Rosanna Davison advises cheating woman to conceal paternity doubts from her boyfriend

hatrickpatrick

I'm pretty speechless after reading this. If anyone wondered why the issue of mens' rights has started to become widely debated in recent times and those who campaign for them sometimes seem bitter and untrusting, this type of unbelievably hideous sh!te is the exact reason.

http://www.independent.ie/style/sex-relationships/dear-rosanna-im-six-months-pregnant-but-im-not-sure-if-my-boyfriend-or-his-best-friend-is-the-father-31094031.html

Q. I’m six months pregnant and I’m not sure that my partner is the father of our child. I had a one night stand with his friend and now timing-wise this child could belong to either man. My boyfriend is so thrilled at the prospect of becoming a father and I want to just go along with that because it’s something that we had planned to do anyway. His pal and I have not said one word to each other since we slept together but I can see how he looks at me since we announced my pregnancy.

He has a wife and two children, so it’s not like he wants any of this to come out, but this is a pretty big secret to have lurking in the background – if there was no chance whatsoever that the pal could be the dad of my baby then I’d try put it behind us, but time wise I can’t lie to myself that this is the case. I think the fact that myself and this other man have not spoken about what happened or the possibility that this child is his is not helping – if we can both agree to chalk it up as a mistake that we will never mention to another soul then maybe I can just plough on with my partner?

A. This pregnancy must have come as a shock timing-wise, but your focus really needs to be on having a healthy and stress-free pregnancy, and delivering a healthy baby.

It’s happened now, you’re bringing a new life into the world and it would be pointless to get caught up in guilt and regret. I do think that you need to speak to your boyfriend’s friend before the baby is born, and to make it clear to him that the baby could be his but if he is willing to forget that the one night stand happened, then you are too. I would imagine that he’s happy to get back to his normal life and not get caught up in another woman’s child, as well as the huge problems it will cause with your boyfriend.

You might consider taking a paternity test on your child, but for now it’s most important to speak to this man and agree on how you both want to proceed. My advice is to focus on your boyfriend as being the father and cut contact with this other man once you have spoken to him.

The fact that a mainstream newspaper (yes, even if it is the Indo) would happily print an article advising somebody to trick her partner into giving up his life to raise another man's child without realising it is something I find shocking, even in a society in which mens' rights and autonomy are generally ridden roughshod over without a second thought. Is paternity fraud really normalised to the extent at which it can be advised to casually and openly, without literally a single sentence in the article giving thought to how the boyfriend might feel if he knew the kid wasn't his?

That's not even getting into the fact that this woman is being advised to conceal her infidelity, again as if her partner's feelings or role in their relationship is completely irrelevant. I have a very hard time imagining that any cheating man would ever be advised to do the same. Nor is it even touching the issue of another man potentially having a child that he will never know about - where do his rights as a biological parent come into any of this?

I consider myself a gender egalitarian rather than either a feminist or an MRA, and I definitely don't consider myself MGTOW - but bullsh!t like this is directly responsible, at least in part, for the trend of guys shunning relationships. The same trend which I'm sure people like Ms Davison will bemoan in future newspaper columns, "why are there no good men who are interested in a relationship / getting married / etc?" before accusing the majority of this generation's men of being childish or having "peter pan syndrome" simply because they're disillusioned with how irrelevant their own desires and feelings in relationships have become from society's point of view.

Does anyone else find the article absolutely abhorrent? Does it surprise anyone? Am I being overly pessimistic in my belief that this kind of male disposability has become absolutely endemic in society to the point at which it is seen as somehow normal, and not a horrific violation of an actual human being's life? Is this view less mainstream than the media trends suggest?

Thoughts?

Kevin McCloud

I don't know op, we wont solve it tonight anyway.

Rothko

She's an idiot so who cares what she thinks.

endacl

Presuming:

(A) the letter wasn't actually 'from' an Indo sub editor filling inches on the page,

and,

(B) the reply wasn't actually 'from' another Indo sub editor filling inches on the page,

who cares? It's the Indo.

The Backwards Man

It's just one woman's opinion in one of those tacky advice columns that all papers go for. Now I'm no expert, but I'm reasonably sure that one woman's opinion does not equal all woman's opinions, so while I like you don't agree with the advice that's given per se, I don't really see the need to go on an all out tirade of gender bashing.

ProudDUB

The main fault lies with the Indo for giving RD a platform in the first place, to advise people on their relationships. How on earth does being the daughter of a former 80's popstar/model/former Miss World/rabid vegan qualify her to meddle in peoples lives like this?

The woman in question also deserves a good smack for thinking that someone like RD should be advising her on her love life.

Kevin McCloud

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I don't really see the need to go on an all out tirade of gender bashing.

Fully agree, think the op is getting very testy, he should go to the gym and do a workout.

Tombi!

I understand why she would advise it. IE: speak not of it and nobody gets hurt. It was a one night stand only.
Raising another person's child doesn't make you any less of a parent, BTW. If you think it does then I'd wonder what you think of adoption. It's not about men's rights anymore than it is about the right of kid she's pregnant with. Nor is it about women's rights.
It's about doing what is best for all parties involved.

Tombi!

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

Fully agree, think the op is getting very testy, he should go to the gym and do a workout.

Remember when you said "fully agree" about no need for the gender bashing? Yeah? Great.
Drop the gender bashing.

tommyboy2222

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I understand why she would advise it. IE: speak not of it and nobody gets hurt. It was a one night stand only.
Raising another person's child doesn't make you any less of a parent, BTW. If you think it does then I'd wonder what you think of adoption. It's not about men's rights anymore than it is about the right of kid she's pregnant with. Nor is it about women's rights.
It's about doing what is best for all parties involved.

Except the boyfriend.

The Backwards Man

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I understand why she would advise it. IE: speak not of it and nobody gets hurt. It was a one night stand only.
Raising another person's child doesn't make you any less of a parent, BTW. If you think it does then I'd wonder what you think of adoption. It's not about men's rights anymore than it is about the right of kid she's pregnant with. Nor is it about women's rights.
It's about doing what is best for all parties involved.

I dunno BD, again I'm no expert, but the longer you spend sweeping under carpets, the more you end up with dirt under your feet.

Tombi!

tommyboy2222 wrote: »

Except the boyfriend.

How so? The choice is "keep the boyfriend out of the loop and never mention the subject again" or "tell boyfriend, potentially risk breakup, possible fist fight between him and the other fella, possible ruining of the other man's family, leaving the pregnant woman without a partner to support her at all.

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I dunno BD, again I'm no expert, but the longer you spend sweeping under carpets, the more you end up with dirt under your feet.

I completely agree but the thing is, the advice seemed to be "if it can be pushed away and never mentioned again then it's fine". It all does come down to individual situations and all but given how little the letter to her said, her reply was pretty decent for the informatnion she got.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

The Backwards Man wrote: »

It's just one woman's opinion in one of those tacky advice columns that all papers go for. Now I'm no expert, but I'm reasonably sure that one woman's opinion does not equal all woman's opinions, so while I like you don't agree with the advice that's given per se, I don't really see the need to go on an all out tirade of gender bashing.

Ehh, I can kind of see his point. Twould raise more than a few eyebrows if a mens' magazine advice column told a man to conceal from his wife the fact that he'd knocked her friend up like. There are gendered double standards all through life, this happens to be one that very much victimises men. Pointing out that something victimises men does not equal woman bashing, just as pointing out that say, sexual violence disproportionately affects women is not man bashing.

But. Some people are horrible. Some of those people are women. Most people are sound. Tbh, this whole thing of avoiding women rather than avoiding horrible people as a response to the actions of some horrible women does come across as the action of someone who's either not that bright or not that predisposed to like women in the first place.

2Bints1Joe

Don't listen to her ladies she couldn't even conceal when she cheated in a charity marathon

ProudDUB

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I understand why she would advise it. IE: speak not of it and nobody gets hurt. It was a one night stand only.
Raising another person's child doesn't make you any less of a parent, BTW. If you think it does then I'd wonder what you think of adoption. It's not about men's rights anymore than it is about the right of kid she's pregnant with. Nor is it about women's rights.
It's about doing what is best for all parties involved.

Of course it doesn't. But people generally enter into an adoptive relationship with a child, knowing full well that they are not biologically related to the child, but they make a conscious decision to love and care for the child anyway. In this case, the "father" has no idea that he isn't the father. He is not being given any choice in the matter. That is not fair to all parties involved, the child most of all.

Junkyard Tom

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Am I being overly pessimistic

Yes, very much so.

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Is this view less mainstream than the media trends suggest?

The mainstream media should only be used as a barometer as to how much we're utter bull**** is passed off as news or how pervasive and shallow celeb-culture is.

Allyall

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

How so? The choice is "keep the boyfriend out of the loop and never mention the subject again" or "tell boyfriend, potentially risk breakup, possible fist fight between him and the other fella, possible ruining of the other man's family, leaving the pregnant woman without a partner to support her at all.

The Father of the Child should step up..
May not be her 'partner', but that's their own doing.

i.e. - For them to figure out, not leave a third person involved.

ballsymchugh

you'd hope the two lads are the same race at least...

Tombi!

ProudDUB wrote: »

Of course it doesn't. But people generally enter into an adoptive relationship with a child, knowing full well that they are not biologically related to the child, but they make a conscious decision to love and care for the child anyway. In this case, the "father" has no idea that he isn't the father. He is not being given any choice in the matter. That is not fair to all parties involved, the child most of all.

You're assuming he's not the father. The lady never stated if either one was the father. Just a "maybe".
In what way does the child lose the most?

Allyall wrote: »

The Father of the Child should step up..
May not be her 'partner', but that's their own doing.

i.e. - For them to figure out, not leave a third person involved.

See above. Lady has no idea who the father is. She thinks it could be his mate.

NachoBusiness

Sorry, but how eactly is the following advice to conceal paternity doubts:

You might consider taking a paternity test on your child, but for now it’s most important to speak to this man and agree on how you both want to proceed.

Surely when she says 'speak to this man' she means regarding her doubts.

crockholm

Take a DNA test from the kid,and work from there.

Tombi!

NachoBusiness wrote: »

Sorry, but how eactly is the following advice to conceal paternity doubts:

Surely when she says 'speak to this man' she means regarding her doubts.

This bit: I do think that you need to speak to your boyfriend’s friend before the baby is born, and to make it clear to him that the baby could be his but if he is willing to forget that the one night stand happened, then you are too. I

Cold War Kid

Crikey what a mess. Paternity test should be done ASAP when the baby's born, in my opinion.

If the other guy is the father, ideally she should come clean - but that could lead to the breakdown of the other guy's marriage and family, so easier said than done. However, not coming clean would mean her partner being duped into thinking he is raising his own child when he isn't, which is simply unacceptable in my opinion.
Coming clean now to her partner that he may not be the father might cause a level of turmoil that wouldn't be good for the baby she is carrying. But waiting until after the baby is born will mean months of her partner being overjoyed that he is about to become a father, and then if it turns out he isn't...
The break-up of their relationship would be no biggie in my opinion as, how well was it going if she had sex with his friend? The pair of tools. I know life isn't straightforward and crap happens, but... his friend?!!

No easy answers, but a decision has to be made, and I don't agree with saying nothing if the paternity test reveals the friend is the father. Desperate fecking advice on that dumb column.

ProudDUB

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

You're assuming he's not the father. The lady never stated if either one was the father. Just a "maybe".
In what way does the child lose the most?



See above. Lady has no idea who the father is. She thinks it could be his mate.

The child loses most if the mother decides to leave things as they are, not raise the paternity issue, but the child finds out later on that Daddy is not their biological father. Some adopted people get on perfectly find not knowing where they "from" or what their biological roots are. Some people don't and are deeply troubled by it.

ballsymchugh

i agree with endacl above, it's probably a bullsh1t story with a bullsh1t reply from someone on work experience.

in all seriousness though, if this were a real situation, it has implications on the baby's health down the line in cases of inherited dodgy genes.

Cold War Kid

And if the other guy is the father, while he says he wouldn't be interested in the child now, it could be a very different story down the line.

Tombi!

ProudDUB wrote: »

The child loses most if the mother decides to leave things as they are, not raise the paternity issue, but the child finds out later on that Daddy is not their biological father. Some adopted people get on perfectly find not knowing where they "from" or what their biological roots are. Some people don't and are deeply troubled by it.

I think you're overreacting here.

iptba

If the issue of paternity is never investigated, the child could end up thinking the wrong person is their father.

As well as the dubious morals regarding causing a man to be cuckolded, it also means that the child would have the wrong information about their family medical history.

Also in terms of dating, they could date somebody who was a close blood relative which is not good for the health of children that result (or if the information did come out eventually that a couple were related biologically after a couple were already close, it would lead to a lot of emotional strife).

Cold War Kid

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I think you're overreacting here.

I don't know. It would be devastating for anyone to find out their father isn't who they thought he was (if it turns out that the friend in this case is the father).

NachoBusiness

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

This bit:

But isn't that just in reference to stopping the affair?

Doesn't her then saying she needs to sit down with her b/f and decide how they want proceed imply that she should tell her b/f of those paternity doubts? I mean, what else would Roseanna mean by saying she needs to "speak to this man" about if not the paternity doubts?

Tombi!

You all do realize it's only a possibly the other man is the father, right? Some of you are acting like it's a sure thing.

Tombi!

NachoBusiness wrote: »

But isn't that just in reference to stopping the affair?

Doesn't her then saying she needs to sit down with her b/f and decide how they want proceed imply that she should tell her b/f of those paternity doubts? I mean, what else would Roseanna mean by saying she needs to "speak to this man" about if not the paternity doubts?

I think you're mixed up (or I am).
"The man" in that quote is the boyfriend's mate. There is no current affair. There was a one night stand

iptba

NachoBusiness wrote: »

Doesn't her then saying she needs to sit down with her b/f and decide how they want proceed imply that she should tell her b/f of those paternity doubts? I mean, what else would Roseanna mean by saying she needs to "speak to this man" about if not the paternity doubts?

She says:

I do think that you need to speak to your boyfriend’s friend before the baby is born

Not the boyfriend

ProudDUB

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I think you're overreacting here.

Trust me. I'm not. I have eight nieces and nephews. Four of them were adopted. They all had wildly varying reactions to being adopted and knowing (or not knowing) their birth families and/or the circumstances of how they came into the world. Two got on just fine. Two were (and are) deeply troubled by it all. No two people are alike on things like this, so dismissing the importance of this as an over reaction, is rather ignorant imo.

ceadaoin.

It seems to me she is saying concentrate on the pregnancy and birth for now and to deal with the paternity issue once the child is born. A stressful pregnancy is best avoided. Anyway, would someone in this situation really consider the opinion of rosanna Davidson their first port of call for advice? I doubt it.

angeline

Absolutely appalling and immoral advice in my opinion....to pretend to her boyfriend that the child is his if it is not is a horrible thing to do to him. Living a lie. Should she really be advising anyone if she considers that good advice....

Allyall

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

See above. Lady has no idea who the father is. She thinks it could be his mate.

Yes, but that doesn't change what I said.
I still think the Father should step up.

When it is known who it is, then he should still be there. It may not be in the form of 'partner', but that is possibly unavoidable at this stage.
The Child could still have a very happy upbringing. Whether or not the Mother has a partner to support her, is tbh, tough..
She should still have the Father around, who should equal the responsibilities.

Kevin McCloud

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

You all do realize it's only a possibly the other man is the father, right? Some of you are acting like it's a sure thing.

We are entitled to our opinions.

Tombi!

ProudDUB wrote: »

Trust me. I'm not. I have eight nieces and nephews. Four of them were adopted. They all had wildly varying reactions to being adopted and knowing (or not knowing) their birth families and/or the circumstances of how they came into the world. Two got on just fine, two were and are deeply troubled by it all. No two people are alike on this, so dismissing the importance of this as an over reaction, is rather ignorant imo.

I'm dismissing it as an overreaction because it's no guarantee that the child is raised by someone who isn't his biological parent.

The Backwards Man

Feline Groovy wrote: »

I don't know. It would be devastating for anyone to find out their father isn't who they thought he was (if it turns out that the friend in this case is the father).

Is it always that way? Having seen both sides, men who have raised other men's children as their own, and men who don't deserve to be called men for the way they treated their own kids, I would think it's not always that simple.

Tombi!

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

We are entitled to our opinions.

Yes... I'm pointing out why I think some of your opinions/reactions to the situation are unwarranted. I'm not saying you can't have them at all.

Cold War Kid

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Is it always that way? Having seen both sides, men who have raised other men's children as their own, and men who don't deserve to be called men for the way they treated their own kids, I would think it's not always that simple.

True, but in the cases where the man raising the child is well loved by the child who believes he's daddy, and then for this to be revealed to be a lie... bound to be at least an upheaval for the child.

ProudDUB

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I'm dismissing it as an overreaction because it's no guarantee that the child is raised by someone who isn't his biological parent.

No there isn't. But the woman seems to want validation for saying nothing, doing nothing and just hoping for the best. If the child winds up being the by product of the one night stand and that fact comes out after the man has already committed to raising him, that could be very damaging to the child.

Kevin McCloud

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Yes... I'm pointing out why I think some of your opinions/reactions to the situation are unwarranted. I'm not saying you can't have them at all.

You seem to be sitting on one side of the fence on this.

Tombi!

ProudDUB wrote: »

No there isn't. But the woman seems to want validation for saying nothing, doing nothing and just hoping for the best. If the child winds up being the by product of the one night stand and that fact comes out after the man has already committed to raising him, that could be very damaging to the child.

The first point is valid, yes. She is looking validation to do as (in her mind) the safest and easiest solution. Miss advice lady and ourselves can be more objective on it. The second one is assuming a worse case scenario here.
Which if it is happening then by all means, she needs to make both men aware of the situation and decide what is best for the child.

Cold War Kid

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

You seem to be sitting on one side of the fence on this.

But isn't deciding that the boyfriend's friend is definitely the father the same thing? He might be, but he might not, so I guess there isn't much point in speaking in terms of him definitely being the father. However she should prepare for the chance that he is. Dopes didn't use protection, ffs. What they did was so stupid I'm not sure I believe it's real actually.

The Backwards Man

Feline Groovy wrote: »

True, but in the cases where the man raising the child is well loved by the child who believes he's daddy, and then for this to be revealed to be a lie... bound to be at least an upheaval for the child.

Yeah, it's a question with no easy right or wrong answers, so I think it's probably a wee bit harsh to berate Rosanna too much on it. Personally, I think honesty is the best policy, but in the real world, this is not always the case.

DoYouEvenLift

I wonder what kind of % of 'fathers' are deceived into raising kids that aren't theirs lol. Absolute scumbag behaviour.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

You all do realize it's only a possibly the other man is the father, right? Some of you are acting like it's a sure thing.

She's "only" running a 50:50 chance of seriously deceiving her partner? What if he finds out about this in twenty years, what if he really wants a kid and decides to just stop at this one and is left nearing retirement having devoted huge amounts of time and money to a relationship (with her) and a family (the child) that's built on a foundation of a fairly mahoosive lie?

Allyall

Feline Groovy wrote: »

But isn't deciding that the boyfriend's friend is definitely the father the same thing? He might be, but he might not, so I guess there isn't much point in speaking in terms of him definitely being the father. However she should prepare for the chance that he is. Dopes didn't use protection, ffs. What they did was so stupid I'm not sure I believe it's real actually.

You don't believe that someone had a one night stand without protection?

I agree, in this day and age, people are more educated than previously, but to assume that one night stands don't happen without protection is pretty naive.

The spontaneity..
The fact that you may have wanted it to happen for a while...
Possibly drunk..

If you don't have it with you (protection), you're not going to go looking for protection....

If it results in pregnancy, and both parents know who they are, and decide to continue with the pregnancy..

Then step up. Take responsibility for it.
If it turns out not to be the guy she's with, then let him know. To string him along endlessly for her mistakes would be nasty.
If it is him, and he sticks with her, then, cool.

Tombi!

electro, I've stated if the child is the other man's she better own the Hell up to it and do something that's in the best interest of the child. My point was that some people are acting like it's a sure thing. Some are not. Neither side giving opinions are 100% correct here and there's no point acting like either side is.