Crowley leaves ALDE - next to leave FF?

raymon

According to RTE Brian Crowley has left the ALDE grouping in Europe and made Michael Martin "furious".

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

This coupled with Crowley's solo run at the election and his Fianna Fail logo getting smaller and smaller on his webpage (now a tiny blip at the bottom of his page http://briancrowleymep.ie ) could make someone think that he may be moving further away from the main party.

Is he also about to leave Fianna Fail to become an Independent ?

In any case if the RTE story is true that this is a solo run - this makes Michael Martin again look very weak , in addition to the weak leadership he showed in the recent Collins and Hanafin debacles.

efb

It's a fairly hard right euro sceptic grouping isn't it? True Finns and that

SpaceTime

ECR contains the Tories and UUP. Maybe FF are now admitting to their true colours and are going to stop with this charade that they've a social conscience!

FTA69

Fianna Fáil are only with that group because the Blueshirts got the jump on them and joined the main Christian Democrat group first. Obviously this group would have suited Fianna Fáil just as well but they had to join the ECR to maintain the illusion that they're in any way different from the other crowd.

Regards Crowley himself, why do people love him so much I wonder? He flies it in every election for some reason. Then again maybe I'm biased against him because he suggested I was a terrorist during a UCC debate years ago.

comongethappy

In other news Ming joined SF in the parliaments communist block.

Good old communism.... Still knocking around.

Shame Ming didn't tell the voters this before the election.

gandalf

It's nice to see Michael Martin exercising his authority over FF in this way. Looks like they are going to sanction or expel their only MEP. I mean they have to or else they won't be considered as a coalition partner by the Sinners in two years time.

dulpit

He (Micháel) had better expel Crowley. As much as it would hurt to lose your MEP, it's better to actually have principles and stick to them.

Will it happen? I don't think so, he'll probably lose the whip (whatever that means for the 1 MEP) or similar.

comongethappy

dulpit wrote: »

He (Micháel) had better expel Crowley. As much as it would hurt to lose your MEP, it's better to actually have principles and stick to them.

Will it happen? I don't think so, he'll probably lose the whip (whatever that means for the 1 MEP) or similar.

Failure to do so would make Martin look very weak.

raymon

comongethappy wrote: »

Failure to do so would make Martin look very weak.

He looks weak either way , he is not going to expel one of his best vote getters.

Apparently FF gave him a six figure sum to fund his campaign

For Reals

Martin won't touch him. You'll get a little bluster and nothing more. Fianna Fail won't risk losing a position of power at home or abroad under any circumstances. Crowley knows this, which is why it seems he didn't even consult with party HQ before hand.

Tramps Like Us

FTA69 wrote: »

Fianna Fáil are only with that group because the Blueshirts got the jump on them and joined the main Christian Democrat group first. Obviously this group would have suited Fianna Fáil just as well but they had to join the ECR to maintain the illusion that they're in any way different from the other crowd.

Regards Crowley himself, why do people love him so much I wonder? He flies it in every election for some reason. Then again maybe I'm biased against him because he suggested I was a terrorist during a UCC debate years ago.

He's a fool who fell off the roof of his school - sympathy.

raymon

Michael Martin must be on holidays.........

michael999999

raymon wrote: »

Michael Martin must be on holidays.........

If he didn't have the balls to sanction Niall Collins, he ain't going to touch Crowley!

Martin is on borrowed time I'd say!

raymon

michael999999 wrote: »

If he didn't have the balls to sanction Niall Collins, he ain't going to touch Crowley!

Martin is on borrowed time I'd say!

I hope Martin stays - he is doing us all a favour by representing Fianna Fail in such a weak manner

Looking through Crowleys literature is confusing - does the "F" stand for facebook or Fianna Fail? http://irishelectionliterature.wordpress.com/tag/brian-crowley/

Nodin

raymon wrote: »

According to RTE Brian Crowley has left the ALDE grouping in Europe and made Michael Martin "furious".

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

This coupled with Crowley's solo run at the election and his Fianna Fail logo getting smaller and smaller on his webpage (now a tiny blip at the bottom of his page http://briancrowleymep.ie ) could make someone think that he may be moving further away from the main party.

Is he also about to leave Fianna Fail to become an Independent ?

In any case if the RTE story is true that this is a solo run - this makes Michael Martin again look very weak , in addition to the weak leadership he showed in the recent Collins and Hanafin debacles.

Apparently its to do with two staff. Apparently.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/brian-crowley-joins-tory-led-eurosceptic-alliance-1.1842335

dulpit

Nodin wrote: »

Apparently its to do with two staff. Apparently.
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/brian-crowley-joins-tory-led-eurosceptic-alliance-1.1842335

Good to see he's so willing to sacrifice his principles and end up in a grouping with the bloody DUP for the sake of one staff member, which I'm sure he could pay for himself with his handsome salary, expenses and Seanad pension...

raymon

He may be expelled by end of the day

Popcorn time..

periodictable

Revenge for refusing to let him run for the presidency and his move on the FF leadership

dixiefly

comongethappy wrote: »

In other news Ming joined SF in the parliaments communist block.

Good old communism.... Still knocking around.

Shame Ming didn't tell the voters this before the election.

Is that true. I never liked him and certainly didn't vote for him. Tbh, I was flabbergasted at how he topped the poll. I think many voted for him because he was the only name they recognised.

dixiefly

dulpit wrote: »

Good to see he's so willing to sacrifice his principles and end up in a grouping with the bloody DUP for the sake of one staff member, which I'm sure he could pay for himself with his handsome salary, expenses and Seanad pension...

This decision should 100% be a party decision and not part of any other negotiations. The Party overall should identify the groupings most suited to their policies and then appropriately align, I do realise that they are somewhat restricted due to FG being in the mix also.

To allow Crowley completely decide this for the Party is ludicrous. That is the stuff that happens with independents.

I never got what the big deal with Crowley was anyway, why is he so popular?

gandalf

Actually forget about FF for the moment. Crowley has shown total disrespect for the people that elected him. They expected him to be aligned to one group and now he has jumped to a totally different crowd. I am not in his constituency but I did choose who to vote for based on the group that they were aligned with in Europe and its stated policies. Crowley has effectively conned his constituents with this action. I don't see how Martin has any option but to expel him from the party.

raymon

gandalf wrote: »

Actually forget about FF for the moment. Crowley has shown total disrespect for the people that elected him. They expected him to be aligned to one group and now he has jumped to a totally different crowd. I am not in his constituency but I did choose who to vote for based on the group that they were aligned with in Europe and its stated policies. Crowley has effectively conned his constituents with this action. I don't see how Martin has any option but to expel him from the party.

I disagree. I think that only about 1% of voters could even name an EU political grouping not to mind be able to name their policies or core values.

I agree that Martin should expel him though. Just because he is giving a very public two fingers to the weak leader.

Sierra Oscar

periodictable wrote: »

Revenge for refusing to let him run for the presidency and his move on the FF leadership

More so setting himself up for the next presidential election. We won't feel it coming around!

SpaceTime

Well, I don't think the majority of voters necessarily voted for him because he was going to be a member of a quite eurosceptic group led largely by the British Tory Party though.

The Tory/UUP stance wouldn't really sit well with say a lot of Irish farmers who are quite pro CAP funding.

I think it's a little bit of a sweeping assumption to make that only 1% would be aware of the EU party groupings. They'd certainly be aware of what more Tory-style policies on agriculture mean, even if they couldn't name the party groupings in the parliament they'd have a fair idea of where FF stands on such things.

raymon

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

More so setting himself up for the next presidential election. We won't feel it coming around!

I agree - he wants to put more distance between himself and Fianna Fail to make sure the FF sullied brand doesn't sink his chances.

raymon

SpaceTime wrote: »

I think it's a little bit of a sweeping assumption to make that only 1% would be aware of the EU party groupings. They'd certainly be aware of what more Tory-style policies on agriculture mean, even if they couldn't name the party groupings in the parliament they'd have a fair idea of where FF stands on such things.

I stand by my 1% estimate . Do you think more than this would be able to name the top 5 groupings without going to Google?

Having a fair idea with where FF stands - That's a totally different thing.

( I personally don't believe that FF know where they stand themselves so would doubt this too )

SpaceTime

raymon wrote: »

I stand by my 1% estimate . Do you think more than this would be able to name the top 5 groupings without going to Google?

Having a fair idea with where FF stands - That's a totally different thing.

( I personally don't believe that FF know where they stand themselves so would doubt this too )

You'd certainly get to one or two with some people. I don't think anyone other than people working in the EP or doing PhDs on it could name 5…

raymon

SpaceTime wrote: »

You'd certainly get to one or two with some people. I don't think anyone other than people working in the EP or doing PhDs on it could name 5…

That's my point - this has nothing to do with political groupings and the man on the street . The man on the street doesn't know about political groupings and doesn't care.

This is about FF pumping a "six figure sum" into Crowleys campaign ( one would assume 100,000 euro or higher) . FF will have nothing to show for this money if they expel him.

On another note - what a waste of money anyway - lets assume they spend 100,000 on all six candidates that's at least 600,000 euro down the Fianna Fail toilet.

Sierra Oscar

Whether he is a PP member or not, Crowley is not going to stop doing the work on the ground for FF representatives. He has been supporting independent FF'ers alongside the FF elected representatives for a long time now. If he loses the whip then he will be outside of the PP, but it is not as if he towed the line for the leadership over the last 20 years anyway. Meh not much will change tbh.

michael999999

Is micheal martin still in hiding after the niall Collins debacle?

dulpit

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Whether he is a PP member or not, Crowley is not going to stop doing the work on the ground for FF representatives. He has been supporting independent FF'ers alongside the FF elected representatives for a long time now. If he loses the whip then he will be outside of the PP, but it is not as if he towed the line for the leadership over the last 20 years anyway. Meh not much will change tbh.

I live in Cork and hear from Brian Crowley only in European election cycles, then he goes back and hides wherever he goes. At least in the last parliament Sean Kelly & Phil Prendergast were somewhat present in the media, but never Crowley.

Kick him out, good riddance...

speed_gun

FTA69 wrote: »

Fianna Fáil are only with that group because the Blueshirts got the jump on them and joined the main Christian Democrat group first. Obviously this group would have suited Fianna Fáil just as well but they had to join the ECR to maintain the illusion that they're in any way different from the other crowd.

Regards Crowley himself, why do people love him so much I wonder? He flies it in every election for some reason. Then again maybe I'm biased against him because he suggested I was a terrorist during a UCC debate years ago.

irish people ( and voters ) are incredibly sentimental

why do you think the man is so popular !

ive never heard him deliver one notable speech or sentance in my entire life

FTA69

speed_gun wrote: »

irish people ( and voters ) are incredibly sentimental

why do you think the man is so popular !

ive never heard him deliver one notable speech or sentance in my entire life

I wouldn't say that either like. He's well able to speak and he's definitely an amiable dude.

I still think he's a langer though.

brandon_flowers

speed_gun wrote: »

ive never heard him deliver one notable speech or sentance in my entire life

He destroyed Ryan Tubridy (a fellow FF'er) with a one liner on the Late Late Show a few years ago.

raymon

They kicked him out today

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/fianna-fail-formally-expel-brian-crowley-from-party-30380509.html

airuser

I cannot understand why he gets such a high vote. With his surplus he should have brought in his running mate. He did not.

His attendance in Europe at "roll calls" is less than 50%.

pajor

To paraphrase Monty Python, "well I didn't vote for him."

I never would have considered FF to exactly be liberal, but this is just taking the piss. I'd say even FF would be right to be rid of him.

airuser

pajor wrote: »

To quote Monty Python, "well I didn't vote for him."

I never would have considered FF to exactly be liberal, but this is just taking the piss. I'd say even FF would be right to be rid of him.

They might. But, how could "live it down", no FF MEP.

dlouth15

raymon wrote: »

They kicked him out today

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/fianna-fail-formally-expel-brian-crowley-from-party-30380509.html

Really just formalizing the decision Crowley himself made. The only way Crowley could have retained the whip would be FF itself realigning itself with the ECR which, of course, was not going to happen.

raymon

dlouth15 wrote: »

Really just formalizing the decision Crowley himself made. The only way Crowley could have retained the whip would be FF itself realigning itself with the ECR which, of course, was not going to happen.

I disagree. It was Michael Martins way of expelling him but not taking the blame. Again showing lack of leadership.

He couldnt exactly expel a man going through a major operation in Cork. It wouldnt look good.

Mr.Micro

raymon wrote: »

I disagree. It was Michael Martins way of expelling him but not taking the blame. Again showing lack of leadership.

He couldnt exactly expel a man going through a major operation in Cork. It wouldnt look good.

Martin not able to make the hard decisions.....

airuser

Just heard Martin on the News. Crowley has left the party himself. The Chief Whip said something similar.

Let us say politics is a shambles in this country.

Look at the TDs we have voted in over the years.

raymon

airuser wrote: »

Just heard Martin on the News. Crowley has left the party himself. The Chief Whip said something similar.

Let us say politics is a shambles in this country.

Look at the TDs we have voted in over the years.

I saw that interview with Michael Martin. Martin looked like a broken man. He is spinning this to look like Crowley left himself, that is not the truth at all. Martin didnt want to be seen to be expelling a guy who is undergoing a major operation. He wanted to pin the blame back on Crowley himself.

That is the way Fianna Fail operate - with a sneaky edge.

Martin is a very poor leader of FF - I hope he is leader for a very long time .

dulpit

To be fair, Michael Martin cannot expel somebody from Fianna Fail, that is the prerogative of the National Executive. He has arranged for him to lost the whip, and the next step (provided Crowley doesn't resign fully) is to go to National Executive (100 members) and ask them to vote on it (needs 2/3 majority).

raymon

dulpit wrote: »

To be fair, Michael Martin cannot expel somebody from Fianna Fail, that is the prerogative of the National Executive. He has arranged for him to lost the whip, and the next step (provided Crowley doesn't resign fully) is to go to National Executive (100 members) and ask them to vote on it (needs 2/3 majority).

Exactly :
"He has arranged for him to lose the whip" = "He has expelled him from the parliamentary party "

But he couldnt say that .... not brave enough

airuser

raymon wrote: »

Exactly :
"He has arranged for him to lose the whip" = "He has expelled him from the parliamentary party "

But he couldnt say that .... not brave enough

No back bone in Irish Politics, On either side .
It is all about power, not country or the people.

For Reals

Martin really doesn't want to give him up.
But he also states:
"He said that fundamentaly, a party has to stand for ideas, policies and for principals and Mr Crowley's decision had been a step too far."
He does know he's in Fianna Fáil?

tipptom

I think Crowley should resign his seat.
Its obvious this decision was made before the election but he waited until after the election to go public with it.
He has fooled voters that he was going on a ticket for both party's(knowing FF had to jettison him) but had no intention of remaining with them,so he fraudulently represented himself to his constituency .

Red Nissan

What bugs me about this FF move is it has NOTHING to do with FF in the Euro Parliament.

Brian is not an FF representative in that Parliament, in fact no one represents one's local party in that assembly.

michael999999

tipptom wrote: »

I think Crowley should resign his seat.
Its obvious this decision was made before the election but he waited until after the election to go public with it.
He has fooled voters that he was going on a ticket for both party's(knowing FF had to jettison him) but had no intention of remaining with them,so he fraudulently represented himself to his constituency .

Ask yourself are you really surprised that a top Fianna fail politician would do sometbing like this?

Red Nissan

tipptom wrote: »

I think Crowley should resign his seat.
Its obvious this decision was made before the election but he waited until after the election to go public with it.
He has fooled voters that he was going on a ticket for both party's(knowing FF had to jettison him) but had no intention of remaining with them,so he fraudulently represented himself to his constituency .

If FF had anything to do with it, I'd agree, but the EU is none party and he can't speak for or represent FF, he can only speak for his Munster Constituents.

That's the simplicity of the EU, it's not a another Dáil and is in fact designed to break local party politics.