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plagiarism

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    #32
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    The lc is the states greatest memory test. The fact you've managed to memorise something word for word is a positive


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    #33
    sleepyheadh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 582 ✭✭✭sleepyheadh


    randylonghorn wrote: »
    Very little to do with personal belief, but rather personal experience: not so much re: the act of correcting myself, which after all is a case study of one, but, as a result of correcting, the experience of interacting with other correctors, supervising examiners, assistant chiefs etc. at marking conferences and elsewhere, and of hearing their comments and feedback.

    What personal experience do you bring to the table, sleepy, apart from your case study of one?

    I just said there were, just as there are very few on the other extreme, with the vast majority (as is normal) falling in the middle.

    Now on the "adding up" issue, in fairness, I will lend you an ear; it never fails to amaze me how many teachers with degrees and often masters can't seem to do simple maths (or even notice that they have entered it incorrectly in the calculator), and that *is* a plaint I've heard echoed from senior people. The fact that all the maths come at the end of a long and tiring couple of weeks doesn't help, but still ...

    Big difference between "a lot of them seem to be hopeless at maths" and saying that correctors are careless / interested only in bringing in a few extra pound to spend on drink.

    Well unfortunately, the results are a number and if the person can't add up to correct number, its a big issue.

    And what happens a lot, is that someone, comes away with something like a B1, and they think happy days, while if they go and check the paper, there is a fair chance that some bit of maths has been added wrongly and thus their grade is wrong.


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    #34
    randylonghorn
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 29,509 Mod ✭✭✭✭randylonghorn


    sleepyheadh wrote: »
    Well unfortunately, the results are a number and if the person can't add up to correct number, its a big issue.

    And what happens a lot, is that someone, comes away with something like a B1, and they think happy days, while if they go and check the paper, there is a fair chance that some bit of maths has been added wrongly and thus their grade is wrong.
    And that's why there's an appeals process PLUS a shorter, simpler process to have marks amended if the only issue is a numerical / arithmetical one; the latter process normally only takes a couple of days after the viewing of scripts; much quicker than the full appeals process.

    That said, I wouldn't take issue with you on anything in the post quoted here; I would take issue with your earlier throwaway comments though.

    Moving on (hopefully) ...


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    #35
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,121 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    EoghanIRL wrote:
    I have my doubts about this..


    Not sure why. If you read the newspaper reports on the day of the results, the press release every year says there are some withheld results. Schools for obvious reasons don't publicise it.

    The best approach is to do your own work, mad idea though that may seem to some people.


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    #36
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    spurious wrote: »
    Not sure why. If you read the newspaper reports on the day of the results, the press release every year says there are some withheld results. Schools for obvious reasons don't publicise it.

    The best approach is to do your own work, mad idea though that may seem to some people.

    Spurious, I don't disagree with you. I have heard of people having results with held. However I don't believe that "about" 10 people got zero for learning off the same essay for Irish. I don't believe everything I read on the internet.
    Results get withheld for cheating etc...
    Learning off the same Irish essay isn't cheating and I doubt 10 people could learn of the same essay word for word exactly.

    " Be careful learning off essays word for word that were given to you. Year before me, about 10 of them got 0 marks in their HL Irish essay because some story the teacher gave them fit one of the essay titles perfectly".


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    #37
    SureYWouldntYa
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭SureYWouldntYa


    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    Spurious, I don't disagree with you. I have heard of people having results with held. However I don't believe that "about" 10 people got zero for learning off the same essay for Irish. I don't believe everything I read on the internet.
    Results get withheld for cheating etc...
    Learning off the same Irish essay isn't cheating and I doubt 10 people could learn of the same essay word for word exactly.

    " Be careful learning off essays word for word that were given to you. Year before me, about 10 of them got 0 marks in their HL Irish essay because some story the teacher gave them fit one of the essay titles perfectly".

    what's so unbelievable about it? if an examiner got x amount of essays in a row that were the exact same, and happened to be from the same school, would that not raise some sort of red flag? not every examiner marks blindly and does the bare minimum


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    #38
    sleepyheadh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 582 ✭✭✭sleepyheadh


    SureYWouldntYa wrote: »
    what's so unbelievable about it? if an examiner got x amount of essays in a row that were the exact same, and happened to be from the same school, would that not raise some sort of red flag? not every examiner marks blindly and does the bare minimum

    Do you not understand how unlikely that is to happen? Of the hundreds of papers the corrector is marking, the 10 or so people who have the same essay, all appear one after another. The marker doesn't take a break and remembers every essay they have read?

    On a scale of zero to leaving cert related folklore..Id say this is firmly in the realm of LC related folklore


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    #39
    NeonNatural
    Registered Users Posts: 16 ✭NeonNatural


    sleepyheadh wrote: »
    Do you not understand how unlikely that is to happen? Of the hundreds of papers the corrector is marking, the 10 or so people who have the same essay, all appear one after another. The marker doesn't take a break and remembers every essay they have read?

    On a scale of zero to leaving cert related folklore..Id say this is firmly in the realm of LC related folklore

    Unlikely but possible, yes?


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    #40
    sleepyheadh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 582 ✭✭✭sleepyheadh


    NeonNatural wrote: »
    Unlikely but possible, yes?

    Yes, in the same was as winning the lotto is possible. Possible but highly unlikely.

    The second you hear someone saying anything like - it happened to a friend, or in the year above me, you can pretty much bet its B.S


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    #41
    SureYWouldntYa
    Registered Users Posts: 7,724 ✭✭✭SureYWouldntYa


    sleepyheadh wrote: »
    Yes, in the same was as winning the lotto is possible. Possible but highly unlikely.

    The second you hear someone saying anything like - it happened to a friend, or in the year above me, you can pretty much bet its B.S

    I really can't understand why it's so unbelievable, it's against the rules, so why is it so unbelievable that someone enforces the rules


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    #42
    sleepyheadh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 582 ✭✭✭sleepyheadh


    SureYWouldntYa wrote: »
    I really can't understand why it's so unbelievable, it's against the rules, so why is it so unbelievable that someone enforces the rules

    I don't doubt that it is against the rules, and I don't doubt if someone, found the rules being broken they would report it.

    What we are saying is that it wouldn't be detected.


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    #43
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    SureYWouldntYa wrote: »
    I really can't understand why it's so unbelievable, it's against the rules, so why is it so unbelievable that someone enforces the rules

    Can you provide proof that having similar essays is against the rules? Link please.

    Also, copying your lc history project from an online article is plagiarism.
    Learning notes given to your class by your teacher and reproducing them in the exam is not plagiarism. It's called rote learning.
    If what you are saying is true then students in nearly every class in the country would be receiving zero marks in the Irish essay.

    Two students having the same Irish essay because they were sitting next to each other and copied each other or brought notes into the exam is cheating and deserves to be given zero marks.


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    #44
    cathal545
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭cathal545


    Thanks guys, I'll take your opinions into consideration and try learn the key points instead


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