Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Is alcoholism a disease?

Options
2

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    damon5
    Registered Users Posts: 831 ✭✭✭damon5


    Anyone hear of spirit possessions that influence a person leading to addictions that are very hard to break...


  • Options
    #33
    Custardpi
    Registered Users Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    damon5 wrote: »
    Anyone hear of spirit possessions that influence a person leading to addictions that are very hard to break...

    Very common. I hear gin & vodka possessions are particularly bad.


  • Options
    #34
    damon5
    Registered Users Posts: 831 ✭✭✭damon5


    Replies from DIPSTICKS not entertained,life is too short.


  • Options
    #35
    Bongalongherb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    damon5 wrote: »
    Anyone hear of spirit possessions that influence a person leading to addictions that are very hard to break...

    Why believe in fairy-tales than the real reality matrix you live in ?.


  • Options
    #36
    Wang King
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,169 ✭✭✭Wang King


    InTheTrees wrote: »
    A broken leg can be cured too.

    :rolleyes:

    Not if its me doing the breaking laddie!
    :);)


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    Wang King
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,169 ✭✭✭Wang King


    damon5 wrote: »
    Anyone hear of spirit possessions that influence a person leading to addictions that are very hard to break...

    So its not a disease, its Brendan Behan possessing me?!


  • Options
    #38
    Bongalongherb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    Wang King wrote: »
    Not if its me doing the breaking laddie!
    :);)

    I sense a bit of Karate in that post. What belt are you ?.


  • Options
    #39
    Wang King
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,169 ✭✭✭Wang King


    Bongalongherb wrote: »
    I sense a bit of Karate in that post. What belt are you ?.

    My iron bar doesn't need a fckin belt!


  • Options
    #40
    Bongalongherb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    I am also addicted to Manhattan dry roasted peanuts, and also ham & cheese fried omelettes. I'm also addicted to learning, philosophy, and seeking to find the answer to life and why we are here in regards to our true purpose.

    Are all of these above addictions a disease ?.


  • Options
    #41
    Lucyfur
    Registered Users Posts: 32,513 ✭✭✭✭Lucyfur


    It's a disease of mind, body and soul.

    In my opinion.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    Wang King
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,169 ✭✭✭Wang King


    Lucyfur wrote: »
    It's a disease of mind, body and soul.

    In my opinion.

    Two out of three ain't bad

    In Meatloaf's opinion


  • Options
    #43
    InTheTrees
    Registered Users Posts: 9,900 ✭✭✭InTheTrees


    Its a really serious medical condition that requires professional help to cure.

    Why does it matter if its a "disease" or not?


  • Options
    #44
    miggins
    Registered Users Posts: 75 ✭✭miggins


    Bongalongherb wrote: »
    I don't mind saying it because it's the truth. I am a long-term alcoholic and not proud of it, but I can tell you first hand that it is a serious addiction of which can, and eventually will, lead to a disease. But it is not a disease itself, it's an addiction full-stop.. Even I know this.

    Cheers ;)

    I really hope you're getting all the help you need I lost a brother in April to alcoholism and have another brother that looks to be going the same way and its heartbreaking to see I also struggled for years with it so I know how difficult it is to kick it. Best of luck man


  • Options
    #45
    Dorethy
    Registered Users Posts: 35 ✭Dorethy


    Alexis Sanchez wrote: »
    No, I don't consider it to be a disease. A disease has to be tangible, it's something you can see under a microscope.

    I looked at definitions and they're so vague that autism could be considered a disease, which is silly.

    Don't mean to drag this off topic, but really, autism is a disorder and not a disease. There's a difference. Now, back to the (demon) drink...


  • Options
    #46
    Jon Stark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,304 ✭✭✭Jon Stark


    the evasion_kid wrote: »
    Well it is progressive,anyone that's had a few relapses under their belt will tell you even during periods of sobriety that mothef*cker is doing push-ups in the background just waiting on the moment you take that first drink,you might get away with a the first few times then like a roller coaster that's reached the top of an incline....bang the brakes come off
    Aye, I know lads and women sober for 5, 6, 7...years and they'll tell you that it's something that never leaves them.

    The temptation is something that will always hang over them and it's something they just have to learn to live with.

    A life long disease that they live with in other words.


  • Options
    #47
    Penny Tration
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,687 ✭✭✭✭Penny Tration


    Jon Stark wrote: »
    Aye, I know lads and women sober for 5, 6, 7...years and they'll tell you that it's something that never leaves them.

    The temptation is something that will always hang over them and it's something they just have to learn to live with.

    A life long disease that they live with in other words.

    My dad is about 15 years without a drink and says the same - he craves it but has to just deal with it and ignore it


  • Options
    #48
    Menas
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,318 ✭✭✭✭Menas


    Jenny Thalia wrote: »
    My dad is about 15 years without a drink and says the same - he craves it but has to just deal with it and ignore it

    My mum is the same, about 15 years off it..and she was a baaad alcoholic for a long time.

    But for her the temptation is not there anymore. She lives on her own, has booze in the house but no inkling to go near it.
    Odd as that may seem she just does not want a drink. But I do think her alcoholism was escapism of sorts...so perhaps slightly different.


  • Options
    #49
    Jon Stark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,304 ✭✭✭Jon Stark


    Jenny Thalia wrote: »
    My dad is about 15 years without a drink and says the same - he craves it but has to just deal with it and ignore it

    I think it says a lot about one's character that they can live with something like that for so long. Fair play to your dad, a stronger man than most of us!


  • Options
    #50
    Custardpi
    Registered Users Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Jenny Thalia wrote: »
    My dad is about 15 years without a drink and says the same - he craves it but has to just deal with it and ignore it

    Read the article I linked to a couple of pages back. A bit long but well worth a look. Challenges the narrative of alcoholics being best advised to swear off drink completely. Finnish research indicates that many problem drinkers (though by no means all) actually do better if they restrict their drinking rather than cut it out totally. Drugs like Naltrexone also seem to be very good at managing one's cravings when used as part of an overall treatment plan.


  • Options
    #51
    Roger_007
    Registered Users Posts: 21,886 ✭✭✭✭Roger_007


    If alcoholism is a disease, then it is one that has a clear and 100% effective cure. Wouldn't it br great if all diseases were like that. All addictions are a result of the inability or unwillingness of the 'victim' to change their behaviour.
    It must be galling for people who have genuinely incurable or terminal illnesses to hear addicts looking for sympathy for themselves instead of changing their behaviour and thereby 'curing' themselves.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    Jon Stark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,304 ✭✭✭Jon Stark


    Custardpi wrote: »
    Read the article I linked to a couple of pages back. A bit long but well worth a look. Challenges the narrative of alcoholics being best advised to swear off drink completely. Finnish research indicates that many problem drinkers (though by no means all) actually do better if they restrict their drinking rather than cut it out totally. Drugs like Naltrexone also seem to be very good at managing one's cravings when used as part of an overall treatment plan.

    Most alcoholics will not have the discipline to "downgrade" their drinking. It's an all or nothing type situation and for anyone who has been able to rework their drinking habits to moderate, I would argue they weren't alcoholics in the first place. Moreso problem drinkers.


  • Options
    #53
    Darpa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 161 ✭✭Darpa


    It's not a disease its an addiction.
    But a lot of people don't seem to understand what an addiction means and entails.


  • Options
    #54
    Custardpi
    Registered Users Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Jon Stark wrote: »
    Most alcoholics will not have the discipline to "downgrade" their drinking. It's an all or nothing type situation and for anyone who has been able to rework their drinking habits to moderate, I would argue they weren't alcoholics in the first place. Moreso problem drinkers.

    That's the standard narrative promoted by AA, which if you read the article appears to be on pretty dodgy ground scientifically. Most of those involved in AA counselling have little to no medical/scientific background. Actual research is showing that the view of alcoholism as being "all or nothing" is not merely unhelpful in many cases but actually harmful to a person's chance of recovery. You should really read the article as it explains this in far better detail than I could. Not claiming it as gospel or anything but no harm in challenging your viewpoint once in a while.


  • Options
    #55
    the evasion_kid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,740 ✭✭✭the evasion_kid


    Jon Stark wrote: »
    Aye, I know lads and women sober for 5, 6, 7...years and they'll tell you that it's something that never leaves them.

    The temptation is something that will always hang over them and it's something they just have to learn to live with.

    A life long disease that they live with in other words.

    There relationship with alcohol has changed drastically,chemically,mentally,phsyically your body is altered to it,your drinking days are over,you could keep on going but I'd think you'd be better of dead.you always hear of a certain percentage who return to moderate drinking but I'd seriously question if they were an alcoholic to begin with and didn't just have a bit of a drink problem.


  • Options
    #56
    Jon Stark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,304 ✭✭✭Jon Stark


    Custardpi wrote: »
    That's the standard narrative promoted by AA, which if you read the article appears to be on pretty dodgy ground scientifically. Most of those involved in AA counselling have little to no medical/scientific background. Actual research is showing that the view of alcoholism as being "all or nothing" is not merely unhelpful in many cases but actually harmful to a person's chance of recovery. You should really read the article as it explains this in far better detail than I could. Not claiming it as gospel or anything but no harm in challenging your viewpoint once in a while.

    I'm not using AA as a narrative, not familiar with it tbh.

    But I've worked in a rehab centre based on a holistic approach. If you saw the state of people who came into us for a medical detox, you'd see why alcohol had to be completely cut from their lifestyle. They wouldn't be able to refine their drinking like you and I might be able to.


  • Options
    #57
    Custardpi
    Registered Users Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Jon Stark wrote: »
    I'm not using AA as a narrative, not familiar with it tbh.

    But I've worked in a rehab centre based on a holistic approach. If you saw the state of people who came into us for a medical detox, you'd see why alcohol had to be completely cut from their lifestyle. They wouldn't be able to refine their drinking like you and I might be able to.

    The influence of the AA view of alcoholism has greatly influenced treatment beyond AA meetings. It's become part of popular culture to view alcoholism as something which people are "helpless" to end themselves. Have a read of the article & see what you make of it when placed in the context of your own experience.


  • Options
    #58
    lickme
    Closed Accounts Posts: 108 ✭✭lickme


    Some People have addictive personalities whether its gambling or alcohol. There brains or somewhat wired differently to others that make them addicted to something. Gambling addiction and alcohol addiction is an illness or disease if you look at the research. Addictive personalities

    People here will probably say depression isn't an illness/disease either. IBS sufferers have nothing to show under the microscope and is classed as an illness/disease.


  • Options
    #59
    lazeedaisy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭lazeedaisy


    Custardpi wrote: »
    Very interesting article in The Atlantic from a few months back about alcoholism, Alcoholics Anonymous & competing narratives around problem drinking. It challenges the one-size-fits-all approach to the issue, noting that studies have shown that most heavy drinkers can actually become moderate drinkers with doctor's help, rather than being completely powerless over it. The "incurable disease" theory applied by AA does appear to be pretty shaky scientifically, as are many of the methods promoted by them to help sufferers. The writer travels to Finland where they're trying out a range of different treatments, including drug based ones which diminish a person's desire for alcohol. Apparently most patients can have alcohol after the treatment there, without the uncontrollable urge to binge which they had before. There's some people it doesn't work for of course, who need to stay 100% away from drink for life, but for most aiming for a respectful relationship with alcohol rather than a complete break seems to work better in terms of avoiding relapses into booze oblivion. I'm not medically qualified to say that this is definitely a better approach than the mainstream AA one but it's a very interesting article nonetheless & I'd urge everyone to read it, even if it is quite long.

    A very interesting article, thanks for that


  • Options
    #60
    Darpa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 161 ✭✭Darpa


    lickme wrote: »
    Some People have addictive personalities whether its gambling or alcohol. There brains or somewhat wired differently to others that make them addicted to something. Gambling addiction and alcohol addiction is an illness or disease if you look at the research. Addictive personalities

    People here will probably say depression isn't an illness/disease either. IBS sufferers have nothing to show under the microscope and is classed as an illness/disease.

    Anyone can get addicted to powerful substances such as alcohol, you just happened to not have met your substance and the correct level of intake to hit trigger level. Pray you never do.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #61
    Jon Stark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,304 ✭✭✭Jon Stark


    Custardpi wrote: »
    The influence of the AA view of alcoholism has greatly influenced treatment beyond AA meetings. It's become part of popular culture to view alcoholism as something which people are "helpless" to end themselves. Have a read of the article & see what you make of it when placed in the context of your own experience.

    I've had a look and can safely say that what he describes about AA doesn't match my own experience in rehab.

    For one, there's no higher power. Secondly, we'd view the idea of shaming someone for suffering a relapse and for not "giving" themselves to the programme as highly unethical and irresponsible. We actually empowered the individual by telling them to do it for themselves and no one else.

    Most importantly, any rehab or detox centre worth its salt is run from top to bottom by professionally trained people barring volunteers.

    So I think you are a little wide of the mark by suggesting AA's influence reaches beyond its own corridors.

    The article did raise one good point about success rates but it's hard to define success. Is completing the programme only to relapse 2 days later deemed as success? Is it staying sober for an x amount of years? At what point is something deemed a failure?


Advertisement