Aer Lingus Fleet/Routes Discussion

HTCOne

L1011 wrote: »

Star - those two partnerships were why people thought an independent EI might actually join Star; particularly after BMI ceased to be and they lost coverage in the UK and Ireland as a result.

Thanks for that.

So UAL and ACA in Star combined with JBU are what the current success is built on.

Then add CPA and QFA....they'd be mad to ditch the current model IMO

Tenger

AoifeOCaa wrote: »

Regarding the aer space, as mentioned by Rutter on the video, launching in 2018, I am really surprised. Thought this wasn't enough profitable to bring a case on this matter. It will be interesting to see if this REALLY happens.

I was informed that AerSpace was being planned when IAG took over. At that point all ongoing projects were frozen as IAG reps looked over the entire EI operation. So perhaps they are content with the business plan and giving the green light so EI can improve their Shorthaul offering?

Locker10a

Tenger wrote: »

AoifeOCaa wrote: »

Regarding the aer space, as mentioned by Rutter on the video, launching in 2018, I am really surprised. Thought this wasn't enough profitable to bring a case on this matter. It will be interesting to see if this REALLY happens.

I was informed that AerSpace was being planned when IAG took over. At that point all ongoing projects were frozen as IAG reps looked over the entire EI operation. So perhaps they are content with the business plan and giving the green light so EI can improve their Shorthaul offering?

Am I correct in thinking that while the A330s are crewed on min Crew, they can depart an outstation with 7 crew if a number of pax are offloaded, where’s this cant happen on the 757 as one Crew station(set of doors) wouldn’t be cover by any crew member and this is a no go

alancostello

Tenger wrote: »

I was informed that AerSpace was being planned when IAG took over. At that point all ongoing projects were frozen as IAG reps looked over the entire EI operation. So perhaps they are content with the business plan and giving the green light so EI can improve their Shorthaul offering?

Part of me assumes if/when it does launch it'll be under a new name as Airbus are using 'AirSpace' to brand their latest cabin interior product.

joeysoap

Locker10a wrote: »

Am I correct in thinking that while the A330s are crewed on min Crew, they can depart an outstation with 7 crew if a number of pax are offloaded, where’s this cant happen on the 757 as one Crew station(set of doors) wouldn’t be cover by any crew member and this is a no go

Does the number of seats not govern the number of cabin crew? I thought it was 1:50.

Afaik AL are amongst the 'leanest' crewed aircraft in transatlantic routes.

Tenger

joeysoap wrote: »

Does the number of seats not govern the number of cabin crew? I thought it was 1:50.

Afaik AL are amongst the 'leanest' crewed aircraft in transatlantic routes.

The general rule worldwide is 1:50. EI A319s had less than 150 seats so 3 crew was the complement, even though the aircraft is just a shortened A320. Ryanair planning 199 seats on their B737MAX-200 will permit the same crewing levels as current operation.
However number of doors on wide bodies is also a consideration. EI B747s had 10 doors so minimum cabin crew would have been 10.
On the B757, as a narrow body the crew can cover a door on either side. I'm not sure if those B757s have crew stations in the middle of the cabin as the A321s have. I expect that they do, thus having only 3 of the 4 pairs of exit manned is a no go.

Locker10a

Tenger wrote: »

joeysoap wrote: »

Does the number of seats not govern the number of cabin crew? I thought it was 1:50.

Afaik AL are amongst the 'leanest' crewed aircraft in transatlantic routes.

The general rule worldwide is 1:50. EI A319s had less than 150 seats so 3 crew was the complement, even though the aircraft is just a shortened A320. Ryanair planning 199 seats on their B737MAX-200 will permit the same crewing levels as current operation.
However number of doors on wide bodies is also a consideration. EI B747s had 10 doors so minimum cabin crew would have been 10.
On the B757, as a narrow body the crew can cover a door on either side. I'm not sure if those B757s have crew stations in the middle of the cabin as the A321s have. I expect that they do, those having only 3 of the 4 pairs of exit manned is a no go.

Yeah the EI 757s go with 4 Crew, one crew member per pair of exits. So one crew member down is one pair of exits unmanned

joeysoap

Hard question; anybody know how many seats planned on the A321LR?

NH2013

joeysoap wrote: »

Hard question; anybody know how many seats planned on the A321LR?

174 Economy and 12 Business for a total of 186.

AoifeOCaa

NH2013 wrote: »

174 Economy and 12 Business for a total of 186.

So it will be 4 crew on the Aer Lingus a321LR?

Locker10a

AoifeOCaa wrote: »

NH2013 wrote: »

174 Economy and 12 Business for a total of 186.

So it will be 4 crew on the Aer Lingus a321LR?

Yeah I’d say 100% they will keep it the same as the 757

Tenger

Locker10a wrote: »

Yeah I’d say 100% they will keep it the same as the 757

The current A321s require 5 crew so I expect similar on the LRs. I'm not sure how the regs are different from the B757. ASL?
Especially in light of planning to have some sort of J Class/Prem Y on the horthaul routes.

JCX BXC

Tenger wrote: »

The current A321s require 5 crew so I expect similar on the LRs. I'm not sure how the regs are different from the B757. ASL?
Especially in light of planning to have some sort of J Class/Prem Y on the horthaul routes.

Are the 5 crew not purely just due to the fact that they have over 200 seats?

Tenger

JCX BXC wrote: »

Are the 5 crew not purely just due to the fact that they have over 200 seats?

Well done me. Completely forgot about the 200+ capacity. In my time in EI it was 193, just shows how much it was drilled into me!

goingnowhere

Its
1 per 50 or part of
1 per main door if widebody, but narrow body it gets fun on the A321 there must be 2 in the rear but 1 in front

So for A321 the minimum is 5, but the A321 is a funny beast it depends on the door config C-C-C-C so full width doors or C-III-III-C, C-I-I-C or C-C-I-C (think this is the EI conf), certified passenger is 180-220 depending on doors, if in C-C-C-C its 4, C-I-I-C its 5. The Airbus docs are not clear on the scenario of a narrow L3/R3 door which EI have.


For A330 as it is a widebody with standard doors (lets ignore the fun with Door L/R3) Its 1 per door, so minimum is 8

J.pilkington

Assuming that there will be business class on the a321 then surely they wouldn’t be able to manage with just 4 crew and maintain the premium service?

Dardania

J.pilkington wrote: »

Assuming that there will be business class on the a321 then surely they wouldn’t be able to manage with just 4 crew and maintain the premium service?

They seem to do it with 757 at present?

smurfjed

For us the wording is "passenger" rather than "seats", so if a cabin crew member goes sick or gets injured, the flight can operate with less passengers down to the minimum safety number which is one per door.

trellheim

Worse, if an Long haul crew member gets sick in Dublin there are no spares in the airport normally, on-call has to come in from home ( direct and personal experience recently )

joeysoap

Would the 12 business not require a more or less dedicated crew member to look after them? I would have thought that at the fares being charged they would be a little bit 'pampered'

This would only leave 3 crew for the other 174 passengerds and IMO that's a little bit tight.

NH2013

joeysoap wrote: »

Would the 12 business not require a more or less dedicated crew member to look after them? I would have thought that at the fares being charged they would be a little bit 'pampered'

This would only leave 3 crew for the other 174 passengerds and IMO that's a little bit tight.

From my experience of the 757, it’s actially worse than this, 2 crew work up front in business to provide that “pampered” service, leaving only 2 down the back to look after the rest. This being in line with Aer Lingus’ low cost mantra across the Atlantic to compete with the likes of Norwegian, other 757 carriers across the Atlantic such as American and United all have 6 cabin crew looking after their passengers and in addition their 757s are actually slightly less densely configured than Aer Lingus.

MoeJay

757 with Aer Lingus has 4 cabin crew, 1 for business, the remainder for economy. Given as it’s worked so far, I think we can presume it won’t be any different for the 321neo LR.

Big big cost advantage over the US carriers.

They previously considered the cost of reroute or cancellation as a result of disruption at the outstation and it was cheaper than taking an extra crew member in any configuration to provide coverage at the outstation.

duskyjoe

smurfjed wrote: »

For us the wording is "passenger" rather than "seats", so if a cabin crew member goes sick or gets injured, the flight can operate with less passengers down to the minimum safety number which is one per door.

For a 330 - min dispatch is 8 irrespective of pax. Return to base with regulatory authority approval is 7

highlydebased

I always thought it was crew per number of seats not pax onboard.

L1011

highlydebased wrote: »

I always thought it was crew per number of seats not pax onboard.

I believe the FAA works on seats onboard and the EASA on pax onboard but that is without checking anything so could be completely wrong.

Jamie2k9

I would expect a few more Y seats on the A321 LR's probally looking closer to 186-196 or at least that's what EI said.

Locker10a

L1011 wrote: »

highlydebased wrote: »

I always thought it was crew per number of seats not pax onboard.

I believe the FAA works on seats onboard and the EASA on pax onboard but that is without checking anything so could be completely wrong.

A flight may operate with a crew member short under certain circumstances. Pax may have to be offloaded and certain rows blocked off close to the unmanned exit. It’s complicated and depends on aircraft type and regulator authority.

Aircraft mad 1

Dose aerlingus have any plans to buy a330neos ��

As I hear they are think of put b757 out of cork to USA

Aircraft mad 1

I understand

So now a350 are going to Iberia and ba

It pity that aerlingus will not get any

Aircraft mad 1

Any update on Ei-gcf ��