Off Topic Thread too point uh

Pudsy33

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Weren't we talking about this yesterday.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/leftfield/here-are-14-rugby-clichs-you-will-hear-a-lot-of-during-the-six-nations-30963368.html

I think Madigan qualifies as mercurial.

CatFromHue

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Raising the age isn't the answer. People will find a way, and anyway most young people are capable of drinking responsibly. More info about the dangers of alcohol would be my preference, not fiddling with prices.

Dunno about that as I think alot of younger people drink to get pissed and not to enjoy the drink.

Whereas if you can't drink til your 21 or 23 or 25 then you're not going to be as happy to deal with the hangovers as you would if you're 18.

Also if it was illegal (and enforced) to be drunk when you're underage it could be a big deterrent too.

dregin

CatFromHue wrote: »

It'll be interesting to see if any pubs knock up there price because of this!

lol, they'd have to be selling drink at about 10% of their current prices in order for this to affect them. I'm sure they'd gladly give it a go, though!

awec

Deleted User wrote: »

Weren't we talking about this yesterday.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/leftfield/here-are-14-rugby-clichs-you-will-hear-a-lot-of-during-the-six-nations-30963368.html

A few times now topics have been discussed on here only to appear in the press soon after.

Hi Declan, whoever you are.

Synode

They simply wouldn't be able to enforce it if they raised the age. Sure look at the amount of underage people drinking now, never mind the amount of people taking drugs regularly

CatFromHue

dregin wrote: »

lol, they'd have to be selling drink at about 10% of their current prices in order for this to affect them. I'm sure they'd gladly give it a go, though!

Ha yeah that's what I mean. The publicans aren't known for not taking the chance to increase the price!

awec

awec wrote: »

A few times now topics have been discussed on here only to appear in the press soon after.

Hi Declan, Whooley-ever you are.

fyp

CatFromHue

Synode wrote: »

They simply wouldn't be able to enforce it if they raised the age. Sure look at the amount of underage people drinking now, never mind the amount of people taking drugs regularly

I was trying to think of something that would actually curb the problem and that's the best I think.

Yeah it would mean more Gardai involvement which is where it would fall down but I can't see the new proposed rule doing anything.

Another thing announced yesterday was a calorie count on beer which is great as it's a relative unknown at the moment. Even for light beer it's an unknown, I've heard some light beers aren't really as light we think too!

Buer

CatFromHue wrote: »

Realistically the people who are problem drinkers now won't be bothered by this, they'll still drink away.

I'm not so sure. If you hit off licenses and raise drink prices across the board, you're going to limit a chunk of people. I know when I was a student, we could get 6 cans for €5. If that was €13, you'd have almost certainly reduced the frequency that people would have been able to drink.

Alcoholics are still going to find alcohol but binge drinkers will be impacted certainly, I'd have thought.

I do agree with the enforcement of drinking laws more stringently. That would go some way to dealing with the issue but you'd have absolute uproar if the age of consumption was raised.

CatFromHue

CatFromHue wrote: »

Realistically the people who are problem drinkers now won't be bothered by this, they'll still drink away.

The best idea I heard to stop the next generation of drinkers is to raise the age of consumption and have big fines for underage people caught with alcohol, as well as who sold it to them.

You might end up with people who don't drink at all then though, and that's bad for business :O

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/this-map-shows-the-legal-drinking-age-all-over-the-world-2014-11

If the problem was caused by age, or could be associated with early consumption, wouldn't that mean that France, Italy, Spain and Portugal would be far worse off than ourselves?

This map (linking cause too big) is useful

Buer

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Raising the age isn't the answer. People will find a way, and anyway most young people are capable of drinking responsibly. More info about the dangers of alcohol would be my preference, not fiddling with prices.

We all know the dangers of alcohol. We know the damage it does. There has been huge publicity around Drinkaware.ie etc. Young people will go out and get locked if they can regardless because it's acceptable. We're all intelligent people on here and I'd wager nearly all of us did it still.

Buer

Synode wrote: »

They simply wouldn't be able to enforce it if they raised the age. Sure look at the amount of underage people drinking now, never mind the amount of people taking drugs regularly

They could enforce it, it's enforced elsewhere. I've been in bars in the states where the liquor commission have walked in and asked for ID. If you can't supply, you're thrown out and the bar is fined.

sydthebeat

maybe one solution

CatFromHue

Buer wrote: »

I'm not so sure. If you hit off licenses and raise drink prices across the board, you're going to limit a chunk of people. I know when I was a student, we could get 6 cans for €5. If that was €13, you'd have almost certainly reduced the frequency that people would have been able to drink.

Alcoholics are still going to find alcohol but binge drinkers will be impacted certainly, I'd have thought.

I do agree with the enforcement of drinking laws more stringently. That would go some way to dealing with the issue but you'd have absolute uproar if the age of consumption was raised.

I don't know how often students actually go out though.

If it's once or twice a week it's not going to massively trouble them.

If it's four or five times then it will but do students go out that much?

OldRio

Whats next on the governments stealth tax list ?

Air?


Getting seriously peed off by this now.

CatFromHue

Deleted User wrote: »

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/this-map-shows-the-legal-drinking-age-all-over-the-world-2014-11

If the problem was caused by age, or could be associated with early consumption, wouldn't that mean that France, Italy, Spain and Portugal would be far off than ourselves?

This map (linking cause too big) is useful

I don't know, what's the story with those countries?

Synode

Buer wrote: »

They could enforce it, it's enforced elsewhere. I've been in bars in the states where the liquor commission have walked in and asked for ID. If you can't supply, you're thrown out and the bar is fined.

Thats a drop in the ocean compared to the amount of people drinking illegally. They can try and enforce it but similar to drugs, it's next to impossible to enforce properly

CatFromHue

You could try and turn it back on the venues I suppose as I'm sure they're not meant to serve drunk people as it is.

CatFromHue

CatFromHue wrote: »

I don't know, what's the story with those countries?

Healthy enough drinking culture, binge drinking not seen to be a reasonable past time.

Buer

Deleted User wrote: »

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/this-map-shows-the-legal-drinking-age-all-over-the-world-2014-11

If the problem was caused by age, or could be associated with early consumption, wouldn't that mean that France, Italy, Spain and Portugal would be far off than ourselves?

This map (linking cause too big) is useful

France, Germany, Portugal and Spain are among the highest consumers of alcohol in the world, even more than us in some cases. However, they're culturally more moderate drinkers; I would think a large chunk of their consumption is down to wine with meals with all sections of society enjoying a glass or two with dinner as opposed to smaller demographics drinking like fish on nights out.

It's undoubtedly a cultural issue but it is probably the single hardest thing to alter. To change things culturally, I'm not sure exactly how to go about it but given how ingrained binge drinking is within our society, limiting availability may be a strong option.

CatFromHue

Binge drinking is seen as a reasonable past time here though so we have to approach it differently than other countries.

Increase the price, which is done regularly anyway, just means we adapt and spend more accordingly so something else is needed.

How do you change your culture is the 64 million dollar question to loads of things.

Buer

CatFromHue wrote: »

How do you change your culture is the 64 million dollar question to loads of things.

Firstly you need a society that wants to change. Does ours? I strongly doubt it.

There's near universal agreement that this nation has an issue with drinking. However, every time there is an effort made to limit availability of alcohol to people, there's uproar and it's headline news. If there was an attempt to raise the legal age of consumption, some would have a meltdown.

OldRio

Why should the majority, who drink sensibly, have to pay for the misdeeds of a minority?

irishbucsfan

OldRio wrote: »

Why should the majority, who drink sensibly, have to pay for the misdeeds of a minority?

Absolutely.

Especially when there is no link between alcohol prices and drinking culture in Europe.

People are just going to change the way they get drunk, the culture will still exist.

Buer

The majority, who drink sensibly, have, in large part, behaved just the same way in days gone by. I doubt there's many of us here who can say they haven't drank to excess on multiple occasions and probably a number of us who have done so to the extent that they've done something stupid or hurt themselves while doing so.

I don't agree with it in isolation as a measure but I do want to see some sort of effort made to address the issue. It's not the best way to go about it but I'm not hearing of too many suggestions of alternate ideas that are more popular.

molloyjh

Buer wrote: »

Firstly you need a society that wants to change. Does ours? I strongly doubt it.

There's near universal agreement that this nation has an issue with drinking. However, every time there is an effort made to limit availability of alcohol to people, there's uproar and it's headline news. If there was an attempt to raise the legal age of consumption, some would have a meltdown.

People don't like to be regulated. And they like it even less these days. We live in a time where personal responsibility is for someone else and anyone who even wants to think about issues with our behaviour is to be ignored at all costs. It's not just a phenomenon that raises it's head with alcohol, it's everywhere from our roads to our attitudes towards politics. People don't want to have to trouble themselves with thought.

That basically means that there is nothing that anybody can do to fix these issues, because as a society we have no interest in fixing them. In the meantime however we're more than happy to b***h and moan about any action taken by anyone to address our problems.

It's like communication. It's a two way street and if the other person isn't willing to listen it doesn't matter how good a job you do they will never get the message. And if it bites them in the ass further down the line they'll blame you for not communicating it to them earlier.

<here endith the rant>

OldRio

People have behaved like sheep in regard to their elected representatives for far to long in this country. The only good thing to come out of these horrid austere times is people have said 'enough is enough' (Unfortunately not the binge drinkers)

molloyjh

OldRio wrote: »

People have behaved like sheep in regard to their elected representatives for far to long in this country. The only good thing to come out of these horrid austere times is people have said 'enough is enough' (Unfortunately not the binge drinkers)

I find that amusing tbh. Those people who are saying enough is enough are just sheep to a different section of parties.

From the river to the sea, Irish water will be free.

So in other words all works, resources and employees involved in the collection, storage, processing and distribution of water should be free. Eh......no. Another amazing example of people refusing to be bothered with thought.

Not that it's surprising, or a first. What SF and a lot of the socialist groups are doing now is no different to what the likes of Libertas and Declan Ganley were doing 6-7 years ago. Whip people up into a frenzy using simplistic and basic notions (regardless of their truth or legitimacy) packaged well that suggest they are in this fight against the establishment with us. They aren't. SF are simply trying to get themselves more seats just like FF, FG and Labour, using the water situation as their banner. Just like Libertas were trying to do with Lisbon.

CatFromHue

OldRio wrote: »

Why should the majority, who drink sensibly, have to pay for the misdeeds of a minority?

Exactly and raising the min age of consumption won't effect you (unless you like hanging out with drunks 18year olds )

The thing about this plan is that all it's going to do is stop you being able to buy slabs of beer for 26euro.

The min price they're talking about is 1.80-2.20 so if they go for the low end it means 8 x 1.80 = 14.40 and 6 x 1.80 = 10.80.

At the moment my local shop is doing 8 cans of Heineken for 13euro and 8 cans of Coors Light for 13euro so it's not much of an increase on them.

dregin

I have zero problem with pay for water. I do have a problem with the fact that a massive chunk of my tax goes to health services and yet, I have to pay the guts of 100 euro a month of my take home pay for private health insurance just to be sure that if **** does hit the fan I'll get decent treatment. Stealth taxes out the wazoo. Fed up with it.