Prime Time on state of Dublin City Center tomorrow night

Kermit.de.frog

All those who think we are all imagining our city center sinking with each passing day in to a gurrier cesspit should look at this tomorrow.

http://www.rte.ie/news/primetime/2014/1001/649312-prime-time-drugs-in-dublin/

Hopefully the program hits home and action is taken with the gardai, the drug clinics or whatever has to be done. It's shameful and embarrassing what is being tolerated and accommodated in the city center. A playground for drunks, junkies and feral youth. Now businesses are speaking out about what they increasingly see and experience day in day out and are giving warnings and some are withholding their rates such is the alarm at what they see.

smellmepower

What action can be taken that already isn't being taken? Gardai can't arrest people simply for being addicts, or because they're appearance intimidates certain people with delicate sensibilities.

The clinics in the city treat a large amount of addicts that are housed in and around the city in poor quality temporary accommodation. Can't see residents of any suburb willing to have them re-located in their area.

Alcoholics, vagrants etc will always flock to the city centre because it offers the most opportunity for begging, and it's where most of the homeless resources are located.

Will just be another hand wringing exercise, where no practical solutions to problems will be offered because they would require political backbone, substantial funding and wouldn't suit the black and white world views of people like the OP who's votes they are courting. Instead the politicians will trot out the same old tired cliches and figures, and then ditzy Miriam will say that's all we have time for.

SteelyDanJalapeno

smellmepower wrote: »

What action can be taken that already isn't being taken? Gardai can't arrest people simply for being addicts, or because they're appearance intimidates certain people with delicate sensibilities.

The clinics in the city treat a large amount of addicts that are housed in and around the city in poor quality temporary accommodation. Can't see residents of any suburb willing to have them re-located in their area.

Alcoholics, vagrants etc will always flock to the city centre because it offers the most opportunity for begging, and it's where most of the homeless resources are located.

Will just be another hand wringing exercise, where no practical solutions to problems will be offered because they would require political backbone, substantial funding and wouldn't suit the black and white world views of people like the OP who's votes they are courting. Instead the politicians will trot out the same old tired cliches and figures, and then ditzy Miriam will say that's all we have time for.

How are other cities in the world managing to keep the junkies away?

Kermit.de.frog

TiltedBrain wrote: »

How are other cities in the world managing to keep the junkies away?

As the description of the report says everything the addicts require is centralised in a small area of Dublin city center to such an extent that they don't just flock in every day from just the suburbs or county - they are coming in every day from all over Leinster!

And where you get so many addicts in the one place as sure as night follows day the tone of the area goes down and gives fertile ground for associates and little scummers to set up camp too.

NO other city that I know has actively damaged ITSELF like this. It's absolutely crazy. This is the center of our capital city. And the damage is being done. Tourists themselves are saying they are intimidated and they don't feel safe.

As one business owner said a few weeks back if something is not done right now this is going to stick and it is fatal for the city center.

They need to wake up and start looking after our city properly.

better call saul

Fück, hope I'm not being profiled

catallus

An easy way to stop begging would be to make it illegal to give money to beggars.

But that would be too simple, wouldn't it?

Kermit.de.frog

It really hits home when you think, for example, we have this huge tech conference in the RDS in November with the most important people from all over the world in that area attending. This is what they will see and experience when they go in to the city center.

It's tourism, investment, Dubliners no longer wanting to go in to town - it's not right. The answer to a big part of the problem is the clinics either have to go completely or drastically reduced in scale and number. We need much more gardaí. In fact Dublin needs it's own dedicated police force because I don't think the gardai are up to it, I really don't.

Just the other night I saw a glass bottle fight outside Connolly station just up the road from Oktoberfest where there were gardaí. I saw a group of tourists quickly moving away and looking on bemused and obviously intimidated as glass was being thrown all over the place between two sets of delinquents. People were telling the visitors to "just walk" in a kind of "this is perfectly normal in Dublin" way. I know this went on uninterrupted for at least 5 minutes. I just kept walking to get my train. Saw no gardaí who were literally just around the corner running to the scene.

ProudDUB

smellmepower wrote: »

What action can be taken that already isn't being taken? Gardai can't arrest people simply for being addicts, or because they're appearance intimidates certain people with delicate sensibilities.

The clinics in the city treat a large amount of addicts that are housed in and around the city in poor quality temporary accommodation. Can't see residents of any suburb willing to have them re-located in their area.

Alcoholics, vagrants etc will always flock to the city centre because it offers the most opportunity for begging, and it's where most of the homeless resources are located.

Will just be another hand wringing exercise, where no practical solutions to problems will be offered because they would require political backbone, substantial funding and wouldn't suit the black and white world views of people like the OP who's votes they are courting. Instead the politicians will trot out the same old tired cliches and figures, and then ditzy Miriam will say that's all we have time for.

Tough. The geniuses who decided to locate all the methadone treatment centres in the city centre, didn't ask the areas residents or business owners what they thought about having them there. They were just foisted upon them, without so much as a by your leave.

I am not saying that such a heavy handed approach to re distributing the locations of support services needs to happen again. But they definitely need to be more evenly distributed and spread out more, away from the city centre, and more towards the communities that these people are originally from. Not only would it help to clean the city centre up, but it would mean that there would be family and community support structures in place, that they just can't access if they are all jammed into the city centre.

I agree with everything else that you say though.

davepatr07

Should be an interesting watch. I hope the city centre doesn't end up like Detroit or Jo-Burg in future. Needs Political intervention. Only the businesses and people can put pressure on the authorities to tackle the problem.

km991148

davepatr07 wrote: »

Needs Political intervention.

Political intervention is needed for many issues this country is facing - but all we have are two sets of weak parties to choose from who seem more interested in covering their own jobs (and those of their own kind)

Phoebas

catallus wrote: »

An easy way to stop begging would be to make it illegal to give money to beggars.

But that would be too simple, wouldn't it?

I don't think it would be simple to place legal restrictions on who people choose to give their money to.

cgcsb

Many other cities have tackled this problem by setting up shelters/clinics in suburban industrial estates where rents are cheap and there is 24 hour security, that way Dubliners can continue to sip their lattes undisturbed.

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

It really hits home when you think, for example, we have this huge tech conference in the RDS in November with the most important people from all over the world in that area attending. This is what they will see and experience when they go in to the city center.

And yet the web summit continues to grow in scale and numbers attending - clearly the city hadn't put those very important people off returning, or telling their mates they should attend.

alastair

Judging from the programme synopsis, there's going to be very little new reported. If the revelation that there's trade in benzos, which aren't proscribed, is the new insight, then Primetime are a little behind the times.

miamee

The root of the problem, IMO is the wide availability of drugs and alcohol and a lack of availability of places in rehab clinics when people decide they went to get off the stuff. They are stuck in a no man's land dependent on methadone or whatever else for years, attending clinics with other addicts and being easily pulled back in to taking drugs. There is no fresh start, there is no getting away from it for them as far as I can see. Possibly an oversimplified view but people can't get hooked on drugs if they don't exist/aren't widely available.

I was away recently and visited a few different cities in Eastern Europe. Last night while running the gauntlet of dodgy characters on Westmoreland Street at about 8.30pm, I realised that not once when I was away did I have to watch where I was walking or duck and dive to avoid running into someone who might take issue with my mere existence. If they were there at all they certainly were not visible. I'd call myself pretty street smart, I don't quake at the sight of a few alcos or junkies and I think that has maybe made me complacent to the fact that there are so many of them. It is not right. And I don't think lifting a giant sweeping brush and sweeping them out to the suburbs is going to help the issue at all except to move the problem elsewhere.

I'll be watching this with interest anyway.

SpaceTime

I think there's been a major attitude problem in Dublin with how people view the city.

For decades the city centre, especially the north inner city but also parts of the south inner city too have just been seen as dumping grounds and no go areas.

This isn't anything new. All that's happened is you've added lots of drugs.

It's a very non-European city in that regard. Usually the city centre is the showpiece and most expensive area.

A lot of American cities have the Dublin style abandoned city centre areas with major social issues.

It isn't the only city I feel intimidated in though.
Brussels has really scary bits right in the city centre too and lots of drugs.

Same with Amsterdam.

I also found some Spanish cities pretty dodgy.

FreudianSlippers

smellmepower wrote: »

What action can be taken that already isn't being taken? Gardai can't arrest people simply for being addicts, or because they're appearance intimidates certain people with delicate sensibilities.

We need an urban regeneration zone(s) in the city, particularly in the North Inner City. IMHO this means tax incentives, easy planning permission (with obvious rules) and mixed-use building. The council needs to put a plan in place that can start immediately and put funding/tax incentives towards it.

The Maverick

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

It really hits home when you think, for example, we have this huge tech conference in the RDS in November with the most important people from all over the world in that area attending. This is what they will see and experience when they go in to the city center.

It's tourism, investment, Dubliners no longer wanting to go in to town - it's not right. The answer to a big part of the problem is the clinics either have to go completely or drastically reduced in scale and number. We need much more gardaí. In fact Dublin needs it's own dedicated police force because I don't think the gardai are up to it, I really don't.

Just the other night I saw a glass bottle fight outside Connolly station just up the road from Oktoberfest where there were gardaí. I saw a group of tourists quickly moving away and looking on bemused and obviously intimidated as glass was being thrown all over the place between two sets of delinquents. People were telling the visitors to "just walk" in a kind of "this is perfectly normal in Dublin" way. I know this went on uninterrupted for at least 5 minutes. I just kept walking to get my train. Saw no gardaí who were literally just around the corner running to the scene.

If these gardai were "just around the corner", why didn't you tell them about these scumbags having a fight? Guards, like the rest of the population are not omnipotent. I understand you could have been running for a train but you can't give out about the lack of a police response when you yourself made no effort.

The idea of Dublin having its own police force doesn't make sense either and it has been tried in the past. Ireland is too small to sustain it, all you will do is add an extra layer of bureaucracy and cost. Even if it were to happen, it would simply be a case of every guard in Dublin switching over to a new force with no real change enacted.

There is no political will to change the situation in Dublin, politicians simply don't care. They have the "budget deficit" banner to use as their get out of jail free card. Until they change their mindset, the guards won't change and neither will the judiciary, prison service or health service

alastair

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

We need an urban regeneration zone(s) in the city, particularly in the North Inner City. IMHO this means tax incentives, easy planning permission (with obvious rules) and mixed-use building. The council needs to put a plan in place that can start immediately and put funding/tax incentives towards it.

Much of this already happens. The Parnell square regeneration scheme is about to kick off - http://parnellsquare.ie - there's been a bunch of new build and refurb retail, office, and residential development, with mixed success - it's easy enough to find new, empty retail and office space in the north inner city. Smithfield is wholly under-utilised in terms of what's been built. The density of middle-class apartment developments is at it's highest ever in the area. Simply throwing up new builds isn't really going to make much difference.

FreudianSlippers

alastair wrote: »

Much of this already happens. The Parnell square regeneration scheme is about to kick off - http://parnellsquare.ie - there's been a bunch of new build and refurb retail, office, and residential development, with mixed success - it's easy enough to find new, empty retail and office space in the north inner city. Smithfield is wholly under-utilised in terms of what's been built. The density of middle-class apartment developments is at it's highest ever in the area. Simply throwing up new builds isn't really going to make much difference.

Urban regeneration is not new builds though. It's ensuring that what is there is being utilised which does not happen in Dublin at all. Sure one of our grandest streets in the city is used to house ****ty hostels and squats.

The Parnell Square project is not a great example tbh. What I'm saying is that the council needs to ensure that poorly utilised areas are given special status and zoning (etc) to ensure revitalisation.

Timberrrrrrrr

TiltedBrain wrote: »

How are other cities in the world managing to keep the junkies away?

They're not.

SpaceTime

alastair wrote: »

Much of this already happens. The Parnell square regeneration scheme is about to kick off - http://parnellsquare.ie - there's been a bunch of new build and refurb retail, office, and residential development, with mixed success - it's easy enough to find new, empty retail and office space in the north inner city. Smithfield is wholly under-utilised in terms of what's been built. The density of middle-class apartment developments is at it's highest ever in the area. Simply throwing up new builds isn't really going to make much difference.

Smithfield is a fine example of how people see the North Inner City though.

Physically, it's really a great space but people don't seem to go there much and the retailers haven't come at all other than a couple of shops serving local needs.
It's also sort of cut off from the increasingly trendy Stoneybatter area because the street linking the two is really run down looking.

Manor Street should tie into Smithfield smoothly.

The National Museum at Collins Barracks isn't integrated into that area properly either.

LeinsterDub

SpaceTime wrote: »

Smithfield is a fine example of how people see the North Inner City though.

Physically, it's really a great space but people don't seem to go there much and the retailers haven't come at all other than a couple of shops serving local needs.
It's also sort of cut off from the increasingly trendy Stoneybatter area because the street linking the two is really run down looking.

Manor Street should tie into Smithfield smoothly.

The National Museum at Collins Barracks isn't integrated into that area properly either.

Their is zero reason for people who don't live in Smithfield to go to Smithfield there is never anything on there.

http://www.smithfieldsquare.ie/

Not single event using the actual square this month ,next or the next

'Come for the culture, stay for the night life', wow Ryan's and the lighthouse cinema not exactly overrun by either culture or nightlife .
Put on a big draw like Oktoberfest there , have decent open air gigs , historical or culture events and I'll go

drumswan

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

It really hits home when you think, for example, we have this huge tech conference in the RDS in November with the most important people from all over the world in that area attending. This is what they will see and experience when they go in to the city center.

Do you honestly think those people will be hanging around corners on O'Connell St or Abbey St? Maybe they'll all head to Supermacs alfter the conference :rolleyes:

Thats what I do when I head to a tech conference, find out where junkies hang around and immediately head there

Aard

A little bit of sensationalism here -- Dublin is not like Detroit or Johannesburg during their bad days. Dublin city centre is gaining population, and a lot of these new residents have money. That in itself is evidence that things aren't so bad. Until now, city councillors haven't been too concerned with the retail spine since not many people live in this narrow strip -- meaning time and energy intensive intervention efforts wouldn't necessarily lead to votes.

Kermit.de.frog

I see the defenders of the realm are out in force trying to defend the situation. They are blinded and immune to the reality. Our only hope is that the numbers wanting action in the city outnumber those with their heads in the sand before it is too late.

Because if nothing happens right now and this is allowed to fester then the city center is dead. That is what will happen. No one will want to go there. Businesses will close, tourists will disappear. Word of mouth is the single most damaging thing and word gets around very quickly. The city center is in a downward spiral. And instead of people trying to defend the indefensible they would be better off saying that this is not ok, it is not acceptable and something has to be done.

drumswan

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I see the defenders of the realm are out in force trying to defend the situation. They are blinded and immune to the reality. Our only hope is that the numbers wanting action in the city outnumber does with their heads in the sand.

There is a strip in the north inner city which needs better policing, everyone agrees. Its a pain in the arse for people who have to live there and work there every day.

Your hysterical sky-is-falling nonsense is just laughable though. Ill be attending the Web Summit with our partners from the UK & Europe, they are all staying in plush hotels in Dublin 4 and we have a dinner booked in Guilbauds on the 5th. Hanging around with junkies is not high on the agenda.

The city center is in a downward spiral.

Sigh. Ive consistently shown you that the city is on an upward spiral, both visitor numbers and investment are RISING year on year. You just dont want to hear it because you are afraid of people in tracksuits.

Kermit.de.frog

drumswan wrote: »

There is a strip in the north inner city which needs better policing, everyone agrees. Its a pain in the arse for people who have to live there and work there every day.

Your hysterical sky-is-falling nonsense is just laughable though. Ill be attending the Web Summit with our partners from the UK & Europe, they are all staying in plush hotels in Dublin 4 and we have a dinner booked in Guilbauds on the 5th. Hanging around with junkies is not high on the agenda.

But aren't you going to bring them to Temple Bar and O'Connell Street?


Oh hold on. The fact you won't is complete vindication of what I am saying. No go areas for friends from abroad because you would rightly be too embarrassed to bring them there. That is the center of Dublin.

That is not right. Do you not see that?

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I see the defenders of the realm are out in force trying to defend the situation. They are blinded and immune to the reality. Our only hope is that the numbers wanting action in the city outnumber those with their heads in the sand before it is too late.

Because if nothing happens right now and this is allowed to fester then the city center is dead. That is what will happen. No one will want to go there. Businesses will close, tourists will disappear. Word of mouth is the single most damaging thing and word gets around very quickly. The city center is in a downward spiral. And instead of people trying to defend the indefensible they would be better off saying that this is not ok, it is not acceptable and something has to be done.

It sounds like the coming of the junkopalyse. Where will a leader to save us come from?! One clear voice that would ring out, and let the world know the truth - Something (undefined) must be done!

drumswan

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

But aren't you going to bring them to Temple Bar and O'Connell Street?

Yeah we are all headed to Dr Quirkeys after Guilbauds. Youre some clown.

Kermit.de.frog

drumswan wrote: »

Yeah we are all headed to Dr Quirkeys after Guilbauds. Youre some clown.

Again you miss the point. That is the center of Dublin.

This is why it has to change.

FreudianSlippers

drumswan wrote: »

There is a strip in the north inner city which needs better policing, everyone agrees. Its a pain in the arse for people who have to live there and work there every day.

Your hysterical sky-is-falling nonsense is just laughable though. Ill be attending the Web Summit with our partners from the UK & Europe, they are all staying in plush hotels in Dublin 4 and we have a dinner booked in Guilbauds on the 5th. Hanging around with junkies is not high on the agenda.


Sigh. Ive consistently shown you that the city is on an upward spiral, both visitor numbers and investment are RISING year on year. You just dont want to hear it because you are afraid of people in tracksuits.

I think this is exactly the problem: basically isolating the Northside as a lost cause ****hole where nobody should go.

Having eaten, btw, in Guilbaud's on multiple occasions; I think Chapter One is a better restaurant. How does this fit in with your concept of keeping everyone away from the Northside?

drumswan

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I think this is exactly the problem: basically isolating the Northside as a lost cause ****hole where nobody should go.

Having eaten, btw, in Guilbaud's on multiple occasions; I think Chapter One is a better restaurant. How does this fit in with your concept of keeping everyone away from the Northside?

Good point, Chapter one is awesome. I guess we'd need one of those bulletproof transport carriers to go though. Or we could assume that a group of grown men from Birmingham and Barcelona might be alright, its not a group of the mentally infirm that are coming over.

Planning on the north city has been notoriously poor. If there wasnt a single vagrant in the city I still wouldnt frequent the area much, there isnt the same vibe as around the Baggot St/South William/Wexford St/Wicklow St/Georges St area.

FreudianSlippers

While I don't disagree that planning has been awful, it's not the full picture (and as I said earlier, I think planning has a lot to do with urban regeneration). Allowing certain areas to fester creates a bad atmosphere in an area, which results in less people frequenting, less businesses choosing to locate there, resulting in more festering.

Take Lower Liffey Street - there are a few good restaurants and bars there, which are suffering because their clientèle are harassed if they sit outside on a nice day by junkies, beggars and thieves. If people don't want to be harassed when they sit outside, they will just go to the Southside as you say - but that means that the businesses on the Northside suffer lost trade and will eventually close if it continues.

We should be promoting a better atmosphere in these Northside areas and promoting new businesses to open at any cost. Smithfield is a prime example of a missed opportunity and hopefully DIT will inject some life into the area. OCS should be a bustling tourist destination with museums, shops, restaurants and events; not a place to be avoided. The only way to do that is to tackle the area head-on.

Amalgam

Aard wrote: »

A little bit of sensationalism here -- Dublin is not like Detroit or Johannesburg during their bad days.

Agreed, but the, 'snatch and grab' tawdriness of the early afternoon around the Liffey is very corrosive to the mood of the city.

The river has a natural tide and a human one..

I feel ashamed to admit it, but seeing people getting dipped or having their bags, 'casually' snatched around the Quays and Temple Bar.. (all south side) doesn't even get a flinch out of me anymore.

I don't get involved either, the people doing the snatching have a higher chance of passing on some form of Hepatitis, which I'm not really keen to acquire.

I do occasionally mention to a tourist floating aound Dame Street/Christchurch to keep their photographic equipment, off the hip.. and have it facing to the front. Some look at you like you've sprouted horns.

We need to give realistic advice to tourists visiting the city and stop the Jolly Leprechaun tat.

drumswan

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

While I don't disagree that planning has been awful, it's not the full picture (and as I said earlier, I think planning has a lot to do with urban regeneration). Allowing certain areas to fester creates a bad atmosphere in an area, which results in less people frequenting, less businesses choosing to locate there, resulting in more festering.

Take Lower Liffey Street - there are a few good restaurants and bars there, which are suffering because their clientèle are harassed if they sit outside on a nice day by junkies, beggars and thieves. If people don't want to be harassed when they sit outside, they will just go to the Southside as you say - but that means that the businesses on the Northside suffer lost trade and will eventually close if it continues.

We should be promoting a better atmosphere in these Northside areas and promoting new businesses to open at any cost. Smithfield is a prime example of a missed opportunity and hopefully DIT will inject some life into the area. OCS should be a bustling tourist destination with museums, shops, restaurants and events; not a place to be avoided. The only way to do that is to tackle the area head-on.

Cant disagree with any of that, intelligent sensible suggestions without the hysteria. There are problems in the north city centre, no doubt. But there is much more to Dublin than those few streets.

Policing is very poor. Though you cant criticism the police in this country, middle Ireland wont have it.

The apartments in Smithfield are built of paper, any might market etc would effectively sound like it was in your living room. More poor planning.

fleet_admiral

No doubt the program will be deeply anti north city like DCC are

rubberdiddies

I was always someone that sang the praises of Dublin to non-Irish people. Through a particular online venture that I run, I promoted Ireland and Dublin to thousands of people all over the world.

For the last few years however, if potential tourists ask me, I recommend that they stay away from Dublin City Centre if at all possible. I feel horrible for doing this as I love the city. I used to be in dublin City Centre every single day for years and years and could see it getting worse as the years went on.

I only now go in when I have to, last year for example I might have only been in the city 10 times.

I found myself in and around the O'Connell Street area on Saturday last at about 9am. Even at that hour of the morning when it was relatively quiet, I saw a fight between 2 guys that seemed to start off as a bit of a play fight that 5 year olds might have, but ended up in a full on savage boxing match to the horror of people around, the majority of whom were tourists. The two lads ended up finishing their fight and walking off calmly together after having the usual night-of-the-living-dead argument.

the majority of people I saw that morning were tourists, which is great, but when I was travelling back home around midday, the place was awash with addicts. And I mean everywhere. It was as if there was some form of convention going on, though I presumed at the time that the dealer(s) were close by.

My point is this goes on ALL the time. It's not normal, it's not safe. I used to feel safe in town. Not any more. Far from it. That's why I rarely go in any more. Many of my friends/family/colleagues feel the same.

It's the businesses that will ultimately suffer. The lack of Garda resources/action/give a sh1tability or whatever it is has a large part to play.

A few weeks ago a neighbour of mine had to call 999 for a major incident. 2 hours later they showed up.

Yet, I believe there were 40 Guards at a water meter protest in Dublin this morning.

Pete_Cavan

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

While I don't disagree that planning has been awful, it's not the full picture (and as I said earlier, I think planning has a lot to do with urban regeneration). Allowing certain areas to fester creates a bad atmosphere in an area, which results in less people frequenting, less businesses choosing to locate there, resulting in more festering.

Agree with this. IMO a lot of the problems we have today stem from bad planning practices in the past. We allowed rich areas and poor areas to develop and problems which exist to some extent in all areas became exaggerated beyond belief. The infamous blocks of flats were built which were a haven for anti-social behaviour and drugs, they spawned many of the problems we have today.

DCC are rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic by refurbishing and amalgamating the flats in old blocks for social housing. The folly of these flats is that there was no social mix and creates greater class divides and even ghettoisation but the refurb plans to nothing to improve this. Going forward, policy should be to develop the city centre with a proper social mix so that such problems are not concentrated in certain areas and the problems allowed to fester. Equally, concentrating prosperity creates different problems, Dun Laoghaire being a good example. We are in the midst of a housing crises and the lack of social housing is a big problem but no doubt the solution pursued will be simply build more housing, rather than pursue a proper housing policy.

Kermit.de.frog

rubberdiddies wrote: »

I was always someone that sang the praises of Dublin to non-Irish people. Through a particular online venture that I run, I promoted Ireland and Dublin to thousands of people all over the world.

For the last few years however, if potential tourists ask me, I recommend that they stay away from Dublin City Centre if at all possible. I feel horrible for doing this as I love the city. I used to be in dublin City Centre every single day for years and years and could see it getting worse as the years went on.

I only now go in when I have to, last year for example I might have only been in the city 10 times.

I found myself in and around the O'Connell Street area on Saturday last at about 9am. Even at that hour of the morning when it was relatively quiet, I saw a fight between 2 guys that seemed to start off as a bit of a play fight that 5 year olds might have, but ended up in a full on savage boxing match to the horror of people around, the majority of whom were tourists. The two lads ended up finishing their fight and walking off calmly together after having the usual night-of-the-living-dead argument.

the majority of people I saw that morning were tourists, which is great, but when I was travelling back home around midday, the place was awash with addicts. And I mean everywhere. It was as if there was some form of convention going on, though I presumed at the time that the dealer(s) were close by.

My point is this goes on ALL the time. It's not normal, it's not safe. I used to feel safe in town. Not any more. Far from it. That's why I rarely go in any more. Many of my friends/family/colleagues feel the same.

It's the businesses that will ultimately suffer. The lack of Garda resources/action/give a sh1tability or whatever it is has a large part to play.

A few weeks ago a neighbour of mine had to call 999 for a major incident. 2 hours later they showed up.

Yet, I believe there were 40 Guards at a water meter protest in Dublin this morning.

Some here think you are making it up and a delicate individual.

I hope they watch this program tonight and I hope it gets people talking and the powers that be to fix it.

desertcircus

Do I live in some parallel-universe Dublin? The city has problems, yes, but the violent crime rate is nothing special by European standards. Is there anything to this other than "there are people around who look like junkies"?

FreudianSlippers

desertcircus wrote: »

Do I live in some parallel-universe Dublin? The city has problems, yes, but the violent crime rate is nothing special by European standards. Is there anything to this other than "there are people around who look like junkies"?

I wouldn't believe someone who said they frequent North Dublin City Centre if they told me that they have never seen anti-social behaviour of some sort on a daily basis.

rubberdiddies

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Some here think you are making it up and a delicate individual.

I hope they watch this program tonight and I hope it gets people talking and the powers that be to fix it.

I'm far from delicate! lol
and certainly not making it up. It happens. I cant understand how some people either seem to think it doesn't happen or think that what happens is grand just because some European cities are worse.

drumswan

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I wouldn't believe someone who said they frequent North Dublin City Centre if they told me that they have never seen anti-social behaviour of some sort on a daily basis.

But it is not dangerous. It simply isnt. Its a nonsense to be advising people to avoid the entire city centre.

Peoples perceptions are another matter.

miamee

desertcircus wrote: »

Do I live in some parallel-universe Dublin? The city has problems, yes, but the violent crime rate is nothing special by European standards. Is there anything to this other than "there are people around who look like junkies"?

The fact that there is a violent crime rate is the issue.

As a born and bred Dubliner, I don't think it's good enough that 'other places are as bad, so it's grand'. Let other places do what they want, I would like my home city to be safe and hassle-free for visitors and locals alike.

ETA: I love Dublin, I have lived here my whole life and will for a long time to come I'm sure. There are no parts of the city centre that I wouldn't walk on my own, I don't feel terrorised or threatened but even the fact that I have to keep an eye out for signs of trouble, dodgy characters, whatever, is not ok. I don't think there is anything wrong with aspiring to a better capital city than we have right now.

FreudianSlippers

drumswan wrote: »

But it is not dangerous. It simply isnt. Its a nonsense to be advising people to avoid the entire city centre.

Peoples perceptions are another matter.

There are areas which are dangerous and times where non-dangerous areas become dangerous for even locals. It's fairly 'dangerous' for tourists in general. My argument is more along the lines that anti-social behaviour is causing a rapid decline of the Northside.

Pete_Cavan

desertcircus wrote: »

Do I live in some parallel-universe Dublin? The city has problems, yes, but the violent crime rate is nothing special by European standards. Is there anything to this other than "there are people around who look like junkies"?

Yes, one thing I would say about Dublin city centre is that the problems come from individuals and their person issues. I dont think violent or organised crime is a big issue in the city centre as with many other cities, although they do exist in certain suburbs.

GinnyR

look I might be out of touch here as I don't live in Dublin but as a very regular visitor (& hopefully soon new resident) I have to say I've never felt unsafe anywhere in town ever ... Even at night as a lone female. Dublin feels a hell of a lot safer to me than London or Birmingham does.

desertcircus

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I wouldn't believe someone who said they frequent North Dublin City Centre if they told me that they have never seen anti-social behaviour of some sort on a daily basis.

Until about three months ago, I walked from the IFSC to the Epicurean Foodhall three times a week for lunch. Never bothered, pickpocketed, attacked. Dublin simply isn't as dangerous as people think it is.

reprazant

While I don't think that Dublin in dangerous, there is a certain part that is pretty grimy really. From O'Connell St to Connelly St is pretty grim and somewhere I'd never really choose to walk around. Nothing have ever happened to me when I have but it is just depressing more than anything.

Saying that the clinics need to be moved to the suburbs is all well and good but I doubt that many of the people demanding that would want a clinic near where they live. When they say move them out of the city, what they mean is move them to places out of the city to areas I don't live in.

Einhard

Dublin, like any other city, does have its share of problems. Some areas of the city are quite grotty and rundown, others can have a hint of menace about them. Unlike many other large cities though, these areas in Dublin are very close to the city centre and are thus more readily apparent than elsewhere.

However, I don't believe that Dublin is "at tipping point" as the PT article stated, or that it's in a downward spiral. I live abroad but visit home fairly regularly and usually spend a few days in Dublin. I've also had foreign friends visit over the past few summers. I've never had a problem in the city, and neither had they. I didn't notice any particularly intimidating of threatening or even hassling behaviour, and I like to spend time wandering the central core of O' Connell St and Temple Bar when I'm back.

I think some of the reaction is based on snobbery, and a disdain for loud locals in tracksuits. I was in the ChristChurch area during the summer and a group of "howyas" walked by in tracksuits, covered in tattoos, and various other adornments. Having a laugh and making a bit of noise. But in no way threatening. Yet one of the people I was with threw her eyes to heaven and called them scumbags. I imagine she would agree wholeheartedly with the OP, when in reality the real problem was her own stereotypes and biases. And she wasn't even from Dublin!