The Witness

tok9

Finally picked it up earlier today and played for an hour or 2 and so far I love it. Going back and forth between puzzles and just having that eureka moment is wonderful.

I'm only after getting the first laser going and finished up there for tonight. I'll crack on again tomorrow.

johnny_ultimate

I would say there's a narrative but not a plot if that makes any sense. The environment, logs and occasionally puzzles themselves provide context and hints, and I think a number of prevalent themes and ideas emerge the more you explore. But they're boiling away in the background, rarely front and centre (audio logs excepted, but even they're thematically focused as opposed to directly explanatory). But for anything concrete about what's happened on the island, those hints are well hidden.

That said, it perhaps conjures up the strongest sense of place I've experienced in a game in a long while. The level of detail and design (the presence of architects is keenly felt!) are incredible and it's a real sensory feast.

I haven't played nearly as much as you guys from what I've read. I'll keep an open mind non the less.

It feels identical to Antichamber and Talos Principle so far. Both decent games but certainly not ground breaking must-play games. They are vessels for quirky puzzles. Although after looking up quick reviews just now, they do score very highly! Maybe I'm just not completely sold on the genre.

If you feel like taking off the binoculars, you can change fov: http://www.gamerevolution.com/faq/the-witness/how-to-fix-the-field-of-view-fov-on-pc-version-121961

I find the tetris block puzzles the hardest by miles. I thought I figured them out around 5 times only for them to break the rules I had came up with.

strelok

how I feel playing the witness

johnny_ultimate

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I find the tetris block puzzles the hardest by miles. I thought I figured them out around 5 times only for them to break the rules I had came up with.

At the tail-end of them and they are indeed brain melting. The first one up on the balcony just wouldn't click with me for ages, thankfully the rest haven't been quite so stupefying but the next one I have to tackle looks tricky.

Definitely one of the sets I've found a pen and paper handy for to visualise some of the combinations.

My camera roll is becoming increasingly chock full of line puzzle reference photos too :pac:

Ugh there was one set of puzzles that weren't intuitive. It was in a room with lots of flowers and stain glass. You have to separate each set of colours into its own box. The first 6 or so follow this rule. One of them then breaks this. You have to just make sure different colours aren't in the same box. Meaning you can have two boxes for one colour if you can't join them. I was stuck on puzzle there for 30 mins. Was this my fault? Or did other people make the same logical error?

so what's the verdict after 20 to 30 hours - anyone got that far? gets boringly repetitive or still think it's good?

the silence is deafening - think that I'll pass on this game or wait for a deal down the line.

The Witness. It's a handy little game where I can throw on a podcast on or listen to some music at the same time. It's identical to Talos Principle or Antichamber. I'm not sure I can consider it a game in the traditional sense. It's like playing those brain training games. It's overrated. A solid 8/10 puzzler at best. A game like Portal is 10/10 in this genre. Too bad there is almost a non existent narrative. It isn't a patch on Braid so I was quite underwhelmed at first, but comparing those two games is apples and oranges. It's missing some of the twitch elements from Braid. There is no element of skill or time pressure to any of the puzzles so it's like doing a crossword at a leisurely pace. There is something about a first person puzzle game that just feels off. I don't really care much for the "beauty" of the island. In fact, I wish it would direct you to incomplete puzzles. I found myself wandering the same areas far too much not knowing where to go. You absolutely have to increase the fov. I was getting motion sickness before increasing it.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

The Witness. It's a handy little game where I can throw on a podcast on or listen to some music at the same time. It's identical to Talos Principle or Antichamber. I'm not sure I can consider it a game in the traditional sense. It's like playing those brain training games. It's overrated. A solid 8/10 puzzler at best. A game like Portal is 10/10 in this genre. Too bad there is almost a non existent narrative. It isn't a patch on Braid so I was quite underwhelmed at first, but comparing those two games is apples and oranges. It's missing some of the twitch elements from Braid. There is no element of skill or time pressure to any of the puzzles so it's like doing a crossword at a leisurely pace. There is something about a first person puzzle game that just feels off. I don't really care much for the "beauty" of the island. In fact, I wish it would direct you to incomplete puzzles. I found myself wandering the same areas far too much not knowing where to go. You absolutely have to increase the fov. I was getting motion sickness before increasing it.

yes it seems like this game was over-hyped. the price is too much for just a set of line puzzles tbh. seems like they get a bit too frustrating for a lot of people also forcing abandonment or resorting to online solutions.

johnny_ultimate

In contrast, I am 20 hours in and am still being surprised and impressed at the level of ingenuity and depth on display. It's easily the most brilliantly designed game I've played in several years, and am finding it absolutely engrossing. It's tough but fair, and have yet to look up any solutions - as Blow himself has indicated, it would be real shame to do so given how rewarding figuring out the game's ruleset is. It also boasts the most beautiful and intriguing game world I have explored in the longest time, an absolute triumph of art design and careful environmental storytelling.

glasso

glasso wrote: »

yes it seems like this game was over-hyped. the price is too much for just a set of line puzzles tbh. seems like they get a bit too frustrating for a lot of people also forcing abandonment or resorting to online solutions.

That said, I find it very... therapeutic. It's incredibly relaxing as long as you are slowly making progress. I imagine a game like this would be absolutely amazing on the oculus rift. It surprises me at how many different puzzles Jonathon Blow can create out of a simple two-dimensional board where you essentially are drawing a line from point A to B.

I can see why people can give it 10/10 but I can also see why some people would give it 3/10. Is it worth the game worth price tag alone? Probably just about, but more importantly I want to fund this guy Jonathon Blow to continue to make games like this. He is obviously a very, very smart guy and he's doing innovative things.

johnny_ultimate

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

In contrast, I am 20 hours in and am still being surprised and impressed at the level of ingenuity and depth on display. It's easily the most brilliantly designed game I've played in several years, and am finding it absolutely engrossing. It's tough but fair, and have yet to look up any solutions - as Blow himself has indicated, it would be real shame to do so given how rewarding figuring out the game's ruleset is. It also boasts the most beautiful and intriguing game world I have explored in the longest time, an absolute triumph of art design and careful environmental storytelling.

What story is there to tell? Random preaching voice notes describing Blow's philosophical leaning don't add up to a story to me. Stone people dotted around the Island? To compare this to Portal; they aren't a patch on GLaDOS or Wheatley.

tok9

Over 180 puzzles in myself and I absolutely adore the game too.

Going from having no idea to solving multiple rules in a puzzle feels so rewarding. I won't lie though I have looked up how to solve 1 puzzle. I'm seriously going to try and refrain from that again.

Now I've just learned to move on and come back later.

Zillah

Deleted User wrote: »

I imagine a game like this would be absolutely amazing on the oculus rift.

It apparently has hidden VR support which can be activated via command line. It's buggy and alpha-ish but it exists. I'll make a wager that a patch will go live that activates it properly once CV1 starts arriving on doorsteps.

johnny_ultimate

glasso wrote:

yes it seems like this game was over-hyped. the price is too much for just a set of line puzzles tbh.

The 'just line puzzles' argument is IMO an extremely reductive take on the game, no better than claiming Half Life is 'just shooting' or Street Fighter 'just fighting'. Yes the core mechanic is tracing a line through mazes, but it's a mechanic that reveals immense depths and variety as you progress through the game.

I'd go as far as to say the game is Blow and his team critically responding to prevalent game design trends. Too many games reveal pretty much all their mechanical nuances within an hour or two, then spend varying amounts of times creating minor variations on a theme, or using fairly lazy methods of varying the flow or challenge (longer health bars, weapon restrictions etc...). Some (most?) games don't even do that, instead just making the player do the same thing over and over and over with few attempts to refresh the formula. Games that legitimately continue to surprise after a two dozen hours are very thin on the ground.

The Witness is, at least partially, an attempt to make a long, large game that is constantly reinventing itself and genuinely challenging the player's understanding of perhaps the most straightforward central mechanic possible. I'm not a game designer, but this **** is game design porn - an idea taken to its creative extreme.

There's a memorable moment midway Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath that forces you to completely re-evaluate and re-learn everything you've learned to date through an ingenious narrative rug pull. From there on out the game fundamentally changes in a really refreshing and interesting way. It's the same game but radically different too. The Witness feels like dozens of smaller moments like that.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What story is there to tell? Random preaching voice notes describing Blow's philosophical leaning don't add up to a story to me. Stone people dotted around the Island? To compare this to Portal; they aren't a patch on GLaDOS or Wheatley.

I would say Portal and The Witness are pretty much incomparable - and I don't meant that as a slight on either, because they're both superb in their own way.

As I suggested elsewhere in the thread, The Witness' story is less about plot but quiet, elliptical ruminations on its themes and ideas. Sometimes that's through the loosely scattered recorders, more often it's images or scenes subtly planted around the environment. If anything, the recorders are one of the more heavy handed methods employed here.

There's more overt examples of that - the keep, for example, has quite a bit of 'story' compared to other locations. But the island itself is intriguingly mysterious and communicative too, deeply atmospheric and full of secrets, connections and background details. That's what I mean with 'environmental storytelling'. There's certainly nothing in the way of wise-cracking psychopathic artificial intelligence, and the narrative is frankly more understated than I ever expected. It's more comparable to a painting or 'non-narrative' cinema at times, although I think there's more obvious 'narrative' there too. But it's the kind of aesthetic and approach I increasingly appreciate in games, and this is one of the most masterly approaches to that I've yet had the pleasure to experience

johnny_ultimate

The way to access

the rapidly closing door in the treehouse section

took me a bloody age to figure out - although it might be one of the most deviously clever in the game.

tok9

So I'm stuck and I don't mean by a puzzle. In one of the area's

The Quarry

, I'm in a shed (one of the points for the boat) and I solved a puzzle which allowed me to raise a panel so I could reach a higher point.

Then I solved some more puzzles and that panel moves to another point but I didn't get on it at the time. Now I can't get to it and I've no way of getting back to the ground. I've tried resetting the puzzles but that's been no use.

Have I missed something?

EDIT: Forget it, I just figured it out. Amazing how quickly that happens when you take a small break.

tok9

And with that, I've finished the quarry area. The tetris puzzles are definitely the ones causing me most issue.

tok9

tok9 wrote: »

And with that, I've finished the quarry area. The tetris puzzles are definitely the ones causing me most issue.

Yeah same. I managed to fluke my way through the "tutorial" puzzles thinking I had it figured out. I hadn't. Just to reiterate it's rule; if you wrap a line around a tetris block:

1. the line must make the shape of that block
2. the shape can end on the edge of the playing field
3. two blocks can be added together to make up one shape
4. ...
5. Can you rotate the blocks if you feel like it? As in, the shape you draw is actually at 90 degrees to the block?
6. What about those blocks that are slightly diagonal? Different rules for them?

Captain Chaos

The blocks that are diagonal can be rotated in any direction you like to suit but must keep their shape. I rotated two L shapes into each other to make a 2x6 rectangle for example.

johnny_ultimate

If you're not already using a pen & paper (as essential as a phone camera), they're a big help for the Tetris blocks. Especially in the later ones, it's immensely helpful to quickly sketch out the sorts of overall shapes at your disposal. Has definitely helped it click in my mind a few times. Of course things get extra fun when they add the hollow blue blocks

The swamp is a hugely satisfying area to clear when you finally get there, particularly since it seems to be overall one of the larger, longer spaces in the game.

tok9

I really want to finish off the town area as every time I go there I feel under prepared.

I think I should be able to get a bit further there now.

I've yet to come across the stars anywhere except the town in the middle

I was passing through the jungle for the umpteenth time when I heard that mobile phone going off... why the feck would there be a mobile phone going- ohhh of course

kearneybobs

There's something really satisfying about noticing the environmental puzzles, the ones that the objects/paths/shadows when lined up allow you to trace them out. Not quite as satisfactory as the eureka moment of truly understanding the rules of the line puzzles and applying them.

Finished it earlier got all

11

of the lasers and completed it. Not sure if I've the patience to go for 100% and get all the puzzles but it says that I've 423 solves, +54 (whatever that means)
Had to use a pen and paper regularly and made a table of colours and

what those colours are when behind different coloured lights/glass.

I really struggled with the

audio

related puzzles. Not sure why.

The absence of story was not a problem for me but I wouldn't have moaned if there was more about it in there. I did notice that some of the larger statues

do line up with the smaller ones. Over in the swamp area where you drain water from the underground the statues line up like reaching statues.

Did anybody spot this in the tree-top area?

Turn your head sideways to see a person praying on their knees

kearneybobs

There's so many hidden people/silhouettes. There's even a scorch mark that looks like a person in

the courtyard area

.