Joan Burton to increase tax on the Rich

mezuzaj

sock puppet wrote: »

Perhaps you could earn more money if you invested in an adult literacy course because she quite clearly stated that she didn't want to increase tax rates.

What she said is no different to all the other left wing politicians who like to talk about closing off numerous unspecified tax breaks but yet somehow don't achieve anything in office.

What tax breaks? that is the question and how much could you bring in.

The country is borrowing 8 billion a year more than it currently takes in Tax. Does she think she can tax the rich 8 billion, or 4 billion or 500 million?

Talk is cheap.

Turtwig

She was talking about those 'unfair' areas where people are avoiding taxes.

Naturally, she didn't specify what the fck she was actually talking about.

But she wasn't saying anything mentioned in the OP. Which is both irrelevant and inaccurate.

DildoFaggins

By rich does she mean anyone with a job:pac:

smileyj1987

HardLuckWoman wrote: »

Ah now. I paid enough.

Ah now subjecting people to that muck should be heavily taxed !!

Idbatterim

In relation to the "rich question" is it meant as in cash and asset rich as lots are cash poor and asset rich. There is no way it is anywhere near 100 or 150k. I just did a quick and simple calculation on the deloitte budget tax calculator, if you earned 150k, you come out with E82,869, not far off from half of what you are allegedly earning. It is absolutely shocking. Anyone who tells me someone on 82k is rich is off their rocker, I think what would be a better term would be the well off, they would be the ones earning low hundreds of thousands. Rich? earning several hundred grand a year at least or old money...

IF the marginal rates werent so scandalous and IF there wasnt enough money to go around, I would have more time for these suggestions BUT there is actually no problem with government income its the spending thats the problem, the use and allocation of funds here is scandalous. You could throw the likes of that joke Burton another ten billion a year and the health service etc actually everything would still be a joke!

stimpson

HardLuckWoman wrote: »

Ah now. I paid enough.

Hard Luck, woman.

suicide_circus

Idbatterim wrote: »

well it must be E32,800 exactly, that is when they confiscate over half of your earnings, at a rate of 52%. I doubt FG will have any of it and quite rightly. She can f**k right off and sort out the billions in government waste and reform welfare.

It really is genuinely gobsmacking when you see it written down, 52% on €32.5.....are they having a fooking laugh. The next budget needs tax relief for middle income workers (those who have actually born the brunt if austerity) not more freebies and certainly not more tax for us "rich".

Turtwig

Idbatterim wrote: »

well it must be E32,800 exactly, that is when they confiscate over half of your earnings, at a rate of 52%. I doubt FG will have any of it and quite rightly. She can f**k right off and sort out the billions in government waste and reform welfare.

Did not a Labour politician recently talk about upping this 32k threshold by about ten thousand.

I'm no fan of Labour, but the OP is a strawman. She has no such public intention. Privately, who knows? But that wasn't what was said.

Idbatterim

It really is genuinely gobsmacking when you see it written down, 52% on €32.5.....are they having a fooking laugh. The next budget needs tax relief for middle income workers (those who have actually born the brunt if austerity) not more freebies and certainly not more tax for us "rich".

Yeah it is absolutely jaw dropping. For every thousand you earn over that amount, they want E520 of it? For what I am not sure.

E1000, they get E520, you get E480. F**cking great country we live in.

teacherhead

By government standards anyone earning over 65k gross is on high pay. That's what they said with their FEMPI legislation.

but its all relative, 65k with a wife and 3 kids is different to 65k if you're single or 65 k if there are two earners or 65k if you inherited your house and have no mortgage.

you cant legislate for personal circumstances, so the notion of high pay is a bit ludicrous really.

there has to be done incentive to work hard apart from self worth etc. What's the point in trying harder to get promoted or improve your business if self employed only to find you're forking out more tax to pay for government advisors on 200k a year.

is 200k high pay? It is if its public money and there's no open competition for appointment. Or is it?

FURET

FloatingVoter wrote: »

You are. Compared to a couple both on minimum wage. Compared to Bono you're a poor person. But outliers like the super-rich don't factor into any statistical analysis done by governments.

Ridiculous. A rich person is someone who, if they stopped working tomorrow, could live without experiencing a drop in their standard of living for many years to come. The OP is not rich. In fact it sounds like he wouldn't last more than 2 or 3 months if all his income stopped - hardly a hallmark of wealth.

Steppenwolfe

Relax people. It's only an election promise. Sure isn't that what you do in an election?

Kermit.de.frog

I think it's disgusting that people who get up early to do an honest days work just to pay their mortgage and provide for their families are being targeted over and over again whilst you have people in this country who have never worked and have no intention of ever working with rent allowance, dole and child benefit, medical card among other things.

And I know someone will say "it's a minority". To be honest I don't give a fcuk if it's a minority. It is not right.

I am in an ok job with an ok wage stressed to bits to keep a roof over my head with mortgage, bills, medical and all the rest. I can literally go out once every 2 weeks for an hour for a drink.

The people around me in the pub a few weeks back, the 3 I know were on the dole (2 with rent allowance) - they seemingly had more expendable income that night than I did! And given their reputation and fondness for drink i'd say it's a fair bet they were having piss ups on Thursday and Friday night too.

Me you and every worker are paying for that and the 5 kids and all the rest.

It's soul destroying if you are even an average wage today.

It's just not right.

/rant

fran17

the labour leader (probably) making wild promises that will be impossible to keep...sorry love we fell for it once but never again;)

bigroad

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I think it's disgusting that people who get up early to do an honest days work just to pay their mortgage and provide for their families are being targeted over and over again whilst you have people in this country who have never worked and have no intention of ever working with rent allowance, dole and child benefit, medical card among other things.

And I know someone will say "it's a minority". To be honest I don't give a fcuk if it's a minority. It is not right.

I am in an ok job with an ok wage stressed to bits to keep a roof over my head with mortgage, bills, medical and all the rest. I can literally go out once every 2 weeks for an hour for a drink.

The people around me in the pub a few weeks back, the 3 I know were on the dole (2 with rent allowance) - they seemingly had more expendable income that night than I did! And given their reputation and fondness for drink i'd say it's a fair bet they were having piss ups on Thursday and Friday night too.

Me you and every worker are paying for that and the 5 kids and all the rest.

It's soul destroying if you are even an average wage today.

It's just not right.

/rant

I agree 100percent .If she has any sense she should target the lifetime dolers and let the rest of us get on with it.

tayto lover

If Joan is elected leader it will be the final nail in Labour's coffin so I hope she gets it. Turncoats.

bigroad

tayto lover wrote: »

If Joan is elected leader it will be the final nail in Labour's coffin so I hope she gets it. Turncoats.

If that be the case will a general election have to be called.

mickydoomsux

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I think it's disgusting that people who get up early to do an honest days work just to pay their mortgage and provide for their families are being targeted over and over again whilst you have people in this country who have never worked and have no intention of ever working with rent allowance, dole and child benefit, medical card among other things.

And I know someone will say "it's a minority". To be honest I don't give a fcuk if it's a minority. It is not right.

I am in an ok job with an ok wage stressed to bits to keep a roof over my head with mortgage, bills, medical and all the rest. I can literally go out once every 2 weeks for an hour for a drink.

The people around me in the pub a few weeks back, the 3 I know were on the dole (2 with rent allowance) - they seemingly had more expendable income that night than I did! And given their reputation and fondness for drink i'd say it's a fair bet they were having piss ups on Thursday and Friday night too.

Me you and every worker are paying for that and the 5 kids and all the rest.

It's soul destroying if you are even an average wage today.

It's just not right.

/rant

Agreed 100%. People ****e on about bank debt and bondholders and yet few talk of the 23bn+ a year that is spent on welfare.

That's per year. Every year.

I refuse to believe that spending that kind of public money is necessary. Especially when someone working and earning anything past the modest 32k mark pays more than half what they earn to fund this unsustainable insanity.

I'm just over the cut off point for the higher rate so literally any overtime I work is worth less than half what I get paid to me.

Taxing "the rich" isn't the solution. A huge overhaul of welfare and pretty much every other area of public expenditure is needed or we'll just end up back here in a decade or two even if the economy improves.

Steppenwolfe

tayto lover wrote: »

If Joan is elected leader it will be the final nail in Labour's coffin so I hope she gets it. Turncoats.

They do seem to be shooting themselves in the foot here. I don't understand how she is favourite to get the job. Based on the recent by election results she's likely to lose her seat in the next election anyway. Which could come sooner than later. What do they do then? It looks to me like the old guard are closing ranks to protect their jobs and **** the party. Not that I care what they do. It just seems strange. They either don't get the zero credibility they have with the electorate now or don't care.

Idbatterim

And I know someone will say "it's a minority". To be honest I don't give a fcuk if it's a minority. It is not right.

Exactly, and you will get people banging on that "oh its a minority" which it might well be, but it runs to bloody serious money and it is not THEIR money, it is yours and mine. FG are supposed to be "right wing" what have they actually done about reform or sorting out this scandalous situation? I have traveled around quite a lot, all over the states and Europe, my Dad is German, nowhere else that I have been would the workers tolerate what they do here, they simply wouldnt have it. IF it wasnt deducted at source I would burn the money sooner than I would give it to those parasites to spend on the legions of wasters here, from Bertie, Neary all the way down to the other extreme!

I'm just over the cut off point for the higher rate so literally any overtime I work is worth less than half what I get paid to me.

Yeah you are earning more for them, than you are for yourself, feels great, doesnt it?!

super_furry

Be much better off moving up the tax bands. The limit at which you start paying the highest rate in this country is criminal.

applehunter

The magic money tree is the problem in this country.

Those in the higher tax bracket are already paying their share.

nc19

Diego Simeone wrote: »

Why do you have upper ranges in each of your poll options Op? Doesn't really make sense.

Captain pedantic

diomed

Tax the other people.

Idbatterim

I was comparing my payslip in 2009 and now, was earning 3k more per year despite the fact my pay has been frozen...

super_furry

suicide_circus wrote: »

It really is genuinely gobsmacking when you see it written down, 52% on €32.5.....are they having a fooking laugh. The next budget needs tax relief for middle income workers (those who have actually born the brunt if austerity) not more freebies and certainly not more tax for us "rich".

That's the more interesting discussion for me, what is middle income? Certaintly don't think anyone on even €50k should be hitting the top rate.

Liamario

She's full of ****. Taxing the rich, while is a viable idea, isn't the cause of the problem nor why she hasn't a hope of getting into power in the next general election.
The fact that she has thrown this around, is a pathetic and hollow attempt to garner some support from the electorate.

jiminho

I'll believe it when I see it but as the OP said, at what point are you considered rich in this country? Also, what would the tax amount to? Maybe after 75k you get put on a 50% tax bracket which would mean in total, you'd be paying 65% in tax.....:eek:

Idbatterim

these insane rates and bear two things in mind, we have virtually no military expenditure and a relatively tiny elderly population i.e. pay out on pensions. I mention this because I am going to try and pull out rates for various different countries, very quickly I have found the below from bbc.co.uk

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26327114

But one important thing to consider when comparing the top rate levels of tax is the threshold where the rate kicks in, because the differences are massive.

"In the UK, the 45% top rate of tax kicks in at an income level of around $250,000 (£151,000) compared to Italy where the top rate of 43% comes in at $125,000," says Ben Wilkins, a tax partner at PWC.

Here it is for Germany from wikipedia, I am looking for the top rates and the threshold that they kick in at! Needless to say, they are all a multiple of here!

Income tax rate in 2010
No income tax is charged on the basic allowance, which is €8,004 for unmarried persons and €16,008 for jointly assessed married couples. Beyond this threshold, the marginal tax rate increases linearly from 14% to 24% for a taxable income of €13,469 (€26,938 for married couples). In the subsequent interval up to a taxable income of €52,881 (€105,762 for married couples), the marginal tax rate increases linearly from 24% to 42%. The last change of rates occurs at a taxable income of €250,730 (€501,460 for married couples) when the marginal tax rate jumps from 42% to 45%. The course of the marginal tax rate and the resulting average tax rate are depicted in the graph to the right.

Frank Lee Midere

I wonder if the people here would be a bit more sanguine if the actual rich were actually taxed. And that reduced the higher rate middle income taxes? It's what she is supposedly talking about.