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ICT Specialists (Executive Officer level) in Civil Service

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,044 ✭✭✭ Zipppy


    ha
    just filling in application for that...

    Neither my name nor candidate number appear in the fields and I cant type them in...any ideas?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,050 ✭✭✭ bobbysands81


    Zipppy wrote: »
    ha
    just filling in application for that...

    Neither my name nor candidate number appear in the fields and I cant type them in...any ideas?

    No idea.

    Any time I've dealt with publicjobs.ie they've been excellent. Would you give them a call?


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,233 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L.Jenkins


    Looks like an interesting little role, but they're putting too much emphasis on Leaving Cert. results versus actual experience.


  • Registered Users Posts: 157 ✭✭ Calmcookie84


    Just applied myself. Fingers crossed and good luck to everyone


  • Registered Users Posts: 135 ✭✭ bodun


    Itzy wrote: »
    Looks like an interesting little role, but they're putting too much emphasis on Leaving Cert. results versus actual experience.

    I presume I needn't bother applying as I don't have 5 Cs at honours level in the LC? I've worked in various IT roles for the last 15 years and have a related degree but I can't apply because of an exam I did nearly 20 years ago, seems a bit ridiculous. :(


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,226 ✭✭✭ boobar


    bodun wrote: »
    I presume I needn't bother applying as I don't have 5 Cs at honours level in the LC? I've worked in various IT roles for the last 15 years and have a related degree but I can't apply because of an exam I did nearly 20 years ago, seems a bit ridiculous. :(

    I just had a quick look at the eligibility criteria where they have:

    The leaving cert with 5 cs etc

    Or

    Something else of an equivalent or higher standard than the LC.

    I think it would be worthwhile calling them and asking would a degree be considered to be a higher standard than the LC.


  • Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭ deathtocaptcha


    seems pretty vague... i'd be tempted were it not the fact that location is more than likely Dublin...

    i'd like to see them allow people to apply for the regional posts... i.e. if there's a position in Donegal or Cork, surely it makes sense to state that up front...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    €1800 net pay a month for a CS degree and proper ICT experience. Who in their right mind would go near this job?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,044 ✭✭✭ Zipppy


    bodun wrote: »
    I presume I needn't bother applying as I don't have 5 Cs at honours level in the LC? I've worked in various IT roles for the last 15 years and have a related degree but I can't apply because of an exam I did nearly 20 years ago, seems a bit ridiculous. :(
    boobar wrote: »
    I just had a quick look at the eligibility criteria where they have:

    The leaving cert with 5 cs etc

    Or

    Something else of an equivalent or higher standard than the LC.

    I think it would be worthwhile calling them and asking would a degree be considered to be a higher standard than the LC.


    Hmmmmmm...only spotting this now...seems madness..

    As you need a level 6 IN ADDITION to LC or equivalent it would, on the face of it, appear that a degree. masters, Phd would not allowable as a 'higher standard' exam.
    Madness..I've a degree and a Masters in CS...In my LC (which I did eons ago) I only got 4 Higher level C's.
    This seems like nonsense......

    Where can you query this?

    Also the AO role is of a higher level and didn't seek this minimum (I think....)


    and I've gotten three interviews in recent years for AO ICT in Revenue (no requirement for 5 LC C's)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,226 ✭✭✭ boobar


    Zipppy wrote: »
    Hmmmmmm...only spotting this now...seems madness..

    As you need a level 6 IN ADDITION to LC or equivalent it would, on the face of it, appear that a degree. masters, Phd would not allowable as a 'higher standard' exam.
    Madness..I've a degree and a Masters in CS...In my LC (which I did eons ago) I only got 4 Higher level C's.
    This seems like nonsense......

    Where can you query this?

    Also the AO role is of a higher level and didn't seek this minimum (I think....)


    and I've gotten three interviews in recent years for AO ICT in Revenue (no requirement for 5 LC C's)

    Best place to ring is PAS...ask for EO ICT competition manager....

    It is a stupid requirement...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,204 ✭✭✭ Elessar


    Beaner1 wrote: »
    €1800 net pay a month for a CS degree and proper ICT experience. Who in their right mind would go near this job?

    +1

    Also, strict working times (clockin/clockout etc), no salary reviews, p*ss poor benefits (hardly any that I can see actually, no VHI or anything) and I'd imagine, terrible pay progression.

    Why would you bother when so many ICT companies are screaming for experienced minds?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,812 ✭✭✭ 6541


    What location is this job in ?


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,233 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L.Jenkins


    bodun wrote: »
    I presume I needn't bother applying as I don't have 5 Cs at honours level in the LC? I've worked in various IT roles for the last 15 years and have a related degree but I can't apply because of an exam I did nearly 20 years ago, seems a bit ridiculous. :(

    I'd say still apply if I were you. I'd say your experience alone would trump LC results. As for me, I don't think I'd be so lucky as I'm only 5-6 years working as a Software Dev and not even 30 yet, that and my LC results aren't great, but they aren't a reflection on my ability to do my job.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,044 ✭✭✭ Zipppy


    Itzy wrote: »
    I'd say still apply if I were you. I'd say your experience alone would trump LC results. As for me, I don't think I'd be so lucky as I'm only 5-6 years working as a Software Dev and not even 30 yet, that and my LC results aren't great, but they aren't a reflection on my ability to do my job.

    Out of interest why would someone with 6 years exp as a software dev choose a role such as this when lots and lots of IT companies will pay you lots more, treat you better, offer you much better conditions and perks etc?


  • Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭ deathtocaptcha


    Zipppy wrote: »
    Out of interest why would someone with 6 years exp as a software dev choose a role such as this when lots and lots of IT companies will pay you lots more, treat you better, offer you much better conditions and perks etc?

    job stability i'm guessing... it's not like the government will up sticks and move to India or Poland... this is effectively a job for life unless you quit. this makes it easier to get loans / mortgages and for many people brings peace of mind...

    also, there is effectively a *guaranteed* pay increase of ~6% per year every year... and that's now when things are 'bad'... when pay rises become the norm, we all know public sector employees get well looked after...

    all of that coupled with vastly less stressful working environment / slower pace of things in public sector would open the door for gigs on the side... a lot of people i know work 60/70 hours a week and would consider a 40 hour week almost a 'part time' job by comparison...


  • Registered Users Posts: 187 ✭✭ Maximus_1


    job stability i'm guessing... it's not like the government will up sticks and move to India or Poland... this is effectively a job for life unless you quit. this makes it easier to get loans / mortgages and for many people brings peace of mind...

    also, there is effectively a *guaranteed* pay increase of ~6% per year every year... and that's now when things are 'bad'... when pay rises become the norm, we all know public sector employees get well looked after...

    all of that coupled with vastly less stressful working environment / slower pace of things in public sector would open the door for gigs on the side... a lot of people i know work 60/70 hours a week and would consider a 40 hour week almost a 'part time' job by comparison...

    Completely agree. I am in IT private sector but you never know how things can go, there is alot to be said for the peace of mind that comes with a role like this. that said the money for Dublin is pretty low, if there were roles outside its livable and then once you climb the scale a bit you will be grand. Basically, there's more to life than money! Hence I will be applying!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,624 ✭✭✭ zweton


    how could one find out if these roles will be outside dublin also.


  • Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭ deathtocaptcha


    Maximus_1 wrote: »
    Completely agree. I am in IT private sector but you never know how things can go, there is alot to be said for the peace of mind that comes with a role like this. that said the money for Dublin is pretty low, if there were roles outside its livable and then once you climb the scale a bit you will be grand. Basically, there's more to life than money! Hence I will be applying!

    The only reason i'm *not* applying is because the roles will more than likely be based in Dublin... which would require moving and a huge increase in living expenses for me...

    So suddenly the money doesn't become very attractive... they should list the regional areas imo that require staff... the role says 'nationwide' but then mentions the fact that the majority of positions will be filled in Dublin... it doesn't mention where else will be available...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Maximus_1 wrote: »
    Completely agree. I am in IT private sector but you never know how things can go, there is alot to be said for the peace of mind that comes with a role like this. that said the money for Dublin is pretty low, if there were roles outside its livable and then once you climb the scale a bit you will be grand. Basically, there's more to life than money! Hence I will be applying!

    There's a lot to be said for not living on the breadline which you will be with this job. Increments are every 18 months and amount to sweet f all as the tax kicks in. Nothing stopping the government ending increments or reversing you pay despite having a contract there isn't any security with these jobs.

    The public service is losing tons of decent, skilled professionals as you can earn so much more elsewhere.

    It's hard to work out the incrmeents these days but it looks like you'll be waiting 20-25 years before taking home the sum total of €2600 per month. Good luck having a family on that money. Seeing as the state is over 120% debt to gdp I would expect the situation to get worse over the next 20 years. Still, at least you will have that pension. Or will you? I'd wager the minimum age will get pushed out to 70 with new calculations taking an average of your whole career earnings and not the 50% of final that we're used to. With the pension crisis looming I think its reasonable to expect a pension in litle different to someone who just paid prsi stamps.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    It's not hard at all to work out the increments, they're listed for public information in quite a number of places if you look. In fact I'm pretty sure if you asked through that contact you'd probably be given it.

    And increments are every 1 year. Not 18 months. Starting salary of an EO is in the 26 to 27000 region don't have the exact figure to hand. Which would be around 2000 a month or slightly less, and that's to start with, so it's hardly going to take 20 years to work up to 2600 a month.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Gongoozler wrote: »
    It's not hard at all to work out the increments, they're listed for public information in quite a number of places if you look. In fact I'm pretty sure if you asked through that contact you'd probably be given it.

    And increments are every 1 year. Not 18 months. Starting salary of an EO is in the 26 to 27000 region don't hav e the exact figure to hand. Which would be around 2000 a month or slightly less, and that's to start with, so it's hardly going to take 20 years to work up to 2600 a month.


    First link will answer your increment question (good luck working it out) and the second seals the net pay debate. Take it from someone who left a higher paying public sector job. Those salaries are an insult to skilled workers and the whole thing should be boycotted.

    1. http://www.impact.ie/haddington-road-agreement/haddington-road-frequently-asked-questions/
    2. http://taxcalc.eu/


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    So those earning above 65000 had to wait 18 months before their next increment. How does that affect EO's? It doesn't.

    And I don't know what you're talking about with the second link. I earn 21345 per year, I take home 1521 per month. If you increase that salary by 509 (as the starting salary for an EO is 27464) you get 2030, take home. Maybe you'll pay slightly more usc or something at the slightly higher pay, but still around 2000 per month starting off.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Yes it does.
    Are my increments frozen?
    Management wanted to freeze all increments until the end of 2016, but unions negotiated a better outcome. In summary:

    Public servants who earn less than €35,000 a year receive their
    next increment when it falls due and then wait 15 months (rather than
    12) before any following increment is paid.
    Public servants who earn between €35,000 and €65,000 receive their
    next increment when it falls due, then wait 15 months (rather than 12)
    before any following increment is paid, and then 15 months (rather than
    12) before the following increment is paid.
    Public servants who earn between €35,000 and €65,000 a year, and
    who are now at the top of their scale, forfeit six days leave, or the
    cash equivalent. This is not a permanent reduction in annual leave
    entitlement; it’s a once-off loss of six day’s leave spread over a three
    year period.

    The taxcalc salaries are spot on and I know from experience.

    The starting salary is 1805 a month whilst the end salary after 20+ years is €2600.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    Beaner1 wrote: »
    Yes it does.



    The taxcalc salaries are spot on and I know from experience.

    The starting salary is 1805 a month whilst the end salary after 20+ years is €2600.

    So, yeah from what you quoted it's not 18 months. The second increment will be after 15 months.

    And presumably as the scale only goes so high, the most you can get as an EO is 47975, how does that work out at 2600 a month?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Gongoozler wrote: »
    So, yeah from what you quoted it's not 18 months. The second increment will be after 15 months.

    And presumably as the scale only goes so high, the most you can get as an EO is 47975, how does that work out at 2600 a month?

    In the previous regime the pay scale topped out after 17 years of service. The changes will bring it up over 20 years for sure.

    I can't make it any easier for you. Put the 47974 salary into taxcalc. Look at the net monthly salary. That is the reality. I know it's depressing to someone who is looking upwards and thinking what is the point.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    Beaner1 wrote: »
    In the previous regime the pay scale topped out after 17 years of service. The changes will bring it up over 20 years for sure.

    I can't make it any easier for you. Put the 47974 salary into taxcalc. Look at the net monthly salary. That is the reality. I know it's depressing to someone who is looking upwards and thinking what is the point.

    Your first point doesn't relate at all to my first point. So you concede that you're wrong about the 18 months?

    I went to your tax calc site, getting security issues with it, what a mess of a page. I've googled another one, and it's saying take home is €33,897. So take home is 2824 per month. Wow that is bad for 20 years of service. But then I suppose if you're ok sticking at EO level (or have no choice in the matter) for 20 years, you're probably not that bothered. €700 a week is nothing to turn your nose up at as far as I'm concerned.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Gongoozler wrote: »
    Your first point doesn't relate at all to my first point. So you concede that you're wrong about the 18 months?

    I went to your tax calc site, getting security issues with it, what a mess of a page. I've googled another one, and it's saying take home is €33,897. So take home is 2824 per month. Wow that is bad for 20 years of service. But then I suppose if you're ok sticking at EO level (or have no choice in the matter) for 20 years, you're probably not that bothered. €700 a week is nothing to turn your nose up at as far as I'm concerned.

    The substantive part of my point stands. 20 years to the max of the scale.

    Taxcalc works if your java is up to date. I use the android app. You are looking at private sector net pay.

    Try and live on 2600 a month in Dublin. You won't have much of a life. You'll quickly realise that with a few years experience as a database admin you can probably get 4k net a month in the private sector. Your 1800 security doesn't look so attractive then.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    Beaner1 wrote: »
    The substantive part of my point stands. 20 years to the max of the scale.

    Taxcalc works if your java is up to date. I use the android app. You are looking at private sector net pay.

    Try and live on 2600 a month in Dublin. You won't have much of a life. You'll quickly realise that with a few years experience as a database admin you can probably get 4k net a month in the private sector. Your 1800 security doesn't look so attractive then.

    I live on 1520 a month just fine. I've been on 3 holidays this year, one to Australia. And still manage to have quite a sum of savings.

    But I just want to clear up here, I'm not defending the public sector, I'd love to get out of it, as to why everyone thinks it's so great, is really beyond me. Usually only thought by those not in it.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 819 Beaner1


    Gongoozler wrote: »
    I live on 1520 a month just fine. I've been on 3 holidays this year, one to Australia. And still manage to have quite a sum of savings.

    But I just want to clear up here, I'm not defending the public sector, I'd love to get out of it, as to why everyone thinks it's so great, is really beyond me. Usually only thought by those not in it.


    It might work out if you're in single in your 20s or you have a parter with better earnings. Hitting 30+ life becomes a real struggle with 900 per month creche fees and e1800 rent or mortgage.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭ Gongoozler


    Beaner1 wrote: »
    It might work out if you're in single in your 20s or you have a parter with better earnings. Hitting 30+ life becomes a real struggle with 900 per month creche fees and e1800 rent or mortgage.

    I'm in my 30's, don't have a partner supporting me, and won't be having any children. But by all means continue trying to be condescending.

    Look, people, yes everyone, has the choice where they work, and what they want to spend on outgoings. Nobody's forced to work for the public sector. Do it if you want, don't if you don't, just don't whinge about it.


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