EGM and AGM notices

ComDubh

@ChessCoach I'm sure you're in a position to provide answers to some of the reasonable questions people have asked on this thread. Could you not do that please? It would be more appreciated than maligning former exec members and writing about buses etc.

Steve

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Ulster boy you will have chance to hear it all at the AGM . I will be glad to meet you there and talk . It is great to see you back to ICU . Welcome . You dont know anything about me at all and my record in Irish Chess . Please make sure to come to me and talk to me at the AGM as for now I have no idea who are you . I know that my friend Cafolla is regular poster on your blog . Pls say hello to him and see you at the AGM.
If you dont mind could you please write what I have done wrong ? What the your boss from Limerick told you about me ?
Did he tolld you about Arbiter Norm ? No ? Yes ? Bus sorted ? Who is the DJ in the bus ? Boss from Limerick ?
Please dont forget to bring your lunch box and water . When you park the bus in Dublin walk slowly across the road . Boss from Limerick will wear yellow tshirt and a hat . Please mind yourself .He will make sure that only he talk to you and that all you know is his truth .
Bless

I'm sure everyone is looking forward to whatever you have to say at the AGM, however if you post like that (being insulting towards another member here rather than engaging in constructive debate) then you will forfeit your ability to post here.

I don't do second chances when it comes to this.

Thanks,
Steve.

Chess_Coach

Steve wrote: »

I'm sure everyone is looking forward to whatever you have to say at the AGM, however if you post like that (being insulting towards another member here rather than engaging in constructive debate) then you will forfeit your ability to post here.

I don't do second chances when it comes to this.

Thanks,
Steve.

Dear Steve

I did plan that but thanks for letting me to write anything really it is not often possible here .

How I can have possible engage in constructive debate with man who write about me and has no clue about me and my work . The one Ballyf..... whatever

Chess_Coach

Time for fair and transparent chat here I think . I am calling you all that we do that for better Irish Chess .
Nice fair chat is only solution .
I think that many of you want the same . Lets try . Those working with me are well aware that I am not bad man .
My problem is that I hate lies games and setups. Cant stand them

Chess_Coach

ComDubh wrote: »

It's a bit off-topic but that FB page and some of the postings here create an extremely bad impression of chess. @ChessCoach If you're really a chess coach, you should be concerned about this.

I am indeed an ICU member. The questions can be answered in the members-only area of the ICU site and I'll be happy to read them there. However the ICU have been promising this for ages and I sense no answers will be forthcoming.

Dear ComDubh

I have asked Executive to publish all material at ICU website for all our members.
I agree that you all should see it .
Totally. Do not forget that I am only one who is talking to you all . Sorry if that is not enough

Steve

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Time for fair and transparent chat here I think . I am calling you all that we do that for better Irish Chess .
Nice fair chat is only solution .
I think that many of you want the same . Lets try .

Fair and transparent debate is what boards.ie is all about, we welcome and embrace it.


We do not, however, welcome people who are here only to promote themselves and who avoid questions asked of them... lets's move forward with that in mind

Chess_Coach

I can not give all answers .Those that I can I ll answer gladly.
I disagree Steve sorry . It looks like very one side platform to me

Steve

Chess_Coach wrote: »

I can not give all answers .Those that I can I ll answer gladly.
I disagree Steve sorry . It looks like very one side platform to me

I have no side in this, no interest in chess whatsoever.

I'll be blunt here - you're looking to speak and / or get elected to ICU but it seems to me (and everyone else here) that you're not answering the questions...

Work with us and the forum will work for you

rob51

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Ulster boy you will have chance to hear it all at the AGM . I will be glad to meet you there and talk . It is great to see you back to ICU . Welcome . You dont know anything about me at all and my record in Irish Chess . Please make sure to come to me and talk to me at the AGM as for now I have no idea who are you . I know that my friend Cafolla is regular poster on your blog . Pls say hello to him and see you at the AGM.
If you dont mind could you please write what I have done wrong ? What the your boss from Limerick told you about me ?
Did he tolld you about Arbiter Norm ? No ? Yes ? Bus sorted ? Who is the DJ in the bus ? Boss from Limerick ?
Please dont forget to bring your lunch box and water . When you park the bus in Dublin walk slowly across the road . Boss from Limerick will wear yellow tshirt and a hat . Please mind yourself .He will make sure that only he talk to you and that all you know is his truth .
Bless

Coach if you keep all these explanations for the AGM it will be a very long week. And I don't see why you should have a problem with members coming to vote. I've yet to see you giving a straight answer to a single question. Just boasting about your integrity and calling anyone who questions you names.

Not very inspiring for a chess coach.

Chess_Coach

My students 14 Irish Champions 2 British 2 youngest FM talk itself. Being a Fide trainer is not big deal is it ?

I will not answer questions that I cant but will what I can. Simple as that .

O Enniscorthy chess kids were coached by me last year . They were great werent they ?

Tell us something about you Rob please ?

Ballynafeigh Chess

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Ulster boy you will have chance to hear it all at the AGM . I will be glad to meet you there and talk . It is great to see you back to ICU . Welcome . You dont know anything about me at all and my record in Irish Chess . Please make sure to come to me and talk to me at the AGM as for now I have no idea who are you . I know that my friend Cafolla is regular poster on your blog . Pls say hello to him and see you at the AGM.
If you dont mind could you please write what I have done wrong ? What the your boss from Limerick told you about me ?
Did he tolld you about Arbiter Norm ? No ? Yes ? Bus sorted ? Who is the DJ in the bus ? Boss from Limerick ?
Please dont forget to bring your lunch box and water . When you park the bus in Dublin walk slowly across the road . Boss from Limerick will wear yellow tshirt and a hat . Please mind yourself .He will make sure that only he talk to you and that all you know is his truth .
Bless

1) How would you know what I do or do not know? You’re being extremely presumptuous

2) I don’t have a boss, I have never had a boss and I never will have a boss. Indeed I’m the personification of independence except when my four year old daughter tells me what to do or where to go, when to go, how to go, what to wear, what to say, actually you’re right I do have a boss now that I think about it! However she’s not from Limerick mores the pity, a beautiful city full of lovely charming intelligent people, many with a love of chess.

3) Your obvious dissatisfaction that ICU members should have the audacity to exercise their democratic franchise without first seeking an audience with yourself is somewhat disturbing. You have already decided in your own mind what I am minded to do, yet as you have stated yourself that you have no idea who I am, then how in heavens name can you automatically assume what allegiances I am beholden to.

4) As for a request to detail what you have done wrong could you enlighten me as to why you want me to answer this? Have I accused you of doing anything wrong? Remember you’ve already documented that I’m someone who doesn’t know you; you don’t even know who I am either. You’re not asking me to write another Aontas report are you Darko? Because I don’t think the last one helped the ICU one tiny bit my traffic watching friend.

Chess_Coach

Ballynafeigh Chess wrote: »

1) How would you know what I do or do not know? You’re being extremely presumptuous

2) I don’t have a boss, I have never had a boss and I never will have a boss. Indeed I’m the personification of independence except when my four year old daughter tells me what to do or where to go, when to go, how to go, what to wear, what to say, actually you’re right I do have a boss now that I think about it! However she’s not from Limerick mores the pity beautiful city full of lovely charming intelligent people, many with a love of chess.

3) Your obvious dissatisfaction that ICU members should have the audacity to exercise their democratic franchise without first seeking an audience with yourself is somewhat disturbing. You have already decided in your own mind what I am minded to do, yet as you have stated yourself that you have no idea who I am how in heavens name can you automatically assume what allegiances I am beholden to.

4) As for a request to detail what you have done wrong could you enlighten me as to why you want me to answer this? Have I accused you of doing anything wrong? Remember you’ve already documented that I’m someone who doesn’t know you; you don’t even know who I am either. You’re not asking me to write another Aontas report are you Darko? Because I don’t think the last one helped the ICU one tiny bit my traffic watching friend.

*SNIP* May God bless you. O BTW how was the arbiter course in Belfast ? Who did it please as I have heard something . Who was there ?

Ballynafeigh Chess

"Thank you for the post I ll waste no time reading it . Ulster Boy"

Good grief Darko

What an unbelievably stupid thing to write in a debate forum! Are your seriously perplexed why ICU members up and down the country are involved in confrontation with if not open rebellion against the ICU executive if this is an example of the crass behaviour they’ve been receiving.

Lecale

Chess_Coach wrote: »

Dear ComDubh

I have asked Executive to publish all material at ICU website for all our members.
I agree that you all should see it .
Totally. Do not forget that I am only one who is talking to you all . Sorry if that is not enough

It is nice that you agree that the report should be published. I wonder if you could also tell us if you agree that the disciplinary procedures should be followed.

Chess_Coach

Ballynafeigh Chess wrote: »

"Thank you for the post I ll waste no time reading it . Ulster Boy"

Good grief Darko

What an unbelievably stupid thing to write in a debate forum! Are your seriously perplexed why ICU members up and down the country are involved in confrontation with if not open rebellion against the ICU executive if this is an example of the crass behaviour they’ve been receiving.

This is what you have been informed <snip>.
And all the lies and attacks on me and Executive from FEW people is sick and it tell you what kind of people they really are .

You will be surprised at the AGM when decent quiet members hear the full story . You and your Limerick boss who actually drag you in this game will face facts reports and calm explanation by Chairman .

Lecale

Chess_Coach, do you really think that the name Ulster Boy is appropriate to use? :pac: This isn't the 70s.

Chess_Coach

He love it trust me . He is at the end the main man in Ulster Chess hahhahahahhahaha. Imagine that rent a crowd following the Limerick boss . It is funny isnt it Bruce Lee admit please. Shame I have to go to work and drive kids to school . All the best ICU members . If you have put same energy into finding sponsors and promoting chess ICU would have 5000 members and State funds. For 100 years all you know is just to spread hate and lies at each other . Nothing more and nothing less that that

ComDubh

Chess_Coach wrote: »

You will be surprised at the AGM when decent quiet members hear the full story. You and your Limerick boss who actually drag you in this game will face facts reports and calm explanation by Chairman. .

I'm sure that many decent, quiet ICU members like me are reading your postings and wondering where all this bile is coming from, and what purpose it serves to be airing it here.

cdeb

The off topic stuff about the facebook page split to here; it's arguably worth a thread of its own.

Chess_Coach - I'll repeat what's been said earlier. Please stay on topic. If you want to discuss something not related to the topic, do it on another (relevant) thread.

This is your last warning on this matter.

wine and final destination

I don't think it's the best policy for anyone looking to gain public support to verbally abuse potential voters. Also where's the correlation between playing strength and knowledge about the betterment of Irish chess? 1600 is also a decent rating regardless anyway it's club level and there's only a few coaches in the country that would have sufficiently greater understanding of the game to coach a 1600-1700 player and I'm not sure if any of them post here!

Pete Morriss

Thanks to rob51 for posting a link to the Munster Chess Union website on the "Munster Chess Union AGM" thread, where there is further information about the letter from ICU Chairperson Pat Fitzsimons to the MCU. I find the information revealed quite astonishing, and think it should be highlighted on this thread as well.

According to the account in that letter, Pat Fitzsimons had received reports of the Munster Chess Union representative's alleged misbehaviour by or before last May, which led him to think that maybe the representative was unsuitable. So did he contact the MCU to inform it of those concerns? Nope. He kept quiet for three months or more, until an ICU executive meeting in August, which the Munster representative had driven across the country to attend, before telling the Munster representative to his face that he could not attend the meeting. When the MCU complained at this treatment of their representative, he had the impertinence to tell it that “The absence of a Munster delegate would not, in my view (Pat Fitzsimons), have disadvantaged your union in any way.” So, in his eyes, there is no need for a Munster representative (or, indeed, any others) since Pat Fitzsimons so readily takes it upon himself to declare the interests of other parties.

This is the same Pat Fitzsimons who rejected motions to the AGM because, in his view, they were not necessary; and who did not follow the ICU's required procedure in a disciplinary case because, in his view, the culprit was so clearly guilty.

Clearly, Pat Fitzsimons is not a fit person to hold the office of Chairperson of the ICU, and anybody who cares anything about democracy should make sure to attend the AGM and vote him out of office. If, that is, there is an AGM. On his track record, Pat Fitzsimons will decide that, in his view, he is so obviously the right person to represent members' interests that there is no need to put the members to the inconvenience of attending a meeting to express their delight at his leadership. That after all is what he has said to the ICU members in Munster.

Danville

Former Chairmen to attend AGM
Eamon Keogh
Michael Crowe
Gerry Graham
Maurice Buckley
Pete Morriss
And Jonathan O Connor
All the above had the honour of being elected as Chairman of the Irish Chess Union by the membership.

Note: Under ‘Officer Roles’ in the ICU Constitution the Chairman is obliged:
‘To ensure that the constitution is observed in all procedures relating to Union matters’

They will be in attendance at the forthcoming AGM expecting to hear from the incumbent Chairman Pat Fitzsimons why he has set aside the Union’s Constitution on more than one occasion.

For example:
They will seek an explanation why a recent disciplinary case was dealt with without giving the accused party benefit of the Constitution under rule 13.2

How was the status of an Honorary Life Member rescinded without reference to the membership at an AGM?

Why was a vote of no confidence in the MCU delegate proposed at the ICU meeting of August 26th when the constitution does not allow the executive to remove a delegate?

(As a result the MCU submitted a motion to be discussed at the AGM, but it is not allowed on the agenda because the executive deem it ineligible. The reason? It was submitted after the deadline of August 31st.)

The ICU is responsible for ensuring three events are held annually, the Irish Championships, The Irish Junior Chess CHampionships and the National Club Championships.
Why have the executive tried to involve themselves in the running of the weekender tournaments without invitation?

The aforementioned former chairmen are unlikely to be voting for the re-election of a chairman who treats the constitution, the tournament organisers and the general membership in such a dismissive and cavalier manner.

The undecided voters might be wise to consider the judgement of these former chairmen before casting their vote.

NotReally321

Danville wrote: »

Former Chairmen to attend AGM
Eamon Keogh
Michael Crowe
Gerry Graham
Maurice Buckley
Pete Morriss
And Jonathan O Connor
All the above had the honour of being elected as Chairman of the Irish Chess Union by the membership.

Note: Under ‘Officer Roles’ in the ICU Constitution the Chairman is obliged:
‘To ensure that the constitution is observed in all procedures relating to Union matters’

They will be in attendance at the forthcoming AGM expecting to hear from the incumbent Chairman Pat Fitzsimons why he has set aside the Union’s Constitution on more than one occasion.

For example:
They will seek an explanation why a recent disciplinary case was dealt with without giving the accused party benefit of the Constitution under rule 13.2

How was the status of an Honorary Life Member rescinded without reference to the membership at an AGM?

Why was a vote of no confidence in the MCU delegate proposed at the ICU meeting of August 26th when the constitution does not allow the executive to remove a delegate?

(As a result the MCU submitted a motion to be discussed at the AGM, but it is not allowed on the agenda because the executive deem it ineligible. The reason? It was submitted after the deadline of August 31st.)

The ICU is responsible for ensuring three events are held annually, the Irish Championships, The Irish Junior Chess CHampionships and the National Club Championships.
Why have the executive tried to involve themselves in the running of the weekender tournaments without invitation?

The aforementioned former chairmen are unlikely to be voting for the re-election of a chairman who treats the constitution, the tournament organisers and the general membership in such a dismissive and cavalier manner.

The undecided voters might be wise to consider the judgement of these former chairmen before casting their vote.

Comedy gold

And of course are you suggesting these guys have a distinguished track record when they were Chairman of the ICU.

To just start with how about an explanation for the humiliating resignation of Maurice Buckley when he was Chairman.If people are going to open these doors then yes I agree Danville we should give people all the information and let them know what is going on.

Be handy if you or any of these folks knew or understood much of anything about the ICU constitution and indeed the issues involved with the items mentioned. Seems very clear you know and understand very little though. Maybe there should be a detailed dossier made available to all ICU members on the actions and track record of all these folks who were previous ICU Chairman.

What do you think Danville. You really think they would fare well under such an examination? I don't and I am pretty sure that would be the view formed of even yourself if you really looked into the details.

reunion

Officer roles wrote:

To advise the executive committee on matters relating to the Constitution and Bye-Laws.

To note: the secretary advises on matters relating to the constitution and Bye-Laws, the chairperson ensures the constitution is adhered to.

I would read that as the secretary informs the committee that the constitution or Bye-laws are being breached and then the chair has to ensure the constitution is adhered to using advice. I wouldn't point all the blame at the chair (he is part of a committee after all).

But the officer roles document is more of a guideline.


Mod note: I'm going to close this thread and move the posts to the AGM discussion. There are enough threads questions actions by the current executive and I don't think this adds any value not already found in a current discussion.

rob51

NotReally321 wrote: »

Comedy gold

Be handy if you or any of these folks knew or understood much of anything about the ICU constitution and indeed the issues involved with the items mentioned. Seems very clear you know and understand very little though. Maybe there should be a detailed dossier made available to all ICU members on the actions and track record of all these folks who were previous ICU Chairman.

Maybe you can answer the serious issues raised in the post. Obviously it's easier to waffle about all the other ills in the world but it doesn't answer any of the issues. I'm surprised you can't see that.

cdeb

Worth noting the EGM is on this Sunday - easy to overlook it as the AGM is taking up all the attention at present.

Four documents to be considered - a revised constitution, a set of disciplinary procedures, a document on the NCC and a document on eligibility criteria for national selection.

The disciplinary policy seems to look at vest all disciplinary powers in the exec. And more specifically, the Chairman, who selects the person (singular) from the current exec to investigate any disciplinary policy. That's a change from the present set-up I think. Is this too much power for the exec? They get to decide what constitutes bringing the game into disrepute (para 2), appoint their own investigator and then decide on a punishment (which is solely at the exec's discretion).

On the NCC -

Where a club has not participated in a provincial league, the team captain of that club’s team must provide satisfactory evidence to the Tournament Director that the team members in question are members of a “bona fide” chess club and are eligible to play in the INCC. The said members must not have represented any other club in the current years provincial leagues and must have played at least ten ICU rated games during the same year

This can only affect Galway, as there is no Connacht league. So if a Galway player plays a game for, say, Ennis or Ballinasloe, they can't play for Galway in the NCC. But if a Ballinasloe player plays for Ennis as well as Ballinasloe, they can still play in the NCC. That doesn't sound fair. I don't know does anyone from Galway have a view on that?

rob51

cdeb wrote: »

Worth noting the EGM is on this Sunday - easy to overlook it as the AGM is taking up all the attention at present.

The disciplinary policy seems to look at vest all disciplinary powers in the exec. And more specifically, the Chairman, who selects the person (singular) from the current exec to investigate any disciplinary policy. That's a change from the present set-up I think. Is this too much power for the exec? They get to decide what constitutes bringing the game into disrepute (para 2), appoint their own investigator and then decide on a punishment (which is solely at the exec's discretion).

On the NCC -


This can only affect Galway, as there is no Connacht league. So if a Galway player plays a game for, say, Ennis or Ballinasloe, they can't play for Galway in the NCC. But if a Ballinasloe player plays for Ennis as well as Ballinasloe, they can still play in the NCC. That doesn't sound fair. I don't know does anyone from Galway have a view on that?

The disciplinary process reads quite well in terms of aspirations but I agree that in fact it is moving away from an independent subcommittee to more power for the executive. Given the current executive's track record on these matters that seems a bad move.

I believe Pete Moriss pointed out the Galway issue several weeks ago and it is quite unfair. A less obvious situation is that some strong players play for smaller clubs who don't enter the NCC. If they want to be involved in the ECC it forces them to change club. I don't see why people who play for clubs who don't play in the NCC can't play for another club in NCC.

RoundTower

The John McMorrow team have posted some thoughts on the EGM motions here. We're asking all ICU members to come along and make your opinion heard. Pat has promised that the meeting won't take long.

RoundTower

Also we should point out that the motions on the ICU site are being changed with no notice to members. So you might have read one set of changes but the vote will be on something totally different. Note that this is especially the case for the constitutional motion, which includes changes already made in 2014.

Pete Morriss

RoundTower wrote: »

Also we should point out that the motions on the ICU site are being changed with no notice to members.

If this is correct, then any such motion passed will be invalid, as the EGM procedure does not allow motions to be changed after members have been notified. The Executive should have got them right within the required time-frame.

What a shambles.