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Separation and House

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  • 12-04-2015 1:19am
    #1
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭


    Myself and my partner have split up. (Not married)
    We have a house with a mortgage which only started in December 2013.
    So we are only 15 mths into 30 year mortgage.
    I have a child from a previous relationship and I would like to stay in the home with him.
    Do I need to go to a solicitor or contact mortgage lender ?


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    #2
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    Your best bet given the rising property market is sell up and start again. Your alternative is 30 years tied to your ex partner.

    Speak to a solicitor ASAP your ex partner should do the same.


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    #3
    fussyonion
    Registered Users Posts: 7,819 ✭✭✭fussyonion


    What if your ex also wants to stay in the house?
    You both have an equal right to be there.


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    #4
    Slydice
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    fussyonion wrote: »
    What if your ex also wants to stay in the house?
    You both have an equal right to be there.

    Then ignore the first part of the previous reply and go straight to:
    MarkAnthony wrote: »
    Speak to a solicitor ASAP your ex partner should do the same.


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    #5
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,280 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    As the child is from a different relationship- your ex who you have this mortgage with, has no duty of care towards the child (or indeed you). You both have equal rights to the property- and indeed, equal obligations towards the mortgage.

    Given the price rises in the last 18 months in the Dublin area- if you sell, you may have a nice little nest egg to split between yourselves.

    If you're still amiable enough with one another- I'd suggest just selling, settle the mortgage and split the difference. If you're not- go the solicitor route.


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    #6
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,812 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    If you want to stay, then you need to figure out how to raise the finance to buy your ex out. Contact your mortgage provider after that. You will need legal advice too.


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    #7
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,280 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Its not just the finance to buy the ex out though- she would have to be in a position to take the mortgage on herself- without the ex- or what his income did from a qualifying perspective in the first place. Unless she is in a very good job- this could be the fence at which she falls. Its almost a foregone conclusion that the bank would nuke this proposal. The only way the bank would countenance this- is if the ex remained as a party to the mortgage- which the ex almost certainly won't want to do.......


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    #8
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    I do want to stay as this is my son's home which I put a lot of effort into making a home.
    This house is near his school and my family and where I grew up myself.
    We signed a family home declaring when purchasing house what does this mean?
    I also contributed more deposit to house.
    I don't understand how I am to pay her off when we are only 15 mths into a mortgage and it's is only coming off the interest


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    #9
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,280 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Presumably the property has increased in value in the last 15-18 months. Your ex is entitled to half the increase- if you want to stay in the property. That you bought the bought the property together a family home- is not disputed. If you wish to remain in the property- you owe half of any increase in the value of the property to the ex. Its reasonable that your increased share of the deposit be factored into the calculations.

    It would not be outside the realms of possibility that the property has increased up to 20% in the last 18 months. Half of this- is 10% of the value of what you paid for the property- less half the difference in deposit- depending on the purchase cost- you may owe the ex somewhere between 10 and 20k- depending on the initial price of the property- and you still have to figure how to get the bank to allow you to take over the mortgage, and get the ex off the deeds for the property...........

    Its messy- and even if everyone is amiable enough with one another- there are legal fees and the bank to be dealt with.


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    #10
    MarkAnthony
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭MarkAnthony


    Brain Fart


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    #11
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    We signed a family home declaring when purchasing house what does this mean?
    I'm guessing this means you registered the purchase as joint tenants instead of tenants in common. This in effect means that your partner "owns" 50% of the property regardless of how much of a deposit you fronted up.

    If you want to stay in the house, then get yourself a solicitor to discuss what you need to do (assuming your partner is willing to leave!).


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    #12
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    I was in a similar position op.

    Six years later we still co-own the house.

    We have negative equity so the solicitor advised we could either buy each other out (couldn't afford to), sell (also couldn't afford to) or just carry on as we were.

    My ex wanted to stay in the house so we've broached the lender a few times about taking my name off the mortgage but have been refused as he doesn't qualify for the mortgage alone.
    I rent and he stays in the house renting out rooms to cover my part of the mortgage.

    As explained to me by the solicitor at the time, we weren't married and my child isn't his. So we have no recognition as a family and the property is viewed as a joint investment.

    I own half. He own half. And we're both responsible for the mortgage.
    So you'll either need to get your ex's name off the mortgage and deeds (with her consent) or calculate the value of the house and any equity in it and buy her out.


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    #13
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    Thank you everyone for your replies.
    The house cost 180k and is prob now valued at 200
    Mortgage was 150
    Deposit 5k my partner and 25k me
    House was purchased through county council annuity loan.
    My income now is 39k.
    Does one have to reapply for mortgage to buy her out?


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    #14
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,280 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Ok- unfortunately it sounds like you don't have the financial means to take on the mortgage yourself. However- your ex could turn up in 10 years time demanding half the property- and legally they would be entitled to it.

    You need to talk to a solicitor.


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    #15
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    How don't I have the financial means?
    Mortgage is 670 a month which us a lot less than rent would be?


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    #16
    The_Morrigan
    Moderators Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    How don't I have the financial means?
    Mortgage is 670 a month which us a lot less than rent would be?

    That's not how it works.

    Go to any bank website, put in your details and see how much of a mortgage they would offer you. It won't be enough to buy out your ex and take on a new sole mortgage.


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    #17
    Lu Tze
    Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Lu Tze


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    How don't I have the financial means?
    Mortgage is 670 a month which us a lot less than rent would be?

    I presume its because your mortgage is nearly 4 times your salary.


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    #18
    ash23
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    Things have really gotten a lot tighter on lending so even if you can show you can afford the mortgage on your own, they might not lend you the amount needed.

    If you got the mortgage through the council the best thing now is to approach them and see if there's any way of getting the mortgage in your name only.


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    #19
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    Should I go directly to council or speak to a solicitor first?


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    #20
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    Should I go directly to council or speak to a solicitor first?

    I'd honestly speak to the ex and try sort it amicably first
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #21
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    I have tried.
    Ex won't leave until she gets whats due to her


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    #22
    hopgog
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭hopgog


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    I have tried.
    Ex won't leave until she gets whats due to her

    Well obviously, she is due what's she due, give her it or sell and start again in a new house by yourself.

    Why do you think you are entitled to it and she should leave.


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    #23
    jon1981
    Registered Users Posts: 4,359 ✭✭✭jon1981


    Sorry, you put in 25k and she put in 5k, you sure you didn't sign a tenants in commons contract? Double check that, very risky thing to do if you didn't.


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    #24
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,280 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    If you paid 25k of the deposit- and she only paid 5k- morally she isn't entitled to anything. However......... moral and legal rights- are two entirely different kettle of fish.........

    Unfortunately- it sounds like you will have to come to a mutually agreed value for the property (usually the average of 4 or 5 local agents), take the cost price of the property from this sum- and split the remainder in 2- and offer her, her half of the increase in the value of the property.

    The fact that you paid 5 times more deposit than she- she may be conveniently overlooking- but if she is entitled to 50% of the property- its moot. Its a sunk cost- you'll probably have to put it down to experience.

    Solicitor and Lender- you need meetings with both.........


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    #25
    TheDriver
    Registered Users Posts: 12,425 ✭✭✭✭TheDriver


    Going by your username, are you in civil partnership? As that could complicate things??


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    #26
    hopgog
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭hopgog


    If the house is now worth 200k from 180k you owe her around 16k to buy her out (10k for the increase and 5k for the deposit) that's if she put no money in after to do it up. If she did you have to work out if that increased the sale price or if she is due some of that money back.

    If you can get a a loan for 16k and the council allow you to remove her name from the mortgage and deeds, that would be your best option at the moment if you like the house and don't want to move, you could offer her to buy you out at 36k as an option too.


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    #27
    The_Morrigan
    Moderators Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Folks you're getting into equitable theory here, morals have no place in the legal profession and anyone who has had the pleasure of studying equitable law will know that joint mortgages which on paper look stacked in the favour of one party will not necessarily mean they have more of a right to that property.

    OP, speak to the council, a solr and your lender. They are the only people who can advise you in detail based on your specific circumstances.


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    #28
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,812 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    Folks you're getting into equitable theory here, morals have no place in the legal profession

    I'm gonna assume yoiu mean in the law, rather than in the profession! Otherwise horrified by that statement.


    Now, back on topic:
    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    OP, speak to the council, a solr and your lender. They are the only people who can advise you in detail based on your specific circumstances.

    This +1000000. Because the council is involved, that makes it a good deal more complex.

    One alternative that no one has mentioned is that you continue to house-share, just not as a couple who are sexually involved. I know of a few people who've done this, simply out of financial necessity. However it does depend on the house having enough bedrooms, you having enough emotional discipline - and it can get messy if you need to claim welfare at any point.

    Besides selling, your only other option is to figure how to raise the cash to buy the ex out. That could involve a Lotto win (yeah, right, we all have those), loan from family or friends (if you're lucky), getting a better job .... Or maybe you could sell to an investor who will continue to rent the place to you.

    But whatever you do, real professional advice is required, not just helpful comment from randoms on the interwebz.


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    #29
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    TheDriver wrote: »
    Going by your username, are you in civil partnership? As that could complicate things??

    No thank god!

    So is there anything I can do to keep my child in his family home as that is my only concern for staying


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    #30
    The_Morrigan
    Moderators Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    GayMom2013 wrote: »
    No thank god!

    So is there anything I can do to keep my child in his family home as that is my only concern for staying

    Do this -
    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    OP, speak to the council, a solr and your lender. They are the only people who can advise you in detail based on your specific circumstances.

    You have no more right to this property than your partner.


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    #31
    GayMom2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭GayMom2013


    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    Do this -



    You have no more right to this property than your partner.

    So if a house is deemed as a family home for a child the child has no rights whatsoever?
    Thanks for the advice anyway I just wanted to make sure that I needed to speak to a solicitor before I went shelling out the fees.


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