Whats the difference between PND and just being mentally worn out?

Lucuma

Don't hold back when you're talking to the GP I'll say that much. Don't play it down. Tell her what you've been thinking and feeling, even the dark stuff. unfortunately it can be the case that mothers with PND don't get taken seriously otherwise.

That PHN that you refer to.......what an absolute disgrace to her profession that she is. They are supposed to be trained to pick up on PND and to be watching out for it. It should have been obvious to her, why would you randomly bring it up like!

Nicman

So I've been to the GP. She asked several questions and said she felt it was alot more than just the effects of tiredness. I held back a little I guess until I was just about to leave and I told her the whole extent of it. She rang the PHN to come to my house today to assess me as urgent and although she says she wouldn't usually do this, she prescribed me a low dose of antidepressant just to get me started because it'll take a bit for them to kick in and she's concerned about me.
I told her about the other PHN who brushed it off a few months back and she's disgusted.
Anyway, although this day has been horrible and tough and I've cried all morning and hate to have this label now, I am so proud of myself and happy that I've dealt with this now.
I have to say talking to you all has given me the push I needed and for a bunch of people whom I've never met I am so so grateful to you for your help and support and for sharing your stories.
x

seoulone

Hi Nicman,

I was on Boards for another reason and came across your post. I couldn't not reply to you. I have to say that I am almost in tears reading this (at work) as you are so brave! Good on you. It's so hard to admit that you feel this way and I feel I had a very low mood with my first girl as she didn't sleep until 16 months old and was colicky and refluxy BUT I never got any support and never reached out to anyway and I should have. All of those things about comments from your Mum etc struck a cord with me. It's onwards and upwards for you from now on. You will have plenty of time to bond with your baby/toddler and it is never too late to help yourself. Being a well Mum is the main thing. Well done x

Nicman

seoulone wrote: »

Hi Nicman,

I was on Boards for another reason and came across your post. I couldn't not reply to you. I have to say that I am almost in tears reading this (at work) as you are so brave! Good on you. It's so hard to admit that you feel this way and I feel I had a very low mood with my first girl as she didn't sleep until 16 months old and was colicky and refluxy BUT I never got any support and never reached out to anyway and I should have. All of those things about comments from your Mum etc struck a cord with me. It's onwards and upwards for you from now on. You will have plenty of time to bond with your baby/toddler and it is never too late to help yourself. Being a well Mum is the main thing. Well done x

Aw God you poor thing. Although it's happened you a while ago I hope it helps to know you're not the only one who felt a certain way or thought certain things. It's hard when you feel like your family don't want to know about it although you've dropped some hints here and there but there you go! I actually broke down to my neighbour this morning - she asked if I wanted to go and call my mum to tell her after I came back from thte doctor and she'd mind my son and I told her I don't want to share this with her which is sad. Anyway you're right, number one priority is my own family now and our happiness - my son, my husband and I and that's what I am determined to work on. I'm sitting here since waiting for the PHN to come to assess me officially.... Weird

bp

Taking these steps is so brave. Remember you are a great mother x

monflat

I'm absolutely delighted you made the first steps.
Well done to you.
Keep the lines of communication open with your husband and talk to him.
Also enjoy your time off I hope your still planning on taking hours to urself tomorrow?

LegacyUser

Well done Nicmum. I'm so glad you went to the GP, I was going to say that I don't know if you have PND or not, but you have to talk to someone.

This is nothing to be ashamed of. You've had a rough ride. I had a week in hospital after the birth of my baby, then returned for another week after having a haemorrage, ended up having a D&C. Everytime anyone hears this they tell me "god you had it rough". I didn't feel like it, and thankfully I coped ok afterwards, but everyone was very concerned about my well being. I also have a refluxy baby. Hang on in there - have you had the GP look at the baby? There are treatments out there that could improve it. Everyone said it was "colic" but I knew - I KNEW - it was something else.

Never underestimate the effect of tiredness. I could never cope with anything when I was tired. I really struggled those days, and I have a baby who is a good sleeper - I can't imagine how you're keeping going.

Previously, (in my life before being a mother!!) I had a mild experience of depression. That feeling of not looking forward to anything - that's exactly how I felt. I just wanted to sit there and cry. Life felt like so so so much effort. When you start feeling like that, it's time to look for help. I had panic attacks at the same time for a while. Eventually I learned to cope but it was hard - and I didn't have a newborn at the time. Motherhood is great, but man, it is such unbelievably hard work. And some days you just have to dig so, so deep - and if you are finding it tough anyway, it's just not going to be in you to dig that deep.

Don't ever compare yourself to anybody else. Ever. You never know what's going on with them, or what might happen to them next time round. I don't think there's a mother on the planet that can truthfully say every day with small children is easy and amazing. Give you baby plenty of hugs and look after yourself well. Never feel bad about yourself because you've taken the first step of asking for help and you're doing the best you can to be the best mother you can. It will all come round eventually, just give it time.

fall

Well done Nicman on having the courage to open up. Don't worry about labels. You went through a trauma and you need help to get through it. There is no shame in that only honesty. Someday someone else will read this thread and it could give them help and support too. So be proud of yourself for doing something about it and cry if you need to. It is part of the healing.

Nicman

Thanks guys, yeah I feel alot better about it today and feel relieved actually. We had a nice family day together yesterday and I'm off today to meet a friend - child free both of us so I'm looking forward to that. x

2xj3hplqgsbkym

Well done nicman, very brave if you to ask for help. I hope you start to feel better soon, if the phn is not helpful make sure you go back to gp ASAP

Nead21

Nicman wrote: »

So I've been to the GP. She asked several questions and said she felt it was alot more than just the effects of tiredness. I held back a little I guess until I was just about to leave and I told her the whole extent of it. She rang the PHN to come to my house today to assess me as urgent and although she says she wouldn't usually do this, she prescribed me a low dose of antidepressant just to get me started because it'll take a bit for them to kick in and she's concerned about me.
I told her about the other PHN who brushed it off a few months back and she's disgusted.
Anyway, although this day has been horrible and tough and I've cried all morning and hate to have this label now, I am so proud of myself and happy that I've dealt with this now.
I have to say talking to you all has given me the push I needed and for a bunch of people whom I've never met I am so so grateful to you for your help and support and for sharing your stories.
x

Nicman I'm crying reading this. Thank you so much for posting. I have been feeling like this since my second baby was born. I've been brushing it off as tiredness but I know in my heart it's more. After reading your post I feel better about making an appointment with my GP for next week.

Nicman

Nead21 wrote: »

Nicman I'm crying reading this. Thank you so much for posting. I have been feeling like this since my second baby was born. I've been brushing it off as tiredness but I know in my heart it's more. After reading your post I feel better about making an appointment with my GP for next week.

Oh I am so glad you have that little push you needed to go to your GP. Be honest with the GP don't be embarrassed they won't judge you. I brushed it aside for so long because I might have a couple of good days and thought "this can't be PND if I'm not at home crying all day everyday" but there's different levels of it. Also you know how it should feel after having a baby since this is your second.
Best of luck. Let me know how you get on. X

fro9etb8j5qsl2

lolademmers wrote: »

One thing I will say to you is don't compare yourself to other mothers!! You think someone has their sh!t together and they could be struggling too. I remember after my first was born what a shock it was the hormones and huge sense of responsibility for this tiny baby. It was overwhelming especially coz no one had ever mentioned it.

This^^^^^
Sometimes I barely manage to throw on a pair of trackie pants and tie my hair back before leaving the house. Other days, by some miracle, I manage to put on some makeup and look half decent. I used to always look at the mammies who seemed to have it all together until I realised that I probably look like I have it together myself at times when in reality, I'm just about treading water and surviving by taking deep breaths and bribing my children with biscuits :pac:

Nobody ever mentioned the overwhelming responsibility to me beforehand either, it was such a shock. I would look at all my friends who were gushing on facebook about how in love they were with their perfect babies and I thought I was the only one who was feeling like crawling under the bed and hiding away from everything. It wasn't until I was chatting one day with my next door neighbour (who is in her 50s and a childminder) and she started talking about it and I realised it's probably more common than I thought.Thankfully the feelings passed for me and I found it easier after my second baby as I knew what to expect.

I'm glad you went to your gp nicman I hope you feel better soon

Lucuma

Kiara Round Bowler wrote: »

Nobody ever mentioned the overwhelming responsibility to me beforehand either

One friend was truthful/warned me about it. A guy. He said ''the first 6 months are sh1t, really tough going''

I try to do the same now whenever I'm chatting to new parents to be. I really appreciate that he was honest with me!

Diamond Doll

Kiara Round Bowler wrote: »

I would look at all my friends who were gushing on facebook about how in love they were with their perfect babies and I thought I was the only one who was feeling like crawling under the bed and hiding away from everything.

This is so true!

I'll never forget one morning when my baby was only a few weeks old, sitting in a baby massage class with him. The other mothers were breastfeeding their babies, I almost felt dirty when I pulled out a bottle of formula for mine. My baby had cradle cap, none of the other babies did, I assumed they thought I didn't wash his hair. If my baby cried, I worried that every other mother was judging me for that. If he didn't, I wondered why the other babies were crying and looking for cuddles, and mine wasn't. I was upset looking at the mothers who had clearly instantly lost their baby weight; I was upset looking at the mothers who hadn't but who seemed to me to be so happy and confident in their post-baby bodies anyways.

In hindsight, I feel so sorry for me. I'd love to give "that" me a hug! My baby was (and is) perfectly well and loved and healthy and happy. So what if I was feeding him formula - he was perfectly well fed. So what if he had cradle cap - loads of babies do, it was no reflection on my care for him. So what if I still had a mummy tummy - I was out, dressed, makeup on me, and I had my six week old at a feckin baby massage class for crying out loud, that seems fairly supermum-ish to me, even though I felt a million miles from supermum at the time!

It took me a looong time to realise that pretty much every other mother has the same doubts and worries and fears that I had. And that pretty much no mother feels they're operating at full capacity as a mother, all of the time. Sure how can you, when you have a house to run, maybe a career too (plus exams to sit in my case), all the rest.

Looking back, I was (and am) a pretty awesome mother. I just hope I can realise that at the time, next time around!

Nicman

I wish that was all I felt diamond doll. I am so indifferent right now I don't care about other mothers or babies. I dont care about anything. The guilt I feel is because I imagined ways to kill my own baby. Because I rocked his cot so hard he cried and cried and cried but that was because I didn't feel safe to take him out of it. Because I feel like my husband and child would be better in this world without me. Because I looked at my antidepressants the other day and for a second, thought "what if I just took them all". Because one day I sat my child in my bed and turned my back to him and lay there without feeding him til my husband came home. The way I am feeling right now is that I want to disappear .... I don't want to be dead but I don't want to be alive.
I'm not saying these things for sympathy or shock but if there's another mother reading this who feels any of this stuff it's time to go get help before you do somwthin you'll regret

bp

Ah Nicman, you are so brave to come here and not follow through on those thoughts.

Keep talking to us and everyone else. When you get those feelings call your hubby home or ask a neighbour to feed him so you get a break. Mammy guilt is a terrible thing that all mammys get in some shape or form

X

LegacyUser

Hang in there Nicmum.You're going in the right direction but it will take a while to sort itself.Try not to think too much about how you or don't feel, just concentrate on looking after yourself.

Separately, have you spoken to the GP at all about the baby?Our little one has silent reflux but we didn't know that at the start.She used to scream and scream in the car seat and pram, and I got to a point where I was afraid to go anywhere because she was so hysterical.When I told the doctor I was stuck at home and really struggling with it, she started to really listen to me about the reflux and we found something that worked for the baby to relieve it.There are ways to help manage all these things and if you could figure something out so your little guy was a bit less cranky, you might feel a bit less stressed out too

Nicman

DizzyIssy wrote: »

Hang in there Nicmum.You're going in the right direction but it will take a while to sort itself.Try not to think too much about how you or don't feel, just concentrate on looking after yourself.

Separately, have you spoken to the GP at all about the baby?Our little one has silent reflux but we didn't know that at the start.She used to scream and scream in the car seat and pram, and I got to a point where I was afraid to go anywhere because she was so hysterical.When I told the doctor I was stuck at home and really struggling with it, she started to really listen to me about the reflux and we found something that worked for the baby to relieve it.There are ways to help manage all these things and if you could figure something out so your little guy was a bit less cranky, you might feel a bit less stressed out too

He did have colic and silent reflux for a while but that seems to have sorted itself. He's really not a cranky child he's generally quite jolly and rarely cries unless he's sick. It's not cause of him I feel like this. He had been cranky for a while because he had a run of ear infections and viruses and then teeth but there wasn't much I could do there it defo made me feel alot worse. He's great now,just I'm not!

Lucuma

My baby was a model baby and it didn't stop PND from visiting my door. I had the birth I wanted (wasn't induced, no epidural, no interventions) breastfeeding went great from day 1, she slept normally, no colic. Teeth haven't really bothered her (and she has millions of them) so in my case it was simply a hormonal and chemical crash that occured in my brain. Thankfully medication and time and a brillant partner fixed it.

I have great faith in the drugs, they do work! (but they can take time and tweaking)

Did the PHN come Nicman? What comes out of that process? I didn't go through that as my GP sent me straight into the psych dept of the hospital.

Nicman

Lucuma wrote: »

My baby was a model baby and it didn't stop PND from visiting my door. I had the birth I wanted (wasn't induced, no epidural, no interventions) breastfeeding went great from day 1, she slept normally, no colic. Teeth haven't really bothered her (and she has millions of them) so in my case it was simply a hormonal and chemical crash that occured in my brain. Thankfully medication and time and a brillant partner fixed it.

I have great faith in the drugs, they do work! (but they can take time and tweaking)

Did the PHN come Nicman? What comes out of that process? I didn't go through that as my GP sent me straight into the psych dept of the hospital.

So glad you're well now lucuma . Phn didn't come I'm not sure what happens now as I've had no contact from anyone but I'm back to gptoday. I felt I needed to come back to see what's happening because since I've opened up I feel I'm not coping at all. Felt relieved at first but now I just want to disappear off the planet until the drugs kick in. Feel like I'm having a breakdown of sorts. I'm going to tell her I can't wait for counselling etc I'm worse than I thought ...will let you know what happens

Lucuma

Nicman wrote: »

So glad you're well now lucuma . Phn didn't come I'm not sure what happens now as I've had no contact from anyone but I'm back to gptoday. I felt I needed to come back to see what's happening because since I've opened up I feel I'm not coping at all. Felt relieved at first but now I just want to disappear off the planet until the drugs kick in. Feel like I'm having a breakdown of sorts. I'm going to tell her I can't wait for counselling etc I'm worse than I thought ...will let you know what happens

I was the same and I did exactly the same ! I went back to the GP a few days later adn told her I felt like I needed to go to hospital and couldn't wait for the anti-ds to kick in so they had to give me a drug which takes effect immediately to tide me over for the couple of weeks til the anti-ds kicked in. My GP wouldn't prescribe that drug though, she referred me into the (public) psych dept and they assessed me and they prescribed that drug for me which gave immediate relief. Following on from that the GP was happy to prescribe that drug as a follow-up prescription but she wouldn't do it first day off her own bat.

LegacyUser

Nicman wrote: »

I wish that was all I felt diamond doll. I am so indifferent right now I don't care about other mothers or babies. I dont care about anything. The guilt I feel is because I imagined ways to kill my own baby. Because I rocked his cot so hard he cried and cried and cried but that was because I didn't feel safe to take him out of it. Because I feel like my husband and child would be better in this world without me. Because I looked at my antidepressants the other day and for a second, thought "what if I just took them all". Because one day I sat my child in my bed and turned my back to him and lay there without feeding him til my husband came home. The way I am feeling right now is that I want to disappear .... I don't want to be dead but I don't want to be alive.
I'm not saying these things for sympathy or shock but if there's another mother reading this who feels any of this stuff it's time to go get help before you do somwthin you'll regret

I'm still feeling like this, three years later. I never went for help, I have the major fear of the hse anyway.. I thought it would get better on its own but it never did.
That bit you said about laying the baby in the middle of the bed, I've done that. I still think about ways to "get out of it" and I feel like a monster for it. Three ye are like. I've not been able to force myself to have sex since before that child was born, I don't know if that's because Im afraid of landing myself back at square one again, I definitely never want to have another child, or if it's because I hate my partner for ruining my life, or if it's cos it still reminds me of the traumatic birth. I feel absolutely ****ing dead inside and seriously, so much time had passed now I don't even know if it's not just become the new me. Its become normal. <Mod Snip- forbidden topic>
You're so much braver than some of us you know. I hope it gets better for you.

Nicman

Lucuma wrote: »

I was the same and I did exactly the same ! I went back to the GP a few days later adn told her I felt like I needed to go to hospital and couldn't wait for the anti-ds to kick in so they had to give me a drug which takes effect immediately to tide me over for the couple of weeks til the anti-ds kicked in. My GP wouldn't prescribe that drug though, she referred me into the (public) psych dept and they assessed me and they prescribed that drug for me which gave immediate relief. Following on from that the GP was happy to prescribe that drug as a follow-up prescription but she wouldn't do it first day off her own bat.

That's interesting. Yeah my doc said she can't give me anything else to expedite this. But she did ask some serious questions and rang my husband while i was there and told him I can't be on my own and that he needs to clear out all medication from the house until the meds kick in :-( Wasnt nice to hear but it has to be done I guess. I almost felt yesterday that I wanted someone to come and take me away from it all. I'll take it day by day and if I still don't feel good I'll go back before Monday (she wants to see me back Monday). The PHN is calling to me this week as well. I had my mother in law here for the day today. I love her to bits and she's great but I found it exhausting just to not be alone for the day you know....

Neyite

Mod:

Hey ladies, I'm sorry to have to say this but Boards have a policy of not allowing any discussions about suicide. Any discussion, however well intentioned, could inadvertently have an adverse effect on someone vulnerable. This also applies to people wanting to help those in distress. We don't have the expertise, or the resources to give the appropriate help and could do more harm than good. I don't want to see this thread locked or deleted because of this reason - its too useful and would be a shame. Some posts might get snipped or deleted if they mention suicide.

So, because of this, can I ask that anyone who is feeling this way, please contact the correct professionals below:

Suicide

turn2me.org - online mental health community providing peer and professional support to people in distress.

Pieta House - Suicide and Self Harm Crisis Centre, providing services for those who are in suicidal distress and those who engage in self-harm. Contact information for your local Pieta House can be found here.

National Office for Suicide Prevention - information and signposting resource regarding suicide in Ireland. NOSP is not a crisis support service.

Here are some other links that might be of benefit to posters:


Depression / Mental Health

Samaritans Ireland - (116 123) - 24 hour support organisation for anybody going through a difficult period of their life. You can also contact your local branch of Samaritans.

GROW - (1890 474 474) - mental health organisation which helps people who have suffered, or are suffering, from mental health problems. Grow also hold regular meetings throughout Ireland.

GROW Young Adult - resources specifically to help the needs of young adults.

Aware - (1890 303 302) - service for people who experience depression and concerned family and friends of those suffering from depression.

Shine - national organisation dedicated to upholding the rights and addressing the needs of all those affected by mental ill health.

Pieta House - Suicide and Self Harm Crisis Centre, providing services for those who are in suicidal distress and those who engage in self-harm. Contact information for your local Pieta House can be found here.

Mental Health Ireland - Information Service on issues relating to mental health and mental illness.

IACP - Irish Association for Counselling & Psychotherapy. Provides services to help you to find a therapist in your area.

LegacyUser

Day by day Nicman.That's all you have to do.Your GP sounds quite good, great she wants to see you again on Monday.And it's Wednesday now, over the hump in the week, hopefully your husband will be around at the weekend and you'll have company.I guess one way to think of it is that this has been a long time in the making, so it won't sort itself out straight away, but you'll get there.You're being incredibly strong., and there is nothing wrong with asking for help.

Lucuma

Nicman wrote: »

That's interesting. Yeah my doc said she can't give me anything else to expedite this. But she did ask some serious questions and rang my husband while i was there and told him I can't be on my own and that he needs to clear out all medication from the house until the meds kick in :-( Wasnt nice to hear but it has to be done I guess. I almost felt yesterday that I wanted someone to come and take me away from it all. I'll take it day by day and if I still don't feel good I'll go back before Monday (she wants to see me back Monday). The PHN is calling to me this week as well. I had my mother in law here for the day today. I love her to bits and she's great but I found it exhausting just to not be alone for the day you know....

Hmmmm......
I know for a fact there are GPs that will prescribe Xanax and the likes (that's not what I was on but that would be an example of something that has immediate affect) however mine and yours obviously are not 2 of those GPs. You need to go and see a psychiatrist methinks. They will have the full plethora of medication at their disposal and find one that works for you. I was really lucky with my GP I know, she referred me straight into the public psych dept (which I've subsequently found out can be very hard for people to access coz it's so stretched/at breaking point) I was assessed and drug prescribed and all within one day. In my opinion from what you've said here you're as bad as I was and I don't see why you're not being offered that service. Can you demand it from her?
The other option, if you can afford it is to go see a psychiatrist privately - only thing is it could cost between 100-200 euro I'm not sure how much exactly. But one appointment could be all you need for now anyway just to get the prescription. Your GP will have to refer you to the private one as well (as far as I know) but if ye have the cash it might be the way to go. I wouldn't like to have to wait the couple of weeks for the anti-ds to kick in if you're as bad as this hon xx

Nicman

Sorry Mod, my bad I didnt think but thanks for all those links, that too is a helpful thing to have on this thread.

Lucuma, yeah I guess she's ringing me every day and making sure I'm not alone and stuff so if it came to it I suppose she'd send me into hospital. I don't want to wait for meds to kick in but I don't want to go to hospital so if i can just ride this out.... if i feel worse I'll tell her and let her see. I really do trust her and think she knows whats best for me and my family right now.

Nicman

So. Here I am in the Psych unit. Been here for the last 3 weeks. Keep wanting to follow up but it's so hard to say these things "out loud". I feel a sense of duty to follow up though for others who might be feeling like I have been and looking for hope or advice or just to know that they're not alone. I was admitted at crisis point by my doctor and diagnosed with severe postnatal depression and psychosis.
The meds still aren't fully working, I don't have the psychosis anymore but the depression is so severe it's crippling. It's too much for me to go into the details here but if anyone is reading this and wondering if they should take the next step please do and please feel free to PM me.

Das Kitty

Thinking of you Nicman. Xx