Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

Greengrass1

Sensor gone in milk tank here. Only a new tank. 2000l milk ruined. Spent 2 hrs this morning trying to get an inch if ice out if it. Still haven't milked. Tank man here now to sort her out

whelan2

Timmaay wrote: »

A rule of thumb of mine, for any tool on the farm that I need to even consider the question will this be a back breaking job, I will try to find another way about doing it. Total waste of time, effort and of course potentially your health.

I bought the scraper years ago before i could afford automatic ones, it was supposed to be easy to push etc, it was a disaster. Quicker with normal hand scraper

whelan2

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Sensor gone in milk tank here. Only a new tank. 2000l milk ruined. Spent 2 hrs this morning trying to get an inch if ice out if it. Still haven't milked. Tank man here now to sort her out

is yours a packo? Sensor went in mine too, you should be covered by 12 month garauntee afaik

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Sensor gone in milk tank here. Only a new tank. 2000l milk ruined. Spent 2 hrs this morning trying to get an inch if ice out if it. Still haven't milked. Tank man here now to sort her out

Thats a balls, What make gg? Went with dx here as well, one thing the ice bank has going for it is it would never freeze the milk. Tank here can txt to notify if something is wrong, will find out when something does I guess

Milked out

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

Agreed, that's what I'm trying to get to. What's the ideal sweet spot. Place is dry here, usually out on 1st of Feb and this year out till 5th of Dec during the day.
Stocked at 2.8 atm on the mp that includes all heifer calves and most silage coming from mp. Place under no real pressure this year, but it was an exceptional year for grass.
Two things that struck me this year were
1, whilst getting the cows out in Feb is a top priority, I'd be more than happy to bring them in early in November rather than trying to get heavy in calf cows to walk long distances in bad weather conditions and then try to get 17-18 litres out of them. This year cows started loosing condition late Nov on grass by day, silage by night and 3kgs meal and a lot of walking. Now they're gaining condition again on pit silage + 3kgs meal and are holding at 16 litres
2, there were 2 cuts of 45+ acres each taken off mp, plus spent the summer messing with bales off the mp. Seems like a waste of ground around the parlour for the sake of some simple supplementary feeding (something like a pitted beet and hulls) in Feb and Mar. By this I mean move up the SR to match the summer peak grass a bit better.

I reckon you'd manage 3.2 without having to buffer with forage at the shoulders obviously weather and growth dependant but this would still mean cutting silage on mp during summer and will be prob enough to meet half your winter requirements. When you go over the 3.2 you will prob need to buffer in the shoulders with a forage, bales at peak growth should supply that easily which as you are doing them.at home would allow you to control the quality of the bales that bit better along with grass for cows. Would drought be much of an issue with you or would the outside ground have enough to allow you to cut enough silage to buffer as well as supply winter feed if peak growth was poor during the year? I guess the only way is to move up every year and see how u get on with it. Don't mind buffering here when weather is bad or ground is wet but the idea of buffering when conditions are perfect outside in spring or autumn would put me off a bit. Then again if it paid id prob be happy after

Greengrass1

whelan2 wrote: »

is yours a packo? Sensor went in mine too, you should be covered by 12 month garauntee afaik

She is yeah. Came out and tank was at 28 °

alps

jack o shea wrote: »

Are those hand yard scrapers with wheels any good lads or would they break ur back?

If there is any item on a farm that will end up making you feel like a mule...This is it..

Avoid

whelan2

Greengrass1 wrote: »

She is yeah. Came out and tank was at 28 °

Was the alarm going off

Greengrass1

whelan2 wrote: »

Was the alarm going off

Nope no alarm at all went off. Which is what I am annoyed over most tbh

RightTurnClyde

Timmaay wrote: »

RTC, you'll manage 3.3 without too much sweat if you shift the silage off the main block, it will probably mean buffer feeding more leafy silage on the shoulders to the milkers , if it doesn't cost you a fortune in infrastructure or extra labour then it's a no brainer to drive on, the extra milk will nicely dilute your fixed costs.

3.3 would suit me fine. It would bring me to a figure that would justify a full time person. And I have enough housing and infrastructure, so I'd have little or no money to spend on capex, just the stock itself.

Deepsouthwest

Greengrass1 wrote: »

She is yeah. Came out and tank was at 28 °

Perfect for making hot chocolate!

RightTurnClyde

Milked out wrote: »

I reckon you'd manage 3.2 without having to buffer with forage at the shoulders obviously weather and growth dependant but this would still mean cutting silage on mp during summer and will be prob enough to meet half your winter requirements. When you go over the 3.2 you will prob need to buffer in the shoulders with a forage, bales at peak growth should supply that easily which as you are doing them.at home would allow you to control the quality of the bales that bit better along with grass for cows. Would drought be much of an issue with you or would the outside ground have enough to allow you to cut enough silage to buffer as well as supply winter feed if peak growth was poor during the year? I guess the only way is to move up every year and see how u get on with it. Don't mind buffering here when weather is bad or ground is wet but the idea of buffering when conditions are perfect outside in spring or autumn would put me off a bit. Then again if it paid id prob be happy after

Thanks. 3.2-3.3 seems to be a number that would be comfortable with me. I don't mind a small few bales now and then to control grass quality for cows but I'm a great fan of premowing. I'd be feeding ~800kgs to cows so if Premowing and reducing meal means I don't have to bake, mores the better.
Unless it's a very severe drought I'm usually okay. This seems to be another area where reseeding is paying.
On buffer feeding, ya I try to avoid as much as possible. An extra bit of targeted meal in the parlour when needed is my preference. Keeps things simple. That said, I wouldn't mind something like pitted beet and hulls would be a nice insurance policy if we get a bad year. And if the year is good, it could be used against the 800kgs

keep going

on the stocking rate its different for every farm and every operator but 3 should be profitable on most farms,when you go above that you need to have everything right otherwise you end up spending what you making very quickly.all things being equal probally less work in it at higher stock rates.in the current climate ration is probaly more cost effective than silage

Snowfire

Lakeland dairies are giving suppliers the option to buy shares for couple of months.

What's the verdict, buy or not?
I've never bought shares in any company before, and don't even know the advantage of buying... Presume it's to collect a return dividend at yr end..?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Snowfire wrote: »

Lakeland dairies are giving suppliers the option to buy shares for couple of months.

What's the verdict, buy or not?
I've never bought shares in any company before, and don't even know the advantage of buying... Presume it's to collect a return dividend at yr end..?

Both dividend and capital appreciation but only the dividend will give a cash flow, which is subject to income tax. Had to be a catch, didn't there;)

You can cash in the shares later to gather the capital appreciation, if any, which will be subject to Capital Gains Tax.

You can also get voting rights on holding shares.

Just general answers, not specific to Lakelands.

Timmaay

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/farmer-writes-combining-the-best-of-irish-grass-feeding-with-british-dairying-195561/ doesn't sound like an enviable position to be in 2bh.

Timmaay

I got a few cull cows, the bull and a twin heifer lined up to go here, just looking at my stock numbers from last year to this year, we are up 13 head of animals on Dec last year at the minute. I'm in my last of 4years of having the 50% partnership stock relief. I'm not sure if we'll be much into the top rate of tax this year, we won't be much into it if we are at all. Can anyone tell me if it makes sense to hang onto these 7 animals until Jan? Or will the tax saving be so marginally that I should just flog them on now? They are in reasonable enough nick at the sec, and only really eating silage and taking up space hanging around 2bh.

alps

Timmaay wrote: »

I got a few cull cows, the bull and a twin heifer lined up to go here, just looking at my stock numbers from last year to this year, we are up 13 head of animals on Dec last year at the minute. I'm in my last of 4years of having the 50% partnership stock relief. I'm not sure if we'll be much into the top rate of tax this year, we won't be much into it if we are at all. Can anyone tell me if it makes sense to hang onto these 7 animals until Jan? Or will the tax saving be so marginally that I should just flog them on now? They are in reasonable enough nick at the sec, and only really eating silage and taking up space hanging around 2bh.

I'd be inclined to hold Timmaay. ..

If you're talking about 4k in sales it's not the tax on the sale you need to be concious of but next year or any year after that you increase your total herd value by this 4k or more, and the tax offset that it would mean at that time.

It's also quiet likely that your accountant will value your whole herd at its maximum possibility and these animals will be valued at productive stock values and not at cull stock value. This could double these culls value and lead to quiet significant tax saving next year or after

darragh_haven

Visited a few dairy farms over the last 10 days while I was in Mississippi, Alabama and Tennessee. They are getting a milk price of $0.48 to $0.52 cent per litre. Milking all year round.
And petrol prices are around $0.46 cents per litre. Diesel is a bit higher. And the dollar and euro are nearly on parity at the moment.
One guy was paying 3 wages out of 90 cows.

Cow Porter

darragh_haven wrote: »

Visited a few dairy farms over the last 10 days while I was in Mississippi, Alabama and Tennessee. They are getting a milk price of $0.48 to $0.52 cent per litre. Milking all year round.
And petrol prices are around $0.46 cents per litre. Diesel is a bit higher. And the dollar and euro are nearly on parity at the moment.
One guy was paying 3 wages out of 90 cows.

Cheap energy and government supports mean the world market is far from a level playing field

Deepsouthwest

darragh_haven wrote: »

Visited a few dairy farms over the last 10 days while I was in Mississippi, Alabama and Tennessee. They are getting a milk price of $0.48 to $0.52 cent per litre. Milking all year round.
And petrol prices are around $0.46 cents per litre. Diesel is a bit higher. And the dollar and euro are nearly on parity at the moment.
One guy was paying 3 wages out of 90 cows.

Any take home messages from US dairy Darragh?

Timmaay

alps wrote: »

I'd be inclined to hold Timmaay. ..

If you're talking about 4k in sales it's not the tax on the sale you need to be concious of but next year or any year after that you increase your total herd value by this 4k or more, and the tax offset that it would mean at that time.

It's also quiet likely that your accountant will value your whole herd at its maximum possibility and these animals will be valued at productive stock values and not at cull stock value. This could double these culls value and lead to quiet significant tax saving next year or after

OK the 2nd question, I'm still considering buying afew Feb calving heifers at the second, say 10 of them. If i get them right now (in say dec), and with the extra few cows my closing stock inventory up is for argument sake 20k, considering I have 50% stock relief this year that will mean I'll get 10k off our taxable income this year, against if I get them in Jan/Feb (if I do bother at all), when I'll be back to a normal 25% stock relief, and only 5k reduction next year? Or do I have the wrong end of the stick here?

darragh_haven

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

Any take home messages from US dairy Darragh?

Take home message is that comparing America and Ireland is like comparing apples and oranges. They are supplying milk for a local market and getting a good premium for all year supply. And their bull calves are worth money at 2 to 4 weeks old. Buyers come to the farm and ship them off to nebraska.
Ireland has a home tiny market for the milk we produce and have to sell at world market price.
This is all stuff that has been said here before but it was really hammered home seeing it in the flesh. 3 wages from a 90 cows herd said it all.

Take home message was we really can't take a message home from America.

Deepsouthwest

darragh_haven wrote: »

Visited a few dairy farms over the last 10 days while I was in Mississippi, Alabama and Tennessee. They are getting a milk price of $0.48 to $0.52 cent per litre. Milking all year round.
And petrol prices are around $0.46 cents per litre. Diesel is a bit higher. And the dollar and euro are nearly on parity at the moment.
One guy was paying 3 wages out of 90 cows.

Chatting to someone in the know this morning, said average milk price in the US at the moment is low to mid 30's. How come these guys were doing so good?

RightTurnClyde

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

Chatting to someone in the know this morning, said average milk price in the US at the moment is low to mid 30's. How come these guys were doing so good?

I asked Pat Dillon this at a meeting in Nenagh a month ago and just got some waffling. When I pressed it more with regards the product mix he just shrugged his shoulders.
In my opinion it's down to the product mix. The US are exporting a small percentage of their product so a bigger percentage is ending up on the table as high value products, milk, cheese, yogurt, butter, etc. We on the other hand are the complete opposite, where a big proportion is being exported as low value product and only a small percentage is going into the high value product on the table.
This is where I feel very left down by the coops and the IDB, they told us if we produced the milk they'd get the markets. Ya they got the markets alright the low value dumping market.
The IDB were more concerned with coming up with a new moranic name for them selves rather than going out with a new product or finding a new market for their existing ones. Their still patting themselves on the back for Kerrygolds success, 40 years later.
<rant over>

Greengrass1

Says it all really.

Greengrass1

Says it all really

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Says it all really

What sort of deviation did they allow for in the calculations given the small no of herds of jex/fr/other compared to the large number of ho herds? The percentage calving at 2 years for the hol herd is low for an all spring calving scenario alright. By 2 years do they mean 22 to 26 months or do they stop strictly at 24 months?. It's an area here I must improve on big time as with the split herd I've heifers born in spring calving in autumn and some vice versa. It means there are a group of cattle here that should be in the parlour that are not and by correcting this should get to target herd size faster as well as saving money. Hopefully reducing number of fr calves born late should help this too.

Greengrass1

Milked out wrote: »

What sort of deviation did they allow for in the calculations given the small no of herds of jex/fr/other compared to the large number of ho herds? The percentage calving at 2 years for the hol herd is low for an all spring calving scenario alright. By 2 years do they mean 22 to 26 months or do they stop strictly at 24 months?. It's an area here I must improve on big time as with the split herd I've heifers born in spring calving in autumn and some vice versa. It means there are a group of cattle here that should be in the parlour that are not and by correcting this should get to target herd size faster as well as saving money. Hopefully reducing number of fr calves born late should help this too.

Some one who was at conference will have to explain what type of herds is in that study but it's certainly interesting seeing as icbf are unbiased imo

Milked out

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Some one who was at conference will have to explain what type of herds is in that study but it's certainly interesting seeing as icbf are unbiased imo

Yeah it's just when comparing herd data from a breed in over 6 thousand herds to data from breeds with 250 is a bit off I reckon. It could turn out to be bang on but the more herds the better the info.