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Porsche 924 Superthread

1356713

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭salysol


    munuus wrote: »
    just checked it now, will take it apart tomorrow and maybe try to bypass it with power probe.

    Thx for the tip

    Relay locations

    [FONT=Arial, Arial, Helvetica]
    (Top Row, left to right)
    1. Not used
    2. Fuel pump relay
    3. Fog Lamp Relay
    4. Not used
    5. Seatbelt warning buzzer relay
    6. Rear window defroster relay
    (Bottom Row, left to right)
    1. Not used
    2. Driving lights
    3. Horn, rear wiper, adjustable mirrors relay
    4. Wiper relay
    5. Turn signal flasher relay


    [FONT=Arial, Arial, Helvetica]My car starts, but won't stay running./My car won't turn over.

    The ignition switch can and will die, after time. If the car dies (like the ignition was turned off) immediately after the ignition switch is released to the "Run" position, but runs fine while in the "Start" position, suspect a bad ignition switch. Likewise, if the dash lights all come on, and if the car can be push-started, but won't even turn over when the ignition switch is turned to the "Crank" position, the ignition switch could be bad.
    The best way to check this is to hotwire the car, bypassing the ignition switch. Go to the Technical Section - Bodywork for details on how to hotwire the car, and for instructions on how to remove and replace the switch.
    However, if the car runs the same after hotwiring, then the problem is elsewhere. If the car does not crank, make sure the battery is good and charged, and make sure all grounds are clean and good. If the engine starts but does not stay running, you should be looking above at the section on Tune-Ups, and at the section on when the engine starts but stalls.
    [/FONT]
    [/FONT]


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,544 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    ^^ Good info there.

    Let us know how you get on, munuus!


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    Just quick update:

    Disconnected ignition switch , bypassed 30-15 ignition on 30-50 cranking. Engine starts and runs while 30 and 50 connected then it dies when released. The same result as before so at least now I know that ignition switch is ok :)

    Also rechecked all fuses. All good.

    There is a weird switch (not factory)with permanent 12V with one wire going to radio (probably memory) and from the switch to windscreen washer motor to the front. need to track what is going on there.

    Was there any immobilizer in 924? I have something on the key ring which goes into the plug beside the ignition. The previous owner said they removed/bypassed that but when I looked on that bypass it was that wire with permanent 12 into radio.


  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭salysol


    munuus wrote: »
    Just quick update:

    Disconnected ignition switch , bypassed 30-15 ignition on 30-50 cranking. Engine starts and runs while 30 and 50 connected then it dies when released. The same result as before so at least now I know that ignition switch is ok :)

    Also rechecked all fuses. All good.

    There is a weird switch (not factory)with permanent 12V with one wire going to radio (probably memory) and from the switch to windscreen washer motor to the front. need to track what is going on there.

    Was there any immobilizer in 924? I have something on the key ring which goes into the plug beside the ignition. The previous owner said they removed/bypassed that but when I looked on that bypass it was that wire with permanent 12 into radio.
    some had immobilizers but if yours has 1 it wouldn't start atall


  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭salysol


    have you checked the fuses in the auxilary fuse board as 1 of the fuses feeds the fuel pump forget which 1 but they tend to become loose.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    Thx for tips :)

    I will look into it tomorrow. I believe all the fuses are fine on both ends but will recheck that tomorrow.
    DME relay seems to work fine, I did check it out of the car and also re soldered 3 or 4 joints.

    The plan for tomorrow is to install fuel pressure gauge and test the pressure when cranking and also after 60 min.
    Possibly checking injectors for blockage/spray pattern. (the old filter was fully blocked when I bought it)
    Amount of fuel pumped in 30 sec.

    All hoses :) again

    Is there any sensor which is required for engine to run?

    K jetronic seems to be pretty simple system, so that might be next step.


  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭salysol


    munuus wrote: »
    Thx for tips :)

    I will look into it tomorrow. I believe all the fuses are fine on both ends but will recheck that tomorrow.
    DME relay seems to work fine, I did check it out of the car and also re soldered 3 or 4 joints.

    The plan for tomorrow is to install fuel pressure gauge and test the pressure when cranking and also after 60 min.
    Possibly checking injectors for blockage/spray pattern. (the old filter was fully blocked when I bought it)
    Amount of fuel pumped in 30 sec.

    All hoses :) again

    Is there any sensor which is required for engine to run?

    K jetronic seems to be pretty simple system, so that might be next step.
    Yes the Kjetronic is very easy,but if it starts then stops it has to be the ignition switch failing that it might be the distributer they tend to play up,what year is it !


  • Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭type85


    munuus wrote: »
    Just quick update:

    Disconnected ignition switch , bypassed 30-15 ignition on 30-50 cranking. Engine starts and runs while 30 and 50 connected then it dies when released. The same result as before so at least now I know that ignition switch is ok :)

    Also rechecked all fuses. All good.

    There is a weird switch (not factory)with permanent 12V with one wire going to radio (probably memory) and from the switch to windscreen washer motor to the front. need to track what is going on there.

    Was there any immobilizer in 924? I have something on the key ring which goes into the plug beside the ignition. The previous owner said they removed/bypassed that but when I looked on that bypass it was that wire with permanent 12 into radio.

    It runs with the starter engaged? And then cuts out when you release the key? Its the Ballast Resistor fitted to the live supply to the Ignition Coil thats at fault, either fit a new one or bypass it and fit a 12v coil


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    It is 1981. 2 owners, first had it dry stored till 2002 then second did probably 500 km in last 13 years.

    We checked spark but only while cranking.
    I'm sure that power is going to distributor, I changed cap,rotor and cables.

    Wasn't sure about cable position on cap so trial and error got it where it is now.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    type85 wrote: »
    It runs with the starter engaged? And then cuts out when you release the key? Its the Ballast Resistor fitted to the live supply to the Ignition Coil thats at fault, either fit a new one or bypass it and fit a 12v coil

    Yes exactly. So should I look for new coil?
    To find out probably need to fit other one and try to start.

    Is there a way to measure coil or ballast resistor?

    Thanks for tip :) mate

    I'll bypass it tomorrow/today from battery to positive on coil and try to start. If it runs fine time to source new ballast resistor. seems to be fun part to find :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    youtube.com/watch?v=HOc9D7LYcT0

    It is running :) thx for all the help

    I did bypass the coil from the battery. First it was quite a struggle but after cleaning spark plugs and letting it dry from fuel it started no problem :)

    It is running little to high 1200-1300rpm but I know vacuum hoses are not in the best shape (loose) and pretty much all connectors need to be stripped and cleaned.

    The mistake I made was the measurement on the coil. I didn't realize that it had ground on both ends. With power probe it was clear that it gets positive voltage while cranking and no voltage (ground) when in run 2th key position.

    The question now is going to be locating that ballast resistor ( I looked everywhere... almost) and buying/refitting new one.

    Also the car is 1981 but the wiring diagram seems to be for ones made 79-80. So I was checking wrong ones all that time.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,544 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    Great news. That's a big step taken. :)


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,544 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    LIGHTNING wrote: »
    The second one you can hear her hunting at idle.
    Does that go away after she warms up a minute? Modern cars are the only cars I've ever had that aren't a bit lumpy straight after startup.

    Nice teaser vids, too. :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    Dades wrote: »
    Does that go away after she warms up a minute? Modern cars are the only cars I've ever had that aren't a bit lumpy straight after startup.

    My E30 ix sounds the same when I start it from time to time, after few km it clears itself and goes smooth.

    Is this daily driver?
    I would check common thing as fuel,air filter, cables, spark plugs, vacuum leak, clean earth points around engine etc, the things that don't cost anything/very little and make quite a difference.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    Haynes has all the steps how to check fuel setting. I would just go step by step from fuel pressure to injectors, checking plate regulator etc.
    I'll be doing similar in week or two so will post some tips.


  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭salysol


    LIGHTNING wrote: »
    It is like that even after a good run. She has had new plugs, air+fuel filter I checked for vacuum leaks but I didn't find any. On full throttle wide open though when the revs go above 4k you get a strong smell of petrol that clears after a few seconds.

    It's possibly getting too much fuel,the easiest way to check this is to go to the fuel distribution unit where the air filter is, on the unit you will see the injector pipes that are held on with banjo bolts,undo 1 of the bolts there are 2 copper washers dont lose them,take the bolt out and move the injector pipe to one side so you can see the rate of flow of the fuel, ideally you will need another person to turn the ignition on [ don't start it ] to see how quick or slow the fuel is rising, it is either going to be reasonably quick or very slow,the next step you will need a long reach 3mm allen key, it would be better if you pm me your phone number and i will give you a ring and explain the process,also tell me a suitable time in the evening to call you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    After a few years break from owning a 924, I finally sold my Honda and bought myself this baby:

    19965427342_dd66c96ec3_c.jpg

    19785063798_da2431133e_c.jpg

    The car was used very little for the last decade or so and does need a lot of time and love to sort out all the minor imperfections, but it is a good base, so I am happy overall.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,544 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    Wow, that looks in great shape! Congratulations!

    I think it was a yellow 924 that lived near me as a kid that always made me want one. What year is it and what kind of stuff needs to be done? I hope your planning on driving it because I'd love to see it on the road.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,061 ✭✭✭Kenny Logins


    That looks great. :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    Dades wrote: »
    Wow, that looks in great shape! Congratulations!

    I think it was a yellow 924 that lived near me as a kid that always made me want one. What year is it and what kind of stuff needs to be done? I hope your planning on driving it because I'd love to see it on the road.
    Thanks :).

    The bodywork is in great condition and I would say more less as good as it gets on a car, never mind a 31 year old car.

    She is a 1984 model, standard 2-litre engine. The suspension is OK, but the tracking needs to be adjusted to make it perfect. No other issues discovered there. The brakes work fine, however both of the front callipers are sticky and I am going to work on them this evening to see what's what (just bough a bucket of Red Grease for the job).

    Another bits that need attention after my quick inspection after the purchase:
    - Injector seals (ordered, should be delivered today, but no sign of yer man, so they will arrive on Monday most likely),
    - A new set of ignition leads - ordered,
    - New distributor cap and rotor arm - ordered,
    - Air filter purchased, will put in this weekend,
    - The alternator cooling hose - ordered,
    - The fuel injection breading pipe cap - ordered,
    - The bonnet opening lever set - ordered,
    - New gearbox oil will have to be selected, ordered and changed,
    - Wheels need to be balanced,
    - I may replace the spark plugs in near future,
    - I will possibly check the engine valve clearance soon,
    - A new engine breather pipe - ordered (the old one is cracked),
    - The ignition leads holders (2 nr) - ordered,
    - New oil pressure sender - ordered,
    - Speedometer in km only - ordered,
    - New expansion tank rubber mounts - ordered,
    - I am sure I will throw that radio away and put something that suits the car (the automatic aerial works, which is nice),
    - The backlight bulbs on some instruments need to be replaced,
    And... possibly a good few more bits and bobs, as I am constantly going through the car when I find a spare minute or two.

    Interestingly, I found in the booth of the car:
    - a new fuel pump,
    - a new set of Bosch fuel injectors,
    - some various genuine clips for the interior,
    - an old cam belt (and alternator belt) in a Porsche box, so I assume the belts were recently replaced.

    All in all, a nice project and although I wasn't too happy as I discovered so many faults with the car, but they are nothing major and I will get it all sorted in a matter of weeks.

    Sure, the car is going to be driven :). No point in just looking at it ;).


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,900 ✭✭✭deckie27


    Seweryn wrote: »
    Thanks :).

    The bodywork is in great condition and I would say more less as good as it gets on a car, never mind a 31 year old car.

    She is a 1984 model, standard 2-litre engine. The suspension is OK, but the tracking needs to be adjusted to make it perfect. No other issues discovered there. The brakes work fine, however both of the front callipers are sticky and I am going to work on them this evening to see what's what (just bough a bucket of Red Grease for the job).

    Another bits that need attention after my quick inspection after the purchase:
    - Injector seals (ordered, should be delivered today, but no sign of yer man, so they will arrive on Monday most likely),
    - A new set of ignition leads - ordered,
    - New distributor cap and rotor arm - ordered,
    - Air filter purchased, will put in this weekend,
    - The alternator cooling hose - ordered,
    - The fuel injection breading pipe cap - ordered,
    - The bonnet opening lever set - ordered,
    - New gearbox oil will have to be selected, ordered and changed,
    - Wheels need to be balanced,
    - I may replace the spark plugs in near future,
    - I will possibly check the engine valve clearance soon,
    - A new engine breather pipe - ordered (the old one is cracked),
    - The ignition leads holders (2 nr) - ordered,
    - New oil pressure sender - ordered,
    - Speedometer in km only - ordered,
    - New expansion tank rubber mounts - ordered,
    - I am sure I will throw that radio away and put something that suits the car (the automatic aerial works, which is nice),
    - The backlight bulbs on some instruments need to be replaced,
    And... possibly a good few more bits and bobs, as I am constantly going through the car when I find a spare minute or two.

    Interestingly, I found in the booth of the car:
    - a new fuel pump,
    - a new set of Bosch fuel injectors,
    - some various genuine clips for the interior,
    - an old cam belt (and alternator belt) in a Porsche box, so I assume the belts were recently replaced.

    All in all, a nice project and although I wasn't too happy as I discovered so many faults with the car, but they are nothing major and I will get it all sorted in a matter of weeks.

    Sure, the car is going to be driven :). No point in just looking at it ;).


    Wow thays an easy enough list. ..Apart from maybe the front calipers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    deckie27 wrote: »
    Wow thays an easy enough list. ..Apart from maybe the front calipers.
    Eh, no... I though they are bad, but just got the callipers removed and checked through with a bottle of beer. New piston rubber boots are needed and another hour or two with more beer and it will be all sorted :).


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    LIGHTNING wrote: »
    She looks lovely! One mod I was thinking of doing that I see your doing is the Speedometer in km only. Where did you get one of these and how tricky a swap is it?
    Thanks. I am just back after getting more work done to the car - have completed the valve clearance adjustment, so another small step ahead :).

    I got the speedometer locally from a scrapped car (don't have it yet, waiting for the delivery), but I guess you can get them on ebay easily. It is not just the 924 speedometer I do not like, but any speedo with miles and km, they just look very messy with double scale and I prefer to count in km anyway :).

    The swap operation of the speedometer is an easy task and I believe shouldn't take more than 15 minutes. The speedo seats in with a rubber seal and needs to pushed out. There are two screws holding the cluster located at the top of the cluster looking up from behind the wheel.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    LIGHTNING wrote: »
    I was looking at this

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-944-924-speedo-kph-rev-counter-clocks-vdo-/191613090252?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2c9d07b9cc

    The sheer volume of cables at the back would worry me but if you can swap out individual instruments I may do it. I also hate dual scale speedo's :)
    Yeah, that set will do, but you can remove and replace the speedometer only.
    There are only a couple of bulbs / control lights to be swapped and the cable from the front wheel that drives the speedo.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    LIGHTNING wrote: »
    Its weird that cars from the 70s and 80's look well in colours that would look awful on modern cars. I had a coffee coloured 924 that looks really nice
    I fully agree with you. Can't wait to park my 924 one day at work between all the grey, silver, black, and 50 other shades of grey uncoloured vehicles.

    It actually makes me a bit sad the fact that colours disappeared from cars somehow. Just have a look at the colours available on a Volkswagen at the time.

    On the other hand, after my post purchase investigation, I discovered that the yellow is not my car's factory original paint. But it is done so well, you would struggle to notice anyway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28 munuus


    Great looking car :) it is quite rare to see dash and seats in such a good nick :)

    May I ask, where u getting all parts? Like injector seals etc? I found that to get proper parts is a bit uphill battle


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    munuus wrote: »
    Great looking car :) it is quite rare to see dash and seats in such a good nick :)
    Thanks. The driver seat actually has a small tear, but nothing major. I can live with it for now.
    munuus wrote: »
    May I ask, where u getting all parts? Like injector seals etc? I found that to get proper parts is a bit uphill battle
    I got most of the second hand bits from a breaker that has a few of these cars. But any consumables are easily available in good shops. For example the Engine Head Cover Gasket (half a circle shape seal - 2 nr required on both sides) I bought new from Micksgarage at a cost of €0.86, the air filter was only €8.46. Also got the driver side Bosch wiper blade for €6.51. Micks also have the Bosch injectors (that I found in the boot of my car), so it is not too bad. Parts are rather reasonably priced.

    I remember with my previous 924 I owned a few years ago that I got a lot of spares from eBay (most of them I found in Germany).


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,900 ✭✭✭deckie27


    munuus wrote: »
    Great looking car :) it is quite rare to see dash and seats in such a good nick :)

    May I ask, where u getting all parts? Like injector seals etc? I found that to get proper parts is a bit uphill battle

    A couple of years i got injector seals from porsche ireland.
    Cost less that €20 delivered for 4.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,487 ✭✭✭Seweryn


    I just decided to remove one of the brake callipers again, cleaned it up properly, greased, and put back together on the old seals. At least the car is now drivable.

    I also made a few final touches to the valve clearance adjustment in the engine.

    Now time for a test drive :).

    20032038411_474a2836c7_z.jpg

    20018979102_a8a9548276_z.jpg


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