The Spring Statement

blackwhite

So with Noonan and Howlin having made their speeches, and seemingly told us SFA that hasn't already been repeated ad nauseum in the last few weeks/months anyway - what are people's thoughts on the usefulness (or otherwise) of this exercise?

To me (as someone who - on balance - feels that the Government have done a reasonably decent job over the past four years), the Spring Statement seems to have been a bit of a PR own goal by the Government.

They didn't reveal anything new or of any real substance, despite having hyped the bejaysus out of it, and have just left themselves open to criticism and sniping for all the things that people have expected/hoped for (no matter whether these hopes/expectations were realistic, or even genuine).

To me, they've have been better served to keep the good news coming in the normal manner, instead of setting up one big non-event.

Yet another example of this Government, despite having what should be a good-news story to tell, managing to make a balls of the PR side of things.

Arsemageddon

Think you it in one OP.

All in all it comes across as a very silly, pointless marketing exercise.

I can't see it having any lasting impact on the electorate. TBH, I can't see many people taking much notice of it outside of those who follow politics.

They would have been better off saving their good news until the budget when people will be engaged.

Muahahaha

Complete PR exercise which has seemed to backfired already. FG/Lab are very keen to control the news agenda. This week was supposed to be a feel good week with Monday dedicated to launching the Yes vote for gay marriage and today was supposed to outline their economic objectives from now to 2020 to tempt voters with tax cuts.

What instead transpired was no new news from the govt. as the cabinet had already spent most of last week leaking details of the spring statement to the media. Instead what we had today was all of the opposition taking the goverment to task over their unkept promises and giving the govt. another battering over appointing KPMG as the insiders to investigate the insiders in the Siteserv debacle.

joe912

Why are they telling us about their plans for 2017-2020. Thankfully they will be nowhere near leinster house let alone the government.

Kermit.de.frog

Who are we going to elect if the current government is not there?

How long would the public finances be out of chaos under that regime?

The opposition don't offer anything but the same economic delinquency that destroyed this country in 2008.

Valetta

joe912 wrote: »

Why are they telling us about their plans for 2017-2020. Thankfully they will be nowhere near leinster house let alone the government.

You think?

Who'll replace them?

Stheno

Valetta wrote: »

You think?

Who'll replace them?

I wonder the same. While never having supported either party in the past their statements today show serious progress in our economy

Never recalling a spring statement before I do see it as a bit of a stunt, was it intended to be a state of the nation type address? Or just a pre election stunt?

Valetta

Stheno wrote: »

I wonder the same. While never having supported either party in the past their statements today show serious progress in our economy

Never recalling a spring statement before I do see it as a bit of a stunt, was it intended to be a state of the nation type address? Or just a pre election stunt?

I think it's a trend to do away with surprise budgets. Last year they just leaked the full budget in advance. This time it's a more "formal" process with the spring statement.

Our friends over the pond to the same with their "autumn statement", in advance of their spring budget.

Sierra Oscar

Pretty disappointing that the Dáil has lost a week of legislative business to allow Government backbenchers to have the opportunity to slap themselves on the back.

joe912

Stheno wrote: »

I wonder the same. While never having supported either party in the past their statements today show serious progress in our economy

Never recalling a spring statement before I do see it as a bit of a stunt, was it intended to be a state of the nation type address? Or just a pre election stunt?

The serious progress as you call it was made while implementing policy agreed between f.f and the troika.
The progress was made on the back of Ireland being lucky that the euro dropped helping exports to u.k and u.s.a and other things outside the governments control like the price of oil falling and interest rates dropping.
Basically the progress is built on sand and with the help of a bit of creative bookkeeping.

joe912

Valetta wrote: »

You think?

Who'll replace them?

possibly sf./f.f. personally I would like to see a f.f/f.g coalition which would hopefully lead to the demise of f.f and f.g, with some sort of amalgamation between the 2 parties. so that the electorate had a clear and easy choice between left and right.

Kermit.de.frog

joe912 wrote: »

The serious progress as you call it was made while implementing policy agreed between f.f and the troika.
The progress was made on the back of Ireland being lucky that the euro dropped helping exports to u.k and u.s.a and other things outside the governments control like the price of oil falling and interest rates dropping.
Basically the progress is built on sand and with the help of a bit of creative bookkeeping.

And the shinners would be a safer bet with the public finances would they?

blackwhite

joe912 wrote: »

The serious progress as you call it was made while implementing policy agreed between f.f and the troika.
The progress was made on the back of Ireland being lucky that the euro dropped helping exports to u.k and u.s.a and other things outside the governments control like the price of oil falling and interest rates dropping.
Basically the progress is built on sand and with the help of a bit of creative bookkeeping.

It's always strange to hear SF supporters claiming that the recovery is only due to FG/Lab following the troika programme, when for the last 5/6 years SF have been saying that we should have abandoned the troika programme.

Stheno

joe912 wrote: »

possibly sf./f.f. personally I would like to see a f.f/f.g coalition which would hopefully lead to the demise of f.f and f.g, with some sort of amalgamation between the 2 parties. so that the electorate had a clear and easy choice between left and right.

If I ever se Sinn Fein in government in this country I'll leave tbh

Whatever about labour I admire fg for having the guts to inflict what they did and encourage recovery

joe912

Stheno wrote: »

If I ever se Sinn Fein in government in this country I'll leave tbh

Whatever about labour I admire fg for having the guts to inflict what they did and encourage recovery

That's hilarious, the amount of f.g supporters who claim they are going to leave when sinn fein get into government.
You cant seriously put f.g and having guts in the one sentence. They feathered their nests and the nests of those who support them. They have alienated a large percentage of the population and through equal measures of incompetence and arrogance presided over serious public unrest which is still continuing.

joe912

blackwhite wrote: »

It's always strange to hear SF supporters claiming that the recovery is only due to FG/Lab following the troika programme, when for the last 5/6 years SF have been saying that we should have abandoned the troika programme.

Because the recovery is only benifiting on section of the community and has no long term benefits accept for those in government now who will retire on lavish pensions.
There is another way, only a recovery that takes everybody with it can be sustainable long term.

Fr Tod Umptious

joe912 wrote: »

Because the recovery is only benifiting on section of the community and has no long term benefits accept for those in government now who will retire on lavish pensions.
There is another way, only a recovery that takes everybody with it can be sustainable long term.

I assume you meant to say "the recovery is only benefiting one section of the community".

So can you tell us what that one section is.

Cos I have benefited but I'm not sure what section I am supposed to be ?

blackwhite

joe912 wrote: »

Because the recovery is only benifiting on section of the community and has no long term benefits accept for those in government now who will retire on lavish pensions.
There is another way, only a recovery that takes everybody with it can be sustainable long term.

Ignoring of course, that recovery has ensured that there's no need for further cuts to welfare (which has been largely spared anyway) and no need for further cuts to services.

It seems that SF and the rest of the "left" have been advocating policies that would have no recovery at all, making sure that there's amble pain for everyone.

BoJack Horseman

joe912 wrote: »

possibly sf./f.f. personally I would like to see a f.f/f.g coalition which would hopefully lead to the demise of f.f and f.g, with some sort of amalgamation between the 2 parties. so that the electorate had a clear and easy choice between left and right.

If its a choice between centre parties & the far left.... The centre wins.

It must also discouraging to the far-left delusionists that they opposed the progress currently underway.

Wrt the thread, aping the Westminster 'autumn statement' in an environment where every single idea implemented or not is leaked 24/7 is pointless.

Rubberchikken

have never heard the term 'spring statement' beore or maybe i've been asleep.
still, not worth the paper it was written on imho.

all they're doing is playing with figures, slapping each other on the backs and making out that they actually did something positive for this country during theirm govt term so far.

who will replace them? another crowd of back slapping, pocket lining ninnies.
for the first time ever, i'm thinking my vote will be a complete waste of time when this GE occurs.

BoJack Horseman

Rubberchikken wrote: »

they actually did something positive for this country during theirm govt term so far.

Primary budget deficit.... Eliminated
Fastest growing EU economy for 2014 & 15
Fastest rate of job creation in the EU.

These are facts.

What is also a fact is that the far-left opposition was against all of this progress.

Its also a fact that the far-left not only opposed this, they stated repeatedly their desire to make a bad situation worse.

So PR stunts aside from the government, to pretend that nothing positive has happened since 2011 is both wilfully blind & factually false.

julie385

Rubberchikken wrote: »

who will replace them? another crowd of back slapping, pocket lining ninnies.
for the first time ever, i'm thinking my vote will be a complete waste of time when this GE occurs.

I have spoiled my vote for the last few GEs.
I will not vote for FF/FG, and I don't believe SF will do any favours for Ireland.

Surely now is the time to end what is effectively a single party (FF/FG) State?

A spoiled vote is not a wasted vote.

hmmm

julie385 wrote: »

A spoiled vote is not a wasted vote.

You should stop clogging up the polling booths if you're not going to be an adult and vote for someone. Spoiling your vote is a whinge and a complete cop-out of the principles of democracy. If you're so sure your vote is wasted, there is nothing stopping you running yourself and we'll see how many votes you get.

Kristopherus

julie385 wrote: »

A spoiled vote is not a wasted vote.

Nonsense, who/what does a spoilt vote benefit?

joe912

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Primary budget deficit.... Eliminated
Fastest growing EU economy for 2014 & 15
Fastest rate of job creation in the EU.

These are facts.

What is also a fact is that the far-left opposition was against all of this progress.

Its also a fact that the far-left not only opposed this, they stated repeatedly their desire to make a bad situation worse.

So PR stunts aside from the government, to pretend that nothing positive has happened since 2011 is both wilfully blind & factually false.

I will see your facts and raise you
Record youth unemployment
Record evictions and homeless
Record emigration
Record hospital waiting lists
Record numbers under the poverty line

BoJack Horseman

joe912 wrote: »

I will see your facts and raise you

can't wait!

Record youth unemployment

Record evictions and homeless

Evictions are too low.... Lower than peer countries.... including the UK.
(And I'm not sure what people refusing to pay their mortgage has to do with this or any government)
Expenditure on homeless services are €31,000 per person... per year!
The ratio of homeless to people working with homeless is 1:1!!

Record emigration

No.... Emigration is falling rapidly.... See CSO.

http://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/pme/populationandmigrationestimatesapril2014/#.VUDLJ8twYm8
(2015 stats not yet available, but likely to show further drops).

Record hospital waiting lists

no, waiting lists /bed lists peaked in 2010

Record numbers under the poverty line

As per guidelines, not having a weekly roast dinner & monthly piss up makes you in poverty (this is a fact)

Try harder!

joe912

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Primary budget deficit.... Eliminated
Fastest growing EU economy for 2014 & 15
Fastest rate of job creation in the EU.

These are facts.

What is also a fact is that the far-left opposition was against all of this progress.

Its also a fact that the far-left not only opposed this, they stated repeatedly their desire to make a bad situation worse.

So PR stunts aside from the government, to pretend that nothing positive has happened since 2011 is both wilfully blind & factually false.

So considering that this boom is a result of enda and his brilliant cabinet, can you point out which of their many creative, original and fair initiatives that were not part of the f.f troika package that you believe led to this boom.

joe912

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

can't wait!




Evictions are too low.... Lower than peer countries....
Expenditure on homeless services are €31,000 per year.
The ratio of homeless to people working with homeless is 1:1!!


No.... Emigration is falling rapidly.... See CAO.


no, waiting lists /bed lists peaked in 2010


As per guidelines, not having a weekly roast dinner & monthly piss up makes you in poverty (this is a fact)

Try harder!

You may believe this. But for people not members of the finegael club of corruption, manipulation and lies it doesn't ring true in the real world.

Godge

joe912 wrote: »

You may believe this. But for people not members of the finegael club of corruption, manipulation and lies it doesn't ring true in the real world.

joe912 wrote: »

That's hilarious, the amount of f.g supporters who claim they are going to leave when sinn fein get into government.
You cant seriously put f.g and having guts in the one sentence. They feathered their nests and the nests of those who support them. They have alienated a large percentage of the population and through equal measures of incompetence and arrogance presided over serious public unrest which is still continuing.

In the real world Pearse Doherty, the SF financial guru, has been talking about a double-dip recession that doesn't exist.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/government-has-begun-buying-a-return-to-power-sinn-fein-31179055.html


"Mr Doherty said the Government caused "a double-dip recession" and delayed recovery."

Which planet is he on?

Valetta

julie385 wrote: »

I

A spoiled vote is not a wasted vote.

A spoiled vote is not a vote at all.

It achieves nothing.

BoJack Horseman

joe912 wrote: »

You may believe this. But for people not members of the finegael club of corruption, manipulation and lies it doesn't ring true in the real world.

Well then kiddo..... Show us your numbers.

Unless the folks in the CSO aren't in the "real world" like you.