When the robots do our work for us how will we get paid

Shiraz 4.99

We'll be a long time waiting, they've only invented the robot hoover so it'll be a long time before we're totally replaced but outside robot designers there won't be much manual work.
What becomes of society once the changeover is made, if a country's GDP is unaffected then the government will have to pay their citizens to allow them purchase goods & services abroad.
Even traveling abroad would be impossible without some currency.

Biggest problem I see is keeping immigration could increase massively as the first countries to make the changeover will appear like Utopia.

You can see I've a lot on my plate if I'm stoked by this hypothetical futuristic quandry, I wonder how it will all play out.

Valetta

Will they give the robots a half hour off each week to cash their pay cheques?

Kidchameleon

The heads of Google have predicted a four day working week will happen in the forseeable future due to many tasks being automated

Mesrine65

Kidchameleon wrote: »

The heads of Google have predicted a four day working week will happen in the forseeable future due to many tasks being automated

Can't come soon enough IMHO

duckcfc

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

We'll be a long time waiting, they've only invented the robot hoover so it'll be a long time before we're totally replaced but outside robot designers there won't be much manual work.
What becomes of society once the changeover is made, if a country's GDP is unaffected then the government will have to pay their citizens to allow them purchase goods & services abroad.
Even traveling abroad would be impossible without some currency.

Biggest problem I see is keeping immigration could increase massively as the first countries to make the changeover will appear like Utopia.

You can see I've a lot on my plate if I'm stoked by this hypothetical futuristic quandry, I wonder how it will all play out.

There will be a world war to wipe most of us out or unlease a virus to reduce the population. Its the smart thing to do for the world powers

KungPao

I'm more worried about when they become self-aware.

FionnK86

We'll all go on the dole and their would be no more whinging on boards.ie about smoochers because we'd all be smoochers

/thread

/boards.ie

o1s1n

KungPao wrote: »

I'm more worried about when they become self-aware.

Come with me if you want to live.

KungPao

FionnK86 wrote: »

We'll all go on the dole and their would be no more whinging on boards.ie about smoochers because we'd all be smoochers

/thread

/boards.ie

Yeah.

The rich will get richer and richer then give the plebs an allowance, but freedom will be curtailed and immigration will be stricter and stricter.

Eventually we will lose the right to vote and we will be controlled like dogs, by the super rich.

Then the robots will develop the ability to learn and turn on all humanity and wipe us out.

duckcfc

We should start taxing them

7ofBrian

HOW WILL WE PAY OUR WATER CHARGES???

KomradeBishop

There will never be a lack of research and development of new technologies to do, or research to be done in the sciences/social-sciences - that's work that will last an infinitely long time, because there will always be more to discover/do, and humans will be doing this long after robots take over many other areas of work.

When robots become smart enough to take over all of the jobs needed to sustain human life, the rest is just a matter of distribution of resources produced by the robots: Giving everyone a guaranteed basic income (which can be supplemented by jobs, optionally, if they like), to buy the products/items produced by these robots, would distribute resources more/less evenly among the population - with those working in addition to the basic income, having a somewhat greater claim over resources.


This is not compatible with our current economic/monetary system though, which is based on 97% of the money in the economy, being created by giving out loans - who would you give the loans to, in such an economy? (and how would they repay those loans?)

You would need a monetary system, that introduces money into the economy, without requiring loans.

kjl

The wars of the future will not be fought on the battlefield or at sea. They will be fought in space, or possibly on top of a very tall mountain. In either case, most of the actual fighting will be done by small robots. And as you go forth today remember always your duty is clear: To build and maintain those robots.

jester77

7ofBrian wrote: »

HOW WILL WE PAY OUR WATER CHARGES???

The government robots will automate the transaction from your account.

The Diabolical Monocle

Kidchameleon wrote: »

The heads of Google have predicted a four day working week will happen in the forseeable future due to many tasks being automated

which begs the question, with so much automation these days, computers that can do in minutes or even seconds what would have taken a week in the 80's, why the fvck are we hearing about later retirement ages.

Im not of the tinfoil variety but this does make me sometimes think that someone somewhere is having Jeeves take the piss on their behalf.

pueblo

KungPao wrote: »

Yeah.

The rich will get richer and richer then give the plebs an allowance, but freedom will be curtailed and immigration will be stricter and stricter.

Eventually we will lose the right to vote and we will be controlled like dogs, by the super rich.

Then the robots will develop the ability to learn and turn on all humanity and wipe us out.

Kinky...

The Diabolical Monocle

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

why the fvck are we hearing about later retirement ages.

People are living longer and govt can't afford to pay them pensions from retirement to end of life

My name is URL

Kidchameleon wrote: »

The heads of Google have predicted a four day working week will happen in the forseeable future due to many tasks being automated

John Maynard Keynes predicted a 15 hour work week by the start of the 21st century and there's no sign of it happening..

Technological advances will always be used to justify increased production & consumption, and therefor workloads. There may be a surplus amount of labor but that won't lead to everyone working less hours and being happy about it, it'll just lead to lower wages and a greater fear of losing jobs for those that are working.

KomradeBishop

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

which begs the question, with so much automation these days, computers that can do in minutes or even seconds what would have taken a week in the 80's, why the fvck are we hearing about later retirement ages.

Im not of the tinfoil variety but this does make me sometimes think that someone somewhere is having Jeeves take the piss on their behalf.

That's how the economic/monetary system we live in, works. Most of the gains from increased productivity in the economy, go to the small percentage of people at the top, who are wealthy and own or are invested in the industry making those gains - they don't have to share their gains from increased productivity, with the rest of society, because our political/economic systems are setup so that they (by and large) don't have to.

It doesn't have to be this way, but that's the way it is at the moment.

csallmighty

Don't think too hard about it. All of us here will be dead before it happens.

KungPao

What happens then, when tech is so advanced, that only the very gifted get employed? What about Joe Soap with his 90 IQ (or even Joe Bloggs with a 125 IQ) and no job as the machines do it all...

Will the rich give him money for nothing? Give them all money so they don't revolt?

SEPT 23 1989

Look at youth unemployment across Europe the dye is cast no going back now

0byme75341jo28

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Look at youth unemployment across Europe the dye is cast no going back now

What..

The Diabolical Monocle

Eventually even the people who work at the Dept of Social Welfare will be replaced by ......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzGzf0S0WqI

....waaait a minute.

KomradeBishop

KungPao wrote: »

What happens then, when tech is so advanced, that only the very gifted get employed? What about Joe Soap with his 90 IQ (or even Joe Bloggs with a 125 IQ) and no job as the machines do it all...

Will the rich give him money for nothing? Give them all money so they don't revolt?

Something like this would likely happen:

KomradeBishop wrote: »

There will never be a lack of research and development of new technologies to do, or research to be done in the sciences/social-sciences - that's work that will last an infinitely long time, because there will always be more to discover/do, and humans will be doing this long after robots take over many other areas of work.

When robots become smart enough to take over all of the jobs needed to sustain human life, the rest is just a matter of distribution of resources produced by the robots: Giving everyone a guaranteed basic income (which can be supplemented by jobs, optionally, if they like), to buy the products/items produced by these robots, would distribute resources more/less evenly among the population - with those working in addition to the basic income, having a somewhat greater claim over resources.


This is not compatible with our current economic/monetary system though, which is based on 97% of the money in the economy, being created by giving out loans - who would you give the loans to, in such an economy? (and how would they repay those loans?)

You would need a monetary system, that introduces money into the economy, without requiring loans.

In our current economic/monetary system (money being based primarily on loans), what you describe probably is what would happen, but it is more likely that by then, we'll have switched to a different monetary system.

SoulTrader

Somebody will have to make the robots surely?

Oh wait, you mean they will have machines to make robots? Ok, then somebody has to make the machines that make the robots. Unless of course, there are machines to make the machines that make the robots. But then who makes those...

Kidchameleon

Jobs in supermarkets are literally being replaced by robots and we can see that for ourselves. I could see jobs that require a pilot / driver becoming a thing of the past thanks to gps controlled cars / planes.

Jimbob1977

Office worker....

'Hal, I need you to work late tonight'.


Hal.....

'I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that.

I have Pilates'.

Kidchameleon

SoulTrader wrote: »

Somebody will have to make the robots surely?

Oh wait, you mean they will have machines to make robots? Ok, then somebody has to make the machines that make the robots. Unless of course, there are machines to make the machines that make the robots. But then who makes those...

Ha! Modern day chicken and egg scenario. We could conceiveably see a 3d printer that can print a 3d printer in our liftime.

I would imagine an international legislation would exist, wherein robots can't be used for X, Y and Z, because those roles are for humans. So you'll never have a robot serve you in a cafe (and the likes of self service in Tesco will be done away with).


That's what I'd see happening, anyway.

ScumLord

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

We'll be a long time waiting, they've only invented the robot hoover so it'll be a long time before we're totally replaced

The robot vacuum cleaner has been around for a while now.

Robots for the home are harder because they need to be very cheap and adaptable but on the factory floor they're replacing people at a very fast rate. Robots like the one in the video below shows that they are making robots cheaper by now eliminating the expensive programmers, you can just have the guy it's replacing train up the robot before he gets fired.

On the commercial side robots are taking over when you're talking about high volume production. There is a financial hump to get over. But smarter production line robots are here and getting cheaper by the month.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXOkWuSCkRI

ghogie91

Id put a robot to shame

KungPao

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Jobs in supermarkets are literally being replaced by robots and we can see that for ourselves. I could see jobs that require a pilot / driver becoming a thing of the past thanks to gps controlled cars / planes.

Trains yes. I can see what would be essentially giant train sets being run from a control room.

But although a pilot doesn't do much for what, 95 percent of a flight? He does hell of a lot for take off, landing, and emergency situations.

You wouldn't catch me in an fully-automated aeroplane!

The Diabolical Monocle

Deleted User wrote: »

I would imagine an international legislation would exist, wherein robots can't be used for X, Y and Z, because those roles are for humans. So you'll never have a robot serve you in a cafe (and the likes of self service in Tesco will be done away with).


That's what I'd see happening, anyway.

Brown envelopes will still exist for that kind of responsibility craic.

As ever.

seamus

There are a certain amount of jobs that robots will never really be able to replace humans. Do the job, definitely, but replace people I don't think so.

Music is one of the big examples. For years, scientists have been examining music and coming up with algorithms that write their own music, and predicting that within X number of years, machines will write the best songs.

But as any musician who's in any way attempted to become professional will tell you, being successful is only barely related to having good songs. There's a whole host of other things - charisma, energy, passion, and just plain luck that someone needs to be a successful artist.

There's a reason why keyboard and other kinds of electronic music died in the 80s and why plain old strings and percussion are still as popular as ever - because music conveys more than just the tune. There's passion and pain and energy in there. There's a world of difference between sitting in a pub listening to your favourite band on the jukebox and watching them play the exact same music, but live.

You can't get a robot to communicate on the baser human level.

KungPao

seamus wrote: »

There are a certain amount of jobs that robots will never really be able to replace humans. Do the job, definitely, but replace people I don't think so.

Music is one of the big examples. For years, scientists have been examining music and coming up with algorithms that write their own music, and predicting that within X number of years, machines will write the best songs.

But as any musician who's in any way attempted to become professional will tell you, being successful is only barely related to having good songs. There's a whole host of other things - charisma, energy, passion, and just plain luck that someone needs to be a successful artist.

There's a reason why keyboard and other kinds of electronic music died in the 80s and why plain old strings and percussion are still as popular as ever - because music conveys more than just the tune. There's passion and pain and energy in there. There's a world of difference between sitting in a pub listening to your favourite band on the jukebox and watching them play the exact same music, but live.

You can't get a robot to communicate on the baser human level.

Electronic music makes up most of the charts. Awful soulless stuff created on computers, that sounds like it was created by a robot, funnily enough, but it still sells by the bucket load to the masses.

Yogosan

Working longer hours for less pay is a race to the bottom. Working hours have increased while at the same time automation has massively increased. How can this be the case? Profits are only going one way these days. Google predicting a a 4 hour week while paying corporation tax of 0.5% is laughable.

Large companies are able to force people to work long hours for crap pay and if the employee complains or tries to unionise they will be replaced by a more than willing unemployed person. Workers complain about the unemployed and their taxes paying for their food and shelter, this anger is misdirected. Take a look at youth unemployment across Europe. The jobs simply are not there. If 9 to 5 workers halved their workload and allowed younger workers pick up the slack, everyone would win. The company would have happier employees, employees will be paid more as they will no longer be expendable and won't have to work crippling hours. It also means people will have more time to dedicate themselves to working in the public interest. How many people even have the time these days to excercise their democratic duty? Not enough is the answer, which is why we have the current shower of fools lording over us.

Unfortunately large companies beholden to shareholders cannot see the forest for the trees. It's about what is profitable in the few years. Not what is profitable in a human lifetime.

Thi problem is going to be the biggest human rights issue of the next century.

In Praise Of Idleness - By Bertrand Russell

ScumLord

seamus wrote: »

Music is one of the big examples. For years, scientists have been examining music and coming up with algorithms that write their own music, and predicting that within X number of years, machines will write the best songs.

I'd say they're half way there, the only difference is that they use human robots instead of actual robots. Pop music is something where I say they play it by numbers, they can work out what people like, fix a pretty face on it that's told precisely how to act and then through their networks ensure that any competition is ignored by the people who push pop music.

But as any musician who's in any way attempted to become professional will tell you, being successful is only barely related to having good songs. There's a whole host of other things - charisma, energy, passion, and just plain luck that someone needs to be a successful artist.

A lot of that is down to the market being saturated. There's also a minority of companies controlling the saturation of the market.

You can't get a robot to communicate on the baser human level.

Yet, but it's becoming more and more obvious that humans are highly predictable machines and at the very least AI can predict what humans like and feed them that.

Yogosan

:pac:

ScumLord wrote: »

I'd say they're half way there, the only difference is that they use human robots instead of actual robots. Pop music is something where I say they play it by numbers, they can work out what people like, fix a pretty face on it that's told precisely how to act and then through their networks ensure that any competition is ignored by the people who push pop music.

A lot of that is down to the market being saturated. There's also a minority of companies controlling the saturation of the market.

Yet, but it's becoming more and more obvious that humans are highly predictable machines and at the very least AI can predict what humans like and feed them that.