Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 **MOD NOTE POST 1***

brookville

I see we're playing laois and kildare next week in the walsh cup I wonder will cody be in charge or will it be dj?I'd say cody will be mad to get going again it'll be interesting to see what lads he'll look at it remember last year he used a strong team starting off then the 21s and finished off with a strong enough team.I'd like to see a lot of fringe players used especially for the walsh cup.

minty81

Any clubs back training this week?! NAME AND SHAME!!

dubcat51

Know of clubs in dublin back training before xmas

Noddy33

minty81 wrote: »

Any clubs back training this week?! NAME AND SHAME!!

Numerous clubs back training and have been for over a month and the sad reality is that this is now the norm..... this includes clubs at senior, intermediate and Junior level.

Bonniedog

What is sad about people training rather than guzzling pints or watching TV?

dzer2

Noddy33 wrote: »

Numerous clubs back training and have been for over a month and the sad reality is that this is now the norm..... this includes clubs at senior, intermediate and Junior level.

And minor U17

Noddy33

Bonniedog wrote: »

What is sad about people training rather than guzzling pints or watching TV?

Given that player burnout is a huge hot topic I do think it is beyond the need to go back training 6 weeks after the Championship has just finished. Club players dont also have the luxury of the additional support structures  that are in place and provided at inter county level.
You also talk to any club player that has a family with young kids and 99% of them well tell you that the club season is now becoming so stretched out that it is now affecting family life.


You have to remember that GAA is only AMATEUR sport yet the the training approach is very much of professional suit. Club players are often placed under 'Drinking ban' for months during championship and recent incidents of Ballyhale are prime examples of what can happen when lads are seen enjoying themselves at social gatherings. Im not gonna get into arguments of opinions as regards the punishment dished out to them lads as that has already been discussed.


But just to put this into context.........I was down in Limerick for the Munster v Leinster rugby match and stayed down in Limerick for the night for a few jars! Almost all of the Munster professionally paid players were out drinking that night including the Irish international players and this is with another rugby game less that 6 days away followed by another game again a week later.


I also think this longer club season will result in players retiring early due to injury and lost interest. The hip injury now becoming so common due to players being over worked. I was at a wedding recently and was talking to an ex under age county player who is still in early 30s and in prime physical condition but has not been playing club hurling for a while as he was working out foreign. This player is back living in his local parish now and I asked him if he would go back hurling next year.......his response was 'not a hope' because the season was long enough and doesnt get going until next September but his local team was back training since November. He added that he would love to go back and do some Junior B hurling as a way for socialising and just for some physical exercise but this was dismissed by management who insisted that all hurlers return for pre-season training and come summer time the same Junior B hurlers will be expected to put in the same time and effort as the first team players. 


The point being the club game gone so serious it no longer accommodates people who for what ever reason cannot give the commitment required for the first team but still want to hurl at some kind of level because it a sport they grew up with and love. This for me is against alot of what that the GAA ethos is suppose to be about and as a result players will retire alot earlier and their is only one loser when that happens......the clubs themselves

suirway

If clubs are back it is surely a direct response to the continued messing about of club fixtures by the GAA. In Kilkenny for example if the seniors are not in the league final then the local leagues start on the weekend of March 24th. That is approx 5/6 weeks earlier than previous years so what are clubs expected to do? Go back around mid February with only a months preparation before the crucial first round of games? Oh and after the initial 2 or 3 games in April clubs then have a full 4 months of farcical Byrne cup matches etc before the real action starts in mid August. So if there is any shame or sadness it is accountable directly to the GAA and not clubs who are continually the poor relations.

Noddy33

suirway wrote: »

If clubs are back it is surely a direct response to the continued messing about of club fixtures by the GAA. In Kilkenny for example if the seniors are not in the league final then the local leagues start on the weekend of March 24th. That is approx 5/6 weeks earlier than previous years so what are clubs expected to do? Go back around mid February with only a months preparation before the crucial first round of games? Oh and after the initial 2 or 3 games in April clubs then have a full 4 months of farcical Byrne cup matches etc before the real action starts in mid August. So if there is any shame or sadness it is accountable directly to the GAA and not clubs who are continually the poor relations.

Clubs often going back in November has been the norm for the last 3years as is nothing to do with the sudden change in Inter County calendar. But as you mentioned there a serious problem where club games for the main summer period consist of lets be honest irrelevant O'Byrne Cup games. 
The core of the problem does lie in the structure and thats what it boils down too. You can say yes there is league Champioship games in April etc but the real nit and gritty knockout dont start until September and thats when teams need to be hitting their near peak. Thats why I would have issues with clubs going back in November when the season really wont kick off properly for another 10months.....Dont ask me what the solution is to the problem tho with regards the whole calendar and how can we fit the inter county and club season in to parts of the year where there is no extended break for either party and all games are played when pitches and weather conditions are somewhat reasonable......

babyjesus14

minty81 wrote: »

Any clubs back training this week?! NAME AND SHAME!!

What an idiotic post! I haven't played competitive sport in over 10 years but i still train(either a 5km run or 90 minutes in the gym) 4-5 times a week including this week. So why wouldn't people who play competitive sport be training this week?!

Cornerback1

I think it would be get all the senior clubs' training to game ratio. That would be interesting.


My opinion is we in the GAA train too much. Over the summer best thing would be just to play games every week-end. The maybe a wall ball / touch session once a week. Ask the Slaughtneil lads in Sepember, October,November - a game a week at high level, then recovery during the week for the next week-end.

How fit can lads get really? If they train 20 times compared to 30 times for example: can that be measured in a game situation. I don't think so. Variables are different in a game setting. Where does over training come in and how can that be measured?

The fixtures are the problem. I don't know the answer. Other sports play a game every week-end and you know when exactly when you are playing etc. Plus you have a proper 'off season'.

minty81

babyjesus14 wrote: »

minty81 wrote: »

Any clubs back training this week?! NAME AND SHAME!!

What an idiotic post! I haven't played competitive sport in over 10 years but i still train(either a 5km run or 90 minutes in the gym) 4-5 times a week including this week. So why wouldn't people who play competitive sport be training this week?!

Whats idiotic is teams training in November/December and not aiming to peak for another 9 months.
But clubs who payout €100 a night to managers can expect to get fleeced early in the year by some managers whose motivation is volume of training sessions rather than longer term player benefit

Claregaafan18

Michael Fennelly has announced his inter-county hurling retirement on twitter this evening. Another outstanding servant for the cats and for his club Ballyhale Shamrocks. Best of luck on your retirement Michael from a Clare fan!

babyjesus14

Claregaafan18 wrote: »

Michael Fennelly has announced his inter-county hurling retirement on twitter this evening. Another outstanding servant for the cats. Best of luck on your retirement Michael from a Clare fan!

Absolutely when he was in his prime he was a force of nature! Saw him a few times with the club in the autumn and he just can't cover the ground anymore which is what his game was all about!

Thanks for the memories Mick, another legend retired!

brookville

I think we all expected him to go this year it was going to be a huge ask for him to go another year.He struggled with injuries especially the last 2 years.I'd like to wish him all the best great engine and worker.

JJs Left Hand

Best of luck to Mick Fennelly. Hopefully the body can recover and gives him no problems in the future.

The most complete midfielder in the last 20 years at least

dubcat51

Another great calls it a day.thanks for the memories mick awesome player.

conor05

The abiding memory I have of Mick Fennelly was in the second half of 2015 when Galway’s so called ‘hard man’ Andy Smyth was taunting TJ Reid while he was taking a free. Mick walked over and drove Andy back about 6 feet with 2 or 3 shoves in the chest and Smyth didn’t want to know, got taken off 10 mins later. Mick was a strong hardy tough nail, great athlete and even better hurler.
Easily the best midfielder over the last 10 years.
A huge loss to Kilkenny but his body has given up on him for Inter County Hurling anyway. He reached a lot of those heights at 70% fitness if even.
Enjoy your retirement Mick.

Cornerback1

A excellent hurler who will be badly missed. I thought, by the chat, that he'd give it another year but it's a huge commitment at that level. Another injury could have done him severe damage for his future years. He owes us or hurling nothing at this stage.

I think of the oohs and aahhs that evening in Thurles when he burst through V Waterford and then crumpled in the middle of the field. Then came the silence for all around the ground. It was a about respect for the brilliant hurler.

He really is a modern day warrior. When I think of Cú Chulainn, I think of Mick Fennelly.

Enjoy your inter-county retirement Michael!

platypus

Sad to see Michael Fennelly retire. A true giant of the game, he was the embodiment of Cody's Kilkenny- a skillful hurler, a tremendous athlete tough as nails and a ferocious competitor. He will be missed not just by Kilkenny but all hurling people

kk.man

Sad to see Mick Fennelly go but what's worse I don't think we actually saw the best of him due to his injuries. I honestly believe if he had been injury free he be up there with Henry, Ring et al.
He could play in any position. He played centre back and didn't look out of place and saw him at centre forward and distorted Tipp in a league final in Nowlan Park.
His ability to tune in for games and had very little training done is a testimony of a true great hurler.
Thanks for the memories, Mick.

jeff bingham

That age group that came through himself,rice,power, Tenno. They were all riddled with injuries. Super hurlers all of them. Wonder was it just bad luck or bad training methods. Probably just wear and tear considering the amount of training between club, colleges etc

Village87

What a player for Kilkenny. Literally bullied opposition in his own. Best midfielder Kilkenny ever had. He was back training with Kilkenny. Hearing today that Brian wasn't happy with his development and training over the past 8 weeks to cope with the schedule ahead for next year

danganabu

Someone above mentioned the term 'Complete Midfielder'' and that's exactly what he was; awesome power, impeccable temperament and always seemed to make the right decisions.

The biggest compliment I can afford him as a Tipp man is that down the years, if Fennelly was missing or not 100% because of injury, you knew you had a chance of beating Kilkenny, otherwise you were looking for a miracle.

In Tipp most would feel that Tommy Dunne and Eddie Enright was the best midfield partnership we had in this era, but KK had Fennelly who was essientially the two lads wrapped into one hurler!

conor05

Village87 wrote: »

What a player for Kilkenny. Literally bullied opposition in his own. Best midfielder Kilkenny ever had. He was back training with Kilkenny. Hearing today that Brian wasn't happy with his development and training over the past 8 weeks to cope with the schedule ahead for next year

Yes heard this tonight myself. Cody has set the bar ridiculously high in terms of pre season training and obviously only wants lads that can survive this training. Looking at Mick in the county champo this year you could see his body cannot move like it used. I presume Mick and Cody had a chat before this decision was made. Still and all if push came to shove in a big match comes July or August Mick Fennelly coming on with 20 minutes to go would surely lift the team?? Anyway that’s the way it goes. He has to think of his quality of life with regards mobility for the years ahead too.

babyjesus14

jeff bingham wrote: »

That age group that came through himself,rice,power, Tenno. They were all riddled with injuries. Super hurlers all of them. Wonder was it just bad luck or bad training methods. Probably just wear and tear considering the amount of training between club, colleges etc

Cha, Eoin Larkin, John Dalton and Willie O'Dwyer were all part of the same minor teams and they all had relatively injury free careers and the latter three are still hurling to a decent level with their clubs.

Every individuals case is different, unfortunately injuries are part and parcel of elite level sport and probably more so in a heavy impact sport like hurling.

tbiggertycome

Village87 wrote: »

What a player for Kilkenny. Literally bullied opposition in his own. Best midfielder Kilkenny ever had. He was back training with Kilkenny. Hearing today that Brian wasn't happy with his development and training over the past 8 weeks to cope with the schedule ahead for next year

I hadn't heard this but it wouldn't suprise me if it happened. I'm sure if it happened, Cody called him in and challenged him to be ready to hurl the league on the 28th of January. He probably told him he needed him to partake in collective training (which he hasn't been doing by all accounts for the last few years). When challenged like this Mick probably realised himself that his body, unfortunately wasn't up to the task ahead in the coming year and decided to retire. He is a huge loss but then again we haven't had a fully fit Michael Fennelly for probably 3 or 4 years. Now he has had some great performances in that time but he has been less and less effective as time has gone on. We'd all take a Michael Fennelly at his pomp he would be a massive addition to the team but unfortunately as his club and county performances showed this year he is not getting back to that level.

For me this shows a few things which bode well for the future of the senior team.
1. Cody is gone back to being more ruthless like in 04 & 05. There were probably a few lads who were not up to the level over the last few years who were not being dropped and this, if true, signifies Cody going back to a basic principle, that the lads on the field have to be fit. I also think you'll see lads getting hauled ashore in matches after 15 or 20 mins.
2. I also think it shows a new or renewed focus from Cody that he's not willing to entertain special cases your either all in or your not in. Injury is a different matter but once your recovered you have to be able to do what the TEAM is doing.
3. A renewed building of team spirit and just an actual team. Last year we played like a bunch of individuals and we had lost what made us so special for many years and that was our spirit and team work. Last year we had 15 individuals on the field against teams and it showed. I would take some positives from that though while we were beat by Wexford and Waterford if the roles had of been reversed and we were playing like a team and they were playing like individuals I think we would have won more convincingly.

This is all conjecture and my opinion. I suppose what I'm trying to say is even though we played really bad last year, If we can get back our team spirit and play to a game plan we can improve no end. We also need to give our young players their head which I think this also shows will happen this year. The only thing I'm not sure on is the game plan.

Topcat32

Village87 wrote: »

What a player for Kilkenny. Literally bullied opposition in his own. Best midfielder Kilkenny ever had. He was back training with Kilkenny. Hearing today that Brian wasn't happy with his development and training over the past 8 weeks to cope with the schedule ahead for next year

He also has a relatively new business on the go in partnership with Anthony Cunningham which I understand is starting to do very well and has worked with some big multinational companies in recent months.

Wouldnt be suprised to see him going into management as his work is based around team building, motivation and so on.

dubcat51

For me playing our best players in their best positions is the most impirtant thing.(padraig back out to half back )rchie fully fit and the likes of bolger awylard cleere etc stepping up and pushing on.

Topcat32

dubcat51 wrote: »

For me playing our best players in their best positions is the most impirtant thing.(padraig back out to half back )rchie fully fit and the likes of bolger awylard cleere etc stepping up and pushing on.

That still leaves the big question of who plays full and centre back. Conor Delaney and Jason Cleere would be the ones that id try first. Can't say id be 100% confident that either will be successful there long term.