Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

leg wax

top price at kilkenny on monday was 1400 for a super heifer , other stock like yours in age were making no bid up to 850.

mf240

Sillycave wrote: »

Have 5 late calvers (calved end of Jul to mid of Sep) who are all 3 and 4th lactation (all Hofr)
All are milking well (about 30 litres/day)
I have no intention of milking them pass Xmas day as am going to try and dry everything else off and not bothered to milk on a couple over Xmas into Jan (for once)
We would normally milk a couple on for this period (i know this irks many on this forum giving cheap milk to our processors but thats another days discussions)
Anyway the father has an intention to try and dry these up with the rest but i don't think this will work (plus there not incalf as i pulled the bull before they calved)
I would rather sell them on to some winter milkers put mightn't get much for them (any idea on prices?)
Has anyone else a suggestion apart from the hook?

Do you know anyone milking for the winter that would lease them for a couple of months. Get them back and put them incalf for Jan 19.

Or milk them on for the winter and be a slow learner like me. It's great crack down here in foundation dairying :D

kowtow

mf240 wrote: »

Do you know anyone milking for the winter that would lease them for a couple of months. Get them back and put them incalf for Jan 19.

Or milk them on for the winter and be a slow learner like me. It's great crack down here in foundation dairying :D

Ah sure some of us are still in kindergarten.

freedominacup

mf240 wrote: »

Do you know anyone milking for the winter that would lease them for a couple of months. Get them back and put them incalf for Jan 19.

Or milk them on for the winter and be a slow learner like me. It's great crack down here in foundation dairying :D

Not a bad plan. There are always ads from herdbuilder crowds in the comic looking for cows for export this time of year. You might get the Sept ones away there.

You're a long way from the only slow learner.

freedominacup

Sometimes footbathing after milking goes off without a hitch, sometimes you get shat on from a great height. Guess what type of one we had this evening😠.

charolais0153

freedominacup wrote: »

Not a bad plan. There are always ads from herdbuilder crowds in the comic looking for cows for export this time of year. You might get the Sept ones away there.

You're a long way from the only slow learner.

A dig at someone , but who.

whelan2

mf240 wrote: »

Do you know anyone milking for the winter that would lease them for a couple of months. Get them back and put them incalf for Jan 19.

Or milk them on for the winter and be a slow learner like me. It's great crack down here in foundation dairying :D

Do people still lease stock? Would disease not be a problem?

Brown Podzol

I have regularly milked to within 6 weeks of calving with no obvious effect on subsequent lactation. Did it last year and have sold over 500 kg/Ms per cow to date, still doing 1.6 per cow per day. Mean calving date Feb 10th. Scanner conditioned scored two weeks ago and only one cow 2.75 bcs or below. All should be 3 or over at dry off.I dry off abruptly and no soak up period, straight onto silage only, usually in the mid 70's dmd. Planning on a longer dry period this year, 60 days, thanks to big Phill.

freedominacup

charolais0153 wrote: »

A dig at someone , but who.

Myself if anyone. But theorise away.

Sillycave

mf240 wrote: »

Do you know anyone milking for the winter that would lease them for a couple of months. Get them back and put them incalf for Jan 19.

Or milk them on for the winter and be a slow learner like me. It's great crack down here in foundation dairying :D

Know one lad well that does, might be worth seeing how he is fixed and if he would be interested although I doubt it as he calves a lot of aut girls himself

Fountain dairying 😂😂 if only I was so lucky!!! But I don't plan on milking through Xmas this year, been a tough year for a few reasons and could do with a break over Xmas

pedigree 6

I see in the journal dairy ads.
Someone is selling off their autumn calving Holstein milking and youngstock.
There must be a switch going on to spring calving cows.
Even from posters on here. It seems to be a trend.

Timmaay

pedigree 6 wrote: »

I see in the journal dairy ads.
Someone is selling off their autumn calving Holstein milking and youngstock.
There must be a switch going on to spring calving cows.
Even from posters on here. It seems to be a trend.

As farms expand away, winter milk becomes a smaller and smaller proportion of the overall milk output, alongside that labour shortage etc, spring only calving makes sense if your the typical "one" man show.

Mooooo

Timmaay wrote: »

pedigree 6 wrote: »

I see in the journal dairy ads.
Someone is selling off their autumn calving Holstein milking and youngstock.
There must be a switch going on to spring calving cows.
Even from posters on here. It seems to be a trend.

As farms expand away, winter milk becomes a smaller and smaller proportion of the overall milk output, alongside that labour shortage etc, spring only calving makes sense if your the typical "one" man show.

Some argue for the one man show it spreads the work of calving so less pressure in spring. The worst thing I find about it is the constant going, calving breeding calving breeding.the milking isn't such an issue. Having tightened up the autumn calving is a big help, do the same now in spring and will see how things shape up

yosemitesam1

kowtow wrote: »

My own very unscientific point of view would be that if the rumen is a fermentation vessel, presumably we are not making (as full) use of it with already fermented silage as we would be with, say, grass or hay. It's plausible surely that the microbe content of the rumen might need exercise during the dry period if it is to be in good heart for the grass it will process in the following year?

Would that also be connected to the common suggestion that longer chopped silage is better for rumen function? Does more lignin mean more exercise?

My vet gave me a very comprehensive lecture on rumen bacteria when we had a cow in bits post twins this year and sure enough his recipe of 'rumen starter' along with enough modern medicine to keep her liver working while the rumen recovered certainly put her back in full health... but of course one cow doesn't make a proof!

During the silage fermentation its only water soluble carbohydrate thats fermented which are about 10-15%, even starch will escape fermentation. I dont know if silage would have any major effects on the rumen or gut microbes but inclusion of the ingredients of milkers ration in reduced rates to drys is done so that you'd have strong populations of the likes of starch/lactate utilising bacteria etc so the rumen adapts faster post calving, grain builds more folds in the rumen wall and increases blood flow to it compared to forage also.
I think longer chop lenghts are to encourage more cudding but as well as maintaining bulk in the rumen (which will also reduce intake) the lignin would slow some of the fibre digestion in the rumen and allow it to be fermented in the intestines (similar to how as starch grains get covered in more proline as the grain matures and the amount thats degraded in the rumen declines and with the proportion digested further down the tract increasing, this is more pronounced in maize afaik) which I think could definitely have a longer lasting effect on gut populations than in the rumen, similar to if you were flat out on the beer for a few weeks that it'd take a while to get your gut healthy again but it'd be in a stronger position to cope with a bit of abuse again!

Signpost

A nothing for most ye I'd imagine but I'm forever and a day doing the worst thing possible and looking over the proverbial ditch at what I class as top class farmers. Always admired Conor Creedon as a mentor farm in Kerry and follow him closely on twitter. Obviously I strive to try get up to the same level. Well following on from his scanning results during the week I had the scanner out today. Was a bit apprehensive based on what I've heard of huge empty rates this year but I still had my bench mark to work off.

https://twitter.com/conorcreedon1/status/788464810195378177 - (scanned cows this evening 91%in calf 75% in 3 weeks 85%in6 all over at 9 the power of crossbreeding)

My results:
98% in calf. 60% in 3 weeks, 85% in 6 weeks, 100% in 9 weeks.

Obviously I'm well off the pace with the 3 week interval which is a bit disappointing but getting a 9 week calving for the first time on the farm alone is a huge win for me. Also doing it with straight FR rather than cross bred is a big deal for me.

In relation to grass growth, solids, profitability, meal fed etc etc etc I am a thousand miles from any mentor farmer I know but having made this a priority of mine when I took the reigns per say, brilliant to finally see effort turning into reward! Its rare I have a pint on a day not starting with S but tonight will be a definite exception!

Waffletraktor

Signpost wrote: »

Obviously I'm well off the pace with the 3 week interval which is a bit disappointing but getting a 9 week calving for the first time on the farm alone is a huge win for me. Also doing it with straight FR rather than cross bred is a big deal for me.

In relation to grass growth, solids, profitability, meal fed etc etc etc I am a thousand miles from any mentor farmer I know but having made this a priority of mine when I took the reigns per say, brilliant to finally see effort turning into reward! Its rare I have a pint on a day not starting with S but tonight will be a definite exception!

Knowing where you want to be, finding out what you need to do to get there and regular monitoring to see where you are on the path. Step by step gets you up the hill!

pedigree 6

Waffletraktor wrote: »

Knowing where you want to be, finding out what you need to do to get there and regular monitoring to see where you are on the path. Step by step gets you up the hill!

The thing is you should never get to the top of the hill.
You should always have that little bit extra that you want to achieve.

I've seen it in both cases of horses and cows.
Some people get to the top and then it's a case of been there done that.
I'm doing something else now.

---

Posters here going on about posts on twitter of milk %'s and posts here.
I agree they should put the litres and %'s up and also the meal fed to get the full picture and it's not easy comparing a spring calving herd to an all year round herd. I wouldn't be the greatest poster for putting up my figures and I may do more. But I like looking at the reports as it gives you something to compare your own herd to.

Waffletraktor

pedigree 6 wrote: »

The thing is you should never get to the top of the hill.
You should always have that little bit extra that you want to achieve.

I've seen it in both cases of horses and cows.
Some people get to the top and then it's a case of been there done that.
I'm doing something else now.

Think the word is complacency to describe that, no fear of that for 10years here atleast. Constantly looking at where you want to be and how far your from it with the changing goalposts then
Want to get the heavy land into a 5yr grass/herbal ley - 5year cropping rotation so we can stop spending a ton of wheat per ha on herbicides for 1 grass weed.
Lighter DD side want to reduce inputs cost by 25% and better management not rely on plastic cans to do the work.

alps

We have to stop comparing.....

Take the figures for what they are....congratulate the man ...move on..

The only operators worth comparing with are ones you know their operations intimately...that's why the profit monitor is only advantageous to your own circle of discussion group members and colleagues....

Outside of that, the variables are so vast and so obscure that you have no accuracy comparing yourself to what cannot forensically know.

Those that live and feed of of farmers constantly have to make up new products and inventions to keep themselves relevant. Many of the things we fill our heads with are products and by products of others trying to make themselves relevant.

Keepgrowing

alps wrote: »

We have to stop comparing.....

Take the figures for what they are....congratulate the man ...move on..

The only operators worth comparing with are ones you know their operations intimately...that's why the profit monitor is only advantageous to your own circle of discussion group members and colleagues....

Outside of that, the variables are so vast and so obscure that you have no accuracy comparing yourself to what cannot forensically know.

Those that live and feed of of farmers constantly have to make up new products and inventions to keep themselves relevant. Many of the things we fill our heads with are products and by products of others trying to make themselves relevant.

+1

I use pm as a reference point for my own business in that I'm constantly trying to improve on previous years performance

If I see someone strong in an area I arrange a visit to their farm and drill down as hard as I can to learn where I'm falling down. There's massive amounts of information out there on farms but some of us are slow to ask for info or help.

We (partnership) will always target an area for improvement each year and will travel to meet a guy we know is excelling at it. We call and tell him exactly what we want to know and if he's agreeable we then visit. This summer we visited Wales specifically to see the profitability of higher stocking rates at grass. Next summer it's the whole area of calf rearing we're after. We need to invest in and seriously up skill in this area. The guy who looks after the calves will also come along as its very important he's up to speed on this and we all going the same direction.

While I agree with you on general comparisons we really need to visit the best operators and bench mark ourselves against them.

kowtow

alps wrote:

We have to stop comparing.....

alps wrote:

Those that live and feed of of farmers constantly have to make up new products and inventions to keep themselves relevant. Many of the things we fill our heads with are products and by products of others trying to make themselves relevant.

I understand that sentiment and I think your final paragraph should be tattooed on the arm of every dairy farmer as a condition of receiving SFP.

But I think also that constructive self criticism, open discussion, sufficient detail to put all figures in their proper context.... these are invaluable. Actually this forum - for some of us the only discussion group available - is fantastic for that, as is the approach which KG outlined above.

Believe me dairying is an unusually complex business for the scale at which it is operated.. I'm in awe of the farmers young and old, big and small, who manage to produce great milk from better cows year in year out.

alps

Keepgrowing wrote: »

+1

I use pm as a reference point for my own business in that I'm constantly trying to improve on previous years performance

If I see someone strong in an area I arrange a visit to their farm and drill down as hard as I can to learn where I'm falling down. There's massive amounts of information out there on farms but some of us are slow to ask for info or help.

We (partnership) will always target an area for improvement each year and will travel to meet a guy we know is excelling at it. We call and tell him exactly what we want to know and if he's agreeable we then visit. This summer we visited Wales specifically to see the profitability of higher stocking rates at grass. Next summer it's the whole area of calf rearing we're after. We need to invest in and seriously up skill in this area. The guy who looks after the calves will also come along as its very important he's up to speed on this and we all going the same direction.

While I agree with you on general comparisons we really need to visit the best operators and bench mark ourselves against them.

Brilliant..

pedigree 6

Right this is power of the internet and free speech.
You can agree or disagree it's up to yourself.

I wouldn't agree with alps with discussing output of your cows here or anywhere.
We all know the work and management and breeding to get your cows to that point and it's not easy (so will be harder replicate). But I could put a figure up here and someone might have a different figure and quiz me on it and learn from it and vice versa.
If it's the milk buyer you are worried about finding out, they already know how many cows you have and volume and kgs. If it's the neighbour down the road then don't put up your milk price (it's your choice).
If it's pride or ego. I lost that a long time ago and i'll learn from anyone I can and share advice that I picked up along the way.

Keepgrowing i'm guessing that the farms you visited, you made contact with them through twitter or facebook and that they were gracious enough to post info about their farms in the first place.

Edit: just to be sure i'm only on about what milk your cows are producing not your profit monitor and farm accounts.

Signpost

I'm all for sharing information but there is far too many lies and bull figures put out there by Teagasc & in turn by farmers. I remember going to the heavy soil farm in Clare (before they sold it because they couldn't farm it...) and listening to these unbelievable figures they were spouting & how they were growing huge volumes of grass and excess silage etc, then going down to the shop with the old lad for a bite of lunch and a few local lads telling us it was all lies up there and there was lorries of silage being drawn in every week. Fair enough no one likes to make a mistake, but people went home trying to replicate what they were told and probably sank with the ship. Over the years I have lost count how many times I've gone to these farms doing the impossible on farm walks and within 5 years they had all folded. I've half lost faith in these groups as a result because its a constant case of whose knob is bigger and saying your figures are superior to the fella before you just because his wife has a better pair of legs than yours. I nearly think an discussion group online would be better at this stage, let people load up everything about the farm honestly behind a username, then create groups based on soil types & fertility, industry, herd size, production costs, profit monitor etc. Then the lad with 60 cows in a heavy soils area can compare accurately with others across the county and not be seeing the figures of a 200 cow herd in tillage country.

Hmm, more I think about this the better the idea gets...

Mooooo

Maize in yesterday, thought pit would be bigger but seems like a good bit of grain in it. Man on the pit was constantly rolling alright. I put one of those zil covers on top of it, it say you don't need tyres on it but there is f-all weight in it. It didn't cover it all so I had a few lorry curtains and mats for the rest so if the bastard crows get thru all that I'll give up

alps

Mooooo wrote: »

Maize in yesterday, thought pit would be bigger but seems like a good bit of grain in it. Man on the pit was constantly rolling alright. I put one of those zil covers on top of it, it say you don't need tyres on it but there is f-all weight in it. It didn't cover it all so I had a few lorry curtains and mats for the rest so if the bastard crows get thru all that I'll give up

What kind of loads per acre Moo...got maize last week grown near Cookstown and it came in here at under 20 tonnes per acre...quiet disappointing as had been much better than that for last few years. I'm one of those mean farmers that counted the trailers, and then rang up wondering if some of the drivers had got lost...Grain exceptionally good though...

Mooooo

Not sure they went into the night harvesting. I'll measure the pit in a few days, bout 23/24 tonne to the acre last year I think, Pit similar to last year but had heard talk of up on 28 tonnes to the acre been cut but the stuff cut earlier and greener may be bulkier and be part of the reason for high yields given. I sent contractor the analysis last year and as he is trying to get varieties that'll yield as well as have plenty grain, dunno did he change from last year

Brown Podzol

Maize in here yesterday as well. Sub 20 ton but with a lot of grain. Those zil covers have gotten lighter over the years but even the heavier ones from years ago had to be covered with tyres. Magpies are the problem here and if even a square inch was left without protection they would get into it.

Brown Podzol

alps wrote: »

What kind of loads per acre Moo...got maize last week grown near Cookstown and it came in here at under 20 tonnes per acre...quiet disappointing as had been much better than that for last few years. I'm one of those mean farmers that counted the trailers, and then rang up wondering if some of the drivers had got lost...Grain exceptionally good though...

Hmmm, place name and missing loads.

Misread, thought you meant Crooksrown.

Mooooo

Brown Podzol wrote: »

alps wrote: »

What kind of loads per acre Moo...got maize last week grown near Cookstown and it came in here at under 20 tonnes per acre...quiet disappointing as had been much better than that for last few years. I'm one of those mean farmers that counted the trailers, and then rang up wondering if some of the drivers had got lost...Grain exceptionally good though...

Hmmm, place name and missing loads.

Misread, thought you meant Crooksrown.

Crookstown?