Where would you go next...

F34

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

And whats the blue exterior called? Is that Portimau?

Yes it’s Portimao Blue

Buddy Bubs

F34 wrote: »

Yes it’s Portimao Blue

Lovely colour. At least I can make up my mind on one thing!

F34

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Lovely colour. At least I can make up my mind on one thing!

It actually looks better on a miserable day when it’s clean lol

Leonard Hofstadter

carsfan2 wrote: »

Here is an example of how the government is dictating our car choices and pushing us out of petrol/diesel.
Specced up two identical m sport 3 series in the dealer yesterday. 330d and 330e.
The 330e pre vat and vrt is actually 200 euro more expensive. After taxes and grants for the 330e it was 11k less expensive than the 330d.
Identical cars others than engine and I guess in the real world the 330e is probably not any cleaner from what I’ve read as how phev are not as green as people think.

Yup, and it's even more stark with the larger cars in the range.

A 545e is cheaper than the 530d.... before the grants are even counted. With the grants it's €8k cheaper.... for a car with a classic BMW straight six petrol and 394 rather than 282 bhp.

Not entirely convinced by plug-ins but with numbers like that I doubt there will be many takers for a 530d. In fact, the 545e is just €8,500 dearer than a standard 520d (which drops to just €5,000 if you compare it with the 520d xDrive) but has over double the power and the straight six. Unsurprisingly the 530e is now the cheapest model in the range after the rebates.

Oddly enough for the 7 series the 745e/Le is only marginally cheaper than the 730d/Ld but obviously there's all that extra power... when you compare it against the nearest equivalent diesel (the 740d/Ld) it's about €22k cheaper to buy!

For the X5 plug-in there's a saving of €22k to be had over the 30d never mind the 40d.... extraordinary. I've long thought the 45e was the version to go for in the X5 anyway (as it's like the least compromised PHEV I can think of, still a big fuel tank and not much of a weight or boot space penalty plus a properly decent electric range) but there's no way anyone could make a case for any of the other models in the range at all now.

Voodoomelon

Yes the straight six is the real sweetener, the 4 pot in the 5 series, let alone the 7 in the e models just didn't cut the mustard, they're a much more attractive proposition now, not to mention supremely better value.

Leonard Hofstadter

The 545e is the 5 series to have in Ireland I reckon, still got a straight six in time honoured BMW tradition... but that power and then there is the stupidly cheap tax. Yeah there's a weight and boot space penalty but the whole thing is so skewed towards cars like this it's hard to make a case for anything else.

To be honest my enthusiasm for it is because of our tax system, I think in terms of the actual best 5 series a rear wheel drive 530d or 540i would be the models to go for, or the M550i of course. The 545e still has the compromised boot space and fuel tank and it's very heavy so I'd say it's no more an 'Ultimate Driving Machine' than I am a professional rugby player - but the tax system makes it fantastic value here.

In general I still think plug-ins are a bit of a pig in a poke except for SUVs because of the compromises in weight, boot space and fuel tank. That said, I'd totally love to drive one, they don't suit my circumstances but I can see how they suit others and I'd just love to see how a 330e in particular compares with a 330i or 330d.

carsfan2

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Yes, very nice. See the 58k price tag on that car, is that inclusive of grants or what way are they advertising them?

Looking at that again price could be inclusive of grants as I went in configurator and the paint etc. Is included. That m sport pro pack is expensive.
I will be interested in what you think of the 330e. I had a long test in one last weekend and impressed. Put it in sport mode with xtraboost selected and use the paddles. Great fun and very quick.
Don’t just pootle around in electric.

chalky_ie

If I understand it correctly, the whole point of the push away from diesel is that it is actually poisonous to the people around you? If that is the case, I don't really see the issue with moving people away from it.

maddness

conor-w wrote: »

If I understand it correctly, the whole point of the push away from diesel is that it is actually poisonous to the people around you? If that is the case, I don't really see the issue with moving people away from it.

Diesel has been linked to onset of new asthma in a couple of clinical studies so yes getting rid of it is a good thing for health reasons.

drunkmonkey

Love this RS3 nearly a perfect spec https://m.carsireland.ie/detail.php?ad_id=2656899&r=s.php%3Fm%3D7%26o%3D2260%26g%3D0

ELM327

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

Yup, and it's even more stark with the larger cars in the range.

A 545e is cheaper than the 530d.... before the grants are even counted. With the grants it's €8k cheaper.... for a car with a classic BMW straight six petrol and 394 rather than 282 bhp.

Not entirely convinced by plug-ins but with numbers like that I doubt there will be many takers for a 530d. In fact, the 545e is just €8,500 dearer than a standard 520d (which drops to just €5,000 if you compare it with the 520d xDrive) but has over double the power and the straight six. Unsurprisingly the 530e is now the cheapest model in the range after the rebates.

Oddly enough for the 7 series the 745e/Le is only marginally cheaper than the 730d/Ld but obviously there's all that extra power... when you compare it against the nearest equivalent diesel (the 740d/Ld) it's about €22k cheaper to buy!

For the X5 plug-in there's a saving of €22k to be had over the 30d never mind the 40d.... extraordinary. I've long thought the 45e was the version to go for in the X5 anyway (as it's like the least compromised PHEV I can think of, still a big fuel tank and not much of a weight or boot space penalty plus a properly decent electric range) but there's no way anyone could make a case for any of the other models in the range at all now.

Are they selling the 545e in Ireland now? Someone here said it was not coming here.

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Yes the straight six is the real sweetener, the 4 pot in the 5 series, let alone the 7 in the e models just didn't cut the mustard, they're a much more attractive proposition now, not to mention supremely better value.

Agree. A 4 pot 7 was never going to work.
I'm really interested in a 45e as a next car now.

Buddy Bubs

carsfan2 wrote: »

Looking at that again price could be inclusive of grants as I went in configurator and the paint etc. Is included. That m sport pro pack is expensive.
I will be interested in what you think of the 330e. I had a long test in one last weekend and impressed. Put it in sport mode with xtraboost selected and use the paddles. Great fun and very quick.
Don’t just pootle around in electric.

Ok, just back home. I really liked it but won't be buying one. Took it for a 35km spin from dealership which is only 2 km from my job to my house. Started off showing 34km when I left dealership. Got to my house 10 kms away and it was still showing 24kms so thats good. Took it away from my house about 5kms up the motorway and back and put it in sport and used xtraboost for a bit. Road noise noticeably increased over my own car.
Headed back towards my house and returned to dealership the long way back. Great power in it and its a nice drive. So overall I covered 30kms between electric and hybrid modes apart from the motorway blast and it was showing 7kms left. But it had gone into some battery power reduction mode but I presume I was using wrong mode for it. But the car easily did a usual days driving for me commuting wise and would still have plenty left for a couple of short trips if I went to a shopping center or supermarket or even just to the local town for a bite to eat.


What I liked

The tech in the car was brilliant. Lovely crisp displays and excellent android auto integration. Car I drove had Harmon Kardon sound system which sounded great. Messed around with some of the gimmicks (revitalisation mode for i am stressed where it played soothing sounds and changed ambient lighting and the other wake-up mode if you tell the car you are tired, it blew cold air on me and played dance music). I do like a gimmick I must say.
Handled very well and plenty of power when pushed on. Looked lovely but I wasn't a fan of the black alloys. It was a grey coloured paint job which is specific to msport pro. Forget the exact name. But it was nice and suited the car very well.

So after a decent list of what I did like, why wouldn't I buy one?

Well I took the route home I normally do from work and there are a good few speed bumps on the way. The suspension was far too firm and the chassis too stiff for me. I know its the trade off for sporty handling. I didn't arrive at the decision immediately after arriving at the dealer, it wasn't a deal breaker on test drive or anything, I arrived at the decision after a couple of minutes in my a6 on way home. Not as sporty as the 330e by a long way but seats offered much better support, are bigger, and are much more comfortable even when stationery and much much more comfortable over speed bumps. And its an S Line on 19s. But it takes them with ease. I could spec the standard suspension rather than msport but still the seats are more comfortable in my own.

So, nothing against the 330e at all, its a smashing car but I've just confirmed to myself that I like big comfortable saloons over sporty ones. Feels closer to a luxobarge than a sporty saloon but i think thats what i like. I also think the 3 series tries to cosset the driver and make it a drivers car whereas my own feels a lot more spacious, even more than the differences in dimensions would suggest as id guess theres not a whole lot between them.

Even though I'm getting bored of my own its probably just because of aged infotainment and tech in it. But it does everything I need. And at coming up to 7 years old now its still sub 100k kms and looks great. Something classy about a black A6 S Line black edition.

What next? Well, I'm still going to upgrade. I'm a badge snob and only 2 brands I'm really interested in are Audi and BMW. So, its either another diesel in which case I reckon it will be an a6 new model over a 520d but I do like the idea of a plug in hybrid. Like it enough to not buy another diesel to be honest. A6 PHEV is brand new and quite frankly too expensive. But I think its the 55 tfsi e on sale at the moment with 367bhp and I believe there is a 50 tfsi e on the way with 299bhp. That will clearly be cheaper. 530e might very well be worth a look on the used market, maybe an 18 model after new year will be a whole lot cheaper. I'll wait and see.

Oh, I'm getting quotes sent to me later too.
Standard msport (not pro) with only options ticked cognac leather (at no cost), msport suspension deleted, Portimao blue for 800 euro and harmon kardon sound system for 900 euro.

Also quote on same car in sport pro spec with 18 inch wheels but a different shade of blue as Portimao not available but everything else the same. This will be the cheaper option.

I believe the car i was driving was early 50s in price.

One last thing if anyone is still reading.....the new 4 series is gorgeous. Don't go by photos and car review videos. Its a real looker.

Wailin

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

One last thing if anyone is still reading.....the new 4 series is gorgeous. Don't go by photos and car review videos. Its a real looker.

Thought the exact same thing when I saw one in frank keanes recently.


Great review btw and at least know you know the type of car you're after. You can get adaptive suspension (thought it was standard on m sport plus?) which helps with the stiffness on bumpy roads. But yeah, the comfort is very noticeable when you drop down a class.

Buddy Bubs

Wailin wrote: »

Thought the exact same thing when I saw one in frank keanes recently.


Great review btw and at least know you know the type of car you're after. You can get adaptive suspension (thought it was standard on m sport plus?) which helps with the stiffness on bumpy roads. But yeah, the comfort is very noticeable when you drop down a class.

Dark blue one? Thats the one I saw today. It was a cracker.
Yes, I think I have a type now. Yes, the A6 and 5 series are big barges now and not sporty but its what I want. Narrows down search. If I could upgrade the tech in my a6 I'd keep it.

I like the idea of over the air software updates the sales guy went through with me today. Its a great idea. I presume its commercially driven but it works.

bazz26

The G20 M Sport Pro model has adaptive suspension as standard on it. From having it myself on the F36 the Sport setting of the chassis is very firm with 19" wheels, I imagine the new 3 Series is similar. You can go into the settings and select between drivetrain + chassis together or individually select drivetrain or chassis. If you select drivetrain only then it keeps the suspension in comfort mode while making the steering and throttle response sharper. Having come from a 5 Series myself your just not going to get the same level of comfort in a car from the segment below. It's not to say the 3 Series isn't a comfortable car, it's just not 5 Series/A6 comfortable. I bet you would get a similar result too if you went and test drove an A4 with the same setup coming from your A6, it's something you have to accept to be honest if you want to downsize.

Buddy Bubs

bazz26 wrote: »

The G20 M Sport Pro model has adaptive suspension as standard on it. From having it myself on the F36 the Sport setting of the chassis is very firm with 19" wheels, I imagine the new 3 Series is similar. You can go into the settings and select between drivetrain + chassis together or individually select drivetrain or chassis. If you select drivetrain only then it keeps the suspension in comfort mode while making the steering and throttle response sharper. Having come from a 5 Series myself your just not going to get the same level of comfort in a car from the segment below. It's not to say the 3 Series isn't a comfortable car, it's just not 5 Series/A6 comfortable. I bet you would get a similar result too if you went and test drove an A4 with the same setup coming from your A6, it's something you have to accept to be honest if you want to downsize.

Yep, happy now with the experience. No I don't think an A4 would be any better so im happy now to stay in the segment I am in. I don't actually like the A4 anyway to be honest.

Have to say about the 330 though, its a very sharp drive. And from what I've read the ICE only ones would be even better

Wailin

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Dark blue one? Thats the one I saw today. It was a cracker.

No the one I saw was mineral grey I think.

GustavoFring

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Yes, I think I have a type now. Yes, the A6 and 5 series are big barges now and not sporty but its what I want. Narrows down search. If I could upgrade the tech in my a6 I'd keep it.

I think you should check out an E class. Tech is serious in them.

https://www.donedeal.ie/view/26741106

Technique

Does the g20 330e have adaptive suspension as an option? I know that the f30 330e couldn't be specced with adaptive suspension.

Buddy Bubs

Technique wrote: »

Does the g20 330e have adaptive suspension as an option? I know that the f30 330e couldn't be specced with adaptive suspension.

M sport pro has it standard. Optional in others.

frozenfrozen

why wouldn't they let 330e have adaptive suspension on the previous generation? didn't think there was much extra equipment except the little actuators on tops of the shocks

Technique

Apparently there wasn't enough room for the electronics with the battery and motor, same with a lack of xdrive option.

I suppose it makes sense, in 2016 they shoehorned a hybrid set-up into a car released in 2012. With the g20, they were designing in a hybrid option from day one.

carsfan2

great review Buddy/Johnny.
Echoes a lot of what I felt on my test drive. Very sharp handling which I like. I can't see any time you would take the suspension out of comfort mode in Ireland. The body control and handling is leagues ahead of the 5 series.
Cabin ambience is super, a million miles from the f30 I had and feels like a shrunken version of our x5.
Agree with you on the 4 series it's a cracker in real life. the grille looks grand.
I reckon a m sport 530e with a few toys is what you need.

I got quotes for new s3, gti clubsport, m135i and 330e and ordered a touring 330e m sport after weighing it all up.

Wailin

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Have to say about the 330 though, its a very sharp drive. And from what I've read the ICE only ones would be even better

It's 300kg heavier than the 320i and 150kg heavier than the 330d. Serious weight increase and I would imagine that would make some difference to handling.

Wailin

carsfan2 wrote: »

I got quotes for new s3, gti clubsport, m135i and 330e and ordered a touring 330e m sport after weighing it all up.

You'll have to give us more than that now! Colour, spec etc.

Buddy Bubs

carsfan2 wrote: »

great review Buddy/Johnny.
Echoes a lot of what I felt on my test drive. Very sharp handling which I like. I can't see any time you would take the suspension out of comfort mode in Ireland. The body control and handling is leagues ahead of the 5 series.
Cabin ambience is super, a million miles from the f30 I had and feels like a shrunken version of our x5.
Agree with you on the 4 series it's a cracker in real life. the grille looks grand.
I reckon a m sport 530e with a few toys is what you need.

I got quotes for new s3, gti clubsport, m135i and 330e and ordered a touring 330e m sport after weighing it all up.

Good man, best of luck with it.

carsfan2

Wailin wrote: »

You'll have to give us more than that now! Colour, spec etc.

I wanted a more sporty, quicker, smoother engine with more power,with a hatchback/ touring boot than my 520d. The 5 is brilliant but I usually travel solo or with one or two teenagers. Other car is the main bus so don’t need the space.
The m 135i or club sport gti were what I thought initially but after experiencing the r line golf I wasn’t sure and when the club sport gti with my spec came in at 58.5 k in the road I just felt it was too much for what it was. The mark 8 golf doesn’t feel like a car of that price regardless of engine.
The s3 with a half decent spec was low 60’s on the road. Neither golf or s3 available to drive. The Audi felt that it might be worth the premium over the golf. More power and Quattro and definitely better quality feel.I was offered same trade in against both in different dealers.
Neither car available until March so they told me I will probably be liable for another 1 to1.5k price rise if vat goes back up as predicted.
Got offered the most against a BMW. Dealer very happy to sell me a m135i or 128ti but warned me that they are very much a niche car in Ireland and not to expect great residual values. Predicted that similar value 330e would be worth 6k more in three years as well as being substantially cheaper to run.
Dealer also probably correctly reckons the step down from a 5 series to a 1 series is too much of a quality drop for someone used to the 5.
Took a long spin in the 330e and was impressed as it ticks the boxes for me and my use. Found the seats with lumbar grand thankfully.
Did some more haggling during the week and ordered touring msport in black with ivory. Added plus pack, tech pack, comfort plus pack, visibility Pack and pan roof. Also changing the brakes from blue to red calipers.
Same cost to change as the golf and lot less than a relatively basic s3 and should have it February hopefully to avoid a price rise.

Wailin

Great spec and great colour combo, I'd have specced the red calipers too.

Buddy Bubs

Sounds like an excellent spec. Hopefully you get it as soon as possible

maddness

carsfan2 wrote: »

great review Buddy/Johnny.
Echoes a lot of what I felt on my test drive. Very sharp handling which I like. I can't see any time you would take the suspension out of comfort mode in Ireland. The body control and handling is leagues ahead of the 5 series.
Cabin ambience is super, a million miles from the f30 I had and feels like a shrunken version of our x5.
Agree with you on the 4 series it's a cracker in real life. the grille looks grand.
I reckon a m sport 530e with a few toys is what you need.

I got quotes for new s3, gti clubsport, m135i and 330e and ordered a touring 330e m sport after weighing it all up.

Lovely, the new 3 series touring is the best looking BMW they make now in humble opinion.