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Any cut off point for amount of sexual partners your partner had?

  • 07-10-2014 10:37pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13


    I was reading a post similar if not identical to this on gc. So what do you ladies think? I'm a virgin so I can't really speak from experience but it wouldn't bother me in the slightest once their clean and healthy. I've been told by a few lads though that they thought girls with more then 2 or 3 were rank! One of my exes told me he was with me because I was the hottest "clean" girl he knew! It's easy to say he wasn't with me much longer!

    What about you ladies? Any preference?


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    No preference. When I was younger a large number would have intimated me hugely, a large number in this context being any number greater than mine :D. It's that fear you won't measure up but as I got older I got past all that. Now I couldn't care once he was disease free. I'm still surprised that men exist who value virginity, I can't imagine anything worse than having to go through that learning process with someone. Give me experience everytime.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,031 ✭✭✭we'llallhavetea


    no cut off point for me.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,687 ✭✭✭✭Penny Tration


    No cut off point. I don't care about how many people they've slept with, once they're disease-free.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,737 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    No cut off for me. In fact I wouldn't want to know how many partners he'd had, and how many I've had is no-one's business but my own.

    You'll find that these guys who won't go with girls who have had more than a couple of partners are often hypocrites who rate their self-worth by how many women they've slept with.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,468 ✭✭✭Ectoplasm


    I don't have a cut off; in fact I have never even considered asking a partner how many people they have slept with. The only thing I want to know related to numbers is that I am the only one they are sleeping with now and even that is dependent on being in a relationship.

    These kind of numbers are always arbitrary and I think are of more concern to younger (early 20s) folk. Wouldn't sleep with someone who has had 50 partners? Well if they are mid to late 30s, even with a few long term relationships (2 years or more) that number could be easily reached, or they could only have had 3 or 4. Who cares?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,121 ✭✭✭Censorsh!t


    Girls who have slept with over 2 or 3 are rank? :O Really dislike silly judgements like that! I'd find it really insulting if a guy said he was with me cause i was the hottest "clean" girl.

    Myself - don't really have a cut off point now that I myself am older and more experiences. I would have found it intimidating when I was younger. But now I don't really care.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,928 ✭✭✭✭rainbow kirby


    No cut off point. I don't care about how many people they've slept with, once they're disease-free.

    ^ This. I would consider STD status a LOT more important than number of previous partners.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    kylith wrote: »
    You'll find that these guys who won't go with girls who have had more than a couple of partners are often hypocrites who rate their self-worth by how many women they've slept with.

    I've found, personally, as a broad trend, more often than not by quite a large degree, the guys I've known who thought like this tended to be speaking purely hypothetically, as they never exactly had many options.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13 S4960


    Censorsh!t wrote: »
    Girls who have slept with over 2 or 3 are rank? :O Really dislike silly judgements like that! I'd find it really insulting if a guy said he was with me cause i was the hottest "clean" girl.

    Me too. He used to point out girls he had slept with too. It was disguising. Needless to say he got his marching orders the same day he told me!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,710 ✭✭✭shalalala


    I think it is less to do with the numbers and more to do with being compatible on attitudes to do with sex. If one sees it as just a physical act that can be done with anyone and the other sees it as being something more of a connection to a special person, it can lead to problems in the relationship if not handles properly.


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  • Posts: 26,052 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No I don't. It's not something I think about, anything I care about, and I've never asked because I don't want to know. I live in the present and not in someone else's past so it has nothing to do with me.

    If someone is discerning, clean, respectful, and faithful to their current partner, how many previous sexual partners they have had is no-one else's business.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,086 ✭✭✭TheBeardedLady


    Not a question I ever asked or was ever asked of me. I don't care either about my number, his number or how he'd feel about my number. This is more of the "only in the realm of Boards and not in my real life" stuff I encounter on here, thank fook.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    I don't know... I mean, ok yeh I wouldn't care about some level of promiscuity, but... womanising, sex addiction behaviour... I wouldn't be keen on these pasts (if I knew about them).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26 ima_believer


    I know everyone has a past, but I wouldnt like the idea of my OH having slept with loads and loads.

    I certainly dont judge anyone if they have but my preference would be someone with low enough numbers


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    I know everyone has a past, but I wouldnt like the idea of my OH having slept with loads and loads.

    I certainly dont judge anyone if they have but my preference would be someone with low enough numbers

    Do you mind if I ask why? Is there a specific reason, or reasons that you are conscious of, or is it just a general feeling you have?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26 ima_believer


    There's no real way of saying it without causing offence to some people, thats not im intention.

    But I suppose I wouldn't like to be with someone who has had loads of ONS. Like someone pointed out in TGC i'd prefer to be with someone who hasn't gone home with anyone and everyone. I know we all have needs and all that but it's just not my thing...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    There's no real way of saying it without causing offence to some people, thats not im intention.

    But I suppose I wouldn't like to be with someone who has had loads of ONS. Like someone pointed out in TGC i'd prefer to be with someone who hasn't gone home with anyone and everyone. I know we all have needs and all that but it's just not my thing...

    That's fair enough, I'd just point out that it could be the case that a guy had quite a low number and/or few or no ONS's and had gone home with anyone and everyone that was willing, and can be the case that a guy had a higher number including ONS's and been quite selective about who they had gone home with or not (I've known both) . So it's not as black and white maybe, and if that's your concern you'd probably have to base your evaluation on whether or not a guy was like that on more than just the number of people they had slept with.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    There's no real way of saying it without causing offence to some people, thats not im intention.

    But I suppose I wouldn't like to be with someone who has had loads of ONS. Like someone pointed out in TGC i'd prefer to be with someone who hasn't gone home with anyone and everyone. I know we all have needs and all that but it's just not my thing...

    This is the problem with the myth of the ONS....not everyone will just go home with "anyone and everyone", even people who have ONS's have standards you know!

    I would know a few people who aren't in relationships at the moment and who would have ONS's, its not a regular thing, it might be 3-4 a year, its not like they are out looking for sex all the time but it adds up and if you are not lucky enough to have found a relationship you can very easily have a high number of partners, it doesn't mean you are sex mad though or willing to sleep with the first person who looks at you.

    They don't just go home with random people, most of them would know the person they have sex with or they would take the time to get to to know them. Its as much about safety as anything, I don't know anyone who would take a complete stranger home.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 746 ✭✭✭Starokan


    I think its linked to a persons ego in a way, its almost like someone hears a number and reacts, its being processed in the mind as he/she has slept with 40 people , everyone wants them why would they stay with me.

    I would hazard a guess that much of the people who would be affected by a number would also be the same person who would develop a serious dislike/fear/hatred/jealousy of a new partners previous long term ex as again they will be perceived as a threat.

    The crazy thing is if you think about a number logically it means nothing, you are effectively judging someone on the number of times they have sex. A single person might average 6 one night stands a year so they have sex 6 times in a year. Whereas a couple who are together will have sex numerous times during that year in numerous different ways and in a far more intimate way. It simply does not make sense


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,745 ✭✭✭Macavity.


    I think some women would definitely have concerns about somebody who had very few sexual partners (or none) if they were over a certain age. Lets say a virgin at thirty or something.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 267 ✭✭larrymickdick


    Is a person's number still a thing? Personally I find asking someone for their "number" a little outdated and really it's no-one elses business but your own. I mean it's sex you've had - it's not like you've murdered someone.

    There is a lot more important things about a person and who they are, than how many people they've had sex with. I thinking judging someone on who they've slept is a horrible thing to do.

    It's like slut shaming, it shouldn't be done.


  • Posts: 26,052 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Macavity. wrote: »
    I think some women would definitely have concerns about somebody who had very few sexual partners (or none) if they were over a certain age. Lets say a virgin at thirty or something.

    It's not always the case that someone would be 'odd' in some way, other than terrible shyness or lack of confidence. Location might be part of the issue too, if someone grew up in a very isolated place or something like that.

    It wouldn't be ideal but it wouldn't necessarily be a bad reflection on someones character.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26 ima_believer


    You all make very valid points about it.

    I should probably have phrased my initial comment differently. I wouldnt like the idea of someone who DOES go home with everyone they meet.

    Im also not insecure about their exs or anything of the sort. And I wouldnt mind if someone was in their 30's and had very few. They may have been in LTRs or as pointed out they could be shy.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    I don't care about an actual number but I do judge people on their sexual behaviour. If someone sleeps with any wagon they can find then no thank you. Also I am not great fan of promiscuous people who are also in long therm relationship. (I know a few). I don't buy the past is not important bs. It can very often tell you what future will bring.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    The experience thing too... not always essential. You can teach someone like. :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 272 ✭✭Lalealynn


    It's not so much the number as what it means. What's behind it. I suppose a man could have slept with over 20 women and be very pure of heart. But then a virgin could be sleazy and ew. I can be easily intimidated by dating anyway.

    I am naive yet perceptive and its an odd mix. I possibly see myself as a little vulnerable. I am a little vulnerable. I would wonder can he even remember what it's like to be like me and be able to empathize. Would we blend would we melt? What appetites and desires would he have picked up along the way? Is his heart a little coarse or maybe a little wounded from it?

    Anyway if he was very worldly and had many partners how could he really be interested in me? Except for that of course!

    Would we connect? Would I feel afraid to connect? If he had that many partners it tends to give you a different perspective on emotions and people and yourself and how you experience things. It can leave you less sensitive. Or maybe more sensitive I don't know.

    I suppose I would take him as I found him really. The number I guess well it's like this I am not really a jealous person but I am into exclusivity as I know my own sensitivity to raw emotions. I would wonder would he be able to empathize with that or if he would want to.
    It's like a ingenue playing with a streetwise kid. I would worry he would not be able to commit or it would not be really wanted but only felt as an obligation.

    But I would took him as I found him to be. The number would look different on everyone. And past is past I guess you look at the person in front of you and look into them and you see them and they see you etc . I suppose the number is not the person at all. And it's not like a high number is a bad thing. I guess it's how he treats me etc and the way he wants to be treated and what he appreciates. It's not for me to pry into his past if he wants to tell me and I liked him and felt safe and appreciated and that he was genuine it would not matter. But it might be best for me to get to know him first. You can form ill opinions when you have a wild imagination. It possibly would not be one of the first things I ask though. And yes if I turn up at his second date and there are three hookers in the closet and a bunch of men watching porn doing coke and strippers right there I am off! If that's been his past he'd have to realize that's not a 'safe place' for me to connect.

    It's not that people should hide these things. It's just you create your own relationship. I think I have my own issues there etc with experiences and It can trigger 'stuff'. Which people can scoff at but there you go.

    The number would not be what frightening me off the man or the way he behaves might be though. It's who he is that matters.

    A virgin can be sleazy and jaded someone who has had a lot of partners can be one of the nicest caring people you have ever met I suppose. Thats what matters. Further into the relationship it probably matters less. It's just one of those first impression things. Which is why maybe it should be about getting to know the guy first.

    We are all sexual beings anyway. There is no point in pretending that energy is not there. It's most beautiful for me in a relationships though.

    Yeah I'm soppy ..sorry.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    The experience thing too... not always essential. You can teach someone like. :)

    You can, but do you really want to? I honestly couldn't be arsed to be someone's tutor, I want a man who knows what he's doing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,949 ✭✭✭✭IvyTheTerrible


    eviltwin wrote: »
    You can, but do you really want to? I honestly couldn't be arsed to be someone's tutor, I want a man who knows what he's doing.
    I think I like a bit of both, I mean, everyone is at least a little bit different, so it's good for a man to know what he's doing but not so much that he is not open to what a partner needs (what worked for his ex will not necessarily work for me). I'm open to learn too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 370 ✭✭Stepping Stone


    I would personally be quite wary of someone with a high number because of the behaviour that I saw with one of my friends.

    She lost her virginity at 16 and had a few one night stands around then. In a small town, she got a rep for being easy pretty quickly but she loved it. She loved the attention, the notoriety, etc. She rapidly turned it into a numbers game. She threw a party after she hit 25 (aged 19) and wanted to get to triple figures asap. It was completely nuts. When we went to college in different cities, any conversation opened with her updating her number. She went out on a fri, Sat and Sun night to up it by three.

    There was no deep seated psychological reason for what was risky behaviour that we ever knew of. She didn't practice safe sex all the time and was literally going home with anyone. She was fixated on the numbers and couldn't see past it.

    She found a boyfriend when she was 24 but they have an open relationship and again, she is working on her numbers. It is behaviour that is completely alien to me. I don't understand it and to be honest, it disgusts me on some level.

    To clarify, she has had sex with almost 100 different men, in 16yrs. While it doesn't seem high on average, I know the intensity with which those numbers were accumulated.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,185 ✭✭✭Snoopy1


    I had a terrible past, not one im proud of . Im completley different now.
    I think a number should be kept to yourself, its certainly not something i would be telling anyone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    eviltwin wrote: »
    You can, but do you really want to?
    If I like him enough, it wouldn't bother me and I don't get why it would bother someone tbh. Experience can be built up with one person. This obsession with "experience" - I don't get it. Yeh it's obviously got its benefits but I don't agree it's as important as is made out.
    I would personally be quite wary of someone with a high number because of the behaviour that I saw with one of my friends.

    She lost her virginity at 16 and had a few one night stands around then. In a small town, she got a rep for being easy pretty quickly but she loved it. She loved the attention, the notoriety, etc. She rapidly turned it into a numbers game. She threw a party after she hit 25 (aged 19) and wanted to get to triple figures asap. It was completely nuts. When we went to college in different cities, any conversation opened with her updating her number. She went out on a fri, Sat and Sun night to up it by three.

    There was no deep seated psychological reason for what was risky behaviour that we ever knew of. She didn't practice safe sex all the time and was literally going home with anyone. She was fixated on the numbers and couldn't see past it.

    She found a boyfriend when she was 24 but they have an open relationship and again, she is working on her numbers. It is behaviour that is completely alien to me. I don't understand it and to be honest, it disgusts me on some level.

    To clarify, she has had sex with almost 100 different men, in 16yrs. While it doesn't seem high on average, I know the intensity with which those numbers were accumulated.
    I'd find that massively off-putting in a guy too. Some people think the issue is with just the sex aspect; it's actually more the silly impressionable behaviour.
    Snoopy1 wrote: »
    I had a terrible past, not one im proud of . Im completley different now.
    I think a number should be kept to yourself, its certainly not something i would be telling anyone.
    Ah I wouldn't agree in feeling like that about your past either - you wanted to do it at the time, don't feel bad now about that. :)


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 61 ✭✭AndreaCollins


    eviltwin wrote: »
    You can, but do you really want to? I honestly couldn't be arsed to be someone's tutor, I want a man who knows what he's doing.


    So what should a 35 year old male virgin do in your opinion? One of my friends is a 35 year old virgin and has no clue what to do in bed. Should he visit escorts for the experience? What is your opinion?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,745 ✭✭✭Macavity.


    A lot of women on here are going to say they wouldn't mind a man who was a thirty something year old virgin, but the truth is the majority would.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    So what should a 35 year old male virgin do in your opinion? One of my friends is a 35 year old virgin and has no clue what to do in bed. Should he visit escorts for the experience? What is your opinion?

    He should put himself out there and see what happens,


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    Macavity. wrote: »
    A lot of women on here are going to say they wouldn't mind a man who was a thirty something year old virgin, but the truth is the majority would.
    The truth? The majority? What?

    In my case, if I met a man whom I really liked, and he was 35 and a virgin, it really would not be an issue for me. I really like him so that's enough. People aren't always virgins due to being unattractive.
    I know generalisations are kinda necessary at times to make a point, but sexual preferences are very individualised, and are annoyingly depicted as broad social trends.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,745 ✭✭✭Macavity.


    In my case, if I met a man whom I really liked, and he was 35 and a virgin, it really would not be an issue for me. I really like him so that's enough. People aren't always virgins due to being unattractive.
    I know generalisations are kinda necessary at times to make a point, but sexual preferences are very individualised, and are annoyingly depicted as broad social trends.

    There is always going to be some people who don't have an issue with it, but that isn't the case for the majority. Being that age and a virgin would suggest that someone has a severe social deficit or something else wrong with them, which would turn a lot of women off. Men aren't as bothered about such things (few men would have an issue about a women being a virgin at 30+) as they are generally more visual, and less concerned with social norms when it comes to a partner.

    Now, this is all from observation and chatting with friends, but even so, I did a quick Google search and there are many studies which support my claim - a man not being experienced at that age is an issue for a lot of women.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 61 ✭✭AndreaCollins


    Macavity. wrote: »
    There is always going to be some people who don't have an issue with it, but that isn't the case for the majority. Being that age and a virgin would suggest that someone has a severe social deficit or something else wrong with them, which would turn a lot of women off. Men aren't as bothered about such things (few men would have an issue about a women being a virgin at 30+) as they are generally more visual, and less concerned with social norms when it comes to a partner.

    Now, this is all from observation and chatting with friends, but even so, I did a quick Google search and there are many studies which support my claim - a man not being experienced at that age is an issue for a lot of women.


    It's also an issue for the man. Sexual confidence is a big issue for men and can affect their confidence in themselves. Plus if he did finally find a girl and go out with her and so on and then get to the bedroom and completely let himself down and make things awkward, which has happened to him, that is really terrible.

    I think he should get the sexual confidence he needs that will make him know that he can satisfy a woman and knows what to do in the bedroom. At least that would be one weight off his shoulders.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Thanks god for hookers then. It seems they are doing a good deed of making some men acceptable as sexual partners. :D

    I don't know the amount of experience doesn't really bother me. Best sex is usually when partners are comfortable with each other anyway and there is always time to learn. For me it is way more important how people behave to get sex.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    It turns me on massively to "teach" a man what I like. Contrary to popular belief, there isn't a "template" - people get turned on by different things.
    Only I know exactly what I like - a man can't be expected to know this. Often when someone is deemed "bad in bed" it's because their partner isn't communicative enough with them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 940 ✭✭✭Tabitharose


    TBH, I'd have a bigger issue with a guy who I knew had visited escorts than one who was still a virgin at 35.

    As far as numbers go, I've never asked, nor have I ever been asked - I don't see what can be achieved by that particular conversation.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,802 ✭✭✭beks101


    I think sexual confidence can only really be acquired through experience. And that accounts for a lot of things - the ability to communicate your preferences, an understanding of your partner's physical cues and an intimate knowledge of the female anatomy, even down to things like rhythm and comfort in each other's nakedness and the general little mishaps and awkward/messy/crazy moments that can happen when you're getting intimate with someone.

    I wouldn't say it would be a deal-breaker for me to meet, for argument's sake, a guy my age who was a virgin, but it would certainly flag some sort of sexual incompatibility right off the mark, as I'd have a high enough drive and sex is something I'd be quite open about. Any issues I'd have had over the years have sort of gotten ironed out with experience.

    I have no interest in 'numbers' or 'cut-off points' as I think that's completely arbitrary as a means of measuring someone's attitude towards sex or potential compatibility with me as a person.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,855 ✭✭✭The Wild Bunch


    I've learned the hard way that the past should be left in the past and it's better not to know - you'll beat yourself up over it and it'll drive you crazy. You'll OBSESS over it


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    Macavity. wrote: »
    There is always going to be some people who don't have an issue with it, but that isn't the case for the majority. Being that age and a virgin would suggest that someone has a severe social deficit or something else wrong with them, which would turn a lot of women off. Men aren't as bothered about such things (few men would have an issue about a women being a virgin at 30+) as they are generally more visual, and less concerned with social norms when it comes to a partner.

    Now, this is all from observation and chatting with friends, but even so, I did a quick Google search and there are many studies which support my claim - a man not being experienced at that age is an issue for a lot of women.

    You forget those who remainder virgins until marriage due to religious believe.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    It's not something I'd ask or information I'd volunteer, and if I did happen to know that someone had a particularly high or low number I don't think it'd bother me. Random shags and sex in an intimate, loving relationship are very different things but a past involving a lot of the former doesn't mean you put less significance on the latter when it happens. I'm sure my own sexual history would raise more than a couple of eyebrows (and I literally could not give less of a shít) so it'd be pretty hypocritical of me to go making someone else's a deal breaker. But yeah, again, it's not something I'd be interested in knowing, a can of worms best left closed.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,134 ✭✭✭Lux23


    I wouldn't ask the question anymore, it means nothing once you're in love with someone.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,188 ✭✭✭DoYouEvenLift


    To people saying there is no cut off, is that entirely true or would your opinion change if you were made aware your partner had been with 500 people? Or even more? Similar to what another member of this forum experienced before. It's obviously extremely rare for people to even reach 100 but it does happen.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,855 ✭✭✭The Wild Bunch


    edit


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,687 ✭✭✭✭Penny Tration


    To people saying there is no cut off, is that entirely true or would your opinion change if you were made aware your partner had been with 500 people? Or even more? Similar to what another member of this forum experienced before. It's obviously extremely rare for people to even reach 100 but it does happen.

    Personally, I wouldn't care.

    If they're willing to get sti testing and are free from any diseases, and I trust and respect them, then their number means nothing.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,737 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    To people saying there is no cut off, is that entirely true or would your opinion change if you were made aware your partner had been with 500 people? Or even more? Similar to what another member of this forum experienced before. It's obviously extremely rare for people to even reach 100 but it does happen.

    Not so much that I wouldn't care as I wouldn't know because I wouldn't ask. If they straight up and told me I'd be more concerned about the fact that it was apparently important to them that I knew how many partner's they'd had.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭ash23


    With my boyfriend for a year and we've never discussed our numbers and I doubt we ever will. It's not important.
    What we have discussed is our previous serious relationships. He knows how many serious boyfriends I've had and I know about his girlfriends but I don't care how many people he's slept with and I hope he wouldn't care either.

    I've racked up a high enough number as I've been single a fair bit on and off through the years and I'm in my 30s now.
    14 years sexually active minus about 8 years in relationships means two or three ONS a year can get you up to the 20s in terms of numbers. And if things don't work out with himself I could easily get up into the 40s or 50s before I hit 50.


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