Aer Lingus Fleet/Routes Discussion

Kcormahs

marno21 wrote: »

Sure, but it does have early morning arrivals from LBA/EMA/LTN/STN/BTS/MAN/EDI/LPL/BRS/BHX/GLA all of which wold have less transatlantic services (or in some cases none) and would be ripe for EI to pick up transatlantic connecting pax

I have been hearing about this Ryanair feeding for a while now and it doesn't seem to be happenning any time soon. I'd say its more of a rumour type and fake propaganda. the IT issue would be sorted by now...

kevinandrew

Kcormahs wrote: »

marno21 wrote: »

Sure, but it does have early morning arrivals from LBA/EMA/LTN/STN/BTS/MAN/EDI/LPL/BRS/BHX/GLA all of which wold have less transatlantic services (or in some cases none) and would be ripe for EI to pick up transatlantic connecting pax

I have been hearing about this Ryanair feeding for a while now and it doesn't seem to be happenning any time soon. I'd say its more of a rumour type and fake propaganda. the IT issue would be sorted by now...

Ryanair management stated it would be up and running by the end of the year but we've heard that one before! It's believed Aer Lingus has a very difficult system to work with, I have no knowledge of this aspect of the business but any issues should have been sorted by now. 

It's not like Ryanair is powering ahead with many of its own deals either, so far just Air Europa over a year ago so you'd have to wonder how committed they are to future relationships. The Norwegian deal was dead before it even started and there's been nothing official from them on Aer Lingus, just the odd manager comment when questioned. 

I think it makes sense to a certain degree for both parties so it would be interesting to finally see it happen.

Kcormahs

kevinandrew wrote: »

Agreed! I think eventually Aer Lingus will need to consider basing aircraft in continental Europe for earlier arrivals in addition to bolstering frequencies throughout the day on the Atlantic. I was responding to Kona's suggestion that the aircraft "may no come near Ireland" which confused me.

I'd like to see the ei519 and the ei601 back eventually (Early Paris and Amesterdam, arriving around 8.30am in Dublin) . Unless aer lingus sold those two slots at AMS and CDG for nightstopping the aircirafts. if so, it'll be harder to see that happening again... and management hasn't mentioned anything regarding this aspect as far as im concerned. maybe im wrong

kona

kevinandrew wrote: »

So you think they'd make more money going non-stop from European cities? Putting themselves in direct competition with home nation airlines like Air France, Lufthansa or KLM? 

Those transfer pax have chosen to fly via Dublin with Aer Lingus for a reason whether it be the lower fares or pre-clearance advantage neither of which are guaranteed with a non stop. It totally eliminates the unique selling point of Aer Lingus.

With the next generation aircraft, some of that is possible. Aer lingus needs to move with the times and basing yourself out of dublin these days is a serious handicap. The airport is a absoloute disaster.
Theres nothing wrong with competing with other flag carriers either, if aer lingus are cheaper people will fly with them.

Idbatterim

kona wrote: »

With the next generation aircraft, some of that is possible. Aer lingus needs to move with the times and basing yourself out of dublin these days is a serious handicap. The airport is a absoloute disaster.
Theres nothing wrong with competing with other flag carriers either, if aer lingus are cheaper people will fly with them.

In what way is it a disaster. Other than the absolute joke that is the congestion on the airfield at peak times ? Or is that what you are referring too?

billy few mates

Idbatterim wrote: »

In what way is it a disaster. Other than the absolute joke that is the congestion on the airfield at peak times ? Or is that what you are referring too?

I'm guessing it's just the congestion rather than anything to do with Aer Lingus itself. Terminal 2 is too small, Aer Lingus could probably fill it on their own besides the other operators. Nothing worse than arriving on a late evening Aer Lingus flight, parking on the B pier, having to do the long walk to T1 to join a massive queue for passport control.
Also the bottle neck at T2 in the mornings and the forty minutes spent crawling the 200m to the runway because of the congestion.

kona

Idbatterim wrote: »

In what way is it a disaster. Other than the absolute joke that is the congestion on the airfield at peak times ? Or is that what you are referring too?

Constant moving of widebody aircraft, chronic congestion, lack of stands. Cul de sacs at every pier.

Tenger

kona wrote: »

Constant moving of widebody aircraft, chronic congestion, lack of stands. Cul de sacs at every pier.

I don’t think anyone is going to dispute those points. However those are not going to change anytime soon (if ever)
I’m not what the solution is.

billy few mates

Tenger wrote: »

I don’t think anyone is going to dispute those points. However those are not going to change anytime soon (if ever)
I’m not what the solution is.

Terminal 3...

Mebuntu

..after their derisory initial offer of $50 voucher was refused.

Which of the fleet, 330 or 757, I wonder?

https://www.elliott.org/thats-ridiculous-2/worst-airline-seat-aer-lingus/

California Dreamer

Mebuntu wrote: »

..after their derisory initial offer of $50 voucher was refused.

Which of the fleet, 330 or 757, I wonder?

https://www.elliott.org/thats-ridiculous-2/worst-airline-seat-aer-lingus/

He told me that the flight was boarding late and there was a bunch of ‘over-served’ policeman going to the St. Patty’s Day parade abroad. He didn’t want to delay the flight any further and so he ‘took one for the team.’ He pulled some pillows down and made the best of it. He received a $50 voucher for Aer Lingus- which is in my opinion not acceptable.

For saying St Patty's Day they should have been denied boarding!!!! :mad::mad:

kona

Mebuntu wrote: »

..after their derisory initial offer of $50 voucher was refused.

Which of the fleet, 330 or 757, I wonder?

https://www.elliott.org/thats-ridiculous-2/worst-airline-seat-aer-lingus/

A330. I find it hard to belive that the cushion was actually missing. It possibly slid off.

kona

Tenger wrote: »

I don’t think anyone is going to dispute those points. However those are not going to change anytime soon (if ever)
I’m not what the solution is.

Base aircraft elsewhere , maybe make more use of shannons pre clearance.

Conflats

Tenger wrote:

I don’t think anyone is going to dispute those points. However those are not going to change anytime soon (if ever) I’m not what the solution is.

I wonder if the ils for 28 was moved to the far side of the r132 into the fields just below the car hire village. Then put a taxiways down lower around the fence and bring the departing aircraft up on the old airport road side of 28/34 and free up some of the bottleneck. Similar set up to what is used in Atlanta with taxiways to stop planes crossing the active runways

Tenger

billy few mates wrote: »

Terminal 3...

That is true but I cant see that happening for another 8-10 years.
Didnt T2 construction alone take 2 years?
So we need a pax target to be reached, planning approval, legal challenges to the planning approval ended, the construction and opening.

IE 222

kona wrote: »

Base aircraft elsewhere , maybe make more use of shannons pre clearance.

Shannon is never going to catch on as some sort of T/A hub. There is not enough local demand to provide the number the flights to other cities/countries needed to supplement an expanded T/A offering in Shannon. There is only a small number of passengers on each flight transferring onwards to the States. It's the amount of flights coming into Dublin rather than the volume on each flight.

IE 222

Kcormahs wrote: »

With earlier departures to the States, most of the connections from Europe and UK won’t be able to book those flights as they all land after 11am+ mostly (possibly apart from LHR (ei149/151) and maybe early inbounds MAN/BHX)

Early morning departures worked before, they can also get an aircraft back to Dub on the same day and even get it out again on a late night departure from DUB if it left early enough. They will also be using smaller aircraft meaning less seats to fill.

The earlier departures can be used by Irish passengers or US travellers returning home offering more seats for connections later in the day and been able to keep the current early T/A departures on the ground till after the first wave of short haul departures return in the late morning.

kona

IE 222 wrote: »

Shannon is never going to catch on as some sort of T/A hub. There is not enough local demand to provide the number the flights to other cities/countries needed to supplement an expanded T/A offering in Shannon. There is only a small number of passengers on each flight transferring onwards to the States. It's the amount of flights coming into Dublin rather than the volume on each flight.

Doesnt kuwait 777 stop off there for preclearance? Nothimg to stop a 321 neo starting off in europe and route thru shannon, take on fuel, pre clear and off to the states. I dont think local demand would come into it.

L1011

kona wrote: »

Doesnt kuwait 777 stop off there for preclearance? Nothimg to stop a 321 neo starting off in europe and route thru shannon, take on fuel, pre clear and off to the states. I dont think local demand would come into it.

US-acceptable security only and not pre-clearance.

JCX BXC

L1011 wrote: »

US-acceptable security only and not pre-clearance.

The long term plan was always to get them to preclear, however I'm unsure if that has occured yet.

Kev11491

kona wrote: »

Doesnt kuwait 777 stop off there for preclearance? Nothimg to stop a 321 neo starting off in europe and route thru shannon, take on fuel, pre clear and off to the states. I dont think local demand would come into it.

If the issue of local demand didn't come into it then it would've happened already.

HTCOne

The KAC B77W can make it direct to the states from home and indeed it used to. It’s only stopping in SNN because the US wasn’t satisfied with their security standards. I believe the plan was to do what was required to meet these standards and end the stopover but who knows.

JCX BXC

HTCOne wrote: »

The KAC B77W can make it direct to the states from home and indeed it used to. .

When did it even fly direct from Kuwait to the US?

Razor44

Conflats wrote: »

I wonder if the ils for 28 was moved to the far side of the r132 into the fields just below the car hire village. Then put a taxiways down lower around the fence and bring the departing aircraft up on the old airport road side of 28/34 and free up some of the bottleneck. Similar set up to what is used in Atlanta with taxiways to stop planes crossing the active runways

That is actually in the 15' - 19' development plan, on page 187. however, if it actually happens, that's another thing altogether :pac:

https://www.aviationreg.ie/_fileupload/2014-05-29%20DAA%20Capital%20Investment%20Proposals.pdf

HTCOne

JCX BXC wrote: »

When did it even fly direct from Kuwait to the US?

They used to run A340s via LHR, then for a while the 77W flew direct in conjuntion with the 340 LHR stop. They ended the LHR-JFK flights after an Israeli passport holder took them to court for refusing to sell them a ticket on the JFK-LHR leg. Like most ME countries, Kuwait doesn’t recognize Israel so the airline wasn’t able to accept the passport as valid.

So the B77W went direct between Kuwait city and JFK for a while before the security issue forced them to stop somewhere. The UAE/ETD/QTR etc B77Ws fly an awful lot further than JFK from the Gulf so range is not an issue.

kona

Kev11491 wrote: »

If the issue of local demand didn't come into it then it would've happened already.

The 321 neo wasnt on the table then. Dublin was also functioning as a airport.

HTCOne

kona wrote: »

The 321 neo wasnt on the table then.

But the B752 was. If tech stopping was still realistic, airlines would be sending A320s, 737s etc say LHR/MAN/GLA-YQX-ORD etc. SNN has the location to be a mini KEF, but it doesn’t have the O&D to make the flights work, especially in winter when TATL demand out of SNN plummets, hence why virtually every TATL route is seasonal.

marno21

KEF is also the primary airport for Iceland in addition to being an international hub

The closest thing to an Irish KEF is Dublin..

kona

HTCOne wrote: »

But the B752 was. If tech stopping was still realistic, airlines would be sending A320s, 737s etc say LHR/MAN/GLA-YQX-ORD etc. SNN has the location to be a mini KEF, but it doesn’t have the O&D to make the flights work, especially in winter when TATL demand out of SNN plummets, hence why virtually every TATL route is seasonal.

Thats really nothing to do with what im saying. A 321 neo wont be stopping 5 times on the way from europe to the states.
They are about 40 years ahead of a 757 too, which means far less costs involved.

L1011

The 321neo doing that will end up being uncompetitive against going through a normal hub just as the 757 was before. They work for point to put or point-hub-point, not point-random fuel stop in the way-point. Pre-clearance costs money and isn't something LCCs or their passengers are massively interested in. Norwegian use it at Dublin only because (almost) everyone does.

Icelandair are extremely reliant on cargo to make their operation work. Shannon is not on an isolated island which needs to import virtually everything through Shannon and also exports lots of food via Shannon.