Apaches over the Curragh

sparky42

Jawgap wrote: »

I think the Canadians would disagree if you asked them about the diesel/electric subs they got from them.

Nice and all are the Type 42s and 23s are - they're probably a bit OTT for fisheries and maritime patrolling.......

Well the 42's are gone, but who knows what happens to the Batch 1 River's. They'll face questions after the next spending review after the election.

cruasder777

Reading between the lines there will also be UKSF and ARW cross training.

Ireland does not have the capability to deal with a simultaneous Paris style terrorist attack, however unlikely.

I expect some of the equipment for the army will be mine protected vehicles like Jackals for the ARW, the Fords they use are not mine protected, 4 tonners and mine protected vehicles for battalions, land rovers and and NBC proof Scimitars, which are being replaced by the UK. More 105mm field guns.

sparky42

cruasder777 wrote: »

Reading between the lines there will also be UKSF and ARW cross training.

Ireland does not have the capability to deal with a simultaneous Paris style terrorist attack, however unlikely.

I expect some of the equipment will be mine protected vehicles like Jackals for the ARW, the Fords they use are not mine protected, 4 tonners and mine protected vehicles for battalions, land rovers and and NBC proof Scimitars, which are being replaced by the UK.

I could live with all of that to be honest, given that the Scimitars have been upgraded (they've had cage armour as well for Afghanistan haven't they?), it could be a good bit of upgrading. And hasn't there been cross training between ARW and UKSF for sometime? Or is this just a step up on that?

cruasder777

sparky42 wrote: »

I could live with all of that to be honest, given that the Scimitars have been upgraded (they've had cage armour as well for Afghanistan haven't they?), it could be a good bit of upgrading. And hasn't there been cross training between ARW and UKSF for sometime? Or is this just a step up on that?

There has never been official acknowledgement. In the age of random and spontaneous terrorism, its common sense they should cross train.

The ARW have sent members over on specialist courses like the RM mountain leader course and FAC Forward air controller course over the years.

aindriu80

i think the army might get some kind of a land vehicle, the brits are replacing the scorpion family and we go some of them before. Ireland would be better off building new (war)ships than getting anything second hand.

Dr.Teeth

Probably be a couple of "spud guns"

sparky42

aindriu80 wrote: »

i think the army might get some kind of a land vehicle, the brits are replacing the scorpion family and we go some of them before. Ireland would be better off building new (war)ships than getting anything second hand.

Certainly, except there's issues with timing coming up with the older hulls, unless we see something soon the hulls are going to wear out.

Silvera

A fleet of upgraded Scimitars would be a good start alright!...

aindriu80

Silvera wrote: »

A fleet of upgraded Scimitars would be a good start alright!...

That would be nothing for the British army. They could give away 30 vehicles in good nick and they would never notice them.

**edit well 10 anyway

riffmongous

Strange timing considering only a month ago the Irish government asked the echr to have another look at the case of the British army torturing Irish people, bizarre

randy hickey

riffmongous wrote: »

Strange timing considering only a month ago the Irish government asked the echr to have another look at the case of the British army torturing Irish people, bizarre

Not really. The past is a different country and all that.

Xios

riffmongous wrote: »

Strange timing considering only a month ago the Irish government asked the echr to have another look at the case of the British army torturing Irish people, bizarre

As a nation Ireland should be looking forward to take advantage of opportunities in our reach.

This does not mean we should not keep investigating into the past and seeking justice for those responsible, but we need to focus on securing our future first.

MrConservative

cruasder777 wrote: »

There has never been official acknowledgement. In the age of random and spontaneous terrorism, its common sense they should cross train.

The ARW have sent members over on specialist courses like the RM mountain leader course and FAC Forward air controller course over the years.

I would expect G2 Branch to do quite nicely out of this as well and as a result the security of nations citizens. Noc that many would know or understand it.

Cheers MrC

skooterblue2

riffmongous wrote: »

Strange timing considering only a month ago the Irish government asked the echr to have another look at the case of the British army torturing Irish people, bizarre

Define Irish People? Do you mean Irish Citizens with Irish passports or Lads that hopped off the boat, "May I have one of those excellent Irish neutral passports?" .... back on the boat to fight NATO sponsored Troops in a Jihad in the middle east kind of guys. Now the %^&* hit the fan all of a sudden they are in the Darby O Gill fan club, kind of Irish people?

riffmongous

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Define Irish People? Do you mean Irish Citizens with Irish passports or Lads that hopped off the boat, "May I have one of those excellent Irish neutral passports?" .... back on the boat to fight NATO sponsored Troops in a Jihad in the middle east kind of guys. Now the %^&* hit the fan all of a sudden they are in the Darby O Gill fan club, kind of Irish people?

What on earth are you rambling about??

riffmongous

Xios wrote: »

As a nation Ireland should be looking forward to take advantage of opportunities in our reach.

This does not mean we should not keep investigating into the past and seeking justice for those responsible, but we need to focus on securing our future first.

No disagreement there, but think of the timing, both decisions were planned at the same time, but, the military deal could never have been agreed unless the Irish government agreed to reopen the echr case as otherwise that would look terrible and be a political disaster and a coup for SF. So getting a deal with the British army involved accusing them of torture, which no matter how pragmatic, is quite frankly bizarre

skooterblue2

The little egyptian boy out in Cario stirring at the Luxor protests last year. Little skut tore up his Irish passport at a demonstration (was on Youtube and calling for blodd in the streets) and then called on the Irish Ambassador to get him out. Which she did (no jail time, no record in Europe, just dont come back again) then threw it in her face and somehow Amnesty Ireland wants him to get a dig out..... these kind of people

riffmongous

skooterblue2 wrote: »

The little egyptian boy out in Cario stirring at the Luxor protests last year. Little skut tore up his Irish passport at a demonstration (was on Youtube and calling for blodd in the streets) and then called on the Irish Ambassador to get him out. Which she did (no jail time, no record in Europe, just dont come back again) then threw it in her face and somehow Amnesty Ireland wants him to get a dig out..... these kind of people

That's not what this case refers to http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1202/664159-hooded-men/

sparky42

riffmongous wrote: »

No disagreement there, but think of the timing, both decisions were planned at the same time, but, the military deal could never have been agreed unless the Irish government agreed to reopen the echr case as otherwise that would look terrible and be a political disaster and a coup for SF. So getting a deal with the British army involved accusing them of torture, which no matter how pragmatic, is quite frankly bizarre

This agreement has been talked about for over a year, while the ECHR case was only reopened after early court proceedings. I'm not sure how you can combine the two issues...

OzCam

Horse84 wrote: »

I'm not sure if the Irish public feel appeased by being gifted surplus British military kit. I'm waiting for the indignant outcry from the crusties and the shinners.

Correct answer to the crusties: Pffft.

Wash 'em, paint 'em green, change the reg plates, change the oil & filters. Job done.

Jawgap

After all this I'd say any kit passed on from the Brits will be boring but important - for example, catering / cooking gear, office equipment, maybe some engineering vehicles - I don't expect there'll be many Mastiffs and Ridgebacks charging around the place!

It might be easier to get spares for stuff too.

sparky42

Jawgap wrote: »

After all this I'd say any kit passed on from the Brits will be boring but important - for example, catering / cooking gear, office equipment, maybe some engineering vehicles - I don't expect there'll be many Mastiffs and Ridgebacks charging around the place!

It might be easier to get spares for stuff too.

Hey, anything that helps the budget is fine for me but the UK is going to have spare hardware going, the post Afghanistan draw down along with the likely reductions that will happen post this general election

sparky42

Ah, I see we have the first letter in the Times from a Crusty, outraged about the 8 in Mali working with the RIR:rolleyes: Apparently it's a sign of rejoining the Commonwealth, and/or having the Army serving under British Control:rolleyes:

I expect there will be plenty more nonsense from the likes of them up until and post the signing of the agreement. Wonder when that will actually happen, I want to actually read all the text to see what has actually been agreed.

Jawgap

sparky42 wrote: »

Ah, I see we have the first letter in the Times from a Crusty, outraged about the 8 in Mali working with the RIR:rolleyes: Apparently it's a sign of rejoining the Commonwealth, and/or having the Army serving under British Control:rolleyes:

I expect there will be plenty more nonsense from the likes of them up until and post the signing of the agreement. Wonder when that will actually happen, I want to actually read all the text to see what has actually been agreed.

Difficult to take a letter signed by a Tommy Cooper seriously

sparky42

Jawgap wrote: »

Difficult to take a letter signed by a Tommy Cooper seriously

Oh god I'd never take that seriously, but if we end up sending a ship or Casa to join the EU anti piracy task force I can just imagine the screaming fit
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/simon-coveney-to-decide-on-defence-forces-role-in-tackling-piracy-in-indian-ocean-1.2066264

Jawgap

sparky42 wrote: »

Oh god I'd never take that seriously, but if we end up sending a ship or Casa to join the EU anti piracy task force I can just imagine the screaming fit
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/simon-coveney-to-decide-on-defence-forces-role-in-tackling-piracy-in-indian-ocean-1.2066264

........or if joint patrolling goes ahead and you get Irish personnel serving on RN ships, even if they are just patrol vessels.

sparky42

Jawgap wrote: »

........or if joint patrolling goes ahead and you get Irish personnel serving on RN ships, even if they are just patrol vessels.

Well clearly that would mean the return of the Act of Union, or some such nonsense (though how some of NI would take joint ops will be interesting). The Rivers have already done some joint exercises so hopefully we will see more, might be interesting if Irish personnel ended up on the drug patrol in the Caribbean now that a River has taken over that deployment. They'd end up servicing with US Coastguard as well then.

randy hickey

Newstalk reporting on their news bulletin that MoD Coveney has signed the defence co-operation agreement with the UK in Dublin Castle this morning.

Larbre34

None of this should be a surprise, FG were anti-neutrality in opposition and pro NATO at other times. Bi-lateral defence co-operation with our nearest neighbours is perfectly understandable, particularly as they provide us with air defence.

As regards EUNAVFOR Operation Atalanta, Ive always thought it would be the perfect platform to improve INS capability, a blue helmet mission for the high seas. Delighted to hear we might send a ship or two in rotation, the Róisín or Beckett class would do the job fine and are equal in size to many european ships previously involved. Operating in a fleet and with armed aggressors (although they have declined greatly) is not something the NS has much experience of and would be of great value.

I'd be surprised if we sent a CASA, it would leave very thin cover and would require a permanent base with support. At least a ship would operate much as it does off Ireland, only requiring replenishment.

sparky42

randy hickey wrote: »

Newstalk reporting on their news bulletin that MoD Coveney has signed the defence co-operation agreement with the UK in Dublin Castle this morning.

The first defence agreement between Ireland and the UK since 1938 and the Treaty Ports. Didn't think it would happen so quickly, hope they publish the text of it...