Working way too much overtime, no lunches

LegacyUser

Hi there

recently got my dream job after a few intern ships and a year long contract in another place in a similar field.

The job I had before this was fine but I wanted to try something new. I deeply regret this. When I signed my contract it stated that I might have to work overtime if there was excess work to do. For no extra pay. A bit of a red flag but I assumed this was a few times when deadlines piled up which I was prepared for.

My hours are normally 9 to 6. However I am here a month now and I have worked at least 10 hours with no lunch almost ever day here since I started. There is simply too much work to do as the company are taking on too many clients. Meaning I have to stay back and do it. I'm always the last in the office after the MD.

I'm here since 9 now and it's 18:45 with another hours at least work ahead of me. I'm exhausted but I can't walk out of the job as no place will hire me thinking I up and left after a month.

I'm slowly losing my life and my sanity with this. I'm only 21 and I don't want to be doing this at my age if ever. What can I do?

Youngblood.III

The maximum working week is 48hrs averaged over 4 weeks, go to citizens advice clinic or contact NERA.

Are you rostered for a lunch..if so take it no matter how busy, if it been denied that's illegal.

Mrs OBumble

Have you spoken to your manager about how you can work more efficiently? if you're only there a month, you're still learning how to do things, and should be getting detailed guidance if you're new to the area.

LegacyUser

You have to start learning to speak up.This isn't an unusual problem for people starting out in the workplace.Firstly, take your lunch.Down tools, walk away and take 30 mins or whatever to eat.You are entitled to it, nobody will begrudge you it (despite what you might think).The work is going nowhere, it will still be there when you've eaten.
Secondly, you need to speak to your manager about your workload.If you keep doing overtime, it will be expected that you will do it, if that makes sense.You need to talk to your manager about your worklaod, but more importantly you need to stand up and walk out at finishing time every day.Nobody is going to tell you to go home, and nobody is going to thank you for staying.It's up to you.If the work doesn't get done, then it's evidence that they need more staff.The only thing for you to do is flag it loud and clear that certain things will be delayed or won't get done because of the workload, and keep saying that.
You'll learn that the only person looking out for you in the workplace is you.Don't ever forget that, so it's up to you to lay down what you will and won't do within reason, because nobody else is going to do it for you.No company will go under because you did your working hours, then went home.No job is so important that you can't eat your lunch (unless you're a medical person, maybe).

therecklessone

Youngblood.III wrote: »

The maximum working week is 48hrs averaged over 4 weeks, go to citizens advice clinic or contact NERA.

Are you rostered for a lunch..if so take it no matter how busy, if it been denied that's illegal.

The maximum working work is 48hrs BUT is averaged over 4 months (6 months in some cases, or as detailed in a collective agreement)

OP you are entitled to breaks under legislation called the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 Check your entitlement there, and get back to us if you have an y further questions.

I would not recommend simply taking a break without first discussing this with your employer. We still live in an economy where employers hold the whip hand, you are in the first month of your employment and have less employment rights than people who are working for more than one year. Staff who demand can often find they are staff who are no longer in demand.

I would suggest taking Mrs O Bumble's advice, I'm sure that a case can be made for your working efficiency suffering as a result of the long hours and lack of breaks and that you can be more effective if adequately rested.

Best of luck.

MarkAnthony

Honestly OP legislation aside it's a suck it up IMHO especially at 21. Now's the time to put in the 10 and 12 hour days and get to were you can in your career. I did when I was that age.

Maybe I'm jaded that I'll have to do it again in my late 30s but that's what happens when you change careers.

Being blunt if you're not willing to do it, many will.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Talk with your manager about workload and your supervisor about work methods.

Either they will reduce your workload or give you guidance in getting through the work. Being new you could be going about things the wrong way which could well be why you are having to do overtime.

Jim2007

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Honestly OP legislation aside it's a suck it up IMHO especially at 21. Now's the time to put in the 10 and 12 hour days and get to were you can in your career. I did when I was that age.

Total and utter nonsense! If you had a bit of respect for yourself you would not allow yourself to be treated this way. Act like a doormat and people will walk on you.

MarkAnthony

Jim2007 wrote: »

Total and utter nonsense! If you had a bit of respect for yourself you would not allow yourself to be treated this way. Act like a doormat and people will walk on you.

I never allowed myself to be a doormat. There were employees who decided it was time to go at 5pm and others that wanted to stay and make a name for themsleves. I had no less respect for the 5pm finishers when I passed them out in the promotion chain and eneded up being their boss, they had other priorities, which was fair enough if they pulled their weight when they were at work. The OP's time to shine is now, perhaps I put that across to flippantly but it's an opputunity that's going to be harder and harder to get as you get older.

As an aside if you're 'BeyondExhausted' on a 9 - 19:00 shift there is something wrong. Unless you're doing a very manual job.

It's a judgement call OP - nothing is more important that your health of course.

Gi joe!

MarkAnthony wrote: »

.

As an aside if you're 'BeyondExhausted' on a 9 - 19:00 shift there is something wrong. Unless you're doing a very manual job.

This would be the case if the OP was taking a lunch and if it wasn't every day, however with them not applying I can fully understand how someone would be exhausted if they had to keep up this kind of routine.

I have a hard time understanding the work culture of some companies that expects 10+ hours days, or the notion of 'being seen' working these kinds of hours equating to more career success. More and more research is showing that work productivity plummets after a certain amount of time, along with the terrible effects on your health.

davo10

Jim2007 wrote: »

Total and utter nonsense! If you had a bit of respect for yourself you would not allow yourself to be treated this way. Act like a doormat and people will walk on you.

The 3 A's employers look for when assessing employees for promotion, Aittitude, Aptitude and Ambition. Some are clock watchers, some want to graft a bit more to be noticed and improve their chances of promotion. Doesn't make you a bad employee if you leave at 5pm nor a good one if you stay on, but if you leave when the manager/boss wants you to stay on, then the guy/gal who will stay in moves ahead of you. Like it or not, that's the way of the working world, others will say that's crap and that merit and talent always wins out but most employers want that and a bit more.

It's not always about "productivity", every company has a manager who got there not because they were the most productive but more likely that they knew how to look productive when it mattered and that is often when the clock watchers have gone home.

stateofflux

OP I have been in your situation a few times. At the end of the day your personal happiness and health is THE most important thing.

NO job is more important than this. Working long hours is fine if you are enjoying it but from your post i do not think this is the case.

If i were in your position i would visualize this job being very short term, start believing in the fact that you are a fantastic asset to ANY Company.

Start looking around actively for other jobs now and do interviews, hang in there for a couple of months until something comes up but Only if you think you can handle it

ask yourself 'whats the worst possible thing that can happen if i leave?'...the reality is not as terrible as you think.

Best of Luck!

Youngblood.III

MarkAnthony wrote: »

There were employees who decided it was time to go at 5pm and others that wanted to stay and make a name for themsleves. I had no less respect for the 5pm finishers when I passed them out in the promotion chain and eneded up being their boss.

Some would say if you can't complete your days work in the 8hrs, you're not managing your work day... people can achevie all their work in 8hrs and some have to stay on late, this doesn't make you manager material.
Promotion should be based on many things like work quality, but not late working and ass kissing....but unfortunately it is.

Example, my current boss was the least productive and awful moaner, a great man to pass off jobs to others. He got the job because no one wanted it and he kissued the right asses..he is not a good boss, he will not last as we don't respect or his ways.

Jim2007

MarkAnthony wrote: »

I never allowed myself to be a doormat. There were employees who decided it was time to go at 5pm and others that wanted to stay and make a name for themsleves. I had no less respect for the 5pm finishers when I passed them out in the promotion chain and eneded up being their boss, they had other priorities, which was fair enough if they pulled their weight when they were at work. The OP's time to shine is now, perhaps I put that across to flippantly but it's an opputunity that's going to be harder and harder to get as you get older.

As an aside if you're 'BeyondExhausted' on a 9 - 19:00 shift there is something wrong. Unless you're doing a very manual job.

It's a judgement call OP - nothing is more important that your health of course.

Honestly if the only way you can get a head at your employers is pile on lots of unpaid overtime then it really is not much of a place to work. Over the past 30 years I've held several management positions at firms in mainland Europe and I never expected any of my team to work an hour beyond their contracted hours nor did I do overtime either.

At the end of the day it is just a job, not your life, or it least it should not be.

davo10

Youngblood.III wrote: »

Some would say if you can't complete your days work in the 8hrs, you're not managing your work day... people can achevie all their work in 8hrs and some have to stay on late, this doesn't make you manager material.
Promotion should be based on many things like work quality, but not late working and ass kissing....but unfortunately it is.

Example, my current boss was the least productive and awful moaner, a great man to pass off jobs to others. He got the job because no one wanted it and he kissued the right asses..he is not a good boss, he will not last as we don't respect or his ways.

If he kissed the right assess, you might be the one who won't last. Depending in what needs to be done and how long it takes to do it, to say if it isn't done in 8hrs then you are not organised is, well naive. Sometimes you have to put your shoulder to the wheel if you want to get on, not only that, if you are clever enough, you can make sure your extra effort is noticed and appreciated. Your boss obviously plays the game better than you.

Jim2007

davo10 wrote: »

Doesn't make you a bad employee if you leave at 5pm nor a good one if you stay on, but if you leave when the manager/boss wants you to stay on, then the guy/gal who will stay in moves ahead of you. Like it or not, that's the way of the working world, others will say that's crap and that merit and talent always wins out but most employers want that and a bit more.

Actually it's not! It's how the US/UK/IE work, but the rest of Europe does it differently - employers respect the work life balance. If our performance assessments working overtime on a regular basis is a very big negative and the manager will very swiftly receive a kick in the ass if he can't organised his team's workload within normal working hours.

davo10

Jim2007 wrote: »

Actually it's not! It's how the US/UK/IE work, but the rest of Europe does it differently - employers respect the work life balance. If our performance assessments working overtime on a regular basis is a very big negative and the manager will very swiftly receive a kick in the ass if he can't organised his team's workload within normal working hours.

That is a very different situation. How would the performance assessment of a team member pan out if they were asked to work 45mins overtime when a big contract had to be finished on a deadline, and they refused to stay beyond 5pm? Also, small companies with limited staff often need employees to work a little longer, the systems in place at a company like Intel are not the same as a small company with 10 employees struggling to stay afloat.

Youngblood.III

davo10 wrote: »

If he kissed the right assess, you might be the one who won't last. Depending in what needs to be done and how long it takes to do it, to say if it isn't done in 8hrs then you are not organised is, well naive. Sometimes you have to put your shoulder to the wheel if you want to get on, not only that, if you are clever enough, you can make sure your extra effort is noticed and appreciated. Your boss obviously plays the game better than you.

That makes me laugh.

MarkAnthony

Jim2007 wrote: »

Honestly if the only way you can get a head at your employers is pile on lots of unpaid overtime then it really is not much of a place to work. Over the past 30 years I've held several management positions at firms in mainland Europe and I never expected any of my team to work an hour beyond their contracted hours nor did I do overtime either.

At the end of the day it is just a job, not your life, or it least it should not be.

I've had (having one still I guess) careers. Retail and the legal profession. Not one person has got ahead in those professions without putting the time and graft in. In the legal profession I will eventually work for myself and that was part of the attraction in fairness.

I've worked in jobs with loads of people and - happy days - it's great but very few work places are big corporate jobbies with loads of people.

Wanderer2010

@Davo10, if spending the guts of 12 hours a day breaking your back trying to climb the corporate ladder is something you aspire to then thats up to you but a huge number of people, myself included, just see work as a means to an end, to pay the bills and save money for non-work activities which are 100 times more important than who gets a promotion. Certainly im happy to be seen as a 9-5 person if it means i get more time with my family and friends. Companies will go on with or without you- time spent being happy can never be recalled.

OP, i understand your worry particularly as you are a new employee. I would advise you to just go for lunch for 30 minutes and if your boss says anything you can retort "Oh im sorry, i thought lunchtime was 12-1 (or whatever), did i get that wrong?", and if he says you have to work through lunch time then you have to make a decision as to whether this company is for you, because its unlikely they will care enough about your worries and just replace you. There ARE companies out there that dont expect you to spend 18 hours a day slaving away, believe it or not, you just have to keep on trying, perhaps stick this job for a few months and then hand in your notice when you find a new one.

OP, there will always be company men and women who live for the office/factory. If you arent one of them, and its fully understandable, then put this experience to one side and keep looking. Best of luck!

MarkAnthony

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

@Davo10, if spending the guts of 12 hours a day breaking your back trying to climb the corporate ladder is something you aspire to then thats up to you but a huge number of people, myself included, just see work as a means to an end, to pay the bills and save money for non-work activities which are 100 times more important than who gets a promotion. Certainly im happy to be seen as a 9-5 person if it means i get more time with my family and friends. Companies will go on with or without you- time spent being happy can never be recalled.

This is time specific as I said at the and I don't want to speak for Davo but I think he picked up on.

It's one thing to be happy being 9-5, as I say no lack of respect for anyone doing that. Some people have families young, drift in regards to promotions and then make it up later. Some go hell for leather when they young - OP is 21. Some are always content to do 9-5. I and others are merely suggesting that there is a time to cut your teeth and get down to it. I don't think anyone has suggested anyone sacrifice their health to do it.

At 21 I could have worked a 12 hour day, gone out got pissed done another 12 hour day and still have found a night's entertainment with some likely lass but that's just me. Now I'm fat and middle aged I can just about manage the long days but then I love what I do and that's the biggest element I think. So many people pick a job because they think it's lucrative, so few realise most things are lucrative if you love something and get good at it.

I suppose we agree on one point - be happy. If you're not do something else but don't expect the job and or profession to change.

ToxicPaddy

OP, being new to a job you obviously want to make a good impression but at the same time you're also setting a precedence for yourself and making it look like you will work long hours, take no breaks and basically run yourself into the ground.

A manager will pick up on this and depending what type they are will either

- Take advantage, milk you for every penny you're worth and abuse the situation

or

- They will realise that you will burn out, end up taking lots of sick leave and being less productive in the long run and or end up leaving due to having no life due to the level of work being piled on you and they will have to spend the time, effort and money to recruit and train your replacement.

My own approach would be firstly, take a decent lunch break away from your desk and one or two small breaks during the day where you run to the kitchen and grab a tea/coffee/drink and take 5-10 mins to relax.

Secondly, talk to your manager about the amount of work being sent your way, they may not even realise what's happening. Ask them for what gets priority and cover getting that done, after that its then a case of you managing your time.

Overtime is required in most jobs, but that's the odd time when deadlines for big projects are coming up fast or certain times of year, like for year end deadlines.

If you're doing endless hours of overtime for no pay or benefits then its just not worth it.

Jim2007

davo10 wrote: »

That is a very different situation. How would the performance assessment of a team member pan out if they were asked to work 45mins overtime when a big contract had to be finished on a deadline, and they refused to stay beyond 5pm? Also, small companies with limited staff often need employees to work a little longer, the systems in place at a company like Intel are not the same as a small company with 10 employees struggling to stay afloat.

Well first of all it does not happen, because if we are not going to meet a deadline the client would have been informed at least two or three days in advance - the vast majority of clients accept it and those that don't... well it is what it is. But if overtime is worked then it is either compensated or paid at a minimum of 125% and this applies to all grades of staff including senior management. So even when doing overtime you'll find very few if any management types around.

And yes the same rules apply to medium and small firms as well (I currently work for one) and they seem to get on just fine. In fact most people tend to work for such firms rather than multinationals.

Jim2007

MarkAnthony wrote: »

I've had (having one still I guess) careers. Retail and the legal profession. Not one person has got ahead in those professions without putting the time and graft in. In the legal profession I will eventually work for myself and that was part of the attraction in fairness.

I've worked in jobs with loads of people and - happy days - it's great but very few work places are big corporate jobbies with loads of people.

Well funny enough I started out at one of the big 4 accounting firms in Dublin... but it did not take me long to realise that even those who 'made it' were still clocking crazy hours and to boot may had serious health problems. At the same time my colleagues in the German, Swiss and Austrian offices appeared to have a far better work-life balance. So I jumped ship.

MarkAnthony

Jim2007 wrote: »

Well funny enough I started out at one of the big 4 accounting firms in Dublin... but it did not take me long to realise that even those who 'made it' were still clocking crazy hours and to boot may had serious health problems. At the same time my colleagues in the German, Swiss and Austrian offices appeared to have a far better work-life balance. So I jumped ship.

Indeed - Don't get me wrong. The mainlanders have a better work culture.

Youngblood.III

What the F is a mainlander?

davo10

Youngblood.III wrote: »

What the F is a mainlander?

Mainland Europe

MarkAnthony

Youngblood.III wrote: »

What the F is a mainlander?

Like the Highlander but there is loads of um.

Youngblood.III

davo10 wrote: »

Mainland Europe

Do you use words like "going forward" too? 😒

mahoganygas

Youngblood.III wrote: »

Do you use words like "going forward" too? 😒

He was thinking outside the box.

LegacyUser

First off all your health is priority. No question about it. It's important to take your breaks including lunch.

At 21 in a salaried office job with plenty of promotional opportunities I worked lots of overtime for no extra pay. At 21, fit and healthy I was well able for it. As another poster mentioned it allowed me to climb the ladder quite quickly to the point where I now don't have to work as many hours.

But again, you know you own health and that's what's most important.

I'm presuming you're in a Monday to Friday job with weekends off

LegacyUser

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Honestly OP legislation aside it's a suck it up IMHO especially at 21. Now's the time to put in the 10 and 12 hour days and get to were you can in your career. I did when I was that age.

Maybe I'm jaded that I'll have to do it again in my late 30s but that's what happens when you change careers.

Being blunt if you're not willing to do it, many will.

That reads like something from the 1980s. I am a Senior Manager myself with 7 internal staff and more off shore.

I have not and would not promote someone because they stay on working for free. If they cannot complete their work in the time provided, they are no good to me.

I rarely, if ever, work beyond 5pm and have been promoted three times in the last 4 years.

Plus, at 21 the last place I wanted to be was at work ;-)

testaccount123

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Indeed - Don't get me wrong. The mainlanders have a better work culture.

We have the same work culture.

People who are unable to manage their time or make sensible decisions around work life balance are just making it very difficult on themselves, ironically meaning that they'll be seen as worker drones and will actually have to work much, much harder to get anywhere.

_davidsmith_

Greed breeds greed, dont listen to the jaded guy whos now the boss and has the attitude of "i had to do it now so do you" these cycles will continue to repeat themselves until someone says no.

OP Work is work, be flat out but take your breaks, stay late if needs be but dont stay till your body is shutting down. If you are entirely success driven and status and paycheque are the only positives you have in your life, then by all means climb the corporate food chain like yer man did, but if you value your life outside of work and dont fancy heart attacking to the top then, do what you have to whilst balancing life outside.

Some people are capable of great things in small doses and others take more time about things, that guys attitude is all wrong even if i do agree with some of his points, certainly glad i dont work with him!

edit. Markanthony is who i was talking about

MarkAnthony

testaccount123 wrote: »

We have the same work culture.

People who are unable to manage their time or make sensible decisions around work life balance are just making it very difficult on themselves, ironically meaning that they'll be seen as worker drones and will actually have to work much, much harder to get anywhere.

We simply don't. There has been numerous pieces of research conducted on the subject.

As for a work life balance, this is exactly what the discussion is about. Striking the right balance for a given person and time in their career. I can't speak for all professions, but I've certainly no one in my circle of acquaintances that didn't go above an beyond what was required to progress, that's the nature of progression.

Perhaps it's different in some professions but I doubt it.

Mrs OBumble

Jim2007 wrote: »

Actually it's not! It's how the US/UK/IE work, but the rest of Europe does it differently - employers respect the work life balance. If our performance assessments working overtime on a regular basis is a very big negative and the manager will very swiftly receive a kick in the ass if he can't organised his team's workload within normal working hours.

Agreed.

But that is also why some American multi-nationals are now unwilling to hire in Continental Europe if they have any alternatives - like hiring a German/English speaker in Ireland, and using them to co-ordinate getting the work done in somewhere far cheaper.

davo10

mahoganygas wrote: »

He was thinking outside the box.

There seems to have been a paradigm shift in the tone of this thread, clearly there has been a lot done, but there is more to do on this topic.

MarkAnthony

davo10 wrote: »

There seems to have been a paradigm shift in the tone of this thread, clearly there has been a lot done, but there is more to do on this topic.

I had to apologise at work for being a bit too honest about something and used the word paradigm to show how corporate (and sarcastic) I could be. My manager corrected it to program and said I'd spelt something wrong. I was so happy! I have a great boss - I really do.

Tazz T

I'd be interested in knowing what industry this is. There are different expectations depending on the industry, but this sounds exceptional if you are always the last to leave. I wonder if there has been a high turnover of staff in that position before you.

Like others have said, you need to talk to your manager and express your concerns.

And no, it isn't worth it in the long run. You'll just spend your life chasing the next promotion and forgetting to live.

testaccount123

MarkAnthony wrote: »

I can't speak for all professions, but I've certainly no one in my circle of acquaintances that didn't go above an beyond what was required to progress, that's the nature of progression.

Perhaps it's different in some professions but I doubt it.

Theres a world of difference between 'going above and beyond' occasionally and doing what the OP is. The nature of progression is doing a job to a very high standard, not giving away your time for free. Its those who cant meet the high standards required to progress that I often find trying to compensate by working ridiculously long hours.

kupus

Welcome to the working world op.
Get back to me when you start 18 hr days six days a week, for no pay.

_davidsmith_

kupus wrote: »

Welcome to the working world op.
Get back to me when you start 18 hr days six days a week, for no pay.

Some working world youre in pal

CelticRambler

Jim2007 wrote: »

Actually it's not! It's how the US/UK/IE work, but the rest of Europe does it differently - employers respect the work life balance.

Not in France, they don't. There's a load of stuff written into the Code de travail that has employers and employees in a state of permanent conflict. The big thing at the moment is employees being asked/expected to handle 'phone calls and emails "off the clock" when they've finished their official 35-hours and gone home/out/on holiday. The same for meetings being scheduled for lunch-time (two hours, unpaid) or after closing time (unpaid).

testaccount123

_davidsmith_ wrote: »

Some working world youre in pal

Its like a Monty Python sketch in here,

'Hard work, you dont know the meaning of the word! We used to work down t'mines 35 hours a day and WE had to pay for the privilege"

_davidsmith_

testaccount123 wrote: »

Its like a Monty Python sketch in here,

'Hard work, you dont know the meaning of the word! We used to work down t'mines 35 hours a day and WE had to pay for the privilege"

I just dont see the point in those posts, in all seriousness the OP probably knows he will get ahead doing what they want but its f*cking him up.

Idiots saying how much they work (no matter how ridiculous they seem) doesnt help

Noone gives a sh*t if you work 18 hours every day

Mrs OBumble

_davidsmith_ wrote: »

Some working world youre in pal

Ahh, I think it's called Parenting.


:rolleyes:

Triangla

OP - Firstly regarding lunch breaks.

You need to make time for lunch, not 10 mins - at least half an hour. Get away from your desk and get some food and fresh air if you can.

Nobody is going to tap you on the shoulder and hand you a McChicken sandwich.

Secondly, if you have too much to do is it because you are unable to complete it in a timely fashion due to lack of tools (training, proper software) or is it that it is just being piled on?

If it is because you don't have the tools, speak with someone. Be specific, if it takes you ages to do something you were shown once then ask to be shown again.

If work is being piled on, it's probably because you're just taking it and getting it done by working longer hours.

Make a list of all that you need to get done, prioritise by deadline and work through it. If something urgent is thrown your way you can mention your other top priority that will get knocked off.

You need to start clawing back your time, just pick a time, say 5:30 and leave. What you don't get done in your working day is there for you the next day. If there is too much due at the same time and you can't fit it in the time you have, speak with a supervisor/manager. That's what they're there for.

Remember, if you get hit by a bus tomorrow the place will go on without you and nobody will be aware of how busy you are unless you tell them.

_davidsmith_

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Ahh, I think it's called Parenting.


:rolleyes:

Only a parent 6 days a week?! jaysus i thought that was 24/7 either way, parenting being a job isnt the thread we are in now

jimd2

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Honestly OP legislation aside it's a suck it up IMHO especially at 21. Now's the time to put in the 10 and 12 hour days and get to were you can in your career. I did when I was that age.

Maybe I'm jaded that I'll have to do it again in my late 30s but that's what happens when you change careers.

Being blunt if you're not willing to do it, many will.

You just defeated your own argument here mate. What was the point in working all the hours in order to perhaps rise the corporate ladder and then jump ship to another profession?

I certainly agree that the early years in a career are more likely to require extended hours, I certainly did it but never did I compromise my lunch break except in absolutely exceptional circumstances.]

My advice is no different to most here but I would emphasize that you start taking your lunch break incorporating some fresh air every day. If you are in the office 4 hours at lunch time then take at least 45 minutes. Generally you should not be working the very long days more than 2 or 3 days a week.

Also, if your work is with a PC there are ergonomic and eyesight rules around that also.

Overall, it is usually good for building up experience, kudos etc by working long hours but nothing is guaranteed and you could end up leaving the place, change careers, go abroad etc and the long hours wont have been as beneficial as some here are making out.

Jim2007

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Agreed.

But that is also why some American multi-nationals are now unwilling to hire in Continental Europe if they have any alternatives - like hiring a German/English speaker in Ireland, and using them to co-ordinate getting the work done in somewhere far cheaper.

Can't agree there. We have 15 Fortune 500 companies headquartered here and another 122 US companies have their European HQ here. Companies like Nestle, Novartis, Zurich Insurance, Roche, Credit Suisse, UBS, ABB, Adecco, CHUB, Dow and so on.

You don't come to Switzerland if you want cheap - I once asked the owner of textile machinery factory how he managed to compete with the low cost alternatives... he said he usually invited the client's top people to Switzerland and then took them out for a day trip by train/boat/bus always taking great care to point out how efficient everything was and how you could plan train journeys with a 5 min break to change trains etc... then at the end of the day he poses the question: Now who do you want to build your machines? the people who can do all this or the ???? (who ever the competitor is) He said he usually gets the contract.

Jim2007

CelticRambler wrote: »

Not in France, they don't. There's a load of stuff written into the Code de travail that has employers and employees in a state of permanent conflict. The big thing at the moment is employees being asked/expected to handle 'phone calls and emails "off the clock" when they've finished their official 35-hours and gone home/out/on holiday. The same for meetings being scheduled for lunch-time (two hours, unpaid) or after closing time (unpaid).

All the same I think they are doing pretty well when all is said and done.