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Are spirits, creepy encounters, ghosts, seances, ouija boards etc proof of afterlife

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    #92
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Why are there no Dinosaur ghosts if Spirits are real.


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    #93
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,412 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Knasher wrote: »
    Why?


    Dunno . I'm going by Knasher's reasoning


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    #94
    Knasher
    Registered Users Posts: 2,370 ✭✭✭Knasher


    kneemos wrote: »
    Dunno . I'm going by Knasher's reasoning
    My reasoning hasn't lead me to the same conclusion. So I'm very interested in hearing how it lead you there.


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    #95
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,412 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Knasher wrote: »
    My reasoning hasn't lead me to the same conclusion. So I'm very interested in hearing how it lead you there.


    Again?


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    #96
    mattP
    Closed Accounts Posts: 255 ✭✭mattP


    Im kinda shocked at the "No proof so it isn't real" attitude that seems prevalent. Do ye not think thats a little narrow minded? Humans have come a long way in their existence and no doubt everyone before us thought they knew it all


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    #97
    Kev W
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭Kev W


    mattP wrote: »
    Im kinda shocked at the "No proof so it isn't real" attitude that seems prevalent. Do ye not think thats a little narrow minded? Humans have come a long way in their existence and no doubt everyone before us thought they knew it all

    I'm seeing a "no proof so let's not make baseless assumptions" attitude. Can you quote any of the posts you're referring to?


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    #98
    Knasher
    Registered Users Posts: 2,370 ✭✭✭Knasher


    kneemos wrote: »
    Again?

    Sure, why not.


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    #99
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    kneemos wrote: »
    So the inexplicable must be proof of an afterlife.
    That's like saying I have a mathematical equation here. I haven't tried to solve it yet so it must be impossible.
    mattP wrote: »
    Im kinda shocked at the "No proof so it isn't real" attitude that seems prevalent. Do ye not think thats a little narrow minded? Humans have come a long way in their existence and no doubt everyone before us thought they knew it all
    Yeah, those are the people that made up ghosts based on ignorance. Most of them thought sickness was ghosts. It was a logical assumption for them to make and it wasn't to far off the truth. The sick person has basically possessed by another creature. But now we know that sickness is caused by bacteria and viruses. If we keep debunking the supernatural with logical answers, is it not more closed minded to continue to believe in things that are consistently shown to be false?

    If you ask the member of a cannibalistic south American tribe why they eat people, they'll look at you like you've two heads and say they don't eat people, the person is gone and this thing their eating is a demon. Why on earth would we assume these people are trustworthy sources of information? Why do we trust ancient tribal fears over science?


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    #100
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,412 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    Knasher wrote: »
    Sure, why not.

    I'll condense it.
    Kev W says the explanation could be supernatural but so far it hasn't been.
    So obviously if there is something unexplained it must be supernatural.


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    #101
    mattP
    Closed Accounts Posts: 255 ✭✭mattP


    endacl wrote:
    What you have provided, OP, is a list of things that constitute evidence of stupid.

    LionelNashe wrote:
    Leaving aside for the moment that there is no such thing as ghosts, and just pretending for the sake of argument that there is such a thing as ghosts.....

    Savage Tyrant wrote:
    Spirits, seances, ghosts and ouija boards are NOT proof of the afterlife... They do belong in the same category though... Listed under complete nonsense.

    An File wrote:
    Not liars. Story-tellers. Some of them very good story-tellers too.

    ScumLord wrote:
    Yeah, those are the people that made up ghosts based on ignorance. Most of them thought sickness was ghosts. It was a logical assumption for them to make and it wasn't to far off the truth. The sick person has basically possessed by another creature. But now we know that sickness is caused by bacteria and viruses. If we keep debunking the supernatural with logical answers, is it not more closed minded to continue to believe in things that are consistently shown to be false?
    Im sorry, but just how have you proved that there is no such thing as a ghost? Or an after Life?
    I was not referring to thr supernatural, I was referring to the collective knowledge of human kind throughout the ages. If you could go back and tell a caveman about airplanes, Netflix and mobile phones he wouldnt be able to conceive it, not in the slightest. That's my point. We are someone else's cavemen.
    ScumLord wrote:
    If you ask the member of a cannibalistic south American tribe why they eat people, they'll look at you like you've two heads and say they don't eat people, the person is gone and this thing their eating is a demon. Why on earth would we assume these people are trustworthy sources of information? Why do we trust ancient tribal fears over science?
    Here's a fiver, call a cab and get back to the topic *rolls eyes*


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    #102
    mattaiuseire
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 295 ✭✭mattaiuseire


    As someone has said already, look at how many HD cameras, even built in on smart phones everybody carries around with them 24/7, and not one instant of tangible evidence. That's not to say that one day some proper evidence will be recorded.

    Entertainers such as Derren Brown have publicly shown how "psychics" ply their trade and if anyone is interested in seeing someone who has spent many years of his life debunking the paranormal, search for James Randi. He has debunked a plethora of paranormal claims, from spoon-bending to "magnetic men". I think a few years ago he offered $1,000,000 to anybody who could come forward to show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power.

    To date, the percentage of claims of supernatural ability proven by these experiments is 0%, and the percentage of claims of supernatural ability DISPROVEN by these experiments is 100%.

    Maybe one day someone will prove it, but for now, based on the evidence around, it's not going to happen any time soon although it would be amazing if it did.
    That is unless all these David Icke rumours are true and the next few generations are star children who are born with psycho & telekinetic abilities...


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    #103
    Titanucd
    Registered Users Posts: 132 ✭✭Titanucd


    Hmm interesting.

    Ive a couple of submissions on the 'creepy' thread. I'm not a liar and I'm not a story teller.

    I dont know how what I experienced happened, could just be coincidence, but I cant understand the people who just poo poo the idea of ghosts/spirits/afterlife and say that its all made up or attention seeking or madness!

    Just because someone says there are no such thing as ghosts or spirits doesnt make it so.

    I wish someone could credibly debunk the mad stuff that happened to me but without a time machine it would be pretty difficult


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    #104
    mattaiuseire
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 295 ✭✭mattaiuseire


    Titanucd wrote: »
    Hmm interesting.

    Ive a couple of submissions on the 'creepy' thread. I'm not a liar and I'm not a story teller.

    I dont know how what I experienced happened, could just be coincidence, but I cant understand the people who just poo poo the idea that its all made up or attention seeking or madness!

    Just because someone says there are no such thing as ghosts or spirits doesnt make it so.

    I wish someone could credibly debunk the mad stuff that happened to me but without a time machine it would be pretty difficult

    You must also take into account that your experience was just like any other experience to any other person - subjective; highly subjective.

    Somebody that tells you you're mad or there are no such things as ghosts, or you're talking nonsense should not be listened to.


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    #105
    mcmoustache
    Registered Users Posts: 7,236 ✭✭✭mcmoustache


    kneemos wrote: »
    I'll condense it.
    Kev W says the explanation could be supernatural but so far it hasn't been.
    So obviously if there is something unexplained it must be supernatural.

    Ken M?

    Seriously, that's not how logical deduction works.

    If the explanation could be supernatural but hasn't been proven as supernatural, it doesn't mean that it is or isn't supernatural. Only that it hasn't been proven as supernatural.

    You can't just leap to the conclusion that it must be supernatural. For example:

    I claim that my excrement is purple. So far, nobody has proven this. Does that mean that it must be purple?


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    #106
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath




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    #107
    FortySeven
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,296 ✭✭✭FortySeven


    mattaiuseire wrote: »
    You must also take into account that your experience was just like any other experience to any other person - subjective; highly subjective.

    Somebody that tells you you're mad or there are no such things as ghosts, or you're talking nonsense should not be listened to.

    A great debating tactic, hands over ears and la, la, la, I can't hear you, la, la, la.....


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    #108
    Steve012
    Registered Users Posts: 938 ✭✭✭Steve012


    mattP wrote: »
    Im kinda shocked at the "No proof so it isn't real" attitude that seems prevalent. Do ye not think thats a little narrow minded? Humans have come a long way in their existence and no doubt everyone before us thought they knew it all

    I would say proof of another dimension, if anything!

    I've had a couple of experiences so has my partner, I know my own mind, and it wasn't "projected" from my consciousness.
    People will believe whatever they choose more power to them!


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    #109
    kneemos
    Registered Users Posts: 20,412 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    mcmoustache wrote: »
    Ken M?

    Seriously, that's not how logical deduction works.

    If the explanation could be supernatural but hasn't been proven as supernatural, it doesn't mean that it is or isn't supernatural. Only that it hasn't been proven as supernatural.

    You can't just leap to the conclusion that it must be supernatural. For example:

    I claim that my excrement is purple. So far, nobody has proven this. Does that mean that it must be purple?


    So you're saying it could be supernatural.


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    #110
    mcmoustache
    Registered Users Posts: 7,236 ✭✭✭mcmoustache


    Steve012 wrote: »
    I would say proof of another dimension, if anything!

    I've had a couple of experiences so has my partner, I know my own mind, and it wasn't "projected" from my consciousness.
    People will believe whatever they choose more power to them!

    Most of us think we know our minds, and we do to a limited degree, but we don't know it that well. It tricks us all the time and we need to be aware of this.


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    #111
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    kneemos wrote: »
    So you're saying it could be supernatural.

    Sleep paralyses used to be witches or demons, then UFO abduction. It was still just sleep paralyses. For example.


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    #112
    Kev W
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭Kev W


    kneemos wrote: »
    I'll condense it.
    Kev W says the explanation could be supernatural but so far it hasn't been.
    So obviously if there is something unexplained it must be supernatural.

    No.

    If something is unexplained it is unexplained.
    If something is explained as supernatural then it is supernatural.


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    #113
    Steve012
    Registered Users Posts: 938 ✭✭✭Steve012


    mcmoustache wrote: »
    Most of us think we know our minds, and we do to a limited degree, but we don't know it that well. It tricks us all the time and we need to be aware of this.

    I think I was told that as a child, Cheers anyway!


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    #114
    Joe prim
    Registered Users Posts: 919 ✭✭✭Joe prim


    I once put a pair of socks in the washer at home, with my weekly wash (it's an old house, with a tiled roof), and later, when I went to get my clean clothes, ONLY ONE SOCK WAS THERE!!!!!!!! There was no sign of the other sock. I have never heard of anything like this happening to anyone else, and it can only be attributable to supernatural forces beyond this world. (the sock was a navy cotton/polyester blend, size 6-8, just in case it materiaises in your time -space continuum, PM me and I'll collect it), But anyway, yeah, definitely.


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    #115
    mcmoustache
    Registered Users Posts: 7,236 ✭✭✭mcmoustache


    kneemos wrote: »
    So you're saying it could be supernatural.

    Do you think my excrement is purple?


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    #116
    Kev W
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭Kev W


    mcmoustache wrote: »
    Do you think my excrement is purple?

    That depends, have any wizards been at it? More to the point, can you prove they haven't?


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    #117
    Fleawuss
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭Fleawuss


    Titanucd wrote: »
    Hmm interesting.

    Ive a couple of submissions on the 'creepy' thread. I'm not a liar and I'm not a story teller.

    I dont know how what I experienced happened, could just be coincidence, but I cant understand the people who just poo poo the idea of ghosts/spirits/afterlife and say that its all made up or attention seeking or madness!

    Just because someone says there are no such thing as ghosts or spirits doesnt make it so.

    I wish someone could credibly debunk the mad stuff that happened to me but without a time machine it would be pretty difficult

    No one has to credibly debunk what you claim. As you have carefully constructed your conditions for such ( a time machine no less) I suspect that you have no intention of ever allowing your beliefto be debunked.

    I look on your story this way ( you are a story teller):
    Why would an evil spirit intent on murder and capable of interference in the physical world give warning of its intention? Why give you time to intervene? You see that makes no sense. What does make sense is that you want to convince people to believe in you and your story and look there's the proof! Murder and a crying child! All we have to do is..... Believe you.

    Your story serves only one purpose: to convince people to believe you. I don't. Your spirit story is nonsense. If it was true we would have verifiable evidence from many sources: spirits on demand. They aren't because there's nothing there except the finality of the grave.


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    #118
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    mattP wrote: »
    Im sorry, but just how have you proved that there is no such thing as a ghost? Or an after Life?
    No one has claimed they've disproved the supernatural. What I said was that I'm supremely confident based on the information to date that there there is no supernatural and I doubt very much it will ever be proved.
    I was not referring to thr supernatural, I was referring to the collective knowledge of human kind throughout the ages. If you could go back and tell a caveman about airplanes, Netflix and mobile phones he wouldnt be able to conceive it, not in the slightest. That's my point. We are someone else's cavemen.
    You mean like old wives tails? There's a big difference between the modern human and a caveman when it comes to our concept of the world. If an alien turned up on earth today and started achieving the impossible we'd just take it for granted that they had superior technology. We wouldn't be completely dumbfounded like a caveman with no frame of reference. The accumulated knowledge of humanity simply doesn't compare to scientific knowledge. Up until science came along there was a lot of superstition, guess work and accidents that lead to beneficial knowledge. But for everything they got right they got as much wrong.



    Here's a fiver, call a cab and get back to the topic *rolls eyes*
    Religion and superstition was invented by tribal people. They did not have a better understanding of the world than we do today. I just think it's ridiculous to compare their version of knowledge with ours today. Ours is based on actual real world observations with as much human bias removed as possible. Ancient knowledge was based on pure theory, luck and nothing but human bias. Why would you put more weight behind the ramblings of ignorant people? I don't mean ignorant as an insult either, they simply didn't know, we would be just as ignorant today without the work of some pioneering scientists.


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    #119
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,243 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    Titanucd wrote: »

    I dont know how what I experienced happened, could just be coincidence, but I cant understand the people who just poo poo the idea of ghosts/spirits/afterlife and say that its all made up or attention seeking or madness!

    It's invariably too too easy to poo poo woo woo.

    :D


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    #120
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Why are there no Dinosaur ghosts if Spirits are real.

    Yeah! And why are there no caveman ghosts? And why are people always the reincarnation of Elizabeth I, not some random gong farmer?




    Could the unexplained be supernatural? Yes, it could, but it's much more likely that we just haven't worked out the mundane answer yet. As has been said 'Every mystery that has ever been solved has turned out to be not magic.' This doesn't mean that anything still unsolved is magic, just like every set of unidentified animal tracks in the forest isn't proof of bigfoot. Sometimes there isn't enough evidence to know for sure what happened, but that doesn't mean that as reasonable to say 'it's ghosts/aliens from the planet Glob/magic' as it is to just say 'buggered if I know'.


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    #121
    DarkyHughes
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,393 ✭✭✭DarkyHughes


    You want proof? Hows this for proof.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZjM83wZmWw


    That's right hell for everybody in this thread.


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