France launches airstrike on ISIS stronghold of Raqqa

RobertKK

A group of civilians in Raqqa known as Raqqa is being slowly slaughtered gave the targets to be hit.

Meanwhile in defiance, ISIS released a video saying France and it's allies wil be attacked and that Washington will be attacked just like Paris was.

Sleepy

StringerBell wrote: »

I think there is a phrase for that, something along the lines of A Crime Against Humanity?

Meh, when your opponent doesn't recognise the Geneva Convention, I see no reason to stick to it yourself.

Billy86 wrote: »

And good for the rest of us that diseases respect national borders, because otherwise releasing very contagious and dangerous chemicals and diseases into a country where people are fleeing in their droves could really come back to bite Europe in the ass.

That and the fact it's just a disgusting idea.

Nothing stopping us from inoculating our own population against it first and / or trusting our medical services to be able to better deal with a disease we know we're about to unleash than those of ISIS.

wakka12 wrote: »

Thats heinous, unethical in the extreme

Is it? You don't bring a knife to a gunfight and you'll get beaten to a pulp if you tried sticking to the Marquis of Queensbury rules in a street fight. This isn't a border dispute.

6781

Those targets would have been bombed yesterday by the west collectively even if the attacks in Paris hadn't happened. It's because of the Paris attacks France was given the lead to show that action is been taken.

Irelandcool

Problems is ISIS engages in a lot of slavery, hostage taking and they're many innocent people that're likey hiding from ISIS as best they can. These strikes could easily kill them unlike just using ground forces who should easily differentiate between innocent or ISIS.

Of course ISIS is more complicated then Nazi Germany given they likely have sleeper cells and sympathizers world wide (possibly even Ireland but the government has the attitude that nothing like this can happen in Ireland).
like the one we've seen in Paris.

They need to locate these first (I mean the NSA knows what porn you're looking up surely they can track down ISIS, given all the twitter accounts and facebook accounts belonging to ISIS it shouldn't be hard at all). Preferable then arrest and gain more intelligence.

By the way I am more for special forces and commandoes going in to get the leaders then drones or airstrikes which could possible kill more innocent rather then just the terrorist.

In my view what ISIS is ultimately trying to do in europe is create sectarian violence between the more radical christian parts of europe and the radical islamic parts in europe. Like say if after the paris attacks some random white supremist or christian extremist group attacks a mosque and then the more radical islamics strike back. Kinda like in Northern Ireland but possibly more on a grandeur scale.

(note I realize not all the christians and muslims are terrorists just saying that they're people of both sides with extreme hatred and have mindset capable of these atrocities).

smash

Irelandcool wrote: »

I mean the NSA knows what porn you're looking up surely they can track down ISIS, given all the twitter accounts and facebook accounts belonging to ISIS it shouldn't be hard at all

Wasn't there reports that terrorists moved to methods like snapchat because it's hard to track and very secure?

Roger Hassenforder

smash wrote: »

Wasn't there reports that terrorists moved to methods like snapchat because it's hard to track and very secure?

Read somewhere this morning, online gaming and encrypted chat rooms is where it's at, according to some security "experts", even writing messages on walls with bullets!

Sleepy

Sleepy wrote: »

Or play them at their own game: allow any who wish to travel to Syria to do so, release some highly contagious pathogens on the flights and let disease do the dirty work?

Be easier to just nuke Syria if you were going down that road.

end of the road

Sleepy wrote: »

Meh, when your opponent doesn't recognise the Geneva Convention, I see no reason to stick to it yourself.

because its your job. if you don't, then you condone and legitimize your opponent, and you don't get to complain about their actions or be all high and mighty.

Sleepy wrote: »

Nothing stopping us from inoculating our own population against it first and / or trusting our medical services to be able to better deal with a disease we know we're about to unleash than those of ISIS.

its a bollox idea. thats the end of it

Laois_Man

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Russia seem to have a plan and i saw no talk of retalliation from Russia. The french strike was a retalliation, because it essentially america going "hey france...you can strike this spot here that we've been minding all year if it makes you feel better"

Why are you talking as if France weren't involved in airstrikes in Syria before this weekend. Last night was their third separate attack in Syria in a week alone (France launched airstrikes last Tuesday and the previous Sunday).

Conversely. Russia have launched airstrikes since their airliner was blown up/shot down. Why should you get to choose which are to be labelled "Retaliation" and which one's are part of a brilliant plan.

Jamsiek

end of the road wrote: »

because its your job. if you don't, then you condone and legitimize your opponent, and you don't get to complain about their actions or be all high and mighty.

...but your heroes in the IRA never stuck to the Geneva Convention either :rolleyes:

DarkyHughes

Jamsiek wrote: »

...but your heroes in the IRA never stuck to the Geneva Convention either :rolleyes:

Either did your heroes in the British Army they killed over 150 unarmed civilians (not including the collusion with the UVF & UDA) & unarmed members of the IRA & unlike the IRA hardly any of them spent a reasonable amount of time in jail.

the evasion_kid

DarkyHughes wrote: »

Either did your heroes in the British Army they killed over 150 unarmed civilians (not including the collusion with the UVF & UDA) & unarmed members of the IRA & unlike the IRA hardly any of them spent a reasonable amount of time in jail.

Might makes right...

Jamsiek

DarkyHughes wrote: »

Either did your heroes in the British Army they killed over 150 unarmed civilians (not including the collusion with the UVF & UDA) & unarmed members of the IRA & unlike the IRA hardly any of them spent a reasonable amount of time in jail.

Not my heroes. Just pointing out the hypocrisy of those that think they have the moral high ground by talking about the Geneva Convention but ignoring it when it suits them.

Jan Laco

end of the road wrote: »

because its your job. if you don't, then you condone and legitimize your opponent, and you don't get to complain about their actions or be all high and mighty.



its a bollox idea. thats the end of it

Who are you to say whats the end of it?

Peist2007

gazzamc wrote: »

Should have nuked the place.

Should have brought some chicken soup

scamalert

These strikes could easily kill them unlike just using ground forces who should easily differentiate between innocent or ISIS

differentiate how-waving white flag while being strapped with c4rs,its not like they can read people minds who might turn around and blow the **** up.

while forgot recent movie about drone pilots,managing all attacks from comfort of thousands miles away,and yes i believe that in most launches against terrorists there are 10 civilians dead for 1 terrorist,but its either they are held hostages as prevention from such attacks,or plain stupidity to remain in such area.Its still better, when such attacks are done from away as possible and person can be home in one piece.

Precious flower

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Context;
US and Allies back Iraq against Iran.
Iran wins. Invades Kuwait.
US and Allies invade Iraq. Withdraw. Sanctions kill millions aided by corrupt and brutal dictator.
Saudi Arabian terrorists plan and carry out 911.
US invades Afghanistan and Iraq? ? Why. Oh WMDs. We-Made-Des up.
US deposes Saddam. Instals puppet government, withdraws. Puppet government falls. ISIS (Sunni radicals created by 20 years of sanctions and bombings ) step in. These ****ers are super crazy. London, Madrid and Paris bombings.
Reaction Options;

1. Keep dropping bombs creating newer crazier suicide bombers. Ask Israel how that tactic's going...

2. Stop. Stop the cycle of violence. Stop dropping bombs on people, and calling them collateral damage. Stop dropping bombs on schools and calling them terrorist training camps. Stop feeding the fear-mongering and hate-whoring. Stop listening and cheering idiots and bigots who talk about bombing people and pretend that is justified, on any side. Nothing. Nothing ever justifies murder.

This has happened before in Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Africa, and through recorded history when a colonial power swept in with breathtaking arrogance believing it was civilised, and right and rigeous and divine. Just stop. Every penny spent on bombs and guns and walls and hate could be spent on homelessness and addiction and clean water and sanitation and love, which is free.

Every war torn generation learns on the battlefield that both sides in every conflict are wrong. And their grandchildren forget until they learn again in the mud, in a war, for nothing except some other ****ers opinion.

I would be inclined to agree with you. Bombing them is a mistake; unless they can completely avoid civilian casualties. Bombing civilians is just playing into ISIS hands. But then what do you? You can't sit down with guys and hash out a deal. You could send in navy seals or something to that effect to kill off individuals but that takes longer and there is a higher chance of failure considering how close they have to get. You can't pull out, morally it's not right and those people suffering under ISIS will continue to suffer. ISIS have no plans to stay in the Middle East either.
War is such a long process it's hard to know what the right move is.

DarkyHughes

Jamsiek wrote: »

Not my heroes. Just pointing out the hypocrisy of those that think they have the moral high ground by talking about the Geneva Convention but ignoring it when it suits them.

So you admit all sides committed war crimes, good. Although you would be hard pressed to find a conflict were a war crime wasn't broken. Just in 20th century Ireland alone from the Easter Rising, Tan War, Civil War & The Northern conflict all sides committed war crimes. The British government was terrible for that sort of hypocrisy during the conflict.

And how do you know the IRA are his heroes? I hold some IRA Volunteers in very high regard like The Dark, Sands, Joe O'Connell, Jim Lynagh, Tommy McKearney etc...I wouldn't call them heroes tho.

SEPT 23 1989

Irelandcool wrote: »

Problems is ISIS engages in a lot of slavery, hostage taking and they're many innocent people that're likey hiding from ISIS as best they can. These strikes could easily kill them unlike just using ground forces who should easily differentiate between innocent or ISIS.

Of course ISIS is more complicated then Nazi Germany given they likely have sleeper cells and sympathizers world wide (possibly even Ireland but the government has the attitude that nothing like this can happen in Ireland).
like the one we've seen in Paris.

They need to locate these first (I mean the NSA knows what porn you're looking up surely they can track down ISIS, given all the twitter accounts and facebook accounts belonging to ISIS it shouldn't be hard at all). Preferable then arrest and gain more intelligence.

By the way I am more for special forces and commandoes going in to get the leaders then drones or airstrikes which could possible kill more innocent rather then just the terrorist.

In my view what ISIS is ultimately trying to do in europe is create sectarian violence between the more radical christian parts of europe and the radical islamic parts in europe. Like say if after the paris attacks some random white supremist or christian extremist group attacks a mosque and then the more radical islamics strike back. Kinda like in Northern Ireland but possibly more on a grandeur scale.

(note I realize not all the christians and muslims are terrorists just saying that they're people of both sides with extreme hatred and have mindset capable of these atrocities).

Special forces and commandoes are already there where do you think the bombers get their coordinates from?

Rough men who we owe a massive debt of gratitude to

masti123

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Context;
US and Allies back Iraq against Iran.
Iran wins. Invades Kuwait.
US and Allies invade Iraq. Withdraw. Sanctions kill millions aided by corrupt and brutal dictator.
Saudi Arabian terrorists plan and carry out 911.
US invades Afghanistan and Iraq? ? Why. Oh WMDs. We-Made-Des up.
US deposes Saddam. Instals puppet government, withdraws. Puppet government falls. ISIS (Sunni radicals created by 20 years of sanctions and bombings ) step in. These ****ers are super crazy. London, Madrid and Paris bombings.
Reaction Options;

1. Keep dropping bombs creating newer crazier suicide bombers. Ask Israel how that tactic's going...

2. Stop. Stop the cycle of violence. Stop dropping bombs on people, and calling them collateral damage. Stop dropping bombs on schools and calling them terrorist training camps. Stop feeding the fear-mongering and hate-whoring. Stop listening and cheering idiots and bigots who talk about bombing people and pretend that is justified, on any side. Nothing. Nothing ever justifies murder.

This has happened before in Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Africa, and through recorded history when a colonial power swept in with breathtaking arrogance believing it was civilised, and right and rigeous and divine. Just stop. Every penny spent on bombs and guns and walls and hate could be spent on homelessness and addiction and clean water and sanitation and love, which is free.

Every war torn generation learns on the battlefield that both sides in every conflict are wrong. And their grandchildren forget until they learn again in the mud, in a war, for nothing except some other ****ers opinion.

What is crazier than a current suicide bomber? Not very much. They aren't exactly technological geniuses, they won't be creating nano-nukes anytime soon.

During the Pacific War, Japan wouldn't surrender, even after being given plenty of opportunities to do so. What happened?
In classic 'Murica style, America dropped an atomic bomb on them. Call it radical and extreme, but it worked.

Bombing people is a **** thing to do, but sometimes it just has to be done. Bomb them now, and more lives will be saved, as appose to bombing them 10 years from now after they've blown up half of Europe themselves.

And of course we have moral superiority. You don't see anyone mass executing children and live-broadcasting cutting peoples heads off because people don't share the same beliefs...
ISIS are utter scum, you can't even class them as people, and it's best to rid of them now before they recruit more people and expand as an 'army'. 

masti123

And to further my point, the game at Hannover Stadium has literally just been cancelled due to explosives being found placed around the stadium itself.
ISIS need to be rid of now, who knows what ****ing ideas they have planned next...