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Road tax

2

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,259 ✭✭✭ sogood


    JohnBoy26 wrote: »
    The global warming effect is what I was referring to when I said cleaner for the enviroment. That was the aim of this, to get emmisions down? Obviously
    People buying diesel cars and diesels health effects weren't given much consideration
    but that wasn't the government's aim though was it?

    Yeah, get our emissions down, create a cleaner atmosphere, and then sell our carbon credits to some other country that is happy to pollute to its' hearts content. End result? Exactly the same amount of emissions globally, except that some governments make some cash out of the system in the process and dupe us all into thinking that we are doing something worthwhile by our choice of motoring, not to mention switching off the "stand by" light on the TV before you go to bed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,672 ✭✭✭ quadrifoglio verde


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    Low me hole. Look at the UK rates. Our low is too high


    Compared to https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/motortaxinfotype.do

    We now will be paying property taxes and water charges. I always justified high motor tax and VRT on the fact we didnt. Its flawed as those who dont own a car could avoid contributing now they cant. If you divide the VRT by the age of the "low tax" car and add it to the annual motor tax we are paying higher again.

    Here's the thing were still spending more a year that what were taking in. People can go on about the bank debts but at this stage well be lucky if that gets undone.
    So if we are to cut motortax we have to find it somewhere else. They're going to get their pound of flesh of you one way or the other


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 HurtLocker


    Australia just scrapped its Carbon tax. We are really trying to stop a river with a twig. Our motor tax is purely revenue and not really helping the environment. Getting our American counterparts to play some small role would help our climate a million times more. We drive tiny cars compared to them.

    With the new water charges and property taxes to pay for local services motor tax should be lowered and ring fenced. The ring fencing is unlikely now but it should be lowered. People won't start driving gas guzzlers but they'll have a little bit more to spend on other expenses. The climate wouldn't be destroyed if we had UK rates, maybe we would could afford to by more locally/Irish produced products.

    The huge motor tax on hgv's needs to be lowered. They are essential to trade and we all benefit especially local business. The higher transport costs the higher the cost of products on a local level.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 HurtLocker


    Here's the thing were still spending more a year that what were taking in. People can go on about the bank debts but at this stage well be lucky if that gets undone.
    So if we are to cut motortax we have to find it somewhere else. They're going to get their pound of flesh of you one way or the other

    Yes water and property taxes. They'll be taking a few pounds from everyone regardless if they personally drive.

    Wasn't it recently the gov announced they are cutting the 52% tax rate?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    Getting our American counterparts to play some small role would help our climate a million times more. We drive tiny cars compared to them.

    I tried making that rather obvious point a couple of weeks back but not one person agreed with me. I thought it very strange at the time.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 HurtLocker


    Jesus. wrote: »
    I tried making that rather obvious point a couple of weeks back but not one person agreed with me. I thought it very strange at the time.

    :eek:
    I'm just back from the states. You'd be lucky to see anything smaller than a passat. In the SUV department they make our Quasqais and Rav 4s look like toys.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    I know. I was told Ireland's fleet of cars (bog standard 1.6L Compacts) would be perfectly suitable over there :eek:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,268 visual


    All this carbon tax and talk of reducing CO2 is nonsense when you compare the emmisions put out by cows farting.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,268 visual


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    :eek:
    I'm just back from the states. You'd be lucky to see anything smaller than a passat. In the SUV department they make our Quasqais and Rav 4s look like toys.

    If I lived there I want a big petrol SUV and not the tinker toys on the road here.
    But I do know diesel is gaining more interest and acceptance and Americas are becoming more aware with what they consider higher fuel prices


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    Jesus. wrote: »
    I tried making that rather obvious point a couple of weeks back but not one person agreed with me. I thought it very strange at the time.

    Irish motorists. We're a self-hating bunch, aren't we? And not only do we gladly hand over our money for all those green clap-trap excuses, we actually shout for more.
    I let you all in on a little secret on how to be a taxpayer:
    YOU NEVER SAY YOU WANT MORE TAXES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Otherwise that is exactly what you get.
    Whatever the level of taxation is, you need to shout bully, abuse, strike, protest and lobby for it to come down, that's how this show works.
    A government has one goal in life:
    To screw you for as much money as they can possibly get away with and get re-elected.
    What do they do with the money? Piss it away like a raging alcoholic does cheap booze.
    Let them have less, they'll have to figure out a way to not waste billions on way too many civil servants and useless vanity projects and cronyism.
    And if you say do want more taxes? You need to up the meds, buddy.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭ MayoSalmon


    Spurgis wrote: »
    the fuel here is not to bad.
    i was on holidays in april in latvia rented a car.
    and was driving around ..
    diesel there is was 1.34 and petrol was round 1.45.
    bare in mind min wage there is 210e a month or somthing.
    so we are getting off lightly

    You were in Latvia...what did you expect?!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,672 ✭✭✭ quadrifoglio verde


    visual wrote: »
    If I lived there I want a big petrol SUV and not the tinker toys on the road here.
    But I do know diesel is gaining more interest and acceptance and Americas are becoming more aware with what they consider higher fuel prices

    Cummins diesel! :cool:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 532 PurvesGrundy


    Jesus. wrote: »
    I tried making that rather obvious point a couple of weeks back but not one person agreed with me. I thought it very strange at the time.

    Even though it's the internet where you or I don't know each other personally other than our usernames, motoring forum boardsies like their internet alter ego's to be perceived as politically correct and law abiding and will go to surprising lengths in blindly defending something that is utterly ridiculous and ludicrous.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,672 ✭✭✭ quadrifoglio verde


    Irish motorists. We're a self-hating bunch, aren't we? And not only do we gladly hand over our money for all those green clap-trap excuses, we actually shout for more.
    I let you all in on a little secret on how to be a taxpayer:
    YOU NEVER SAY YOU WANT MORE TAXES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Otherwise that is exactly what you get.
    Whatever the level of taxation is, you need to shout bully, abuse, strike, protest and lobby for it to come down, that's how this show works.
    A government has one goal in life:
    To screw you for as much money as they can possibly get away with and get re-elected.
    What do they do with the money? Piss it away like a raging alcoholic does cheap booze.
    Let them have less, they'll have to figure out a way to not waste billions on way too many civil servants and useless vanity projects and cronyism.
    And if you say do want more taxes? You need to up the meds, buddy.

    I don't want to pay more taxes, I just want you to pay more taxes so I don't have to pay as much....and then I want the government to spend as much money on me to buy my vote and as little money on you.
    Isn't that the way it works?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,268 visual


    Cummins diesel! :cool:

    I spend quite a bit of time on US Jeep forum
    the amount of guys who want to fit a cummins diesel is unreal. Very few actually do it because the electronics modules in their Jeeps won't support a different engine computer module need for cummins.

    But every now and again someone ditches all the OEM modules and goes way out there with a truly custom rig.

    Cummins engine is like the holy grail :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,069 ✭✭✭ ZeroThreat


    Spurgis wrote: »
    the fuel here is not to bad.
    i was on holidays in april in latvia rented a car.
    and was driving around ..
    diesel there is was 1.34 and petrol was round 1.45.
    bare in mind min wage there is 210e a month or somthing.
    so we are getting off lightly

    Hard to imagine people having to live on 50 quid a week tbh :(


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭ Jesus.


    Even though it's the internet where you or I don't know each other personally other than our usernames, motoring forum boardsies like their internet alter ego's to be perceived as politically correct and law abiding and will go to surprising lengths in blindly defending something that is utterly ridiculous and ludicrous.

    I've noticed that time and time again and it appears to be very particular to this Board / Petrol heads. Again, I find it utterly bizarre.

    We want more taxes.
    More speed traps.
    More Government control over us (cos the Government is perfect)
    The death penalty for any fellow motorist who goes 1 kph over the speed limit
    Everybody touting on one another


    (Oh and our beige trousers pressed and laid out every night before bedtime...)


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    I don't want to pay more taxes, I just want you to pay more taxes so I don't have to pay as much....and then I want the government to spend as much money on me to buy my vote and as little money on you.
    Isn't that the way it works?

    Almost. :D
    There is the big, frienldy, generous party that like to do handouts, buys off the unions and generally just throws money everyone's way and buys as many elections as possible whilst lying to the people about the country heading over a cliff.
    Once the excrement has hit the fan in an almighty sh*tstorm and those lairs, thieves, wasters and morons get kicked out, the other party takes over.
    Grey, dour-faced, talking about belt-tightening and misery, their job is to dig the country out of the cesspit it has landed itself in.
    Inevitably this pisses the voters off, who still remember the good times they had with the first party, so they get voted back in, so they can then create the next mess for Party Dour to pull us out of.
    What neither party does is actually target the billions of waste that happen in almost any modern western government, so the cycle continues until we are so in debt that there is no hope of ever paying it off in a thousand years.
    And who gets to pay? We do. Including their caviar and champagne pensions.

    The only way to survive is to cheat or to be one of them, which is the same.
    In fact the system is built to anticipate a certain level of cheating. So if you're honest and pay everything, you are being overcharged.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    sogood wrote: »
    Yeah, get our emissions down, create a cleaner atmosphere, and then sell our carbon credits to some other country that is happy to pollute to its' hearts content. End result? Exactly the same amount of emissions globally, except that some governments make some cash out of the system in the process and dupe us all into thinking that we are doing something worthwhile by our choice of motoring, not to mention switching off the "stand by" light on the TV before you go to bed.

    Carbon credits are a global scam. Where does the money go?
    Does it go into a special account labeled "Mother Earth Rescue Fund" which is earmarked for green tech, buying and protecting rainforest, research into cleaning the atmosphere and lots of other cool stuff to do with social engineering, providing human rights and generally making this a better planet?
    I trust that scam even less than "aid" going to African dictators so they can buy more weapons, palaces and cars for themselves.
    Humans are mean, stupid, greedy and would gladly sell out the planet for a massive sack of cash. So far no-one or very few have proven to be truly selfless in the face of huge piles of cash.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,973 ✭✭✭✭ challengemaster


    JohnBoy26 wrote: »
    anyway Imo it shouldn't be any higher, especially since the government has forced a raft of new taxes and charges on the citizens of this country and we haven't seen any of this "motor tax" ring fenced for road improvement, badly needed road improvements in many parts of the country.


    I don't know how many times it has to be explained on here - motor tax goes into the general revenue pool of the country. It's not "road tax" and does not get set aside for road improvement.

    And it's been calculated on here before. The country takes in over €1bn from motor tax alone.

    Considering the current budget deficit, losing €1bn/yr in stable income is probably not the first port of call for the government, nor would it be easily replaced.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 HurtLocker


    I don't know how many times it has to be explained on here - motor tax goes into the general revenue pool of the country. It's not "road tax" and does not get set aside for road improvement.

    And it's been calculated on here before. The country takes in over €1bn from motor tax alone.

    Considering the current budget deficit, losing €1bn/yr in stable income is probably not the first port of call for the government, nor would it be easily replaced.

    It goes into the general pot the provide services that the property taxes and water charges should now pay for. It's unfair that people can opt out of contributing by simple not owning a car. They still benefit without contributing. And as you say motor tax is seen as a key money maker. Not an attempt to save the earth. Shift the burden to provide local services into the local property tax. Then everyone pays to provide.

    They closed all motor tax offices up north recently. We should too but we won't. Instead we split the motor tax office up and now their is the NDLS and the Tax offices. So much money wasted.

    With electric cars in the future they'll have to ween off fuel and motor taxes eventually.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,548 ✭✭✭ JohnBoy26


    I don't know how many times it has to be explained on here - motor tax goes into the general revenue pool of the country. It's not "road tax" and does not get set aside for road improvement.

    And it's been calculated on here before. The country takes in over €1bn from motor tax alone.

    Considering the current budget deficit, losing €1bn/yr in stable income is probably not the first port of call for the government, nor would it be easily replaced.
    calm down there, please tell me where I called it "road tax"? I know where the money goes thanks very much but my point was that at least some should be ring fenced for road improvements as there are plenty of roads in this country in a bad state.

    You can say what you like about budget deficits and all of that, (a hole that no amount of taxes will fill) but were things done any differently when there was no budget deficit, in the good times?

    Weather it's called motor tax or not we should and should of with years had some of the ridiculously high "motortax" we paid be put back into the roads.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    HurtLocker wrote: »

    With electric cars in the future they'll have to ween off fuel and motor taxes eventually.

    All that will happen there is electricity prices will be made even more expensive.

    Also, Moneypoint coal ESB station emits 4.7 million tonnes of CO2 p/a.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,090 ✭✭✭ hi5


    visual wrote: »
    I spend quite a bit of time on US Jeep forum
    the amount of guys who want to fit a cummins diesel is unreal. Very few actually do it because the electronics modules in their Jeeps won't support a different engine computer module need for cummins.

    But every now and again someone ditches all the OEM modules and goes way out there with a truly custom rig.

    Cummins engine is like the holy grail :)

    The Ram 1500 with the Fiat 3.0 turbo diesel are flying off the forecourts apparently.

    http://www.turbodieselregister.com/content/464-what-if-numbers-dont-lie


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,249 ✭✭✭✭ Guy:Incognito


    JohnBoy26 wrote: »
    calm down there, please tell me where I called it "road tax"? I know where the money goes thanks very much but my point was that at least some should be ring fenced for road improvements as there are plenty of roads in this country in a bad state.

    You can say what you like about budget deficits and all of that, (a hole that no amount of taxes will fill) but were things done any differently when there was no budget deficit, in the good times?

    Weather it's called motor tax or not we should and should of with years had some of the ridiculously high "motortax" we paid be put back into the roads.

    Does it really make a difference if the actual notes used to fix roads is ring fenced from motor tax or not If the budget is say 500 million either way?

    It's semantics. If it makes people feel better the government could always just say "X amount of motortax is ring fenced for roads"


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    All that will happen there is electricity prices will be made even more expensive.

    Also, Moneypoint coal ESB station emits 4.7 million tonnes of CO2 p/a.

    Yep, electricity prices will be loaded with taxes and anyone who thinks that motor tax will be abolished if everyone drove electric is as naive as a new born kitten.
    As for the 19th century coal and turf fired power stations, if the government really cared about emissions, they'd go nuclear. Were getting nuclear power from the brits as it is, so it is disingenuous to say we will never use it, we have done so for years.
    Or maybe fusion reactors will be ready by then.
    Going fully hydrogen is the best option, you could cover Ireland in windmills and it would not be enough (more of a figleaf look how green we are project) but using renewables to make hydrogen would be the best way of storing the energy, because the one thing no one seems to grasp about wind is that it doesn't care about demand and if it stops, so do we.


  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Yep, the key to all this is cheap electricity.
    If electricity were cheap enough I wouldn't burn oil for central heating.
    What sort of messed up place is it where people are burning oil they got delivered to heat their house and others are trying to figure out how to make a car run 500 miles on batteries charged up by a coal station....

    The elephant in the room is nuclear.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭ dr.fuzzenstein


    hi5 wrote: »
    The Ram 1500 with the Fiat 3.0 turbo diesel are flying off the forecourts apparently.

    http://www.turbodieselregister.com/content/464-what-if-numbers-dont-lie

    Only in America is a 3 liter engine described as "eco". :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,935 ✭✭✭ Renegade Mechanic


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    Yep, the key to all this is cheap electricity.
    If electricity were cheap enough I wouldn't burn oil for central heating.
    What sort of messed up place is it where people are burning oil they got delivered to heat their house and others are trying to figure out how to make a car run 500 miles on batteries charged up by a coal station....

    The elephant in the room is nuclear.

    Indeed. But can we make a reactor small enough? I recall years ago reading that the entire country didnt even have the demand of just one plant.

    Still, if thats true I dont know why we couldnt export the "overspill".


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  • Registered Users Posts: 72,611 ✭✭✭✭ colm_mcm


    Just make it attractive (cheap) to people and they'd use electricity for things they use fossil fuels for now.


This discussion has been closed.
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