Impending eviction; questioning whether to help or not

Wompa1

Coincidentally enough something somewhat similar just happened to me again today, my mother (she's American by the way) back in Ireland (I'm in the US) contacted me today. She's very upset.

My grandfather who is also in the US but on the other side of the country to me, who is her dad is going to be evicted tomorrow. The man is 85 years old. He lost a leg over 30 years ago in an accident that was not caused by him. My aunt, my mothers sister has been living with him for the last 2 years. She's got severe mental issues. She's been diagnosed as Skitzophrenic with all other kinds of issues. Last time I saw this woman she was skin and bone, refused to shower or bathe because she was so skinny that she would become extremely cold after the bath or shower. Her husband died right after they had their second kid. Her youngest died tragically when he was 20 years old. She's been a bit of a wreck ever since.

So, as they live together, both of them are being evicted. They have been trying to fight the eviction but have lost for the last couple of weeks (I didn't know this was happening). Somebody in the Sheriffs department will be arriving tomorrow to make sure they leave.

Problem is, apparently they don't have any money.

They need movers to move their furniture. They likely need a storage unit at least for a short while. They also need a place to stay. They both receive food stamps for food. My only other family in the area is an aunt who has 5 people in a 2 bedroom apartment already, as she's taking care of her husbands aging family.

It's a huge clusterf*ck and my mother has asked me if I can wire them some money...she says she will pay me the money back slowly over time. My mother works in a Topaz. The bank owns the house her and my father live in. Most of the money she makes is servicing debt. I know for a fact, I will never see this money again and I'm expecting my first child.

I'm in a big predicament. I am the only person in the family that's not a complete f*ck up when it comes to finances.

R.D. aka MR.D

Wompa1 wrote: »

They both receive food stamps for food.

Some one can correct me if I'm wrong because I haven't lived at home for almost 3 years but I'm 99% sure we don't have food stamps in Ireland...

Wompa1

R.D. aka MR.D wrote: »

Some one can correct me if I'm wrong because I haven't lived at home for almost 3 years but I'm 99% sure we don't have food stamps in Ireland...

Sorry, I thought I said they were in the US. I didn't. I only said I was. I'm in the US. My grandfather and aunt are in the US but the other side of the country. My parents are in Ireland.

IvoryTower

That's a tough one wompa1, I would certainly help if I could in that situation. I had my first child last year and apart from the initial hit where you have to buy stuff, I actually found I had more money overall because your social life turns into walks in the park, there's not much you can do with a baby in their first year. I guess you'd need to find out the exact situation to see where you can help. Like if they have somewhere to go and it's just a case of moving their furniture than that could your dig out?

Easyliving

Wompa1 wrote: »

Sorry, I thought I said they were in the US. I didn't. I only said I was. I'm in the US. My grandfather and aunt are in the US but the other side of the country. My parents are in Ireland.

Vivs situation is tough but your family is in a tougher situation. This is a no brainer you have to help in some way. You are descended from this man, and he not only is in a physically terrible situation but he is clearly in a horrible situation every other way. We are not all lucky enough to have grandparents left. When you are old you will regret not helping. Clearly he is a decent man if he's helping his daughter with that level of problems and him obviously being very old. There are times in our lives we have to man up and this is one time. Do what you can.

fits

Yep wompa. That really sucks but if you can get them moved and set up somewhere it would be a very good thing. Like, what is the alternative really?

Wompa1

No alternative. My mother gave him a bunch of money when she had some and blew through it.

I told them I'm willing to help but I'm not wiring them money or send them cash. If they want my help, I can pay for movers, hotel etc. with a credit card.

Working very hard to make the money that I do. It's crappy to see it get away like this because there's no chance I'll ever get it back.

iusedtoknow

Is there a way you can practically without giving them money? Ie pay for x amount of time in a hotel and for their furniture storage. I would be very wary of handing over cash

zeffabelli

Call Adult Protective Services....they might be able to help....

Wompa1

iusedtoknow wrote: »

Is there a way you can practically without giving them money? Ie pay for x amount of time in a hotel and for their furniture storage. I would be very wary of handing over cash

We did this today and one of my other aunts actually stepped up, which is great. She is going through the wars right now herself. She has an overfull house AND to make it worse, she's a hardcore alcoholic. She's literally drinking every minute from when she gets home from work to when she goes to bed every day. High functioning, though. She keeps a steady job.

The US side of my family have a lot of problems!

But thankfully she took the day off of work and helped co-ordinate things. She said they were about to be out on the street and neither one of them seemed to care. They also seemed pretty ungrateful...

Two people that have given up, I guess.

Thanks for the insights. We'll see how things turn out over the next few weeks. My aunt said she's going to takeover management of my grandfathers income. So, it might be a case that this can be resolved sooner rather than later. He said he's willing to go into assisted living and my aunt will see if they are willing to also accept my other aunt too. My grandfather says he doesn't want to leave her...

Rachiee

Wow your Aunt sounds like an amazing woman I'd forgive her the drink !!! Good luck with the baby OP , If I was you I'd help with practical money stiff only as suggested, you'll regret and wonder if you don't.

Wompa1

Update for this one. My grandfather lasted a day at the hotel. He had got his leg stump stuck in the small hotel restroom and had a heart attack. It also turns out that when they got the notice that somebody from the Sheriffs office was coming around to ensure they vacate, he stopped taking his medication.

So now the situation is that he's lost it. I guess the medication was keeping dementia away. He lost his prosthetic leg which costs a fortune. He didn't make any sense when speaking for days and now he's just not very lucid at all.

He's still in care and it's being covered by the Veteran Association. So that actually helped out financially. My aunt moved in with my other aunt and that huge crowd that was already there.

That brings me to today. The VA is ready to release my grandfather and he doesn't have anywhere to go. At this point, he still needs care. An assisted living facility has been suggested but even to get accepted they need 7k. I am being told he will die if he doesn't get this care and that he's got something called a life vest right now.

It was one thing paying for a hotel for a while or paying a months rent and a deposit on an apartment while his retirement cheques accumulated enough to start paying for himself. But this is now into the territory in which I'm very uncomfortable and it's causing me a lot of stress and anxiety.

I have 7k but this is a serious amount of money to me. It's not an amount that I'd be ok with never seeing again. My aunt has said she will pay me back in February when she gets her retirement...I'm just really worried about never seeing that money again.

PinkLemonade

If that money would actually make the diffrence between a stable retirement home and homelessness, I think I'd pay it personally

Look into every option OP though before parting with that kind of money, there's likely more options on the table than you can see right now

Wompa1

PinkLemonade wrote: »

If that money would actually make the diffrence between a stable retirement home and homelessness, I think I'd pay it personally

Look into every option OP though before parting with that kind of money, there's likely more options on the table than you can see right now

Unfortunately, I'm a couple thousand miles away so I can only go off of what they are telling me. Also, they have again left it until the last minute. He's about to be discharged (The VA is like an Irish Hospital in that it's social medicine and are limited for beds. They can't or won't continue to keep him there.) I'm being told he needs to leave early next week

zeffabelli

Wompa1 wrote: »

Unfortunately, I'm a couple thousand miles away so I can only go off of what they are telling me. Also, they have again left it until the last minute. He's about to be discharged (The VA is like an Irish Hospital in that it's social medicine and are limited for beds. They can't or won't continue to keep him there.) I'm being told he needs to leave early next week

The hospital cannot legally discharge him unless someone signs for him and he has somewhere to go. It is illegal to do so. That's how so many is hospitals are stuck with stroke survivors.

Don't panic.

Also get ghe social workers and adult protective services involved in finding him a place.

Wompa1

zeffabelli wrote: »

The hospital cannot legally discharge him unless someone signs for him and he has somewhere to go. It is illegal to do so. That's how so many is hospitals are stuck with stroke survivors.

Don't panic.

Also get ghe social workers and adult protective services involved in finding him a place.

The more I'm hearing. The more it sounds like I'm being manipulated. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about how things are done over in the US to know what questions to ask

Penny Tration

http://www.canhr.org/factsheets/nh_fs/html/fs_challengingdischarge.htm


According to the link above, he cannot be discharged without a social worker team assessing him and arranging a suitable care package for him.

No hospital is able to release a patient they believe will die after discharge, even medicaid patients have a right to treatment and the hospital has a duty of care to them.

Tbh mate what you're being told sounds very far fetched, and I have suspicions that it may be a money grabbing plot.

Wompa1

Penny Tration wrote: »

http://www.canhr.org/factsheets/nh_fs/html/fs_challengingdischarge.htm


According to the link above, he cannot be discharged without a social worker team assessing him and arranging a suitable care package for him.

No hospital is able to release a patient they believe will die after discharge, even medicaid patients have a right to treatment and the hospital has a duty of care to them.

Tbh mate what you're being told sounds very far fetched, and I have suspicions that it may be a money grabbing plot.

What I'm being told is he is being discharged from the Rehab and needs to be put in assisted living. His benefits cover part of the cost but not all of it.

Penny Tration

And what exactly are they quoting the 7k for?

According to the link I'll paste below, average cost of assisted living is 2500 dollars a month, not 7? And in 41 states, there is a possibility of medicaid covering it.
http://archive.ahrq.gov/professionals/systems/long-term-care/resources/facilities/ltcscan/ltc3.html

I think that you need to get a lot more information before giving away your money like that

Wompa1

Penny Tration wrote: »

And what exactly are they quoting the 7k for?

According to the link I'll paste below, average cost of assisted living is 2500 dollars a month, not 7? And in 41 states, there is a possibility of medicaid covering it.
http://archive.ahrq.gov/professionals/systems/long-term-care/resources/facilities/ltcscan/ltc3.html

I think that you need to get a lot more information before giving away your money like that

I'm being told in order for a room. There's an upfront fee. I have to speak with my aunt tomorrow. I'm getting the feeling that maybe she's half a$$ing it and just see's me as the easiest path forward

dori_dormer

Ask for the name of the place they are planning to send him to and give them a call. Ask their policies etc. ask them to email you payment plans and that. Then you can figure out what's going on. I would never give my money blindly without knowing exactly where it was going

zeffabelli

Wompa1 wrote: »

The more I'm hearing. The more it sounds like I'm being manipulated. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about how things are done over in the US to know what questions to ask

You maybe being manipulated only as much as they are.

It's a complicated and convoluted system where they are not always transparent with what the laws are.

He cannot be discharged from a hospital.

Get onto the social worker. They have assisted living through Medicaid if he is poor enough to qualify for Medicaid.

Saying this I am not au fair with post Obama care protocols but I do know for a fact a hospital cannot discharge without a patient being signed for.

Wompa1

Well, things have gone from bad to worse...

Over the weekend, I had conversations with my aunt and the people at the assisted living facility. It costs a small fortune.

It's turned into a cluster. My fiance and I were meant to be getting married in November. She now says she wants to hold off due to me giving them the money....

I wasn't expecting such a drastic reaction. She has not been pleased about the whole thing and I now wish I just hid it from her. She was crying because she thinks it's very unfair. She drew comparisons between my family and her family. And how my parents have not been supportive....My parents live 5k miles away and don't have any money. She said it's not about the money. I said, well if you want to live beside them, I'm sure they'll mind the kid for us.

She says it's not right to have been put in this position.

zeffabelli

Wompa1 wrote: »

Well, things have gone from bad to worse...

Over the weekend, I had conversations with my aunt and the people at the assisted living facility. It costs a small fortune.

It's turned into a cluster. My fiance and I were meant to be getting married in November. She now says she wants to hold off due to me giving them the money....

I wasn't expecting such a drastic reaction. She has not been pleased about the whole thing and I now wish I just hid it from her. She was crying because she thinks it's very unfair. She drew comparisons between my family and her family. And how my parents have not been supportive....My parents live 5k miles away and don't have any money. She said it's not about the money. I said, well if you want to live beside them, I'm sure they'll mind the kid for us.

She says it's not right to have been put in this position.

Wompa1 - this is a new problem, generated by the current problem.

Well it is unfair but that's life - it gets unfair sometimes.

Just remember you don't have to do anything, give money, get married nothing.

Yes you might look like the bad guy, that also happens under moral pressure.

I think it is about the money ....re your girlfriend... But distance also makes people less emotionally connected and your parents might be a little passive and maybe could have more input in guiding you and backing you up? It is there family too and this should not be landed entirely on you. So your fiancée has a bit of a point.

Postponing the wedding I read as a kind of leverage move - do this and I won't marry you. This isn't really fair.

Not liking your in laws... Part of the deal... Pretty common. I assume she's American?

Penny Tration

Did you discuss it with your fiancee?


I can understand why she'd be furious if you discussed it and she was dead against it. Ultimately now you're getting married, large financial decisions should be joint decisions rather than one ignoring the views of the other.

LegacyUser

Penny Tration wrote: »

Did you discuss it with your fiancee?


I can understand why she'd be furious if you discussed it and she was dead against it. Ultimately now you're getting married, large financial decisions should be joint decisions rather than one ignoring the views of the other.

I may be wrong but I get the impression that the OP is the person earning the bulk of the money rather than his fiancée. This in my opinion would remove a lot of the say of a partner regardless of getting married or not.

Wompa1

Yes, we discussed it. She felt that I should not have given money because we're having a kid. She also said it's really wrong of them to ask knowing I'm having a kid. Why can't they ask anybody else etc. She claims the most upsetting part is that they asked for $7k but the cost was $5k. She said they lied and shouldn't get anything....My mother and aunt are not getting any money from me, though. I mailed a cheque to the company last night.

This morning she was saying how hurt she is that at a time when we're having our first kid my family has not been supportive....

My family is 5k miles away. Her parents are not helping financially and either are mine. We don't need financial help. Her mother is going to mind the child for us when we're at work...because she doesn't work and lives near us. My parents currently do the same back in Ireland for my brothers kid.

I think she's being pretty irrational. I didn't do anything to help my brother with his kid. I don't expect help...I guess she does

For the last poster. I am earning the bulk of the money. In fact, right now, I am the only one saving. She's in debt due to a car loan and school loan.

fits

Did she expect you to let them live on the street or what? I'm sorry to be so blunt, but that seemed like the only alternative.

Wompa1

fits wrote: »

Did she expect you to let them live on the street or what? I'm sorry to be so blunt, but that seemed like the only alternative.

She wanted them to be backed into a corner to come up with another way, rather than 'using' me.

My aunt is hopefully getting power of attorney from my grandfather today. So, that means she can manage his finances. Clearly, he has not been saving a penny. In fact, he owes money on a credit card. I told my mother and aunt that, this was all I can do and that it's hurting my relationship with my fiancé.

My mother is coming for a visit (which I paid for as a 60th birthday present about 6 months ago) in 2.5 weeks. I paid for her to go to see my Grandfather and then come over to visit us....there's going to be a lot of tension now since my fiance distrusts her

zeffabelli

Wompa1 wrote: »

She wanted them to be backed into a corner to come up with another way, rather than 'using' me.

My aunt is hopefully getting power of attorney from my grandfather today. So, that means she can manage his finances. Clearly, he has not been saving a penny. In fact, he owes money on a credit card. I told my mother and aunt that, this was all I can do and that it's hurting my relationship with my fiancé.

My mother is coming for a visit (which I paid for as a 60th birthday present about 6 months ago) in 2.5 weeks. I paid for her to go to see my Grandfather and then come over to visit us....there's going to be a lot of tension now since my fiance distrusts her

Pregnant wives do not like it when money leaves the nest. In her mind, you just gave away baby money. You just took a bunch of stuff for the baby and gave it to this bumbling relative of yours. This is chimp/ pterdactly stuff.

Shes pissed t you but your mother is going to get it.

keithclancy

Hi OP,

Seen you mention this stuff elsewhere.

Just on the slant of living in another country without that network of family there, I would say you should just tell them it's not possible to help them financially, don't dig any deeper or try to analyse the story further.

You will never see that money again, if your mother in Ireland wants to send money to them and it's that important let her take a loan from the credit union, they will also let her pay back the money slowly over time and there will be no emotional ties muddying the arrangement.

If your mother cannot get the loan then there's a good reason why she can't get the loan.

In the end if you follow the path of paying out this money I think it will either end with:

A. You send the money, you don't want to upset the relationship between your mother and yourself so you don't ask for it back, your wife will resent you for this.

or

B. You pester your mother for the money, you get some of it back but not all of it and are seen as a bad guy because your relatives situation will of course become worse and you'll only be expected to send more.

Also you have to think about your own potential rainy days in the future, kids are expensive

Nip it in the bud now, just say no. If they ask why tell them it's because you love them and you don't want money to come between them in the future and you have your own family to think about.

Wompa1

keithclancy wrote: »

Hi OP,

Seen you mention this stuff elsewhere.

Just on the slant of living in another country without that network of family there, I would say you should just tell them it's not possible to help them financially, don't dig any deeper or try to analyse the story further.

You will never see that money again, if your mother in Ireland wants to send money to them and it's that important let her take a loan from the credit union, they will also let her pay back the money slowly over time and there will be no emotional ties muddying the arrangement.

If your mother cannot get the loan then there's a good reason why she can't get the loan.

In the end if you follow the path of paying out this money I think it will either end with:

A. You send the money, you don't want to upset the relationship between your mother and yourself so you don't ask for it back, your wife will resent you for this.

or

B. You pester your mother for the money, you get some of it back but not all of it and are seen as a bad guy because your relatives situation will of course become worse and you'll only be expected to send more.

Also you have to think about your own potential rainy days in the future, kids are expensive

Nip it in the bud now, just say no. If they ask why tell them it's because you love them and you don't want money to come between them in the future and you have your own family to think about.

Thanks for the advice. I ended up sending the money to the assisted living home. It should arrive tomorrow.

My mother would not be able to put anything into a credit union account in order to get the loan. From what I remember, you can borrow up to 3 times what you've got in there. My parents are flat broke. They say they don't have enough money for home heating oil again this year. My sister paid for it last year.

My father hasn't worked since early 2000. My mother works a lowly paid full time job. They didn't have any money to give..I don't doubt that. They live pretty frugally now and don't have the best quality of life for themselves. But that's a whole other thread!

My relatives in the US include the Skitzophrenic aunt who has apparently gone from so skinny she wouldn't shower because she would freeze afterwards to ballooning in weight. Sadly, it's probably a race to the finish between her and my grandfather. She's not capable of taking care of herself. The whole reason this has happened so suddenly is because they put my grandfather and that mentally disturbed aunt living together...neither are capable of looking after themselves. It was a recipe for disaster.

I have a cousin who is divorced, makes damn all and pays support to his ex. He's broke. I have an aunt working in a convenience store in upstate New York. Her husband is a reserve firefighter and works part time in a Department store...they don't have any money, they live week to week and rely on his parents for support for themselves.

The most tragic part is the most competent in that side of the family is my aunt that's mentally handicapped. She doesn't work, though but herself and her husband can take care of themselves which is more than I can say for the rest of the sisters!

I'm not in the dog house as much any more. My fiancé says she's just upset with the situation and not with me. She's still angry with my mother for lying so it will still be tense when she gets over here...

It turns out my fiancé says she has more reason to be stressed. She wants to quit her job. She's working a low paid job for the state...the insurance is great and will pay for everything through the pregnancy. But she's not sure if she can stick it. 5 people quit and she's been physically threatened twice in the last couple of months. Both times with the threat of being shot...I had told her before any of this happened that if she felt threatened to walk off the job and quit...she wants to hang in there for the insurance.

We live in a sh1t country...

keithclancy

Wompa1 wrote: »

We live in a sh1t country...

Indeed.... Just going forward remember, you need to put your family first (the three of you)

Be well.

Wompa1

keithclancy wrote: »

Indeed.... Just going forward remember, you need to put your family first (the three of you)

Be well.

Thanks! I plan to...this money may be for my own conscience more than anything else.