Retro Brite - Restoration Logs

Myrddin

Ok, I originally pitched this as a group build idea...but looking at it in more detail, it's really too cheap to do to be any use amongst a group. I've decided to try my hand at this & need some bits & pieces to do it correctly.

First up, a UV light box:

For obvious reasons, the sunlight here in Ireland is as far from dependable as you can get. We get patchy, low intensity sunlight for most of the year (if we're lucky!). Combined with sketchy results like swirling, I've decided to go the light box route. Basically the idea is to build a small box, in which there will be a lid/door to block out all light. Inside the box there will be a UV light source, so any plastic that gets placed inside will be exposed to consistent & balanced UV light, giving much better results by all accounts. The inside of the box will be lined with reflective foil (tin foil), to keep the light inside as broad & spread out as possible. Here's what I've done so far:

Myrddin

I've also picked these up:

T5 8W fluorescent light fittings x2
UVA 8W G5 bulbs x2

Myrddin

Still to get:

A roll of cling film to wrap any plastic going into the UV box. This prevents the retrobrite drying out, which creates bleaching/stains on the plastic.

Retrobrite itself, by all accounts this stuff is retrobrite in a bottle, and is available easily enough:



Once obtained, I'll fit the fixtures to the lid of the box & begin the trials!

Corholio

Looks good! I'd experiment using a ziplock bag as well as the clingfilm. Its actually a little tough to keep air out of little pockets in the clingfilm and can dry out small bits faster than others. I've had good and less than good results with clingfilm.

Keep us updated though!

Myrddin

Corholio wrote: »

Looks good! I'd experiment using a ziplock bag as well as the clingfilm. Its actually a little tough to keep air out of little pockets in the clingfilm and can dry out small bits faster than others. I've had good and less than good results with clingfilm.

Keep us updated though!

Cheers for that, have you tried it with zip-lock bags & found it to be better in that regard?

Steve X2

They sell that Oxy stuff you need to help make the real stuff in the Euro shops by the way.
Might be helpful to add it to this mixture maybe?

Myrddin

Steve X2 wrote: »

They sell that Oxy stuff you need to help make the real stuff in the Euro shops by the way.
Might be helpful to add it to this mixture maybe?

Yep was thinking the same myself, though given the stuff from the bottle is already thickened, I'm not sure how adding Oxy would affect it (or the ratio I should add it in etc).

Corholio

Myrddin wrote: »

Cheers for that, have you tried it with zip-lock bags & found it to be better in that regard?

I've only used it once in the zip lock bag and it turned out decent enough. It also resolves the problem of the clingfilm sticking to the surface which can create slight overlapping of the plastic which can keep out the rays and create little lines.

As for the Oxy, the stuff in the bottle is pretty much the real stuff anyway so I don't think you'd need the Oxy either. The Oxy was usually just a sort of first step or just added to the ingredients to boost it.

The Last Bandit

Is it necessary to seal in the 'stuff' at all when using a light box ? The heat generated should be low and the exposure time should be much shorter ?

Myrddin

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Is it necessary to seal in the 'stuff' at all when using a light box ? The heat generated should be low and the exposure time should be much shorter ?

From what I've read, it's still kinda necessary (see post #10 & 18 here), depending on the bulb type used. Do the above bulbs I got give off much heat normally?

Steve X2

Myrddin wrote: »

Yep was thinking the same myself, though given the stuff from the bottle is already thickened, I'm not sure how adding Oxy would affect it (or the ratio I should add it in etc).

Oxy is not to thicken it, that's what the Xantar gum does. The Oxy is added just before you apply the Retr0brite as an activator for the peroxide mix. Without the activator it won't work very well at all.

A lot of people skip the Oxy and wonder why the results are not great. It's the TAED (Tetraacetylethylenediamine) in the Oxy that works as a catalyst so you need to make sure that's what's in the Oxy you buy.

The Last Bandit

Myrddin wrote: »

From what I've read, it's still kinda necessary (see post #10 & 18 here), depending on the bulb type used. Do the above bulbs I got give off much heat normally?

Not sure really, you're the one that'll be doing all the experiments for us and reporting back the best method

eddhorse

Steve X2 wrote: »

(Tetraacetylethylenediamine)

Easy for you to say.

Best of luck with this, pass the tinfoil box around when you are done.

Myrddin

Steve X2 wrote: »

Oxy is not to thicken it, that's what the Xantar gum does. The Oxy is added just before you apply the Retr0brite as an activator for the peroxide mix. Without the activator it won't work very well at all.

A lot of people skip the Oxy and wonder why the results are not great. It's the TAED (Tetraacetylethylenediamine) in the Oxy that works as a catalyst so you need to make sure that's what's in the Oxy you buy.

Interesting, though my point was I'm not sure if adding Oxy will make the already thickened 'stuff' even thicker, to the point where it just turns into useless gloop. If adding Oxy, should I be adding a small amout of a diluting agent to keep the 'stuff' at the right consistency?

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Not sure really, you're the one that'll be doing all the experiments for us and reporting back the best method

A DIY UV Light Box you say?

Steve X2

Myrddin wrote: »

Interesting, though my point was I'm not sure if adding Oxy will make the already thickened 'stuff' even thicker, to the point where it just turns into useless gloop. If adding Oxy, should I be adding a small amout of a diluting agent to keep the 'stuff' at the right consistency?

Ah ok, yes you dissolve the Oxy in warm water and add it to the mix just before you apply. So you could get the consistency about the same as your other mix.

Corholio

Steve X2 wrote: »

Oxy is not to thicken it, that's what the Xantar gum does. The Oxy is added just before you apply the Retr0brite as an activator for the peroxide mix. Without the activator it won't work very well at all.

A lot of people skip the Oxy and wonder why the results are not great. It's the TAED (Tetraacetylethylenediamine) in the Oxy that works as a catalyst so you need to make sure that's what's in the Oxy you buy.

The effect of Oxy seems to be very hit and miss on oxidised plastic though. For other cleaning projects on non-plastic it seems to have a better effect than it does on plastic, like for example on fabrics on which Oxy was specifically used for. I don't think it's really a case of without it, it won't work very well. In my experiences it's never been a must have thing, but always worth trying with it anyway of course. Apparently the formula with Oxy works well with old Apple products but not so much with plastic in the SNES, and I can testify that using it with I didn't notice any difference than using without.

Steve X2

Corholio wrote: »

The effect of Oxy seems to be very hit and miss on oxidised plastic though. For other cleaning projects on non-plastic it seems to have a better effect than it does on plastic, like for example on fabrics on which Oxy was specifically used for. I don't think it's really a case of without it, it won't work very well. In my experiences it's never been a must have thing, but always worth trying with it anyway of course. Apparently the formula with Oxy works well with old Apple products but not so much with plastic in the SNES, and I can testify that using it with I didn't notice any difference than using without.

Retr0brite has many recipes for different ABS mixes as you can see online. I've used Retr0brite mainly on older apple stuff as well as Amiga/Commodore systems and without the Oxy it was only ok. But with the added Oxy at the right time it does make a big difference. It's the TAED that does the work here, so the Oxy has to have that and not all do.

Myrddin

Build update:

Light fixtures fixed to the lid of the box



Test using standard bulbs



Test using UV bulbs



My god...it's full of stars





Things to do:

Obtain zip lock bags (hopefully on Monday)
Obtain that Bblonde stuff (hopefully Saturday)

I should be all set to try this all out then over the following week or so.

Corholio

When you take the top off the box after doing it it's gonna be like this........:pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69AyYUJUBTg

Looks good though!

So those UV bulbs make your clothes glow ?
I need to get some for the arcade.

Myrddin

The 'stuff' has been procured. These are only small bottles, & I'm not sure how much is needed so I got three for now. Only thing left is some zip-lock bags, & I should have those tomorrow.

Corholio

You shouldn't need too much I would say, the cream handily spreads around quite good when you do it with your fingers (in gloves of course)

Myrddin

Just about to test this all out on a Super Famicom. Will take pics & post later on...

STG.Otaku

Corholio wrote: »

the cream handily spreads around quite good when you do it with your fingers (in gloves of course)

Myrddin

3 hours in, can't say I notice any real difference

The Last Bandit

Myrddin wrote: »

3 hours in, can't say I notice any real difference

Something wrong there, I've used that same bottle of stuff on an old Amiga power supply and there was a noticeable difference after 30 mins of sunlight.

Are they the right type of UV bulbs ? Think it needs UVB to work and not UVA.

Myrddin

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Are they the right type of UV bulbs ? Think it needs UVB to work and not UVA.

They're UVA from what I can see I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere about UVB, is that definitely the case?

The Last Bandit

Myrddin wrote: »

They're UVA from what I can see I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere about UVB, is that definitely the case?

Seems to be mixed reports on people have success with both UVA & UVB on Amibay retrobrite thread, thought I did read somewhere previously about UVB being better.
I guess let them cook away for another bit ?

Myrddin

The Last Bandit wrote: »

I guess let them cook away for another bit ?

Aye, I'll leave them be for the time being. Had a quick look there for an Exo Terra Repti UVB bulb in Ireland, €43 for a screw in bulb?? Ffs

Myrddin

Build Log 1: Super Famicom (colour fixed in another post

I'm quite disappointed the result isn't better than it is, & the final pics are made to look better than it does in reality given the artificial light I took them under. I reckon the UVA bulbs I'm using just simply aren't that well suited to the process. They've made some difference, a small difference...but given the use of a light box & for several hours, I think the results should be a lot better than this. I'll get different bulbs in there maybe in a week or two to finish the job.

Only the top half was done, I didn't touch the bottom half except for cleaning it.

Before cleaning











The 'stuff applied





Results

Corholio

It looks decent enough though, can definitely see a change. The strange thing I found sometimes doing it (with me it was sunlight, but may still apply) is that I got quite different results day to day. Sometimes the 2nd day would be much better than the first etc, other times some tints of yellow was still there even after the 4th day. What I would say is on the 2nd day try rubbing the cream in more, apparently the plastic absorbing it better can improve results.

Myrddin

I may have been a bit hasty in my judgement, it's definitely working. It's just taking a lot longer than I thought it would. I also think the reaction continues even when the part has been cleaned, the top half of the Snes now isn't far from perfect I have the bottom half in now, which is significantly more yellowed...so I'm thinking maybe three or four six hour sessions in 'the box' will at least be needed

bennya

Where did you pick up the BBlonde mix? Looking at doing this myself with a couple of C64's and a grey Spectrum +2 that's turned green

Myrddin

bennya wrote: »

Where did you pick up the BBlonde mix? Looking at doing this myself with a couple of C64's and a grey Spectrum +2 that's turned green

Boots stock it

bennya

Excellent (rubs hands)

BGOllie

mmm. I was happy with my yellowed consoles till now... dammit!

Myrddin

The bottom half of the SFC is in 'the box' as we speak. It's much better than before (after a few treatments), but the sides still need work. I'll update again when I've the results I want from it.

@BGOllie, if you build it...they will come

Myrddin

Very slow going on the bottom half of the SFC (which was much worse than the top half). It's coming along though, it'll need several more 12+ hour sessions I'd say though

bennya

Did a quick test piece this morning while there was some fleeting sun - got about three hours worth, which made a noticeable difference to the right hand side (left was masked off):

h t t ps://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5799/22616219321_da57293555_z_d.jpg

(Joined in 2006 but still a new user. Tch.)

Myrddin

^^ Can definitely see a difference there

The bottom half of my SFC is now nearly matching the top half. Once they're the same, I can start putting them in the box together to speed up the process. If I do it now, they'll stay at a relative difference & it might be hard to match them for the final finish

eddhorse

bennya wrote: »

Did a quick test piece this morning while there was some fleeting sun - got about three hours worth, which made a noticeable difference to the right hand side (left was masked off):

h t t ps://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5799/22616219321_da57293555_z_d.jpg

(Joined in 2006 but still a new user. Tch.)

Looks good https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5799/22616219321_da57293555_z_d.jpg

Corholio

Myrddin wrote: »

^^ Can definitely see a difference there

The bottom half of my SFC is now nearly matching the top half. Once they're the same, I can start putting them in the box together to speed up the process. If I do it now, they'll stay at a relative difference & it might be hard to match them for the final finish

That's a good idea definitely, it is quite tough to get the same shade from individual pieces even with doing the exact same for both. Good to hear it's working though!

Myrddin

I'll try colour correct the original photo's too, before I show the current progress (because looking at them now they're terrible & don't show how bad the yellowing was at all).

Myrddin

Log 1















It's still got a little way to go, a few more shades and it'll be as close to normal as makes no difference.

Myrddin

^^ The little plate that says Super Famicom has spent more time in the box than the top shell itself, so has come all the way to being perfect. I'll get the top half to match the name plate over the next couple of days & that'll be that. Also my pics above still make it difficult to convey the true colour, the top half looks as if it hasn't changed really, but it has...significantly, damn shadows etc

The Last Bandit

Any way of avoiding the shadows, would more bulbs be any help ?

Myrddin

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Any way of avoiding the shadows, would more bulbs be any help ?

The shadows are only affecting me taking pictures to show the results, the light box is obviously shadow free

The Last Bandit

Myrddin wrote: »

The shadows are only affecting me taking pictures to show the results, the light box is obviously shadow free

ah right, misunderstood completely

So long do the bits need to be in the box ?

Myrddin

The Last Bandit wrote: »

So long do the bits need to be in the box ?

Significantly longer than I thought anyway. I haven't kept a record (which I should have), but the bottom half has had 36/48 hours or thereabouts I'd say (spread across focusing on the bottom, and then each of the four corners).

Los Lobos

They may be different to look at right in front of you, but in the pictures its chalk and cheese. Nice job

Myrddin

So, the Snes is finished. It's almost perfect, the lower half is a shade or two darker than the top which mightn't come across via the pics, but we're only talking a shade or two and you have to look very close to see it. The lower half just won't come up any brighter, so short of a peroxide bath this is the best it'll get. I'm chuffed with the results













You can see the RF unit has it's own plastic which doesn't remove, it has come a long way! I could dismantle the RF unit if I wanted to remove this plastic, but I kinda like having it there as a way to remind me how bad this console used to be!