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Blurred Lines.

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24

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    #32
    AndonHandon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,384 ✭✭✭AndonHandon


    They sound very similar. It's justice for that prick Thicke. But Pharell as well is clearly on the way out these past few years; feeling old and washed up so resorts to desperate tactics to patch up an ailing career.


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    #33
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    diomed wrote: »
    Originality is the art of concealing your source.

    Exactly. All art is derivative. That's the bloody point.


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    #34
    4zn76tysfajdxp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,944 ✭✭✭✭4zn76tysfajdxp


    AndonHandon wrote: »
    They sound very similar. It's justice for that prick Thicke. But Pharell as well is clearly on the way out these past few years; feeling old and washed up so resorts to desperate tactics to patch up an ailing career.

    Ailing career? Didn't he have a massive song last year?


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    #35
    Wide Load
    Closed Accounts Posts: 112 ✭✭Wide Load


    AndonHandon wrote: »
    They sound very similar. It's justice for that prick Thicke. But Pharell as well is clearly on the way out these past few years; feeling old and washed up so resorts to desperate tactics to patch up an ailing career.

    It's a shame but he's never really been on form on his own for the most part, bar a couple of tracks here and there. His best and most creative work has always been with The Neptunes & N.E.R.D.


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    #36
    AndonHandon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,384 ✭✭✭AndonHandon


    Evie Nutty Mushroom wrote: »
    Ailing career? Didn't he have a massive song last year?

    ?


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    #37
    bjork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭bjork


    What what what?

    You mean Thicke and Pharrell have no talent and have to rip off other peoples music :eek:

    Get out


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    #38
    Teyla Emmagan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,641 ✭✭✭Teyla Emmagan


    They sound vaguely similar to me but that's about it. In the way that millions of songs are alike. Nothing is truly original any more. I actually prefer Blurred Lines.


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    #39
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    AndonHandon wrote: »
    They sound very similar. It's justice for that prick Thicke. But Pharell as well is clearly on the way out these past few years; feeling old and washed up so resorts to desperate tactics to patch up an ailing career.
    Teyla Emmagan wrote: »
    They sound vaguely similar to me but that's about it. In the way that millions of songs are alike. Nothing is truly original any more. I actually prefer Blurred Lines.

    You can say the same thing for a whole load of blues music. But these 2 songs in question have very distinctive differences.

    The Marvin Gaye track has a a different bass line. It even runs from a different beat.

    The only thing that's similar is the notation of 2 notes at the start of each bass line. And it's been shown before that rhythm itself can not be copyrighted.

    I'd be rather interested to see what the basis of the Jury's verdict was on this (as it's not mentioned in the article in the OP). And whether any of them had any knowledge of music itself.


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    #40
    floggg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭floggg


    What I love most about that song is that the appearance of a drug dealer with multiple criminal convictions (including for trying to buy enough guns to take over a small country) is one of the least controversial elements of the song!


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    #41
    floggg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭floggg


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    You can say the same thing for a whole load of blues music. But these 2 songs in question have very distinctive differences.

    The Marvin Gaye track has a a different bass line. It even runs from a different beat.

    The only thing that's similar is the notation of 2 notes at the start of each bass line. And it's been shown before that rhythm itself can not be copyrighted.

    I'd be rather interested to see what the basis of the Jury's verdict was on this (as it's not mentioned in the article in the OP). And whether any of them had any knowledge of music itself.

    I imagine the rapey lyrics couldn't have helped

    (I like the song, and am listening to it as I type - but damn those lyrics are rapey).


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    #42
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    floggg wrote: »
    I imagine the rapey lyrics couldn't have helped

    (I like the song, and am listening to it as I type - but damn those lyrics are rapey).

    They can be perceived as that alright, but when I heard it, it was more of a case of anxious desperation and sexual frustration, from the man's point of view. Sort of a parody on PUA.


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    #43
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    All I got out of it is Thicke Gaye Busch…


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    #44
    bjork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭bjork


    floggg wrote: »
    I imagine the rapey lyrics couldn't have helped

    (I like the song, and am listening to it as I type - but damn those lyrics are rapey).


    An easy way to promote something is to put a catchy tune behind it.


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    #45
    wally79
    Registered Users Posts: 2,933 ✭✭✭wally79


    Favourite part of the whole article is the first comment


    "Here we go. Another article pushing the Gaye agenda."


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    #46
    MakeEmLaugh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,356 ✭✭✭MakeEmLaugh


    The jury didn't even hear the two tracks side by side.

    They had a musician come in and 'interpret' each song based on sheet music.

    Unless you have an extraordinary versatile musician, then the songs are going to sound, at the very least, somewhat similar.


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    #47
    MakeEmLaugh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,356 ✭✭✭MakeEmLaugh


    floggg wrote: »
    I imagine the rapey lyrics couldn't have helped

    (I like the song, and am listening to it as I type - but damn those lyrics are rapey).

    That isn't a problem with the song or with Robin Thicke and Pharrell Williams, it's a problem with hip-hop.

    There are literally hundreds of hip-hop songs that are far more misogynist (or 'rapey') than 'Blurred Lines'.

    NWA, who practically invented modern hip-hop, had a lyric on the first track of their first album that went

    "I find a good piece of pussy, I go up in it
    So if you're at a show in the front row
    I'm a call you a bitch or dirty-ass ho
    You'll probably get mad like a bitch is supposed to
    But that shows me, slut, you're composed to
    a crazy muthaf-cker from the street"

    Next to that, Blurred Lines seems positively tame.


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    #48
    4zn76tysfajdxp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,944 ✭✭✭✭4zn76tysfajdxp


    AndonHandon wrote: »
    ?

    Or two years ago. Whichever.


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    #49
    Irish Guitarist
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,736 ✭✭✭Irish Guitarist


    I always thought it sampled Kiss by Prince.


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    #50
    valoren
    Registered Users Posts: 5,458 ✭✭✭valoren


    Because I'm not Happy-yyyyyyy-eeee-yyyyy-eeeee-eeeeee.


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    #51
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Copy one person and it's called plagiarism. Copy a load of people and it's called research!


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    #52
    floggg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭floggg


    MakeEmLaugh wrote: »
    That isn't a problem with the song or with Robin Thicke and Pharrell Williams, it's a problem with hip-hop.

    There are literally hundreds of hip-hop songs that are far more misogynist (or 'rapey') than 'Blurred Lines'.

    NWA, who practically invented modern hip-hop, had a lyric on the first track of their first album that went

    "I find a good piece of pussy, I go up in it
    So if you're at a show in the front row
    I'm a call you a bitch or dirty-ass ho
    You'll probably get mad like a bitch is supposed to
    But that shows me, slut, you're composed to
    a crazy muthaf-cker from the street"

    Next to that, Blurred Lines seems positively tame.

    No it's not. Ice Cube certainly doesn't show much respect for women in that song, but he is not suggesting he would rape them. His view on woman in the early stages of his career was simply that they were materialistic and would only sleep with you if they thought they could get something out of it.

    Hip-hop is certainly misogynistic, and doesn't always demonstrate much regard for women, but for the most part it does respect the requirement for consent in its lyrics.*

    It's just that many rappers don't think very highly of those that they have consensual sex with.

    The blurred lines song is distinctly rapey though - it's premise is that Thicke refuses to accept a woman saying "No" actually means it, and that she secretly wants him to take her roughly.

    That's far worse than call somebody a bitch or hoe.

    Also, Thicke isn't a hip-hop artist. While there is a featured rapper on the song, I haven't seen too many people take specific issue with his verse. While his use of the word bitch is certainly misogynistic, he is verse is trying to persuade a woman to be with him. There is nothing rapey about it in the slightest.

    Trying to blame it on hip-hop, or absolving Thicke and Pharrell of personally responsibility, is therefore puzzling.

    Also, given the many spectacular examples of misogyny in hip-hop, was a song from 1989 the best you could do? A Bitch is A Bitch would have been a better choice at least - though Too Short or 2 Live Crew would have been way better choices from that era.


    Also, NWA didn't invent modern hip-hop. They brought gangster rap to public awareness but they were just building on what others created before them.

    *there are exceptions of course, usually rappers who use it for shock value, which are equally troubling.


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    #53
    MakeEmLaugh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,356 ✭✭✭MakeEmLaugh


    floggg wrote: »
    No it's not. Ice Cube certainly doesn't show much respect for women in that song, but he is not suggesting he would rape them.

    The verse I quoted was by MC Ren, not Ice Cube.
    floggg wrote: »
    Also, Thicke isn't a hip-hop artist.

    Blurred Lines reached Number 1 on the US Top 100 Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs. It's a hop-hop song.
    floggg wrote: »
    Also, given the many spectacular examples of misogyny in hip-hop, was a song from 1989 the best you could do?

    No, I chose an older (and hugely influential) song to show how long misogyny has been part of hip-hop.


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    #54
    lee_baby_simms
    Registered Users Posts: 3,407 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    They can be perceived as that alright, but when I heard it, it was more of a case of anxious desperation and sexual frustration, from the man's point of view. Sort of a parody on PUA.

    Funnily enough that was also Gary Glitters recent defence in court.


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    #55
    floggg
    Registered Users Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭floggg


    MakeEmLaugh wrote: »
    The verse I quoted was by MC Ren, not Ice Cube.



    Blurred Lines reached Number 1 on the US Top 100 Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs. It's a hop-hop song.



    No, I chose an older (and hugely influential) song to show how long misogyny has been part of hip-hop.

    Forgive me for mixing up rappers on a 25 year old song.

    I won't excuse misognyistic rap, but I think songs which strong rape themes more objectionable (I still listen to both mind).

    Also, have you considered that it might fall within the R&B side of that chart. The two genres are not interchangeable.

    Both Wikipedia and iTunes seem to think it does.


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    #56
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    This is going to destroy music. If two riffs like that which are so spectacularly different can be got for copyright of one of them, I honestly don't see how anyone is ever going to write another song which doesn't rip off somebody - if this is how low the bar for "ripping off" has been set.


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    #57
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    This is going to destroy music. If two riffs like that which are so spectacularly different can be got for copyright of one of them, I honestly don't see how anyone is ever going to write another song which doesn't rip off somebody - if this is how low the bar for "ripping off" has been set.

    Aye. I'm a bit shocked by it. Trying to find what the Jury's verdict was based on and came across this article on The Gaurdian:

    http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/mar/10/blurred-lines-pharrell-robin-thicke-copied-marvin-gaye

    Quoted:
    Howard King, lead attorney for Williams and Thicke, told the panel that a verdict in favor of the Gaye family would have a chilling effect on musicians who were trying to recreate a genre or homage to another artist’s sound.

    King denied there were any substantial similarities between Blurred Lines and the sheet music Gaye submitted to obtain copyright protection.

    What in the hell?


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    #58
    Thargor
    Registered Users Posts: 17,885 ✭✭✭✭Thargor


    Hate this song more than any other of the last few years both for the message, that fcuking bellend Williams and the amount of play it got but yeah this verdict is crazy. Not sure you should have slobs on a jury deciding these kind of things, very tempting for them to do something they consider significant like smacking down celebrities so they can tell all their friends than to do the right thing instead.

    Also the sister sobbing on the news about how the chains had been broken and they were now free because they got this payout made me want to punch the tv.


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    #59
    Jay D
    Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Jay D


    I have to say, not mad on the lads found guilty but I don't think they sound similar at all.


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    #60
    KungPao
    Registered Users Posts: 4,781 ✭✭✭KungPao


    A vague similarity. Crazy decision.

    Here is an example of "paying homage" going too far:

    1992/3
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6TEZPe4oII


    1996/7
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw-WODGUXEw


    Now that's a blatant copy.

    The Blurred Lines thing is not like Vanilla Ice/Queen either..it's just not that similar.


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    #61
    Kenny B
    Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Kenny B


    I Heard the Gaye song on RTE Gold a while back and straight away felt it was a rip off.

    That they lost a court is not surprising, that they let it go to court is.

    Wham/Barry Manilow for 'Last Christmas/Can't smile without you' and the more recent Grammy winning song 'Stay with Me' by sam smyth which was taken from Tom Petty 'I Won't back down' are examples of where the offending artist holds up the hands and a deal is done on Royalties to keep it out of the courts, usually the original artist says some very complimentary remarks about the younger cogger to show no hard feelings.


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