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Road tax

  • 19-07-2014 11:26am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    hi guys have seen and heard alot of people talking that soon we wont have roadtax just very expensive fuel... is this true??
    and what you all think?
    i think it would be great,,,,
    the more you use the road the more you pay.
    wouldnt stop people from having a 3 liter car and only driving 100milles a week.
    i think this would be great.
    Tagged:


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 38,249 ✭✭✭✭ Guy:Incognito


    They're bringing in this thing called motor tax to replace it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    We already have very expensive fuel too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    any idea how will that new system work?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    the fuel here is not to bad.
    i was on holidays in april in latvia rented a car.
    and was driving around ..
    diesel there is was 1.34 and petrol was round 1.45.
    bare in mind min wage there is 210e a month or somthing.
    so we are getting off lightly


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Idea is to out more tax on fuel so the less you drive/more efficient your car the less you pay. Laundering and the fact that we're bordering Northern Ireland doesn't help matters.
    Also the gov aren't interested in saving you money on tax. The new emissions based tax is already too low IMO.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    i know they want all the money we have.
    but for me id say it would be better.
    im paying 710 tax now and drive maybe 50milles a week to work and back.
    but i hate small cars. so i dont wantt a little micra or fiest.
    but i cant afford a new car thats emissions based.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,031 ✭✭✭✭ Atlantic Dawn


    The proportion of "low" motor tax 2008 onwards cars is growing so the tax on these cars will need to be doubled and eventually trippled over the coming years to make up the shortfall of pre 2008 cars coming off the roads. Also the VRT taken in from these cars when originally purchased has been blown on running the country, paying our debts etc...


  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    like my friends said ... best to chance a cheap car with no tax at all :D:D:D ahh id say we will live and see how the tax system will work out.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Spurgis wrote: »
    i know they want all the money we have.
    but for me id say it would be better.
    im paying 710 tax now and drive maybe 50milles a week to work and back.
    but i hate small cars. so i dont wantt a little micra or fiest.
    but i cant afford a new car thats emissions based.

    If tax was abolished years ago then 2.0 cars like yours would have become way more expensive. Swings and roundabouts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ Spurgis


    i know it would be very expensive to buy one..thats why im getting some info get a 3l bmw now while they are still cheap and then use it when the system changes. thats my plan :D


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  • Registered Users Posts: 27,188 ✭✭✭✭ _Kaiser_


    Spurgis wrote: »
    i know it would be very expensive to buy one..thats why im getting some info get a 3l bmw now while they are still cheap and then use it when the system changes. thats my plan :D

    A 3L BMW will cost you just under €1500 a year in tax (or even more @ €422 a quarter if you haven't got all that in one go). It'll also be older and while that's not a problem in itself, it will likely mean more expensive maintenance

    Also that price could (probably will!) increase as well so I can't see you saving anything there either unfortunately.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    Spurgis wrote: »
    any idea how will that new system work?

    This is Ireland, so first they will make the fuel more expensive, then they will make the fuel more expensive. After that fuel will go up and then taxes on fuel will go up. And then we will need to increase the carbon levy, because how dare you drive a car you dirty swine. After that motor tax will go up. Then the cars, VRT and possibly a levy on insurance. Maybe some more tolls too.
    After that the government will make everything more expensive, because we couldn't have people actually making money here, now could we, this country is geared towards the rich and big industry.
    Just goes to remind me, when I look at the cream of Irish society that it's not only cream that floats to the top.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,242 ✭✭✭✭ djimi


    Spurgis wrote: »
    i know it would be very expensive to buy one..thats why im getting some info get a 3l bmw now while they are still cheap and then use it when the system changes. thats my plan :D

    People have been talking about the tax system changing to a fuel based tax for a long time now. I wouldnt be holding my breath for it to happen any time soon.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    cheap tax exists on the old cc system too under say 1.5L... yeah you can go out and get an emissions based car, but the depreciation is going to a multiple of the tax "saving" you pay one way or another, also if you are taking out a bigger loan to pay for the a newer emissions car, loan interest isnt exactly cheap at the moment!

    below is a recently posted thread, a guy asking about 26k F10 520D, 26k is a fairly serious wedge, where does €400,500,600 for tax even register on the radar when you are prepared to lose 4-5k a year on average over the first 3 years of ownership and another several on loan interest (if you take a loan)...

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057251662

    this Irish notion you are doing one over on the "system" by costing yourself a lot more on depreciation etc is laughable!

    for the motor tax, why not have a flat rate of say E500 a year regardless of CC or emissions a reasonable amount, that everyone pays. Then the rest would be made up from fuel, the thirstier the car, the more you pay... This concept of the Irish "motoring industry" the vast majority just leaves our country never to be seen again and flows to germany, france, japan etc... We can buy their luxury cars 40,50,60k luxury cars, but hey, they can buy our E2 kerrygold!

    Ps the value with the bm's on CC is the 2.5L... Wouldnt entertain the 3L unless it was the 258 bhp in a 6 or 7 series, where the prestige would do something to take away the sick feeling of handing over those parasites E1500 a year and another what E150-200 if paid in instalments...


  • Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭ turbocab


    djimi wrote: »
    People have been talking about the tax system changing to a fuel based tax for a long time now. I wouldnt be holding my breath for it to happen any time soon.

    agreed.they wont change it because the hauliers and taxi drivers would be up in arms over it, although it would be fairer,


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    The new emissions based tax is already too low IMO.

    In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary....................... come again?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,349 No Pants


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    ...we're bordering Northern Ireland doesn't help matters.
    Regardless of price, every time I'm up there and if I'm near a station that stocks it, I brim the tank with premium fuel.

    It's a shame that you can't get decent petrol down here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Jesus. wrote: »
    In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary....................... come again?

    Too low, unsustainable. Didn't take into account 6 years ago the advances in terms of engineering a car to do well on a euro emissions cycle - that were certain to happen and have happened.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,788 ✭✭✭ markpb


    Jesus. wrote: »
    In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary....................... come again?

    Total intake from motor tax has almost certainly fallen over the last few years. It's hard to see how a government, which already has a budget shortfall, could allow a previously reliable tax to drop. Moreso because a rise in motor tax is unlikely to see less people owning cars so rising it has almost no downsides (for them).


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    Too low, unsustainable.

    Not in practically every other Country on the Planet it aint!

    Its only in the Rip-off Republic that 3 hundred quid a year or whatever the average is, is considered fukk all when it comes to Motor tax.

    We're a laughing stock


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,549 ✭✭✭ murphyebass


    turbocab wrote: »
    agreed.they wont change it because the hauliers and taxi drivers would be up in arms over it, although it would be fairer,

    Yup would agree with this. And the border county effect also makes it a really tough call to make.

    That said the emissions model will have to change. The 07 diesel car v the 08 diesel car tax thing makes absolutely nonsense for example. Same car same engine different tax due 1 year!

    Anyway I'll toddle off back to 2.2ltr diesel €280 a year for now until they do amend the rules. Feels wrong after payin over double that for a petrol 2ltr not so long ago.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    Jesus. wrote: »
    Not in practically every other Country on the Planet it aint!

    Its only in the Rip-off Republic that 3 hundred quid a year or whatever the average is, is considered fukk all when it comes to Motor tax.

    We're a laughing stock

    I just had a lobotomy, so yes, I fully agree, we need more taxes and we need to jack up existing taxes! We don't give enough of the little bit of money we enslave ourselves for to the state, so they can give it to billionaire bankers. Won't someone please think of the bankers! They can only afford 150 cases of Kristall for their next annual blowout and coke and hookers might have to be cut, this is a disaster and must not be allowed to happen.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,548 ✭✭✭ JohnBoy26


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    Too low, unsustainable. Didn't take into account 6 years ago the advances in terms of engineering a car to do well on a euro emissions cycle - that were certain to happen and have happened.
    wasn't that the whole aim of the change in the first place though, to get people into cleaner and greener cars. The lower the Co2 the better for the environment, the less you pay.

    anyway Imo it shouldn't be any higher, especially since the government has forced a raft of new taxes and charges on the citizens of this country and we haven't seen any of this "motor tax" ring fenced for road improvement, badly needed road improvements in many parts of the country.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,548 ✭✭✭ JohnBoy26


    Yup would agree with this. And the border county effect also makes it a really tough call to make.

    That said the emissions model will have to change. The 07 diesel car v the 08 diesel car tax thing makes absolutely nonsense for example. Same car same engine different tax due 1 year!

    Anyway I'll toddle off back to 2.2ltr diesel €280 a year for now until they do amend the rules. Feels wrong after payin over double that for a petrol 2ltr not so long ago.
    it works both ways though. An 08 diesel car might be cheaper to tax than its 07 equivalent but for many petrol cars of that era it had the opposite effect.

    for example an 07 1.4 ford focus is €385 on the cc based system and for the same car on the Co2 system the tax is over circa €570

    this decimated the sales of petrol cars for a long time and even still to this day, although they are making a bit of a comeback now as the Co2 and tax has fallen on newer generation petrol engines, brining them closer to diesels.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,038 ✭✭✭✭ CiniO


    JohnBoy26 wrote: »
    wasn't that the whole aim of the change in the first place though, to get people into cleaner and greener cars. The lower the Co2 the better for the environment, the less you pay.

    Well it isn't really.
    Tax is dependant on CO2 emission rates. CO2 is not poisonous gas. It's a natural gas which naturally exists in air we breath.

    Yes indeed - there are theories that increase emissions of CO2 globally, can cause global warming effect.
    But it's not poisonous for us directly.

    Rather oppositely. Tax system encouraging vehicles with low CO2 emission rates, effectively encourages diesel car, which are much more poisonous for us in place we live and walk (on the streets).

    So I wouldn't say that our tax system encourages cars which are better for our environment.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 HurtLocker


    The proportion of "low" motor tax 2008 onwards cars is growing so the tax on these cars will need to be doubled and eventually trippled over the coming years to make up the shortfall of pre 2008 cars coming off the roads. Also the VRT taken in from these cars when originally purchased has been blown on running the country, paying our debts etc...

    Low me hole. Look at the UK rates. Our low is too high
    12 Months and 6 Months
    A Up to 100 £0.00 Not available
    B 101-110 £20.00 Not available
    C 111-120 £30.00 Not available
    D 121-130 £110.00 £60.50
    E 131-140 £130.00 £71.50
    F 141-150 £145.00 £79.75
    G 151-165 £180.00 £99.00
    H 166-175 £205.00 £112.75
    I 176-185 £225.00 £123.75
    J 186-200 £265.00 £145.75
    K* 201-225 £285.00 £156.75
    L 226-255 £485.00 £266.75
    M Over 255 £500.00 £275.00 (OVER €2300 here compared to €800 !!)

    Compared to https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/motortaxinfotype.do

    We now will be paying property taxes and water charges. I always justified high motor tax and VRT on the fact we didnt. Its flawed as those who dont own a car could avoid contributing now they cant. If you divide the VRT by the age of the "low tax" car and add it to the annual motor tax we are paying higher again.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    How the feck are cars that bellow out clouds of black SSHmoke better for the environment?

    I'm no Scientist but it looks weird to me :confused:


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,548 ✭✭✭ JohnBoy26


    CiniO wrote: »
    Well it isn't really.
    Tax is dependant on CO2 emission rates. CO2 is not poisonous gas. It's a natural gas which naturally exists in air we breath.

    Yes indeed - there are theories that increase emissions of CO2 globally, can cause global warming effect.
    But it's not poisonous for us directly.

    Rather oppositely. Tax system encouraging vehicles with low CO2 emission rates, effectively encourages diesel car, which are much more poisonous for us in place we live and walk (on the streets).

    So I wouldn't say that our tax system encourages cars which are better for our environment.
    The global warming effect is what I was referring to when I said cleaner for the enviroment. That was the aim of this, to get emmisions down? Obviously
    People buying diesel cars and diesels health effects weren't given much consideration
    but that wasn't the government's aim though was it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,038 ✭✭✭✭ CiniO


    JohnBoy26 wrote: »
    The global warming effect is what I was referring to when I said cleaner for the enviroment. That was the aim of this, to get emmisions down? Obviously
    People buying diesel cars and diesels health effects weren't given much consideration
    but that wasn't the government's aim though was it?

    Hmm. Question is why wasn't it.

    Loweing CO2 emissions on Irish cars, will change f3ck all globally, consindering Ireland emits very little CO2 anyway, and is fairly small country with fairly low population, very little heavy industry and not that many cars.

    On the other hand, encouraging smoky diesels into our towns where people live and breathe was quite ridiculous idea.

    I don't really understand why did they do it.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,548 ✭✭✭ JohnBoy26


    CiniO wrote: »
    Hmm. Question is why wasn't it.

    Loweing CO2 emissions on Irish cars, will change f3ck all globally, consindering Ireland emits very little CO2 anyway, and is fairly small country with fairly low population, very little heavy industry and not that many cars.

    On the other hand, encouraging smoky diesels into our towns where people live and breathe was quite ridiculous idea.

    I don't really understand why did they do it.

    The hole in the ozone is what they were more interested in. I think diesel smoke effects parts of the UK a lot too, afaik air samples were taken not so long ago with high pollution recorded. They don't call it the fuel of the devil for no reason.


This discussion has been closed.
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