Application Form and Diabetes?

LiamLad

Filling out my first ever FCA1 here and in the medical history section it asks about any medical conditions that could affect your ability to posses,use or carry firearms....reading that i am wondering do i have to tick the YES box as im diabetic even though i don't think it would effect my abilitys in any way.

Anyone else on here diabetic or that can tell me what to do?...any info appreciated thanks.

Cass

I'm not diabetic, but just spit balling here.

The form asks have you any medical condition that could affect your ability, not do you think it will. Now i'm not being a dick or smart arse. What you need to think of are the symptoms, effects of your condition. Could it in any way cause an issue? Do you suffer from faint spells, dizziness, blackouts, fatigue, disorientation, weakness, etc as a result? Would you be in a position whereby any such symptom could cause an accident or accidental discharge of a firearm leading to a problem?

A separate, yet related topic, is insurance. While not a prerequisite, if you did not declare a pre-existing medical condition when applying for insurance and you were involved in an accident any subsequent investigation would show this and you will find yourself in trouble or more importantly out of cover for not declaring it.

So the same applies to a firearm application. God forbid if there were an accident and an investigation showed up a medical condition that you did not declare where would you be?

I know the reason for wondering is simple. If i declare it will i be refused? Well frankly i cannot answer that. So it leaves you in the position of either:

• Declaring it and risking a refusal (a risk that may not exist)
• Not declaring it, getting the license and end up in a precarious position, legally.

It really is a catch 22. Even if you got a letter from your GP saying it won't affect your ability then you have to ask yourself why declare it so.

The simple answer, imo, is this. If you do not suffer any of the symptoms i named above or other ones associated to the condition that i have not mentioned then there may not be a need to declare it. If you do then i would declare it, possibly get a GP's letter to support your appiciation, and keep yourself legally covered.

It goes without saying, but i'm not a medical professional and none of the advice others or i give should be classed as medical advise. Only our opinions based on experience.

LiamLad

Thanks for the reply Cass, Helped clear things up.

Although i do not suffer from the symptoms mentioned, as i take care of my condition and can provide proof of this with a letter from my GP and Doctor, I think its best to declare to be legally covered like you said. (just incase I would have an accident)

Thinking about it i don't think i should fear the application being refused, but better safe than sorry!

Cass

LiamLad wrote: »

Thinking about it i don't think i should fear the application being refused, but better safe than sorry!

It's a completely personal choice as to whether you believe it necessary or not, but as you said sometimes fearing a refusal is is completely unnecessary as it turns out to be a non issue.


I'd wait a while to see if someone in a similar position has been through this and seek advice from them before acting.

LiamLad

Cass wrote:

I'd wait a while to see if someone in a similar position has been through this and seek advice from them before acting.

Will do!

BattleCorp

I guess that if you put diabetes on the form, the Gardai will contact your doctor to see if your medical condition poses a safety risk. I reckon that's what they'd do for any listed illness.

I suppose it all depends then on what the doctor says at that stage.

Chiparus

Ask your GP if your diabetes would be an impediment to you getting a driving license - if not then it is unlikely that it should be an impediment to you getting a firearms license.

fish slapped

Chiparus wrote: »

Ask your GP if your diabetes would be an impediment to you getting a driving license - if not then it is unlikely that it should be an impediment to you getting a firearms license.

A driving licence and a firearms licence are two very different things. one is a vehicle in motion which which would carry on in motion if consciousness is lost, the other is not.

Their isn't any point in approaching most GP's about an issue such as this as the ignorance and personal opinion among some GP's about diabetes is shocking.

For me there would be not reason for properly managed diabetes to affect your ability to hold a firearms licence, this is my personal opinion. If you're unsure you're diabetes or oncology team can provide proper information and advice.

johnnymolloy

I'm not sure if this is going to help but, working in car insurance this is something that comes up quite often the fact it says could or may effect your ability to use a car even if doesn't you would have to put it down, in insurance if it is not noted it can null an void the policy if something happens and its not noted on a policy,noting anything like this on a insurance policy causes no problems what so ever only some more documentation in some cases

i can only assume with it being a gun license it would have to be noted

edit:- just realised cass had mentioned this

LiamLad

Thanks for the replys lads i have noted on the form that i am diabetic.
Going to the garda station sometime next week so ill see how it goes thanks again.

Snakezilla

Im an insulin dependant diabetic and have a few licenses. Never had a problem or been an issue ! I have always said it every time Im applying for a license that I have Type 1 diabetes and no guard has ever batted an eye lid - just as long as the GP's name , address and phone number is on it.

Chiparus

fish slapped wrote: »

A driving licence and a firearms licence are two very different things. one is a vehicle in motion which which would carry on in motion if consciousness is lost, the other is not.

Their isn't any point in approaching most GP's about an issue such as this as the ignorance and personal opinion among some GP's about diabetes is shocking.

For me there would be not reason for properly managed diabetes to affect your ability to hold a firearms licence, this is my personal opinion. If you're unsure you're diabetes or oncology team can provide proper information and advice.

Have to say your ignorance is shocking too.
Being a diabetic does not mean you lose consciousness, a hypo can just result in a clouding of judgement or a confusional state.

meathstevie

Chiparus wrote: »

Have to say your ignorance is shocking too.
Being a diabetic does not mean you lose consciousness, a hypo can just result in a clouding of judgement or a confusional state.

Quite incorrect, at the extreme end of bad condition management unconsciousness or death as a direct result of the condition is not unheard of. I can and will not disclose any detail but I personally know of one case where someone with additional underlying conditions slipped into unconsciousness and someone acting as a good Samaritan administered additional insulin directly causing death.

On the other hand though properly managed diabetes equates to a practically "normal" life.

Chiparus

meathstevie wrote: »

Quite incorrect, at the extreme end of bad condition management unconsciousness or death as a direct result of the condition is not unheard of. I can and will not disclose any detail but I personally know of one case where someone with additional underlying conditions slipped into unconsciousness and someone acting as a good Samaritan administered additional insulin directly causing death.

On the other hand though properly managed diabetes equates to a practically "normal" life.

Of course you can go unconscious with a hypo , just as you can with hyper glycaemic keto acidosis or even hyperosmolar non-ketotosis.

I was responding that a vehicle would carry on in motion if consciousness was lost.
Hypos generally do not go straight to unconsciousness but tend to manifest as irritability , decreased attentiveness , confusion , sometimes agitation or bizarre behavior.
Rather like operating a vehicle operating a firearm whilst suffering from a hypo can have serious consequences.

From Web MD:

Symptoms of Hypoglycemia

Most people feel symptoms of hypoglycemia when their blood sugar is 70 mg/dL or lower.

Each person with diabetes may have different symptoms of hypoglycemia. You will learn to recognize yours.

Early symptoms of hypoglycemia may include:


Confusion
Dizziness
Feeling shaky
Hunger
Headaches
Irritability
Pounding heart; racing pulse
Pale skin
Sweating
Trembling
Weakness
Anxiety
Without treatment, more severe hypoglycemia symptoms may develop, including:

Headache
Feeling irritable
Poor coordination
Poor concentration
Numbness in mouth and tongue
Passing out
Nightmares or bad dreams
Coma

Sparks

Mod note: WebMD showing up generally means non-doctors are giving medical opinions. Guys, there's a boards.ie-wide ban on that for good reasons based on awful precedents, so knock that on the head please and keep to the licencing side of the topic.

That said, this is one of those things in the Firearms Act where it sounded great and simple to the people calling for a change in the law, but people who knew anything about medicine or firearms or the drafting or enforcement of legislation had their head in their hands the moment they heard it because they knew what a gods-awful idea it was. The applicant is not a medical doctor, neither is the Garda, so neither of them can know enough to fill in that form, and the doctor has no idea about firearms so doesn't know for sure how to fill in the form, and it's a criminal offence to knowingly fill in the form wrong. Kafka used to write whole books about laws like that...

OP, if you're concerned, ask your GP. If you know enough about your condition - as most people with chronic conditions seem to do - to answer the questions the Gardai might have (such as "Can you pass out without warning?" and the like), then you're meeting the spirit of the thing at least.