Girl from Gort who constantly drives at 50kph

AugustusMinimus

Didn't want to be cluttering a thread on the roads forum but a number of boardsies have recently been held up by a girl in her twenties who drives at 50kph on all national and regional roads. Slows down to 30kph in the corners :eek:

Anyone ever encounter this person before ? One of the posters in the thread stated that the Gardaí actually had to pull her over as there was a tailback behind her several miles long and that she was doing her best to stop people from overtaking her.

What are people's views on others driving well below the speed limit. While not making progress will get you a fail in your driving test, I don't think there's any actual minimum speed to drive on our roads. I personally view it as dangerous and an incredible inconvenience but not against the law.

Original thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055673984&page=50

Dempsey

These people shouldn't be on the road

CelticRambler

Ahhhh, the innocence of the Irish! One driver doing 50kph! Here in France, there are thousands of them - all perfectly legal. If you're not fit to have a licence (can't pass driving test, failed too many breathalysers, dodgy eyesight, never learnt to drive anything other than a tractor) you can buy a "sans permis" car and tootle along the highways to your heart's content ... limited to 50kph (though I did tailgate one last week who hit 60kph on a downhill stretch).

Sit back an enjoy the view.

Caliden

Well if she was doing her best to stop people overtaking her then she should be done for careless driving.

That behaviour wrecks my head. Drive 50kmh all you want but don't attempt to accelerate/block my overtaking just because you don't like it. Same goes for people who flash their lights when they're overtaken.

Page 110 in the rules of the road:

Avoid driving too slowly
In normal road and traffic conditions, safely keep up with the pace of the traffic
flow while obeying the speed limit. While you must keep a safe distance away
from the vehicle in front, you should not drive so slowly that your vehicle
unnecessarily blocks other road users. If you drive too slowly, you risk frustrating
other drivers, which could lead to dangerous overtaking. However, remember:
you must not drive at a speed at which you cannot stop the vehicle within the
distance you can see to be clear ahead.

Bandara

It's the countryside, tractors don't go any faster

sullivlo

Bandara wrote: »

It's the countryside, tractors don't go any faster

Tractors usually pull in at a safe spot to let traffic pass

foggy_lad

Caliden wrote: »

Well if she was doing her best to stop people overtaking her then she should be done for careless driving.

That behaviour wrecks my head. Drive 50kmh all you want but don't attempt to accelerate/block my overtaking just because you don't like it. Same goes for people who flash their lights when they're overtaken.

Page 110 in the rules of the road:

What proof is there that she is or was deliberately blocking other drivers from overtaking?

Can you link to the statute which bans driving too slowly and how slow is too slow according to the law?

foggy_lad

sullivlo wrote: »

Tractors usually pull in at a safe spot to let traffic pass

But they don't have to. Only vehicles like steam traction engines etc which are even slower than tractors have any obligation to pull in and allow the traffic to pass when there are more than ten vehicles behind them afaik

Caliden

foggy_lad wrote: »

What proof is there that she is or was deliberately blocking other drivers from overtaking?

Can you link to the statute which bans driving too slowly and how slow is too slow according to the law?

Well the Gardai pulled her over so she must have done something wrong don't you think?

You know full well there isn't a statute to cover such a case, the Gardai have to use logic in a case like this.

If she was deliberately driving slowing she could be prosecuted under the section 52:
"52.—(1) A person shall not drive a vehicle in a public place without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the place."

loyatemu

CelticRambler wrote: »

Ahhhh, the innocence of the Irish! One driver doing 50kph! Here in France, there are thousands of them - all perfectly legal. If you're not fit to have a licence (can't pass driving test, failed too many breathalysers, dodgy eyesight, never learnt to drive anything other than a tractor) you can buy a "sans permis" car and tootle along the highways to your heart's content ... limited to 50kph (though I did tailgate one last week who hit 60kph on a downhill stretch).

Sit back an enjoy the view.

I've seen loads of those little Aixam cars over in France - never knew you could drive them without a license. Seems crazy (but that's the French driving laws in general, like the whole mandatory breathalyser thing).

JC01

How can anything doing 50kph block people overtaking? I don't imagine she's driving a Range Rover or anything halfways big?

It would bring you to tears seeing this everyday though, the best part is she probably thinks she's a great driver and the RSA would no doubt use her as a poster child

Caliden

JC01 wrote: »

How can anything doing 50kph block people overtaking? I don't imagine she's driving a Range Rover or anything halfways big?

It would bring you to tears seeing this everyday though, the best part is she probably thinks she's a great driver and the RSA would no doubt use her as a poster child

She could be one of these drivers who hover the white line making it extremely difficult to overtake but without a dash cam or evidence of it, it's all conjecture.

foggy_lad

Caliden wrote: »

Well the Gardai pulled her over so she must have done something wrong don't you think?

You know full well there isn't a statute to cover such a case, the Gardai have to use logic in a case like this.

If she was deliberately driving slowing she could be prosecuted under the section 52:
"52.—(1) A person shall not drive a vehicle in a public place without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the place."

The gardai pulled her over because she was not going as fas as the other traffic which is not an offence in any statute book in the state AFAIK.

Gardai and logic are things that rarely sit well together.

She could be charged with dangerous or any other type of driving but would o my be found guilty with irrefutable proof which a garda can not give.

djimi

sullivlo wrote: »

Tractors usually pull in at a safe spot to let traffic pass

No they dont in fairness. Occasionally perhaps, but nothing like usually.

Sam Kade

Caliden wrote: »

Well if she was doing her best to stop people overtaking her then she should be done for careless driving.

That behaviour wrecks my head. Drive 50kmh all you want but don't attempt to accelerate/block my overtaking just because you don't like it. Same goes for people who flash their lights when they're overtaken.

Page 110 in the rules of the road:

People who flash their lights when overtaken do it because the driver overtaking cuts in front of them

djimi

foggy_lad wrote: »

The gardai pulled her over because she was not going as fas as the other traffic which is not an offence in any statute book in the state AFAIK.

Gardai and logic are things that rarely sit well together.

She could be charged with dangerous or any other type of driving but would o my be found guilty with irrefutable proof which a garda can not give.

Perhaps the Gardai just pulled her over to have a chat, knowing that they couldnt actually charge her for anything but that at least pulling her over would relieve the rolling roadblock for a couple of minutes. If they see someone driving excessively slowly then they would have good reason to suspect drunk or otherwise impaired driving in fairness.

doolox

I recall a tractor driver in Westport was pulled over and fined for careless driving for holding up traffic on the Westport Newport road.

Several cars on the Enfield road do 60kph holding everyone up in a an 80kph zone. Most commercials happily do 90-100 on that stretch of road, experienced drivers who are conscious of dangers and costs but some overzealous slow drivers hold everybody else up as there is no overtaking allowed on that road.

I have also seen people doing 70kph on the outside lane of the M50 at 5 am when it is almost empty!!!

They should be on the inside lane.

Absolutely infuriating.

Caliden

foggy_lad wrote: »

The gardai pulled her over because she was not going as fas as the other traffic which is not an offence in any statute book in the state AFAIK.

Gardai and logic are things that rarely sit well together.

She could be charged with dangerous or any other type of driving but would o my be found guilty with irrefutable proof which a garda can not give.

How would careless driving not apply in this case?
Driving too slowly for the road conditions can be just as dangerous as too fast.

Apply the same to a car going 50kmh on a 120kmh motorway, that's careless driving as they are driving considerably slower than other vehicles.

It's up to a prosecutor to use the letter of the law (in this case, "(driving)...without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons") and apply it to this person's unwillingness to let others overtake her (if the OP's statement is true) and progress at a reasonable speed on the road in question.

If she really does drive at this speed and has a several mile long tailback then she slowing progress for other (more capable) drivers and is not being considerate of other drivers.

Wouldn't you agree?

Sam Kade wrote: »

People who flash their lights when overtaken do it because the driver overtaking cuts in front of them

Never cut anyone up any of the times it happened to me so please don't accuse me of something I never did.

corktina

Driving without due consideration is an offence isn't it?

djimi

Caliden wrote: »

How would careless driving not apply in this case?
Driving too slowly for the road conditions can be just as dangerous as too fast.

Apply the same to a car going 50kmh on a 120kmh motorway, that's careless driving as they are driving considerably slower than other vehicles.

It's up to a prosecutor to use the letter of the law (in this case, "(driving)...without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons") and apply it to this person's unwillingness to let others overtake her (if the OP's statement is true) and progress at a reasonable speed on the road in question.

If she really does drive at this speed and has a several mile long tailback then she slowing progress for other (more capable) drivers and is not being considerate of other drivers.

Wouldn't you agree?

It depends on the situation. It might seem like careless or dangerous driving to be going a lot slower than the speed limit, but there are vehicles on the road that will legitimately be going that slowly, and motorists need to be aware of this either way. Its no more dangerous for me to come around a corner and meet a car doing 25mph as it is for me to meet a tractor doing the same speed.

Also if visibility is good then there is no danger whatsoever. It is undoubtedly infuriating to be stuck behind a driver like this, but they are not posing a direct danger.

Caliden

corktina wrote: »

Driving without due consideration is an offence isn't it?

Yup, section 52. Quoted it on the previous page.
I also quoted the rules of the road from the RSA website which advises against driving too slowly (unsure how legally binding they are).

Sam Kade

Caliden wrote: »

Never cut anyone up any of the times it happened to me so please don't accuse me of something I never did.

Hold on a second where did I accuse you of doing anything?

Caliden

Sam Kade wrote: »

Hold on a second where did I accuse you of doing anything?

"People who flash their lights when overtaken do it because the driver overtaking cuts in front of them"

Inferred from the above. I don't see how you were trying to say anything else when making the above statement.



Back on topic, here's the correct page of the thread in question:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=90246824

And here's a google map of the road:
http://goo.gl/maps/hM193

100kmh limit for most of it.

antoobrien

foggy_lad wrote: »

What proof is there that she is or was deliberately blocking other drivers from overtaking?

Here's the posts that complained about the driver in question:

Deleted User wrote: »

A girl driving less than 50kph from Gort to Kilcolgan, 30kph around the bends. Easily two miles of traffic stuck behind her by the time the Gardai pulled her over in Kilcolgan. She hogged the white line the whole way and was nearly responsible for several accidents with people desperate to overtake her.

Deleted User wrote: »

She was early twenties with some other fella in the front. She had 30 minutes to pull over and didn't try once even though the road has a decent hard shoulder. Gardai tailed her for a few minutes and then stopped her.

foggy_lad wrote: »

Gardai and logic are things that rarely sit well together.

She could be charged with dangerous or any other type of driving but would o my be found guilty with irrefutable proof which a garda can not give.

In this case the Gardai seem to have gotten it correct (and perfectly logically too) as her lack of care and consideration for other road users were causing a dangerous situation.

I don't know if the squad cars carry video cameras, but given that the Gardai were behind her for a few minutes they'd easily be able to build a case by observing her behaviour and the number of cars she got queued up behind her.

Whether they'd actually attempt to press charges is another issue, but it should happen far more often.

Sam Kade

Caliden wrote: »

"People who flash their lights when overtaken do it because the driver overtaking cuts in front of them"

Inferred from the above. I don't see how you were trying to say anything else when making the above statement.

So you are the driver, calm down and stop reading between the lines

rabwaygal

[="JC01;90271116"]How can anything doing 50kph block people overtaking? I don't imagine she's driving a Range Rover or anything halfways big?]

That road has very limited over taking oppurtunies. It's almost continuous white line and has a lot of bends. I wouldn't fancy driving that road knowing there will be a very slow tail back there!

Sheldons Brain

She hogged the white line the whole way and was nearly responsible for several accidents with people desperate to overtake her.

This person might have been a right pain in the butt, but she was not "nearly responsible for several accidents", that responsibility lies squarely with those impatient persons attempting to overtake when unsafe to do so. A distinction has to be made between bad manners (the original driver) and dangerous driving ( the overtakers).

Driving with care and consideration needs to be defined.

ironclaw

The way I kinda see it, as annoying as it is, whats the point in getting stressed? You could easily fly past them and by the time you get to the next town, you get a bad change at a few lights, and they are right back behind you. I drive at the speed limit for the most part, and in 99% of the cases I'll catch someone who barrels past me by the next town, toll bridge or slower section. In my own head, and if conditions allow, I keep to the limit and I don't let it slip below 5% of it.

Say you were held up over a 20km (12.5 mile stretch)

At 50km/h, that will take you 24mins.

At 80km/h, that will take you 15mins.

At 100km/h, that will take you 12 mins.

What person here can't afford (Probably at most) 12 mins the rare occasion they get held up? And think about it, 20km is actually a very long way. Its give or take half the length of the M50. I doubt anyone would have that distance to be held up at an average speed of 50km/h and NO opportunity to overtake.

Cool the jets lads. Its infuriating but your saving minutes out of a lifetime. You'll get there!

corktina

It's an offense to hold up the traffic like that...there was a tractor driver prosecuted for it a few years ago, but at least he was driving a slow vehicle!

djimi

Sheldons Brain wrote: »

This person might have been a right pain in the butt, but she was not "nearly responsible for several accidents", that responsibility lies squarely with those impatient persons attempting to overtake when unsafe to do so. A distinction has to be made between bad manners (the original driver) and dangerous driving ( the overtakers).

This comes up in these sort of threads a lot. Some will argue until they are blue in the face that it is the slow driver who forces people to overtake them dangerously. The simple fact is that we are all responsible for our own actions, and if you overtake when its not safe to do so, regardless of the situation, then its on you, 100%, if it leads to an incident.

Kenny Logins

That's 24 minutes stuck behind her, and then you're 12 minutes late. I'd explode. :pac:

djimi

ironclaw wrote: »

The way I kinda see it, as annoying as it is, whats the point in getting stressed? You could easily fly past them and by the time you get to the next town, you get a bad change at a few lights, and they are right back behind you. I drive at the speed limit for the most part, and in 99% of the cases I'll catch someone who barrels past me by the next town, toll bridge or slower section. In my own head, and if conditions allow, I keep to the limit and I don't let it slip below 5% of it.

Its a fair point. On Monday I was stuck behind someone who was going no more than 75-80 the whole way from Blessington to Brittas (on what is probably the best stretch of 100km/h road in the county), and I couldnt get past them. In hindsight it probably cost me about 2-3 minutes max compared to overtaking them. Sometimes its really not worth worrying about.

Renegade Mechanic

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Didn't want to be cluttering a thread on the roads forum but a number of boardsies have recently been held up by a girl in her twenties who drives at 50kph on all national and regional roads. Slows down to 30kph in the corners :eek:

Anyone ever encounter this person before ? One of the posters in the thread stated that the Gardaí actually had to pull her over as there was a tailback behind her several miles long and that she was******** doing her best to stop people from overtaking her.*******

What are people's views on others driving well below the speed limit. While not making progress will get you a fail in your driving test, I don't think there's any actual minimum speed to drive on our roads. I personally view it as dangerous and an incredible inconvenience but not against the law.

Original thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055673984&page=50

There. Right there I hate that so ****ing MUCH. I have driven along ditches to get past the kind of absolute roaring, thundering **** that does those speeds then moves out to prevent you overtaking. Just to prove to them that I can be an even bigger **** than they are. Its only happened rarely but my god I cannot think of anything more infuriating on the road!:mad:

Caliden

ironclaw wrote: »

The way I kinda see it, as annoying as it is, whats the point in getting stressed? You could easily fly past them and by the time you get to the next town, you get a bad change at a few lights, and they are right back behind you. I drive at the speed limit for the most part, and in 99% of the cases I'll catch someone who barrels past me by the next town, toll bridge or slower section. In my own head, and if conditions allow, I keep to the limit and I don't let it slip below 5% of it.

Say you were held up over a 20km (12.5 mile stretch)

At 50km/h, that will take you 24mins.

At 80km/h, that will take you 15mins.

At 100km/h, that will take you 12 mins.

What person here can't afford (Probably at most) 12 mins the rare occasion they get held up? And think about it, 20km is actually a very long way. Its give or take half the length of the M50. I doubt anyone would have that distance to be held up at an average speed of 50km/h and NO opportunity to overtake.

Cool the jets lads. Its infuriating but your saving minutes out of a lifetime. You'll get there!

From reading the thread, this isn't an isolated incident. Getting stuck behind that 5 days a week for a year would be 52 hours lost. I can think of a lot better ways to spend 52 hours of my life than to be stuck behind someone thinking to myself "ah shure it's not worth getting worked up about....".

And that's only one leg of your journey, imagine both directions!

Also, she wasn't going 50 consistently, she was slowing to 30kmh on the 'corners' (I've driven that road a few times and not sure there are any corners that require this speed) so it would be longer than 12 minutes 'lost'.

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

Why are people playing devil's advocate, and defending this woman's driving? It must be low level trolling.

Going by the letter of the law, should she be doing this speed? Arguably not illegal (depends on if she is deliberately blocking drivers who try to overtake?

Going on logic and reason should she be doing that speed? Not a f*cking chance.

djimi

Duracell Bunny wrote: »

Why are people playing devil's advocate, and defending this woman's driving? It must be low level trolling.

Going by the letter of the law, should she be doing this speed? Arguably not illegal (depends on if she is deliberately blocking drivers who try to overtake?

Going on logic and reason should she be doing that speed? Not a f*cking chance.

Its not a case of playing devils advocate, but there is little point in sparking up the flaming pitchforks for a good old rant if she isnt actually breaking any laws. A lot depends on the road and the situation, and exactly how much she is actually blocking people from overtaking (ie is she speeding up/moving over, or just not pulling in to assist the overtake). People use words like dangerour and careless to describe slow drivers, when I have encountered slow drivers who are neither dangerous or careless.

Driving without consideration seems to be the main thing that we can point to, but aside from one case of a tractor that seems to get referred to a lot, Im not sure how many people have actually been done for this.

ironclaw

Duracell Bunny wrote: »

Why are people playing devil's advocate, and defending this woman's driving? It must be low level trolling.

I'm not justifying her speed or behaviour. Yes, its annoying and stressful. But the point I was making that unless your getting caught behind someone doing this every single day, on every single journey you make then your not saving or losing time on the grand sum of things. Its insignificant. My example was 20km of a solid 50km/h. Thats never going to happen.

I've said it so many times, people have no concept of average speed here. If you top 160km/h for 10 solid minutes on a 2 hour journey and then drop to 120km/h for the rest, you may as well not have bothered because your average by the end will be the same.

I suppose my point is, when are you ever going to be behind someone for so long that it makes a difference to your day. Few people on this forum have jobs or responsibilities where a quick phone call saying you are going to be 5 mins late (At worst) will go astray.

Call them in to the Garda, wait to pass and get on with your life. Will stave off the heart attack incurred by the poor driving standards in this country by a few years anyway :pac:

Sheldons Brain

Duracell Bunny wrote: »

Why are people playing devil's advocate, and defending this woman's driving? It must be low level trolling.
.

Who has defended this woman's driving? She was clearly driving in an anti-social manner.

Joe 90

Does she drive a Micra?

the_syco

Sheldons Brain wrote: »

This person might have been a right pain in the butt, but she was not "nearly responsible for several accidents"

You could argue the two or three cars immediately behind her are guilty, for not overtaking in the first place.

=-=

For those who say that "shure, you can wait", these holdups can impede the progress of emergency vehicles.

corktina

Duracell Bunny wrote: »

Why are people playing devil's advocate, and defending this woman's driving? It must be low level trolling.

Going by the letter of the law, should she be doing this speed? Arguably not illegal (depends on if she is deliberately blocking drivers who try to overtake?

Going on logic and reason should she be doing that speed? Not a f*cking chance.

do you understand the principle of Devil's Advocate?

doolox

doolox wrote: »

I recall a tractor driver in Westport was pulled over and fined for careless driving for holding up traffic on the Westport Newport road.

Several cars on the Enfield road do 60kph holding everyone up in a an 80kph zone. Most commercials happily do 90-100 on that stretch of road, experienced drivers who are conscious of dangers and costs but some overzealous slow drivers hold everybody else up as there is no overtaking allowed on that road.

I have also seen people doing 70kph on the outside lane of the M50 at 5 am when it is almost empty!!!

They should be on the inside lane.

Absolutely infuriating.

Several occasions slow drivers in Mayo have been stopped by the Gardai.

One case reached court last year where somebody overtook a slow driver on the inside lane. The Gardai pulled over these people and it went to court, the jusge kicked the case out and told the Gardai that they should of pulled the over the slow driver instead. It made a lot of noise on local radio. It probably explains why these drivers are now getting stopped.

However Galway appears to be a completely different country. Drive as slow as you like and the Gardai sit in there car and watch 100's of cars follow the slow driver.

It was good to see the Gardai make an exception in this case.

power pants

Perhaps leave off earlier for your destination to anticipate things like this

I was one of the Drivers behind her last Monday. It was very hard for anybody to overtake as the traffic was so heavy coming the other way. She drove on the white line the whole way. When people did get to go there were cars popping out everywhere in the queue behind her. It nearly caused a number of crashes.

Traffic as far as i could see in the distance behind me were backed up. This was than going to cause big delays going into clarinbridge especially a Bank Holiday Monday.

What was worse was that there are sections of this road where a bus could of driven on the inside of her car. It wasn't like there was nobody to tell her what was going on, there was a passenger in the front that could hear all the cars beeping.

They should give her a bus pass and take her off the road as she is certain to cost lives at some point in the future.

I think the Gardai had been waiting for her as they pulled out right behind her after she passed them. Then pulled her over at the next big hard shoulder before clarinbridge.

What worse if it wasn't for the Gardai we would of been behind her the whole way to Oranmore or probably Tuam if she was going that way.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Renegade Mechanic

Joe 90 wrote: »

Does she drive a Micra?

........... Dark green?...... Limerick!?:eek:

Moneymaker

Glad I don't live near Gort. Sounds very dangerous and with all the aggressive drivers out there it's asking for something nasty to happen.

SpaceTime

You still encounter quite a few drivers in Ireland who drive far too slowly for the road conditions.

Driving at the speed limit isn't necessarily advisable either on some roads where the surfaces and turns don't really allow for it, but on most N roads and absolutely on M roads the speed limit is usually reasonable for the road conditions.

What drives me nuts is the old dudes driving along in the hard shoulder at about <50km/h for absolutely no reason other than they're 'driving locally'.

All they're doing is creating a moving obstacle that has to be passed and they're also a potential hazard to anything in the hard shoulder which in rural areas can include pedestrians and cyclists.

whomitconcerns

the way i look at it, its not the person who is slow whos at fault..thats their decision, its the people right behind them that wont overtake...that mean you guranteed have to do at least a 2 car overtake if you want to go past are teh ones who annoy me...

I had to go past a chain of 3 cars on the N81 a few weeks back...sunday morning early, road not busy and all these muppets in a chain doing 60-70kph....

SpaceTime

The other one that I don't get is people driving along on perfectly smooth, wide, open N-roads or even motorway who keep drifting from say 100km/h back to about 80 km/h then they suddenly speed up again and why you try to pass them they tend to slam down the accelerator and take it as a personal insult.

Caliden

whomitconcerns wrote: »

the way i look at it, its not the person who is slow whos at fault..thats their decision, its the people right behind them that wont overtake...that mean you guranteed have to do at least a 2 car overtake if you want to go past are teh ones who annoy me...

I had to go past a chain of 3 cars on the N81 a few weeks back...sunday morning early, road not busy and all these muppets in a chain doing 60-70kph....

Someone who was actually behind the car in question posted saying when the road markings allowed overtaking, the oncoming traffic was too heavy so it's not exactly the fault of the first 2/3 cars behind either.