How much do you Value your pet?

doubter

The Cool wrote: »

For those asking about good quality dry food, we use Maxi Zoo's own brand, Select Gold. It's about 50 quid for the 12kg bag but it lasts about 6 weeks - they display daily feeding costs in the shop and I think it works out about €1.08 per day. He had been fed Bakers before we got him, but when we switched food it made such a difference to his energy and his coat - everyone comments on how shiny his coat is, he's very good looking. He also smells a lot better, and doesn't fart as much, or as badly! The salmon stuff in particular is great for shiny coats.

Good move. bakers is sh****..except for good quality farts. I've 8 dogs and had run out of my normal food, so had to get some at the late night store. dooooooo.they only had bakers. I was literally gassed out of my living room that night..went to bed early..>blerk<

Wibbs

Deleted User wrote: »

The only destruction of my house that has ever happened was early on - when I took seriously but not seriously enough - that wolves are more social than dogs and you really simply can not leave them alone. You simply do not do it. Failing to take that seriously resulted in him eating into things of some value to me - such as actual walls. It is not an error I made often - or since.

It's highly unlikely your dog is a wolf T. Especially in this country(more likely in the US, but even there most are hybrids). He may have recent wolf ancestry, or be one of the official wolfdog hybrids like the Czech or Saarloos, but they're very rare to see. The vast majority of so called wolves or wolf hybrids are huskie crosses, usually crossed with German Shepherds. And this is a good thing as the real deal, even the recognised wolfdog breeds are a real handful, can be real "brutes".

A real wolf or high content wolfdog(outside of the official breeds) would be nigh on impossible to house train. Wholesale destruction would be a near given. They would tend towards extreme fearfullness and extremes in emotion anyway. They're escape artists so at least a 4 metre fence, with another metre buried would be required. Oh and they can dig to China in seconds. As pups they'd be relatively OK, but as maturity hit you'd see big changes. Maybe even dangerous ones(adding dog to the mix makes them more aggressive). Extremely high prey drive and resource guarding and challenging for position as an adolescent would be givens. They would also require an exercise regime that would knacker a sled dog, never mind a constant supply of raw meat(they fade fast on dry food). Pretty much impossible to have as a "pet".

Mr. Nice wrote:

You almost sound like you know what you're talking about Ted. Except that British Bulldogs have an extremely strong bite force and have no trouble crunching through solid bone.
Also, many are fed raw meat because it's better for their health.
And stiff joints? Although prone to hip dysplasia, they are quite agile and athletic (albeit in short bursts).

Maybe next time you'll base your comments on some knowledge.

Oh this should be fun... "Quite agile and athletic"? The British Bulldog? :pac: Oh man that cheered me up. A Border collie is agile and athletic, a British BUlldog is stiff legged, under lunged with often severe breathing difficulties and overheating issues because of the now breed standard flat face. This also often buggers their teeth as they have an unnatural underbite and malocclusion is a given. And they don't have an extremely strong bite force. That's a fallacy, a labrador would have higher. Google will back me up all the way here BTW. The British Bulldog as it currently stands with the breed standard is far away from the noble and useful dog it was a century ago and very far away from nature's "dog" shape. Their heads have become so large that giving birth without going the caesarean route is common, they can even have difficulty mating. The list of genetic damage in the breed is one of the longest. Again the facts will back me up on this. Maybe have a read of this and get back to me. Don't buy that page? Fair enough, there are hundreds of others. Here's another.

jeanrose770

Whoaaaa I was just talking about how much I don't like cats!
I guess it would depend on my situation, I mean if I did happen to like cats, own a cat and have an extra 5 grand I would for sure take care of the cost. My value on pets I place very high, and care for them like family. However, I am much more of a dog person. I own one, and without blinking would find a way to cover the expense. She is muh baby girl!!!

Mr. Nice

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh this should be fun... "Quite agile and athletic"? The British Bulldog? :pac: Oh man that cheered me up. A Border collie is agile and athletic, a British BUlldog is stiff legged, under lunged with often severe breathing difficulties and overheating issues because of the now breed standard flat face. This also often buggers their teeth as they have an unnatural underbite and malocclusion is a given. And they don't have an extremely strong bite force. That's a fallacy, a labrador would have higher. Google will back me up all the way here BTW. The British Bulldog as it currently stands with the breed standard is far away from the noble and useful dog it was a century ago and very far away from nature's "dog" shape. Their heads have become so large that giving birth without going the caesarean route is common, they can even have difficulty mating. The list of genetic damage in the breed is one of the longest. Again the facts will back me up on this. Maybe have a read of this and get back to me. Don't buy that page? Fair enough, there are hundreds of others. Here's another.

How is it stiff legged? My bulldog runs like crazy, turns sharply, jumps really well and can stand unsupported on his hind legs.
The shape and size of a bulldog skull gives it a very strong bite. Mine munches through beef shins as if they were balsa wood.
And I don't need Google or your links, Winston will back me up on this.

sadie06

My dog means the world to me, and there is nothing I wouldn't do (once it was in his best interest also) to keep him with us. I have pet insurance as I wouldn't be able to shell out huge sums on the spot.

kylith

I love my dogs but there's a lot I'd have to take into consideration before spending a lot of money on, for example, prosthetics for one of them; the dog's age and temperament, their perceived quality of life and mobility after the operation, the seriousness of the recovery time, the length of time to recover, and much as I hate to say it, my availability. I don't think it would be fair to, for example, put an old dog through an operation which will have a long recuperation period afterwards.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

It's highly unlikely your dog is a wolf T.

Indeed - and you have also offered this opinion in the past - and I appreciate your opinion - and the time you have invested in offering it - based - as it is - on absence from the actual animal - with no access to it of any form- done vicariously through the medium of text and the internet - off the back of a handful of anecdotes I have provided you - without having even laid eyes on the creature even once from afar - (unless you have stalked me unknown in real life ya naughty naughty thing you).

But I am afraid I am still more inclined to demur to my own access to the animal - and the access and opinions of those trained in relevant fields who have also had many forms of access to the animal - internal and external - over the time I have possessed him - including exotic animal vetinarians I have had to source - and the opinion of the trusted source I commissioned to source him in the first place. Weighted up against the vicarious opinion of a stranger on an internet forum - I am compelled strongly in which way I am likely to lean.

As I enjoy and respect the great majority of your posts - that is the politest way I know to indicate you simply do not know what you are talking about - be it one of the most informed of not knowing what you are talking about that can be found on After Hours in general. And should it ever become in any way important or relevant to me that you believe my claims as to the ancestry of an animal that has nothing to do with you - I will be more than happy at that point to offer any proof you require. At this time however I have no such concern. Especially given this is a thread on "How much you value your pet" not "Is any given pet exactly what you think it to be?"

Wibbs wrote: »

They would also require an exercise regime that would knacker a sled dog, never mind a constant supply of raw meat(they fade fast on dry food). Pretty much impossible to have as a "pet".

The level of exercise he receives - and by proxy that I receive - has indeed been something I have benefited heavily from in my time owning him. It has pushed me to extremes in my own life that I might never have attained had I been given any other motivation for making the attempt. I run with him an hour every morning - and I cycle with him at quite the speed with him running along with me for an hour every evening. And thats a _minimum_ day. This is actually relevant to the thread title - as the level of energy I have invested in him for this reason certainly indicates my emotional investment too. Though I would be lying to even imply that I have not benefited mightily in return from the physical regime such things have placed on my life.

And you would be essentially correct on his diet too - with the addition of supplemental additions I obtain via the internet - also on the suggestion and informed opinion of exotic vets that have accessed him.

I have benefited quite heavily from the recent rise in suppliers of raw meat for dog owners in this country. A new "fad" that has exploded the number of suppliers of late. One of the suppliers I use most - recently failed me by temporarily going out of business as he basically had to move his entire operation to support a move to a significantly bigger premises - such has been the increase in the level of interest. My dad an owner of a sickly spaniel rescue dog also recently switched to one of my suppliers away from commercial dog food and - I can barely relate - an astounding over all change in that dogs well being was the result. I can see why more and more people are buying into it.

It has certainly impacted the costs and resources I have to invest in feeding him anyway - having specific suppliers I can turn to for such things rather than the local butcher alone.

denhaagenite

kylith wrote: »

I love my dogs but there's a lot I'd have to take into consideration before spending a lot of money on, for example, prosthetics for one of them; the dog's age and temperament, their perceived quality of life and mobility after the operation, the seriousness of the recovery time, the length of time to recover, and much as I hate to say it, my availability. I don't think it would be fair to, for example, put an old dog through an operation which will have a long recuperation period afterwards.

This is fair enough. If the only benefit from something like this would be to us then I couldn't in good conscience put her through it.

Kevin McCloud wrote: »

Have 2 dogs, two good pets but working dogs also on the farm. Wouldn't go spending big money if needs be on any of them. Not that i am mean but would rather have that money for a family member or some family emergency.
Have to put family first, pets second.

You're getting more than the average pet owner out of your dogs and would do well to remember that. Are they by any chance earning enough to pay for insurance?

Wibbs

Deleted User wrote: »

Indeed - and you have also offered this opinion in the past - and I appreciate your opinion - and the time you have invested in offering it - based - as it is - on absence from the actual animal - with no access to it of any form- done vicariously through the medium of text and the internet - off the back of a handful of anecdotes I have provided you - without having even laid eyes on the creature even once from afar - (unless you have stalked me unknown in real life ya naughty naughty thing you).

But I am afraid I am still more inclined to demur to my own access to the animal - and the access and opinions of those trained in relevant fields who have also had many forms of access to the animal - internal and external - over the time I have possessed him - including exotic animal vetinarians I have had to source - and the opinion of the trusted source I commissioned to source him in the first place. Weighted up against the vicarious opinion of a stranger on an internet forum - I am compelled strongly in which way I am likely to lean.

Fair enough and that's cool T, but I'd still bet my house and its contents you don't have a wolf. Wolf hybrid at best and likely a low content one going by your descriptions and even by "remote" that's pretty much enough. EG If you could demonstrate to animal behaviourists your ability to regularly cycle along with an actual wolf or high content hybrid(F1 or F2, even an F3) trotting alongside beside you'd rewrite their textbooks. If he's off lead doing tis they'd need to burn their libraries. I could get into the physical and behavioural diffs, or the extreme difficulty in getting an actual wolf through any channels in this island, the UK or the rest of Europe, or the "breeders" in the UK claiming to sell them(the UK banned recognised dog breeds with wolf ancestry until 2011, never mind wolves), but it would be to little end. And that's cool as I said. If he's a hybrid of any content you're also very lucky he's turned out so well, which is as much a testament to you.

BTW the main reason I have questioned this, is not any attack on you or your dog T, it sounds like ye have a great relationship and long may it go on. It is in case any naive call of the wild/hippie dippy/goth type or worse a hard man is reading along and thinks "TaxAHcruel has a wolf and he sounds great and a pleasure to be around, just like a dog only cooler" and then goes and secures an actual high content animal through some dodgy UK breeder, or through gumtree(there's an ad for them as we speak on one of the Irish classifieds, though I'll bet they're bogus) then I can guarantee they will see problems and they could be potentially very dangerous problems with it, best case scenario the dog will be destroyed as it matures and changes. And I further guarantee any actual experts with actual experience with wolves and high content wolf-dog hybrids(not the dodgy "experts" selling them for big money) will back me up to the hilt on that score.

My dad an owner of a sickly spaniel rescue dog also recently switched to one of my suppliers away from commercial dog food and - I can barely relate - an astounding over all change in that dogs well being was the result. I can see why more and more people are buying into it.

I'm with you 110% there T. I've seen similar results myself. A few large scale studies including one by the Australian guide dog assoc proved the huge benefits of raw over dry food for dogs. There's a good reason behind the old saying of "as fit as a butcher's dog".

doubter

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm with you 110% there T. I've seen similar results myself. A few large scale studies including one by the Australian guide dog assoc proved the huge benefits of raw over dry food for dogs. There's a good reason behind the old saying of "as fit as a butcher's dog".

except for the smell. mine are on raw with rice and veg mixed in but hell-their breath would take crows out of the sky at a 2 mile distance sometimes

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

Fair enough and that's cool T, but I'd still bet my house and its contents you don't have a wolf.

Do you normally bet on conclusions with little to no evidence? I am surprised you still own a house :-) As I said A) The thread is not about this and I respect the opinions of people actually in the field over people on the internet who read a wild life magazine or two - and actually do not know what they are talking about because they have not accessed the specimen in - well - and form at all. Including that of a very wonderful woman who works with wolves in Hanau Germany who I met once there - and who was so excited by mine that she even made a point of visiting Ireland and taking in a visit to us.

Wibbs wrote: »

dodgy UK breeder, or through gumtree

I have no doubt there are a lot of dodgy dealers profiting from the word "wolf" indeed. That is why I ensured that my source was someone beyond reproach and who I trust as much as anyone. I can not explain how and why I know or trust him - without revealing things about him - but I do. And the many people who have brought their expertise to bear on not just him - but me as the owner - and ensured many things about us went well.

I join you gladly - and with experience - in saying it is not for everyone. Most exotic animals are not for everyone - but people get them for fashion reasons or because it sounds good. Where I grew up in Dublin there was a guy with snakes, exotic birds, and even a monkey. A monkey that was miserably tied up in the garden on a long rope - keening for attention from passers by. It was tragic.

No one should get exotic animals without being entirely sure what they are getting into. Even I knew what I was getting into - and it has pushed the limits of my surprise and personal resources.

catallus

They eat dogs in Asia.

Lucyfur

I'm the worst doggy owner in the world ever today

I was out for a couple of hours earlier and when I got home, I let my dog out for a wee. And totally forgot about him

He was out in the cold and wet and quite frankly, yucky weather, for 20 minutes and he was soaked. SOAKED.

He's drying out in front of the fire and was fed his favourite biscuits by wy of an apology.

Kevin McCloud

denhaagenite wrote: »

You're getting more than the average pet owner out of your dogs and would do well to remember that. Are they by any chance earning enough to pay for insurance?

They are no doubt but i feel it more important to pay my families health insurance over taking up pet insurance.

Aphex

I'd do anything to keep my pet cat happy miserable. Love that dude

Wibbs

Sod this guff and gloves off, in case somebody out there thinks this is reality and might be tempted to make a grave error for them and theirs on the back of it and end up with an actual wolf or high content hybrid.

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you normally bet on conclusions with little to no evidence? I am surprised you still own a house :-)

Actually you have provided more than enough "evidence" to come to a conclusion that anyone who has actual experience with actual wolves would back up.

As I said A) The thread is not about this

I grant you that, on the other hand I don't want passersby thinking your so called "wolf" and experience of same is even close to the reaility of having an actual wolf in a modern human environment and again actual experts would back me up on this 100 percent.

TBH it pisses me right off when people, desperately uniformed people, aided and abetted by equally uniformed people, some with euro signs in their eyes, want that hippie dippy "wildness" in their lives and think, "I know, Il'l get a wolf, they're like dogs you know". Anyone who claims that is at best naive and at worst a damned fool. And if they read your "opinion" might buy into it.

I have no doubt there are a lot of dodgy dealers profiting from the word "wolf" indeed. That is why I ensured that my source was someone beyond reproach and who I trust as much as anyone. I can not explain how and why I know or trust him - without revealing things about him - but I do.

That's all lovely and all, however reality again comes in to bite that on the arse. While Ireland doesn't have a dangerous animals act(sadly), the other countries in the EU do, including our UK neighbour, so actually securing such an animal would be just a tad problematic as their export and general movements are legally sanctioned, unless you were an accredited researcher with the facilities to match. Oh and that goes double for the rest of Europe unless you were in the zoo game.

Now you might be OK to own one here legally(borderline), but getting one here is quite another matter. Indeed in the UK with their legislation even securing a licence to keep them is very difficult and requires inspection of the enclosures they will be housed in. You can't get one singly and no way as a house "pet". Even after that, securing an animal from overseas is extremely lengthy a process. Indeed it's only since 2010-11 that the UK allowed the movement, import and sale of recognised wolfdog breeds like the Czech and Saarloos. So if you have an actual wolf you are publicly admitting you procured him illegally at some point in the transaction.

It's one reason why a load of charlatan wolf hybrid "breeders" decamped to Ireland in the eighties, to sell their wares at high prices to your call of the wild, hippy dippy types, goth and hardchaw types who wanted such an animal(who then got one helluva shock when the animal matured. If it was actually a hybrid). There are "breeders" in the UK selling hybrids and let's just say highly dubious they are with equally highly dubious programmes. Hence European breeders of the recognised breeds have largely boycotted selling the such breeds to them.

As for "experts". Well the breeder isn't going to say much against the very reason he or she can ask for the big bucks. General vets, even some specialist vets wouldn't be clued into what a wolf may look and act like and will go along with the owners description, unless they have actual contact with them in a zoo or research environment. There was an Irish facebook page warning people off them as pets(rightfully) showing a purported "wolf hybrid" vetted by vets(had to write that) and it was as much a hybrid as a hamster is. If there was any content it was low. Hell there was a popular book out a few years back about some American bloke and his "wolf" and it was obvious to see it was a Mal cross, maybe with some wolf blood, yet the "experts"(his mates) in the book claimed it was a pure wolf.

I respect the opinions of people actually in the field over people on the internet who read a wild life magazine or two - and actually do not know what they are talking about because they have not accessed the specimen in - well - and form at all.

Frankly GTFO. I've had hands on experience with habituated wolves since the 1980's. Both US and European wolves(the latter are a little more tractable) I had an F3 wolf dog hybrid in my life for over 16 years. I've dealt with Saarloos and Czech wolfdogs and have one of the latter in my life as we speak. One of my closest mates is a zoologist whose doctorate was in wolf dynamics and their impact as an apex predator on an environment. He was personally involved with their reintroduction into the Yellowstone national park. A little beyond some dreamcatcher hippie "expert" notion of what an actual wolf is and how such an animal would behave in a domestic environment.

No one should get exotic animals without being entirely sure what they are getting into. Even I knew what I was getting into - and it has pushed the limits of my surprise and personal resources.

If you were told that you could have a pure bred wolf in your house, house trained and going for walks and trotting alongside you on a bike you were being completely and utterly bullshítted and are now passing that bullshít on. Given you apparently give courses in Vipassana, you're well ahead of the curve on subjective magical thinking that can twist itself into something that approaches logic if you buy into it, so no real surprise there. The idea of the "wolf", the wild, the untamed, that you could magically "tame" would play right into that and since water finds it's own level those you bump into will appease that for you.

I really fcuking wish some folks in the actual field would jump in here, as opposed to hawkers and hippies and enablers buying into the BS. Otherwise some innocent passersby would think this was a good plan and it really bloody well isn't and they would find out damned fúcking quickly that the "fantasy" wouldn't gel with the reality. A potentially dangerous reality.

Ever wonder why in the movies, real wolves are rarely used? You will see more tigers and lions in films than wolves. They're just too unpredictable. If your "wolf" is so easily dealt with I suggest you get onto Game of Thrones and other such productions, cos they'd lay out the red carpet for you.

Youtube the BBC programme The Secret Life of the Dog and check out the section where actual scientists and actual researchers with experience and behavioral expertise brought wolf pups into their lives and tried to raise them as dogs to see if it was the environment that made the difference. I'll give you a hint, it wasn't and said actual wolves were reintroduced into existing captive wolf programmes, when they became simply too dangerous to handle. Go and email Shaun Ellis who might be considered on the "fringe" among some in the mainstream when it comes to wolves, but the chap has actual direct and daily experience with the real deal over many years, so knows his shít up close and personal and you tell him you have a wolf living with you as a pet that goes for walks and bike rides and again I'll happily and with complete confidence bet my house that he'll say you're producing something one might step in if they followed a male example of the family bovidae around a field for a while.

TL;DR? If you're reading this thinking a wolf makes a good "pet" or companion, who can be housetrained and will go for walks and run alongside your bike you're living in cloud cuckoo land and provably and demonstrably so.




TL;DR Part Deux? Please, please, Please folks, do NOT buy into this hippie BS. Wolves belong in the wild but if you bring that wild into your home(and the fact is, in Ireland you won't be able to), you WILL regret it and said "wolf" will end up being destroyed. And that goes for high content hybrids too.

obplayer

Wibbs wrote: »

Sod this guff and gloves off, in case somebody out there thinks this is reality and might be tempted to make a grave error for them and theirs on the back of it and end up with an actual wolf or high content hybrid.


Actually you have provided more than enough "evidence" to come to a conclusion that anyone who has actual experience with actual wolves would back up. I grant you that, on the other hand I don't want passersby thinking your so called "wolf" and experience of same is even close to the reaility of having an actual wolf in a modern human environment and again actual experts would back me up on this 100 percent.

TBH it pisses me right off when people, desperately uniformed people, aided and abetted by equally uniformed people, some with euro signs in their eyes, want that hippie dippy "wildness" in their lives and think, "I know, Il'l get a wolf, they're like dogs you know". Anyone who claims that is at best naive and at worst a damned fool. And if they read your "opinion" might buy into it.



That's all lovely and all, however reality again comes in to bite that on the arse. While Ireland doesn't have a dangerous animals act(sadly), the other countries in the EU do, including our UK neighbour, so actually securing such an animal would be just a tad problematic as their export and general movements are legally sanctioned, unless you were an accredited researcher with the facilities to match. Oh and that goes double for the rest of Europe unless you were in the zoo game.

Now you might be OK to own one here legally(borderline), but getting one here is quite another matter. Indeed in the UK with their legislation even securing a licence to keep them is very difficult and requires inspection of the enclosures they will be housed in. You can't get one singly and no way as a house "pet". Even after that, securing an animal from overseas is extremely lengthy a process. Indeed it's only since 2010-11 that the UK allowed the movement, import and sale of recognised wolfdog breeds like the Czech and Saarloos. So if you have an actual wolf you are publicly admitting you procured him illegally at some point in the transaction.

It's one reason why a load of charlatan wolf hybrid "breeders" decamped to Ireland in the eighties, to sell their wares at high prices to your call of the wild, hippy dippy types, goth and hardchaw types who wanted such an animal(who then got one helluva shock when the animal matured. If it was actually a hybrid). There are "breeders" in the UK selling hybrids and let's just say highly dubious they are with equally highly dubious programmes. Hence European breeders of the recognised breeds have largely boycotted selling the such breeds to them.

As for "experts". Well the breeder isn't going to say much against the very reason he or she can ask for the big bucks. General vets, even some specialist vets wouldn't be clued into what a wolf may look and act like and will go along with the owners description, unless they have actual contact with them in a zoo or research environment. There was an Irish facebook page warning people off them as pets(rightfully) showing a purported "wolf hybrid" vetted by vets(had to write that) and it was as much a hybrid as a hamster is. If there was any content it was low. Hell there was a popular book out a few years back about some American bloke and his "wolf" and it was obvious to see it was a Mal cross, maybe with some wolf blood, yet the "experts"(his mates) in the book claimed it was a pure wolf.



Frankly GTFO. I've had hands on experience with habituated wolves since the 1980's. Both US and European wolves(the latter are a little more tractable) I had an F3 wolf dog hybrid in my life for over 16 years. I've dealt with Saarloos and Czech wolfdogs and have one of the latter in my life as we speak. One of my closest mates is a zoologist whose doctorate was in wolf dynamics and their impact as an apex predator on an environment. He was personally involved with their reintroduction into the Yellowstone national park. A little beyond some dreamcatcher hippie "expert" notion of what an actual wolf is and how such an animal would behave in a domestic environment.


If you were told that you could have a pure bred wolf in your house, house trained and going for walks and trotting alongside you on a bike you were being completely and utterly bullshítted and are now passing that bullshít on. Given you apparently give courses in Vipassana, you're well ahead of the curve on subjective magical thinking that can twist itself into something that approaches logic if you buy into it, so no real surprise there. The idea of the "wolf", the wild, the untamed, that you could magically "tame" would play right into that and since water finds it's own level those you bump into will appease that for you.

I really fcuking wish some folks in the actual field would jump in here, as opposed to hawkers and hippies and enablers buying into the BS. Otherwise some innocent passersby would think this was a good plan and it really bloody well isn't and they would find out damned fúcking quickly that the "fantasy" wouldn't gel with the reality. A potentially dangerous reality.

Ever wonder why in the movies, real wolves are rarely used? You will see more tigers and lions in films than wolves. They're just too unpredictable. If your "wolf" is so easily dealt with I suggest you get onto Game of Thrones and other such productions, cos they'd lay out the red carpet for you.

Youtube the BBC programme The Secret Life of the Dog and check out the section where actual scientists and actual researchers with experience and behavioral expertise brought wolf pups into their lives and tried to raise them as dogs to see if it was the environment that made the difference. I'll give you a hint, it wasn't and said actual wolves were reintroduced into existing captive wolf programmes, when they became simply too dangerous to handle. Go and email Shaun Ellis who might be considered on the "fringe" among some in the mainstream when it comes to wolves, but the chap has actual direct and daily experience with the real deal over many years, so knows his shít up close and personal and you tell him you have a wolf living with you as a pet that goes for walks and bike rides and again I'll happily and with complete confidence bet my house that he'll say you're producing something one might step in if they followed a male example of the family bovidae around a field for a while.

TL;DR? If you're reading this thinking a wolf makes a good "pet" or companion, who can be housetrained and will go for walks and run alongside your bike you're living in cloud cuckoo land and provably and demonstrably so.




TL;DR Part Deux? Please, please, Please folks, do NOT buy into this hippie BS. Wolves belong in the wild but if you bring that wild into your home(and the fact is, in Ireland you won't be able to), you WILL regret it and said "wolf" will end up being destroyed. And that goes for high content hybrids too.

Brilliant post. I have seen the video you suggest and I also grasp that 10,000 years of selective breeding will have produced a vast difference between dogs and wolves. As an aside there is a book The Secret Life Of Dogs (similar but different title to Wibbs suggested video) which describes how dogs behave when they are given food and shelter from humans but otherwise left pretty well to their own devices to form what kind of relationships / societies they choose and pass the time as they choose. Fascinating book.

Posy

My name is URL wrote: »

5 grand for a leg operation on a cat seems too expensive. I wouldn't pay that much out of my pocket for what is essentially an untested operation with no guarantee of success and fair chance that the animal will be left in a lot of pain.

The case on The Supervet was actually a complete hip replacement on a very large dog, not a cat.
The dog was quite young and the operation was almost guaranteed to completely fix him- in a case like that, it'd be a no brainer for me.
If I get a doggie, I'll definitely be getting pet insurance though!

Ranchu

Wibbs wrote: »

That's all lovely and all, however reality again comes in to bite that on the arse. While Ireland doesn't have a dangerous animals act(sadly), the other countries in the EU do, including our UK neighbour, so actually securing such an animal would be just a tad problematic as their export and general movements are legally sanctioned, unless you were an accredited researcher with the facilities to match. Oh and that goes double for the rest of Europe unless you were in the zoo game.

Now you might be OK to own one here legally(borderline), but getting one here is quite another matter. Indeed in the UK with their legislation even securing a licence to keep them is very difficult and requires inspection of the enclosures they will be housed in. You can't get one singly and no way as a house "pet". Even after that, securing an animal from overseas is extremely lengthy a process. Indeed it's only since 2010-11 that the UK allowed the movement, import and sale of recognised wolfdog breeds like the Czech and Saarloos. So if you have an actual wolf you are publicly admitting you procured him illegally at some point in the transaction.

You're very naive on how the import of animals happens in this country. It's a lawless land. There are hundreds of venomous snakes, crocodilians and various other unsuitable animals in this country all procured from within the E.U who you misguidedly think are filtering out what gets in.

That lad could have a wolf and could have it legally because no one in this country could stop him. Licences to keep dangerous animals in the UK do not effect the transportation of the animals.

I was offered the chance of getting a young hyena from a lad that imported animals from mainland western Europe not that long ago and I'm in no doubt he could have got me it. The UK has very new laws on animals but we have none. The zoo trade is also shady at best.

Caprica6

Pumpkinseeds wrote: »

Pet insurance does give fantastic peace of mind. One of ours arrived as a very ill stray and needed the better part of 2 grands worth of treatment over the first 18 months he was with us. Ever since then we got insurance for the others as each of them arrived and moved in. The thing with pet insurance is that you want to get it as soon as you get the pet so that they're covered for as much as possible. I don't have health insurance for myself but I'dn never be without it for our pets.:)

Pet insurance can't be renewed once your pet reaches a certain age!

Lucyfur

Lucyfur wrote: »

I'm the worst doggy owner in the world ever today

I was out for a couple of hours earlier and when I got home, I let my dog out for a wee. And totally forgot about him

He was out in the cold and wet and quite frankly, yucky weather, for 20 minutes and he was soaked. SOAKED.

He's drying out in front of the fire and was fed his favourite biscuits by wy of an apology.

Ah don't beat yourself up over that. My own fella is strictly an indoor dog but when he's out he spends as long as possible outside. Rain doesn't bother him in the slightest. He's even trained to dry off when he's all wet. He basically rolls around on a towel when I say "dry off" or rubs his head off the nearest human leg like a cat. He listens to every noise coming from the farm over the back wall though. We live in an estate but its surrounded by farms so he can hear all sorts of noises. He has a command (GET IN!!) to come inside when he goes off in a fit of barking and it works. When he wants to come in on his own he basically knocks on the patio door. Its really weird.

He is terrified of the wind though. He won't even sit near the fireplace if there's any bit of a gust coming down the chimney. Thats when he gets to come upstairs.

Dogs are the job

Gordon Minard

We have a lovely little 4-Year old Jack Russell cross . . . . I was "duped" into buying her at a fair over 2 years ago . . .

We had her only 2-3 Months when she ran under a car. We had to bring her to the Pet Hospital in UCD and our Vet. Nearly €800 by the time we were finished . . .

Didn't regret a penny . . .. I would be lost if anything happened her now! She has paid us back many times over in love and enjoyment . . .

It wouldn't be a million miles asking me would I spend money on a member of my family if, God forbid, they got sick . . .

Micky Dolenz

I once had a pet elephant. His name was Stampy.

Cherry Blossom

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh and apparently a dog licking your mouth has much less bacterial transfer than kissing a fellow human would. Their mouths are "cleaner". Their saliva contains very strong anti bacterial agents.

My mother was giving out stink yesterday because I was letting my dog lick soup off my spoon, good to know she was wrong :pac:

Squeedily Spooch

Deleted User wrote: »

Thus far owning a wolf has been surprisingly inexpensive. So I have not been tested on how far I would go to maintain his medical well being. But my expectation is the levels will be quite extreme. Anything that does not prove to be an ultimate detriment to my family is on the table. All else is expendable and I expect I would happy expend it if required.

Do you think you own an actual wolf? Thats cute.

Tail Docker

Hey Wibbs! Wibber! I have a Wolf! It's a real, big old 80% wolf. Honest.

Runs and hides...:pac::D

Pumpkinseeds

Caprica6 wrote: »

Pet insurance can't be renewed once your pet reaches a certain age!

It's still worth having until your pet reaches that age.

brian888

It's very comforting to know there are a lot of people who really love their dear pets. Really balances out the picture for me, some people should not be allowed to take responsibility of anything more than a ham sandwich.

coffee_cake

now I don't know anymore if he has a wolf or not


I did a wolf sponsorship thing once, that was nice

Midnight Sundance

Would do anything for my dogs. Had to pay close to 3 grand for op for one of them but totally worth it. Still with us 8 years on!
Have pet insurance on younger dog in case he ever has any problems.