This Card operates more like a prepaid debit card!

Why prepaid? Maybe I'm missing something, but how is it different from a standard debit card?

Delta2113

Spot on hognef - Infact it's really a prepaid Credit Card. Number 26 should emphasis prepaid.

Delta2113

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/prepaid-credit-card.asp - more info.

hognef

Delta2113 wrote: »

Spot on hognef - Infact it's really a prepaid Credit Card. Number 26 should emphasis prepaid.

I don't see it - how can it be considered prepaid if it's linked to a bank account?

Quackster

Delta2113 wrote: »

Spot on hognef - Infact it's really a prepaid Credit Card. Number 26 should emphasis prepaid.

So the card is coded as a credit card? This would be a nuisance with websites like Irish Rail and Ryanair that surcharge credit card payments.

hognef

Delta2113 wrote: »

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/prepaid-credit-card.asp - more info.

Side tracking now, but surely the term 'prepaid credit card' is a bit of an oxymoron? The ones I've seen offer no actual credit, as they're indeed prepaid.

Delta2113

You must have the money in your number 26 bank account and it is a bank account - no argument on that. That's why I'm saying prepaid - open to correction.

Yes the coding could hit problems - i hope to have my card in a few days to start testing.

hognef

Delta2113 wrote: »

You must have the money in your number 26 bank account and it is a bank account - no argument on that. That's why I'm saying prepaid - open to correction.

Yes the coding could hit problems - i hope to have my card in a few days to start testing.

Don't want to come across as awkward, but I'm genuinely wondering what, specifically, makes you think this offering is any different from a 'normal' bank account with a 'normal' bank/debit card. Is it the coding of the card as 'credit'? As you have clearly signed up, you probably know more than I do.

I hope you'll revert with details of your experience once you do receive the card and start using it.

Quackster

Delta2113 wrote: »

Yes the coding could hit problems - i hope to have my card in a few days to start testing.

Likewise!

Pablo1802

Number26 says they offer a credit card, but it is a debit card linked to the german account managed by Number26. It is not a prepaid card or credit card. It is not possible to spend more than you have on your account, however there is a plan for overdraft facility in the near future.
I presume Number26 must be able to deal with Irish Credit Bureau first to offer overdrafts in Ireland
Checking the SWIFT details, they are the following info:
DE Wirecard Bank AG WIREDEMMXXX 51230800 85609 Aschheim

It is very straightforward bank product.

Asmooh

The problem is that people want to spend more money than they have on their account.
It's actually kinda normal not to be able to spend more than you have. Otherwise it's called a loan and you should pay fees over that.


The other thing that someone mentioned was welfare money to that account? My employer refuses to pay to an non Irish account -_- is there an on-line Irish account that doesn't cost anything that will automatically forward all incoming money real time at the same time it arrives to another iban?

And how about creditcard / debit card.
Some stores will wine (eg paypal and apple) that the card is German but your address is in Ireland...

Anyway as long as there are no atm fees and contactsless payment fees, and you can transfer to another iban Im happy.

I never deposit money to my account using bills Anyway because I can't. When I finish work everything is closed and when I start work everything is closed. And weekend the bank is closed.

The J Stands for Jay

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Withdraw money from an atm with your credit card and then start asking your bank about fees.

This is what number 26 say about withdrawing money at an ATM:

"Where can I withdraw money without fees?

With your NUMBER26 MasterCard you can withdraw money for free at almost every ATM (cash machine) worldwide that accept MasterCard. Occasionally, the operator of the ATM charges a fee for MasterCard that we cannot influence. However, this fee is explicitly pointed out to you before the transaction and you can cancel the transaction before paying the fee. In that case we recommend that you go to the next ATM. Our experience has shown that merely 1-2% of ATM operators charge this fee. Generally, the next ATM should not be too far away.

Moreover, we do not charge any additional fees for withdrawals abroad in foreign currencies. The daily MasterCard exchange rate is applied and is generally better than if you change money abroad."

Yggr of Asgard

I think the reason (and that is my personal opinion) why it's coded as credit card rather than debit card is straight forward, 0.1% of the amount you spend.

With the new EU regulations in place, the issuing bank can get 0.3% interchange fee on credit cards while debit cards only get 0.2%.

And somehow they need to make money without customer fees for any of their services.

Yggr of Asgard

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

This isn't a bank account in any meaningful sense of the word.

It's a credit card with some add on features.

Can't make deposits.

Can't make withdrawals. (payments via credit card are not withdrawals, yes there is a difference)

No cash services.

No resident customer services.

It's not a bank account.

Check the interest rates and compare it against other credit card sellers.

I wonder how much you actually have read about the offering or are these the talking points of the Banking & Payments Federation Ireland?


It's a credit card with some add on features.
It's a bank account with a master card linked to it.

Can't make deposits.
You get an IBAN number so you can make deposits and in addition you can receive money from anybody just like with any bank account.

Can't make withdrawals. (payments via credit card are not withdrawals, yes there is a difference)
You can make transfers to other SEPA bank accounts online in the app or web. Unfortunately no SWIFT or foreign currency yet.

No cash services.
Yeah, just like KBC for example. It's a issue for some but if you prefer to go to the counter than this account is not for you.

No resident customer services.
And you call that a problem? They offer English support, what does it matter where the support is located. Their FAQ is miles ahead of any Irish Bank's FAQ.

It's not a bank account.
Actually it is, which shows that these must be the talking points of the BPFI.

But I can understand that you are concerned, I mean the millions Irish banks are going to loose for not being able to charging foreign currency charges and loss in interchange fees once Irish people get accounts outside Ireland is going to be felt very hard.

user1842

Asmooh wrote: »

The other thing that someone mentioned was welfare money to that account? My employer refuses to pay to an non Irish account -_- is there an on-line Irish account that doesn't cost anything that will automatically forward all incoming money real time at the same time it arrives to another iban?

Your employer is acting illegally. They cannot refuse payment to a EUR SEPA account. Please report them to the Central Bank of Ireland who are the competent authority of REGULATION (EU) No 260/2012.

Francie Barrett

Do you have to have an app to use this? Can I not just use a website?

Yggr of Asgard

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Do you have to have an app to use this? Can I not just use a website?

You need to use the app to set your Mastercard PIN and the authorization PIN which you require to do for example bank transfers.

Also with the APP the IDNow works better than with a PC/Laptop video camera.

Francie Barrett

So they ask for a passport when signing up, but I don't see any need for proof of address - is this not required? I have to say, I am almost sold on this, avoid fx fees, avoid Irish bank fees - what is not to like?

Yggr of Asgard

Francie Barrett wrote: »

So they ask for a passport when signing up, but I don't see any need for proof of address - is this not required? I have to say, I am almost sold on this, avoid fx fees, avoid Irish bank fees - what is not to like?

They are working according to the Geman Geldwäschegesetz (Money Laundering Law) and according to the latest instructions of the Regulator your passport is good enough.

Fun is however if you would reside in Germany than they would check your address because it's written into the ID Card.

I think the fact that they send you the card to your address is serving as proof of address. If you get it and activate it than obviously your address is existing.

Now I think there are some flaws in there because in Germany it's less easy to fake any data. You must register with the local authority where you live and it's part of your ID Card. You can't get a mobile number (even prepaid) without registering it with your ID Card/Passport. Not like here where your gas bill works or your prepaid mobile does not require ID.

But if the regulator is happy with this process than all is good.

Asmooh

Francie Barrett wrote: »

So they ask for a passport when signing up, but I don't see any need for proof of address - is this not required? I have to say, I am almost sold on this, avoid fx fees, avoid Irish bank fees - what is not to like?

They will sent you the card by post so with a fake address you wont get the card

Francie Barrett

Does NUMBER26 have a banking license?

NUMBER26 works with a partner bank, namely the Wirecard Bank AG. The accounts are opened at this bank, and your money is deposited at the Wirecard Bank AG. Through the German Deposit Protection Fund, your deposits are protected up to several millions euros (for more information, click here). You can see the list of all credit institutions authorised by the German regulatory authority BaFin here (http://www.bafin.de/SharedDocs/Downloads/DE/Liste/Unternehmensdatenbank/dl_li_ki_gesamt.html?nn=2696482). However, for any customer communication, we ask you to contact us directly.

This bit concerns me. How do we know clients deposits are going to be segregated from the company's?

Asmooh

Yggr of Asgard wrote: »

They are working according to the Geman Geldwäschegesetz (Money Laundering Law) and according to the latest instructions of the Regulator your passport is good enough.

Fun is however if you would reside in Germany than they would check your address because it's written into the ID Card.

I think the fact that they send you the card to your address is serving as proof of address. If you get it and activate it than obviously your address is existing.

Now I think there are some flaws in there because in Germany it's less easy to fake any data. You must register with the local authority where you live and it's part of your ID Card. You can't get a mobile number (even prepaid) without registering it with your ID Card/Passport. Not like here where your gas bill works or your prepaid mobile does not require ID.

But if the regulator is happy with this process than all is good.

No, because that would be weird.
My card is from the netherlands, living in Ireland.
Useless to sent it to my old address right? They sent it to the address that you applied with

Yggr of Asgard

Francie Barrett wrote: »

This bit concerns me. How do we know clients deposits are going to be segregated from the company's?

They are fully segregated, your account is with Wirecard Bank and it's a fully separate account from any others customers (you have a full bank account behind it).

In case of a failure of number26 your money is still with Wirecard Bank.

In case of failure of Wirecard you have both the state guarantee (100.000 €) and the way higher guarantee of the German Bankers Association which guarantees funds above 100.000 € with up to 20% of the individuals bank own capital (which is a minimum of 5 Million € so it would be 1 Million € per customer). It might even be higher depending on Wirecards own capital.

Wirecard bank is regulated by the German Regulator BaFin.

Number26 is if you want just the front end of this account, everything is done via Wirecard bank in the back. Which is why you use an IBAN issues by Wirecard Bank and a Mastercard issues by Wirecard Bank.

Yggr of Asgard

Asmooh wrote: »

No, because that would be weird.
My card is from the netherlands, living in Ireland.
Useless to sent it to my old address right? They sent it to the address that you applied with

I don't know what the regulator is thinking, but according to the process deployed doing it this way is valid. No need of sending in or copying a proof of address.

This is Germany, I will not question the wisdom of a German Government Body.

I know when I opened my DKB account I had to provide proof of address but with Number26 it looks like that is not needed.

Francie Barrett

Yggr of Asgard wrote: »

They are fully segregated, your account is with Wirecard Bank and it's a fully separate account from any others customers (you have a full bank account behind it).

In case of a failure of number26 your money is still with Wirecard Bank.

In case of failure of Wirecard you have both the state guarantee (100.000 €) and the way higher guarantee of the German Bankers Association which guarantees funds above 100.000 € with up to 20% of the individuals bank own capital (which is a minimum of 5 Million € so it would be 1 Million € per customer). It might even be higher depending on Wirecards own capital.

Wirecard bank is regulated by the German Regulator BaFin.

Number26 is if you want just the front end of this account, everything is done via Wirecard bank in the back. Which is why you use an IBAN issues by Wirecard Bank and a Mastercard issues by Wirecard Bank.

I have no doubts about Wirecard - they have a full German banking licence and have been operating for years. I am sure all money that reaches their account will be fully audited, accounted for and protected. What does worry me is this Number26 company that operate in-front of it. What happens if they go belly-up, could cards/accounts get frozen, etc? I will be signing up, but I would have reservations about leaving significant cash in the account.

curiosity

Yggr of Asgard wrote: »

I think the fact that they send you the card to your address is serving as proof of address. If you get it and activate it than obviously your address is existing.

Now I think there are some flaws in there because in Germany it's less easy to fake any data.

Nothing to stop you giving any address you could receive post at so? Very useful for anyone who hasn't any "proof of address" as required by Irish Banks.

Yggr of Asgard

Francie Barrett wrote: »

I have no doubts about Wirecard - they have a full German banking licence and have been operating for years. I am sure all money that reaches their account will be fully audited, accounted for and protected. What does worry me is this Number26 company that operate in-front of it. What happens if they go belly-up, could cards/accounts get frozen, etc? I will be signing up, but I would have reservations about leaving significant cash in the account.

I agree with you, it's never a good idea to have all eggs in one basket.

Reading through the T&C when I signed up 99% of all T&C are Wirecard based.

Yggr of Asgard

curiosity wrote: »

Nothing to stop you giving any address you could receive post at so? Very useful for anyone who hasn't any "proof of address" as required by Irish Banks.

If the Irish bank accepts the web bank statement printout as proof of residence.