One person always ruins it.

gunny558

Some lad pulling out his legally held shotgun on Irish Water workers yesterday.

http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-water-gun-pulled-on-worker-1751030-Oct2014/

All it takes is one or two incidents like this and before ya know it the DOJ will be breathing down our necks..... and nevermind giving ammo (forgive the pun) for the ongoing court cases.

BTW: THat article is actually decent enough and doesnt paint us in a terribly bad light- a quick google search will pull up other articles which say the IW worker who was minding his own business installing the meter when the evil mad looney turns up with a gun.

Dr Strange

I think it's safe to say he will not be allowed to hold a permit in future. And quite rightly so.

Sparks

It looks bad; on the other hand the source is the Journal and the Star, so I'd hold off on the pitchforks just yet. We don't know if the Irish Water worker was trespassing, we don't know if the shotgun was pointed or if it was being carried when the two met, or any of the details.

gunny558

Sparks wrote: »

It looks bad; on the other hand the source is the Journal and the Star, so I'd hold off on the pitchforks just yet. We don't know if the Irish Water worker was trespassing, we don't know if the shotgun was pointed or if it was being carried when the two met, or any of the details.

Sparks me and you both know it doesnt really matter if its not entirely accurate. We can be objective on here. But when Joe Soap reads a dodgy article.... it doesnt matter if its true or not.... that can be enough to sway opinion.

The main article I was looking at was actually here:

http://talkofthetown.ie/2014/10/29/anti-water-charges-protest-planned-for-dundalk-this-saturday/

And again, living not far from Ardee, people here are talking about the issue with wagging tongues.

daveob007

Were we not the ones who suffered under Dermot Aherns legislation because of the actions of criminals,and still are. some people will jump on this regardless of how it happened.

rsole1

daveob007 wrote: »

Were we not the ones who suffered under Dermot Aherns legislation because of the actions of criminals,and still are. some people will jump on this regardless of how it happened.

So you can't challenge a trespasser on your property what is his business? So you may be holding a shotgun, as you've just been out rabbiting the back field? This place is becoming thief / burglar friendly.

BattleCorp

I'll reserve judgement on yer man with the shotgun until more facts are known.

Maybe he pointed the shotgun at the worker.

Maybe the worker freaked when he saw someone innocently walking across the yard with a shotgun.

I don't know, I wasn't there. Hopefully a swift investigation will determine what happened.

What I do hope though is that if yer man was stupid enough to threaten somebody with a shotgun, that he gets time behind bars.

djflawless

^^^ more of this with support from anyone legit about our sport
sick of reading red top papers one sided shyte!!

gunny558

I think yous are missing the point I was making....

When newspapers are running headings like:

Gardaí seized a firearm yesterday when a homeowner produced it during a confrontation with an Irish Water worker trying to install a meter.

An Irish Water worker who was installing water meters fled a property after a homeowner confronted him with shotgun yesterday.

Irish Water worker confronted by armed man

Irish Water worker flees Co Louth property 'after man pulls out a shotgun'.

This is bad for us. It doesnt really matter if they are over sensationalising it and making a mountain out of a mole hill. What matters is these articles are bad publicity for our sport and the way I see it, we are on rocky ground as it stands- we dont need to this kinda hassle.

tomtucker81

Arent the meters being installed to properties on mains water? So normally a property in a built up area.
Maybe the chap happened to be walking out the door to go shooting, who knows.
If he did threaten someone though, he deserves to lose the licence.

cw67irl

Second hand info I got from a local was that the gun was neither loaded nor pointed as the IW lad. (Not defending just repeating what I heard) Also the installer was wandering looking for the stopcock and might have startled the lad. Seemed like a somewhat innocent mistake although the papers in the morning will no doubt have the IW lad on his knees preparing for his exceution.

djflawless

I swears it your honour i could see the rifling of the shotgun barrel :P

lanber man

cw67irl wrote: »

Second hand info I got from a local was that the gun was neither loaded nor pointed as the IW lad. (Not defending just repeating what I heard) Also the installer was wandering looking for the stopcock and might have startled the lad. Seemed like a somewhat innocent mistake although the papers in the morning will no doubt have the IW lad on his knees preparing for his exceution.

I hope I'm wrong but it seems a bit off for the gardai to seize a gun unwarranted. Of course they've to be careful but if iw lad called them and when they came asked if it looked broken or 'straight' it'd put them on the right track.
Only way to carry a gun is closed in a case or broken. No excuses

bravestar

lanber man wrote: »

I hope I'm wrong but it seems a bit off for the gardai to seize a gun unwarranted. Of course they've to be careful but if iw lad called them and when they came asked if it looked broken or 'straight' it'd put them on the right track.
Only way to carry a gun is closed in a case or broken. No excuses

The firearm was seized while the investigation takes place, nothing a bit off or unwarranted about it.

daveob007

no matter what happened the media love this sort of firearm owner bashing and so do certain politicians.....full story not out yet but be sure if the landowner was only out carrying the gun to his car and did nothing wrong the media wont publish that,they prefer the more dramatic story..

Cass

Does anyone remember this recent article discussed in this thread?

Things are not always what they are reported to be. I had a quick look at the article, and that was only because everyone was going on about it. Some things stood out to me.

• The IW worker "accidentally wandered" onto this land so that trespassing straight away (whether accidental or not if you're on someone's land without permission it's trespassing.)
• How the gun owner approached the IW worker was not described. IOW was he out with the gun and the IW worker met him as he was coming home or heading out?
• The Gardaí seized the gun, but the IW worker would have had to call the Gardaí or go and report yer man to them. Meaning they arrived after the fact and are only acting because an "incident" with a firearm was reported.
• No arrests made. If it was so serious then they would have arrested the man or at least brought him in for questioning.
• "The gun was pulled". Sensationalist much? It's a fecking shotgun. Not something that can be hidden in your pocket. Plus it was legally held. What firearm owner, in his right mind, would do such a thing over water charges? Whether he agrees with it or not no one is that stupid.
• IT'S THE JOURNAL. Not exactly a firearm friendly "media"" outlet.

I'm not saying that the guy is innocent simply because he is a firearm owner, but i'm more than willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and support his position because i (as i assume a lot of us) have been on the receiving end of something similar simply because we have guns. Exaggerated reports of a "gun wielding maniac" on our own land or property.

useurowname

Is the suggestion therefore that it was coincidence that the Water guy accidentally trespassed on to the mans while the man happened to be out and about with his gun? What an unfortunate turn of events!

Cass

My suggestion, won't speak for anyone else, is i'd sooner see accurate facts that have been proved than speculation from an anti-firearm source. Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt and i'll place my support behind a fellow shooter.

meathstevie

Innocent until proven guilty. Amen.

If the man pointed a gun at someone who was completely non violent he has committed an offence.

If.the water fella saw 1 + 1 = 3 than he's a Muppet.

Let the Gardai do their job and see where it all ends up if it ends up anywhere at all.

Personally I'm quite sure that if a serious firearms incident happens you would see support units and above all arrests.

useurowname

I'd err on the side of caution myself. I don't see us shooters as a tribe, there are many thousands of licensed firearms in Ireland a small few of which are in the hands of idiots (see signage shooting, deer poaching, eagle shooting and so on for evidence) I'd wait and see before backing him or anyone else that runs into firearms related bother. I agree that this case is sketchy on detail and the man should not be tried by media, but as the title of the thread alludes, it takes a few to make life more difficult for the rest of us.. this one really is a newspaper mans dream, water metres and guns, sometimes it's just too easy for them.

Heckler

So many ifs and buts going on in this case. One thing is for sure if it turns out to be a harmless case of a water worker innocently bumping into a guy with a legally held firearm walking his land the resolution won't get a mention in the anti-firearms biased media.

Cass

The way i see it is this. The IW worker was trespassing. The owner sees someone on his land that he doesn't know and did not make themselves known to the owner. With his gun in his possession, the reasons why are irrelevant as it's legally held and he is on his land, he approaches the man. The IW worker panics after seeing someone approaching with a gun. He most likely does not know anything about guns or whether one broken across the owners arm is any different to one that is closed and in a "ready" position. He calls the Gardaí, they arrive because a firearm is involved, the gun is taken, the owner is NOT arrested, and an investigation is launched.

Now if the firearm owner was acting in a threatening manner the possession of the gun at the time could be coincidental. Even if it's not, there is a trespasser on his land/property. I'm not advocating the use of a firearm for self defense as the discussion of such is prohibited and the act of such is illegal, but so far everything points to the land owner being 100% in the right, and IW worker being in the wrong. However the land/firearm owner gets it in the neck because he is a firearm owner. If he (land owner) is 100% in the wrong, and acted improperly then he will be dealt with by An Gardaí. However, and this is a big "but", look at the source, the language used to report the incident, and sensationalist wording. 99% of these cases end up being nothing.

As i said above i've experienced this first hand over the years. We're [firearm owners] classed as greater threat simply by owning them. How many times have you heard of people having their guns taken off them because of untrue rumors reported to AGS by people with an agenda. Before i'm accused of Garda bashing, i'm not. I appreciate the Gardaí have to take care in such circumstances, and i'd rather see 99 false instances where the gun was removed than 1 were it wasn't and something did happen. However it's disheartening to think that because we own guns, have kept our noses clean for years in order to be able to do so, that we are so vulnerable to attack by any person suffering from ignorance or stupidity.

Heckler

And thats the rub. The hoops we have to have jump through to get a licence which means we are the most regulated AND self regulated sporting class in the land means nothing when it comes to a populist, sensationalist article involving firearms. Frustrating beyond belief. PM'd.

minktrapper

Landowner might have thought it was an E.T.

Varmint Shooter

Any follow up on this available?