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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

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    #62
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    It's been said before but Clint did exactly what he was signed to do; filled a jersey for a couple of months when we had quite literally no-one else. He wasn't a bad signing.


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    #63
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,179 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    padser wrote: »
    No Clint???

    Compared to the guys I went with, Clint was a hero, I think. He was derided while he was here but I think he was someone that actually didn't do that badly. He clearly became a good bit fitter and was even trusted by Schmidt to come on in big HEC games.


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    #64
    TommyOM
    Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭TommyOM


    Clint was grand, was fine in HEC games and wasn't out of place at Rabo level. He is certainly not deserving of being placed alongside the likes of those mentioned so far.


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    #65
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Newland had a bad reputation because of how out of shape he was, but he wasn't getting his forehead smashed off his knee in the same way Hagan was at times, for example. Then again if we ever saw a foreign player turning out like that they'd probably be shipped off fairly quickly.


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    #66
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    With possibly five props away at the RWC, maybe we can get him back for a while?


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    #67
    Clearlier
    Registered Users Posts: 4,454 ✭✭✭Clearlier


    Buer wrote: »
    It tends to be the way, alright. But in a number of cases, they didn't get much of a look in because they simply were so bad in their appearances (Pala'amo, Vermass, Gomez, Hepworth etc.)

    There are guys in my selection that are there simply because they were the worst we had, in my opinion, but were actually not bad players. Chris Keane had a good pro career but we never really had very bad scrum halves (or very good).

    The wingers are probably the hardest done by. McWeeney is always remembered harshly but he picked up an international start against NZ at 21 years old. He just faded and quit when he was very young. Burke would be fondly remembered if he played elsewhere. We just had incredibly strong wing options for most of the professional era.

    And, no, not a clue about Tony Goldfinch! 5'5"?! I'm assuming he wasn't the greatest?

    He was up there with Aaron Freeman (reportedly struggled to make Lansdowne 2nds) in terms of his impact although at 6' 9" and 120kgs size wasn't Freeman's problem. I remember them both better as example of imports gone wrong than for anything that they every did on the pitch to be honest.

    TBH I have got fond memories of Burke! A real trier (no pun intended) who was small and not very quick but somehow slipped tackles and scored tries. He went over to 2nd level English rugby IIRC. As an example of a forgotten man Paddy Galvin played ten times for Leinster at the start of the professional era but I just can't remember him at all.

    As for scrum halves I feared for the safety of Derek Hegarty every time that he took the ball into contact and he did it often enough because his pass wasn't untypical of Irish scrum halves at the time. I vaguely remember Kevin Putt playing for us for a while and being somewhat unimpressive.


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    #68
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Newland had a bad reputation because of how out of shape he was, but he wasn't getting his forehead smashed off his knee in the same way Hagan was at times, for example. Then again if we ever saw a foreign player turning out like that they'd probably be shipped off fairly quickly.

    His forehead wasn't smashing off his knee because he spent his entire time here upright with his forehead as far away from his knee as was possible. Even at scrum time. The mother-in-laws partner nicknamed him Snow Patrol, because every time he came out of the scrum he had snow on him he'd been up so high.

    But yeah he wasn't the worst.


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    #69
    The_Captain
    Registered Users Posts: 1,376 ✭✭✭The_Captain


    Is the worst/best list based on forum during their Leinster tenure or their overall career peaks?

    On Leinster form, CJ would have to be in the running for worst


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    #70
    TommyOM
    Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭TommyOM


    The_Captain wrote: »
    Is the worst/best list based on forum during their Leinster tenure or their overall career peaks?

    On Leinster form, CJ would have to be in the running for worst

    He wasn't as good as he could have been when you consider his reputation and lots of injuries and a slow start meant that Leinster didn't get close to the best out of him but he played HEC games and played well for the most part.


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    #71
    SaveOurLyric
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    RuggieBear wrote: »
    Interesting.

    Erm..I mean

    Interesting

    You're one to talk yourself with your gratuitously provocative, cruel, and yes, trolling, tagline to the thread title. 'Leinster teamtalk/gossip thread IV' would have been just fine. But no. It deserves a kicker. A reminder of the dark times we live in. Do you realise the stress some of us are under at the moment ? The pills we are popping, and psychiatric treatment sessions in progress, just to get ourselves up to go to the game on Saturday ? Trying to forget they doddering hand on the blue tiller. Then 'BAM!'. You remind us.

    Thanks etc.

    And as you say, Interesting.


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    #72
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    SaveOurLyric wrote: »
    You're one to talk yourself with your gratuitously provocative, cruel, and yes, trolling, tagline to the thread title. 'Leinster teamtalk/gossip thread IV' would have been just fine. But no. It deserves a kicker. A reminder of the dark times we live in. Do you realise the stress some of us are under at the moment ? The pills we are popping, and psychiatric treatment sessions in progress, just to get ourselves up to go to the game on Saturday ? Trying to forget they doddering hand on the blue tiller. Then 'BAM!'. You remind us.

    Thanks etc.

    And as you say, Interesting.

    VII will be MOC Awakens (after contract extension).


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    #73
    SaveOurLyric
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    .ak wrote: »
    VII will be MOC Awakens (after contract extension).

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhggggggggg !!!!!!!!! :eek:


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    #74
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Ben Teo and Kane Douglas are the only NIEs contracted so far for next season

    That means we can make two signings, one of which should be a project (I dont believe that Ben Teo is a project player despite the fact that he could qualigy for Ireland).

    I would expect a signing at 9 (I expect it to be a project player for some reason). Assuming Kirchener leaves we would also likely sign a utility back, possibly one that can play 10as well as the back 3.


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    #75
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    Ben Teo and Kane Douglas are the only NIEs contracted so far for next season

    That means we can make two signings, one of which should be a project (I dont believe that Ben Teo is a project player despite the fact that he could qualigy for Ireland).

    I would expect a signing at 9 (I expect it to be a project player for some reason). Assuming Kirchener leaves we would also likely sign a utility back, possibly one that can play 10as well as the back 3.

    Yeah, I think the real problem is finding those players. Leinster need a 9 and are trying to find one but I don't think there's much out there. It's a big need for us though so I hope they're willing to shell out for it.

    As for utility backs, I think it's quite rare that one who can cover at 10 is ever able to bring much in the position, if Isa does come back as a player/coach that might be our slot used there though I suppose.


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    #76
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Yeah, I think the real problem is finding those players. Leinster need a 9 and are trying to find one but I don't think there's much out there. It's a big need for us though so I hope they're willing to shell out for it.

    As for utility backs, I think it's quite rare that one who can cover at 10 is ever able to bring much in the position, if Isa does come back as a player/coach that might be our slot used there though I suppose.

    Can't see Isa coming back despite rumours. I'm not saying we need god at 10 just someone that can come in or move around if Ross Byrne /Cathal Marsh is having a mare and steady things.

    Also I wonder if Ferg has been kicking much recently in training if not included internationally for the rwc he could take some pressure off whoever we have at 10.


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    #77
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    Can't see Isa coming back despite rumours. I'm not saying we need god at 10 just someone that can come in or move around if Ross Byrne /Cathal Marsh is having a mare and steady things.

    Also I wonder if Ferg has been kicking much recently in training if not included internationally for the rwc he could take some pressure off whoever we have at 10.

    If he isn't coming back then I do think we'll find it difficult to attract a utility player who can cover 10 of any particular quality. I'd much prefer we found someone who can do one or the other well (and we don't really need back 3 players desperately I suppose).


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    #78
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Was only thinking about it the other day, but do people remember when Madigan never took any kick, Isa or ferg used to take them, any everyone thought he couldn't kick but now he's probably the best kicker in the country.


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    #79
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,599 Mod ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    .ak wrote: »
    Was only thinking about it the other day, but do people remember when Madigan never took any kick, Isa or ferg used to take them, any everyone thought he couldn't kick but now he's probably the best kicker in the country.

    Remember at one point Leinster had 4 of the top 10 in the golden boot competition, Sexton, Isa, Ferg and Madigan.

    To be honest Id expect Ferg to have a better percentage than Gopperth has managed this season.


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    #80
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    I never felt it was his goal kicking that was a problem but his kicking from hand.


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    #81
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Can we find a 9/10 somewhere?

    Get Yachvili out of retirement.


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    #82
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    Down the Blind Side a podcast had an interview with Mick Dawson, they just tweeted:

    @TheBlindSideIRL
    Leinster expected to make an announcement on Isa Nacewa "within the week", - CEO, Mick Dawson http://downtheblindside.com/episode-20/

    I haven't had a listen, but seems some announcement is going to be made.


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    #83
    SaveOurLyric
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    wicklowwonder wrote: »
    Down the Blind Side a podcast had an interview with Mick Dawson, they just tweeted:

    @TheBlindSideIRL
    Leinster expected to make an announcement on Isa Nacewa "within the week", - CEO, Mick Dawson http://downtheblindside.com/episode-20/

    I haven't had a listen, but seems some announcement is going to be made.

    By the way, he has spent his time coaching since he left us.


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    #84
    wicklowwonder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭wicklowwonder


    SaveOurLyric wrote: »
    By the way, he has spent his time coaching since he left us.

    Yeah, I really hope it is as a coach he returns, I can't see him having an influence as a player after two seasons out of the game.


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    #85
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    He's been a "Mental coach," it'd be interesting to know what that means.

    If he is announced as a coach within the week then those hoping for a termination of MOC's contract should be pretty worried. If they are shopping around for another coach then appointing more backroom staff is an odd way to be going about it.


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    #86
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    wicklowwonder wrote: »
    Down the Blind Side a podcast had an interview with Mick Dawson, they just tweeted:

    @TheBlindSideIRL
    Leinster expected to make an announcement on Isa Nacewa "within the week", - CEO, Mick Dawson http://downtheblindside.com/episode-20/

    I haven't had a listen, but seems some announcement is going to be made.

    A bit of talk about a B&I league. Dawson says they'd be in favour of it, but it'd be hard to get the AP guys on board unless a broadcaster came with a package looking to drive it. He talks a bit about improving the Pro12 by targetting the brand and TV market. Mentions the Welsh having to bring players home and the Scots having to get more through the turnstiles with Edinburgh having to be more competitive.

    Dodged the question on MOC when Fanning asked him if he went "all Michael Cheika" on MOC given the results throughout the 6 Nations.

    Says Isa is a possibility but they are talking to a number of foreign players and an announcement on foreign players will hopefully be made during the week.

    Spoke about a learning curve during his time there and specifically said that they think they are there or thereabouts, but that still doesn't mean they get it right all the time.

    The Leinster Way is a plan they have for managing the provincial set-up from schools all the way up. Apparently not only are the other provinces looking at the set-up, but English clubs are over looking at it as well. There seems to be concerns over younger players getting poached early. It's up to Leinster to make sure they hold onto the best of them.

    Dawson agreed with meritocracy in the Pro12. With the money in the French and English game it's a tougher environment for Pro12 teams but he think the big Pro12 clubs should still be in with a shout, but it's important to get the commercial elements sorted to ensure that remains.


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    #87
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    He's been a "Mental coach," it'd be interesting to know what that means.

    If he is announced as a coach within the week then those hoping for a termination of MOC's contract should be pretty worried. If they are shopping around for another coach then appointing more backroom staff is an odd way to be going about it.

    Dawson specifically spoke about players during the Isa bit so I'm not sure he'd be coming in as a coach. He's Mental Skills coach, which from what I read is almost an Enda Falvey type role. So he's not teaching actual rugby skills. Unless of course it's a different type of mental they're talking about.


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    #88
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    molloyjh wrote: »
    Dawson specifically spoke about players during the Isa bit so I'm not sure he'd be coming in as a coach. He's Mental Skills coach, which from what I read is almost an Enda Falvey type role. So he's not teaching actual rugby skills. Unless of course it's a different type of mental they're talking about.

    I was under the impression it was a mental approach sort of role, analysis and decision making etc. But maybe you're right, if it is I wonder how he ended up in going that direction.


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    #89
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    Isa is the guy who kicks the bin and then throws it across the dressing while shouting.


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    #90
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Also interesting how he was so quick to point out that he agreed with the English and French after such an embarrassingly leading question... but maybe best to not dwell on that bit...


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    #91
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,143 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Also interesting how he was so quick to point out that he agreed with the English and French after such an embarrassingly leading question... but maybe best to not dwell on that bit...

    I think he's always been in favour of meritocracy and change in the Pro12, on the record too.


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