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Season 5 x 09: The Dance of Dragons - HAVE READ the books
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Iwasfrozen wrote: »The Iron Islands have way more then 80 ships, the iron fleet is 100 strong and that's not all of them.
The Greyjoys are interesting because they're a wildcard and Euron is a well travelled psychopath who has set his eyes on the throne of Westeros and actually stands a decent chance of succeeding with the help of a magic dragon horn he recovered from the ruins of Valyria, a place most captains refuse to even sail near.
Rooting for the underdog is always fun, when that underdog is an evil magic pirate it's ten times as fun.
All the Iron Islands together are about the size of Skagos
And while Skagos is pretty cold, it can't be terribly less hospitable than
"The islands [which] are stern and stony places, scant of comfort and bleak of prospect. Death is never far here, and life is mean and meagre. Men spend their nights drinking ale and arguing over whose lot is worse, the fisherfolk who fight the sea or the farmers who and scratch a crop from the poor thin soil. If truth be told, the miners have it worse than either, breaking their backs down in the dark, and for what? Iron, lead, tin, those are our treasures. Small wonder the ironmen of old turned to raiding."
Who knows? Maybe Skagos will conquer Westeros...
The war ships of the Iron Islands may have a crew of 100 (that would be the size of the Sea Bitch for example) and that would be consistent with the number of ships quoted. But compare this to the quinquerem of ancient Rome which carried a total crew of 420.
Either way, you have a fighting force of maybe 20000, tops. (which is sort of confirmed by semi-cannon sources).
Quake in fear at the 20K troops that can be mustered by the Iron Islands! Hardly a game changer, right? Okay, if they threw in their lot with some other side I could see it making a difference (particularly given their skill on the sea). But I just can't buy the idea that they are significant in isolation. Dorne or even the Vale of Arryn, on the other hand, would be significant - so on those grounds, at least, I can forgive their inclusion in plot lines.
Oh, and the idea that the wildlings could muster a force of 100,000 was just... well... fantasy. At least that number has become a more realistic figure of 5,000 (in the tv series at least). But the TV series seems even weaker at keeping track of numbers than GRRM (Dany in Series 2 has 40 Dothraki... wait... 200... 1... 50.... 100s... and now... 0?)0 -
The best estimate I've seen for the population of the Iron Islands is roughly 1 million and troop numbers at around 20k, they have a higher population density than the other kingdoms in Westeros due to their history of kidnapping women.OneOfThem Stumbled wrote: »All the Iron Islands together are about the size of Skagos
And while Skagos is pretty cold, it can't be terribly less hospitable than
"The islands [which] are stern and stony places, scant of comfort and bleak of prospect. Death is never far here, and life is mean and meagre. Men spend their nights drinking ale and arguing over whose lot is worse, the fisherfolk who fight the sea or the farmers who and scratch a crop from the poor thin soil. If truth be told, the miners have it worse than either, breaking their backs down in the dark, and for what? Iron, lead, tin, those are our treasures. Small wonder the ironmen of old turned to raiding."
Who knows? Maybe Skagos will conquer Westeros...
The war ships of the Iron Islands may have a crew of 100 (that would be the size of the Sea Bitch for example) and that would be consistent with the number of ships quoted. But compare this to the quinquerem of ancient Rome which carried a total crew of 420.
Either way, you have a fighting force of maybe 20000, tops. (which is sort of confirmed by semi-cannon sources).
Quake in fear at the 20K troops that can be mustered by the Iron Islands! Hardly a game changer, right? Okay, if they threw in their lot with some other side I could see it making a difference (particularly given their skill on the sea). But I just can't buy the idea that they are significant in isolation. Dorne or even the Vale of Arryn, on the other hand, would be significant - so on those grounds, at least, I can forgive their inclusion in plot lines.
Oh, and the idea that the wildlings could muster a force of 100,000 was just... well... fantasy. At least that number has become a more realistic figure of 5,000 (in the tv series at least). But the TV series seems even weaker at keeping track of numbers than GRRM (Dany in Series 2 has 40 Dothraki... wait... 200... 1... 50.... 100s... and now... 0?)
Granted 20k men aren't going to conquer the whole continent but with a dragon under his control, the best navy in Westeros, Danerys as an unwilling wife and whatever he's looking to seize from the Citadel I can see Euron succeeding. Temporarily at least.
Also the 100k wildlings wee a population not an army. 100k was literally almost all the wildlings.0 -
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OneOfThem Stumbled wrote: »All the Iron Islands together are about the size of Skagos
And while Skagos is pretty cold, it can't be terribly less hospitable than
"The islands [which] are stern and stony places, scant of comfort and bleak of prospect. Death is never far here, and life is mean and meagre. Men spend their nights drinking ale and arguing over whose lot is worse, the fisherfolk who fight the sea or the farmers who and scratch a crop from the poor thin soil. If truth be told, the miners have it worse than either, breaking their backs down in the dark, and for what? Iron, lead, tin, those are our treasures. Small wonder the ironmen of old turned to raiding."
Who knows? Maybe Skagos will conquer Westeros...
The war ships of the Iron Islands may have a crew of 100 (that would be the size of the Sea Bitch for example) and that would be consistent with the number of ships quoted. But compare this to the quinquerem of ancient Rome which carried a total crew of 420.
Either way, you have a fighting force of maybe 20000, tops. (which is sort of confirmed by semi-cannon sources).
Quake in fear at the 20K troops that can be mustered by the Iron Islands! Hardly a game changer, right? Okay, if they threw in their lot with some other side I could see it making a difference (particularly given their skill on the sea). But I just can't buy the idea that they are significant in isolation. Dorne or even the Vale of Arryn, on the other hand, would be significant - so on those grounds, at least, I can forgive their inclusion in plot lines.
Oh, and the idea that the wildlings could muster a force of 100,000 was just... well... fantasy. At least that number has become a more realistic figure of 5,000 (in the tv series at least). But the TV series seems even weaker at keeping track of numbers than GRRM (Dany in Series 2 has 40 Dothraki... wait... 200... 1... 50.... 100s... and now... 0?)
Not really sure what you are arguing? When has anyone on the show quaked in fear at the thought of the Greyjoys taking over Westeros? The Greyjoys have never threatened to take over Westeros. They know their own limitations. When Yara comes to get Theon at Winterfell she literally calls him an idiot for thinking he could hold the North.
I think they are a great inclusion as they are so different from the other houses.0 -
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No King is a pov character. Being non pov makes him more likely to sit the Iron Throne.Washington Irving wrote: »I didn't/don't really see Stannis taking the Iron Throne due to\mitigating factors such as winter worsening, threat of the Others (Stannis being the only contender paying attention to them), being in the North with nowhere to hole up (even if they take Winterfell, he'll have a hard time pushing south of the neck), Aegon's invasion, and potentially Dany's. And, as Liam O mentioned, he's not a POV, like Joffrey, Renly, Robb and Balon.
Unless he somehow swings an alliance with Highgarden (if by a miracle he forgives/finds a non-fatal way of punishing their 'treason' of allying with Renly and the Lannisters) and Sunspear, he hasn't a chance unless a spanner gets thrown into the works.
I still really want to see him do it, but everything is against him.
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Iwasfrozen wrote: »No King is a pov character. Being non pov makes him more likely to sit the Iron Throne.
No king lives either. So even if he does reach the Iron Throne he'll end up the same as the rest of them soon after
:pac: 0 -
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