Aventador Crash - Moment of Impact

vibe666

vibe666 wrote: »

you mean the same rules of the road which would require the lambo driver NOT to be speeding and paying due care and attention to other road users, instead of showboating for the camera?

the excessive speed of the lambo was a contributing factor to the accident, if he hadn't been driving at excessive speed in a busy built up area with a bus obscuring his view and the view of the mazda, there is a very good chance the accident would never have happened therefore he has to take a portion of the blame.

You have no basis for the claim he was travelling at excessive speed, to me he does not appear to be travelling excessively fast and I would not even consider giving him 1% of the blame.

dantastic

Let's have a closer look where it happened.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.493774,-0.158068,3a,75y,351.42h,71.57t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s_H9MZoFEUj9jYcFhcBv2yA!2e0

The arguments supporting the Mazda are getting pretty ridiculous.

Skatedude

i dont see any indication that the lambo was travelling too fast. He would have stopped much quicker if the mazda hadnt been turning so much that his front wheel was sticking out far enough for the lambo to ride up on it. thats what launched the car, not speed.

H3llR4iser

Skatedude wrote: »

i dont see any indication that the lambo was travelling too fast. He would have stopped much quicker if the mazda hadnt been turning so much that his front wheel was sticking out far enough for the lambo to ride up on it. thats what launched the car, not speed.

Sssst! Don't try to explain physics 101 to the "he was doing MAAAD speed!!!!" brigade (which by the way, would be blaming the Mazda en masse had the other car been a Panda).

For the record, I witnessed somebody overturning their car (an Alfa 147, definitely not a taller-than-wide citycar) from a standstill exiting the parking garage at work: he was stopped at the access barrier when somehow accidentally let go of the clutch - the front right wheel rode up the barrier support column et voila', the car was on its roof. One of the most ridiculous things I have ever seen, as it was essentially an accident in slow motion.

Besides, there's the famous videclip of some lady managing to overturn her SW Audi from a standstill as well...

unkel

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Besides, there's the famous videclip of some lady managing to overturn her SW Audi from a standstill as well...

You're thinking of this one?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQKlyi_49gA

Marty McFly

^^^ she was travelling far to fast. Sure it took her bouncing off the opposite wall to stop the car from rolling.

Tea 1000

Legend Ugly Passport wrote: »

The car leaving the ground is a very poor indication of his speed, the front of a Lamborghini is very light as its engine is in the rear and its also has a very different body shape to a normal car. All you need is for the two cars to meet in a certain way and it will lift it off the ground even at slow speed.

If he was travelling very fast the crash would have been much worse. The airbags didn't even deploy in the Lamborghini.

EDIT: Looking at the video again, the reason the Lamborghini launched was that it connected with the wheel of the mazda which was sticking out due to turning. The rotation of the wheel would have the effect of launching the Lamborghini.

Mazda pulled out in front of him alright, and it'll be hard to argue away any blame from him when it comes to the insurance claim, but anyone who thinks that Lambo wasn't going fast doesn't understand speed. Listen to the engine sound on approach. He was also late on the anchors, must have assumed he'd get by. Mazda driver caused the accident, Lambo driver was a bit of a tool.
Also re above post, they're not light at the front, nor rear engined! They're mid-engined with an almost perfect 50:50 weight distribution. He impacted hard enough to bust away enough front wing for his wheel to get purchase from the Mazda wheel or body to launch him. And it'll stop quicker from 30mph than it did in that video! (despite 2 impacts to help him slow down!)

the_syco

Marty McFly wrote: »

Also has someone else said look how quick the Lamo stopped despite going airborne.

After hitting two cars. Mazda is still in the wrong for pulling out, but I wonder how hidden the Lambo would have been? Looking at 00:54, and I wonder if the Mazda saw anything approach? To be fair, the driver seemed to be cautiously turning when the crash happened.

Here's the junction (found by Googling the shop next to the junction), and it looks like since the picture was taken, a pedestrian crossing had been removed. Odd.

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Argument "He should have seen me pull out":
B*llocks. He should have watched out for traffic on the road that has priority over him. It's his job to watch out for traffic and pull out when safe. Especially if said traffic can be heard three blocks away.

You can hear it three blocks away if you're not in a car... or maybe have the windows down. Windows up, and listening to your own music, you probably won't hear it. As for watching traffic, the Mazda seemed to inch out, probably because the couldn't see left as there was cars parked to their left. From looking at the street, I'm unsure if the Lambo would be visible, as it seems to be lower than most cars.

dantastic wrote: »

It's the same as this one, just not a lambo involved
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=89690517&postcount=3252
Plenty of suggestions it was the OPs fault.

At 0.02 the signpost shows the poster was on the main road of the crossroads, and thus the other driver should have given way. In saying that, it looks like the usual blind crossroads :mad:

Caliden

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Mazda pulled out in front of him alright, and it'll be hard to argue away any blame from him when it comes to the insurance claim, but anyone who thinks that Lambo wasn't going fast doesn't understand speed. Listen to the engine sound on approach. He was also late on the anchors, must have assumed he'd get by. Mazda driver caused the accident, Lambo driver was a bit of a tool.
Also re above post, they're not light at the front, nor rear engined! They're mid-engined with an almost perfect 50:50 weight distribution. He impacted hard enough to bust away enough front wing for his wheel to get purchase from the Mazda wheel or body to launch him. And it'll stop quicker from 30mph than it did in that video! (despite 2 impacts to help him slow down!)

You can't judge speed by sound. It's a 6.5litre v12 with 700hp, that thing would be loud going 10mph

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQ1DDIwhw4M

Shure jaysus lads he's flying it with the sound out of it

Kenny Logins

dantastic wrote: »

Let's have a closer look where it happened.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.493774,-0.158068,3a,75y,351.42h,71.57t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s_H9MZoFEUj9jYcFhcBv2yA!2e0

The arguments supporting the Mazda are getting pretty ridiculous.

That's a view of the road through a very wide angle lens, and from a height far above a driver's eye level. Not sure what it proves or disproves..

We don't know if the Mazda's view was obstructed (Aventador is ~1.2m tall and the colour of asphalt FFS :pac:), or if the Lambo actually was speeding (I don't think he was). We do know that the Mazda pulled out, and the Lambo didn't (or couldn't) stop in time, and hit it. That's why I'm going with 50/50 - We don't know the details, and can only guess.


Keep guessing though, I'm playing high-horse bingo here.

dantastic

Alright, being as far out the road as the Mazda was. This is the last he saw before he decided to commit to turning out.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.493864,-0.158094,3a,75y,182.61h,61.16t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sy_Hqc_Z7JYD5u2i4NeMcfA!2e0

H3llR4iser

unkel wrote: »

You're thinking of this one?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQKlyi_49gA

Lol yeah, got the car mixed up - look like it's a Skoda. Fairly sure I saw another one with an A6 though. And believe me, seeing this happen in the flesh before your very eyes is one of the most astonishing things ever - car creeps forward, and creeps, and oops, it's on the roof!

MarkR

Kenny Logins wrote: »

That's a view of the road through a very wide angle lens, and from a height far above a driver's eye level. Not sure what it proves or disproves..

We don't know if the Mazda's view was obstructed (Aventador is ~1.2m tall and the colour of asphalt FFS :pac:), or if the Lambo actually was speeding (I don't think he was). We do know that the Mazda pulled out, and the Lambo didn't (or couldn't) stop in time, and hit it. That's why I'm going with 50/50 - We don't know the details, and can only guess.


Keep guessing though, I'm playing high-horse bingo here.

How on god's green earth the flying spaghetti monsters's great noodly appendage does that make it 50/50?

stimpson

For all the people who say that it must have been speeding as it left the ground - here's a lambo at 35mph into a solid object. The back wheels leave the ground. The one in the OP had the mazda to launch itself from.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3d5LuNp6yI

I don't think there is enough evidence in that video to say for sure that the lambo was speeding.

Marcusm

I drive that street maybe 3-4 times a week. TheLambo driver has taken a sharp left off Sloane Square across a zebra crossing that allows little more than 1 car through before the next people try to cross and down a very straight and very deceptive Sloane Street. He has travelled maybe 100yds when he hits the Mazda who should not have been there. However, anyone who drives it regularly knows to be very careful as pulling out from kerbs or from side streets without looking is very common. Those are the sorts of hazards you have to be wary of if you have any interest in your car. It shouldn't be that way but half the drivers around there are either self entitled assholes or doddery not paying attention types. Not a good combination, at least it only seems to be material damage.

Kenny Logins

MarkR wrote: »

How on god's green earth does that make it 50/50?

Don't bring religion into it FFS.

MarkR

Kenny Logins wrote: »

Don't bring religion into it FFS.

Noted and corrected.

BMJD

The Lambo is to blame because it's expensive and I can't afford one. Any arguments against this and I'll remind you to think of the children.

seamus

BMJD wrote: »

The Lambo is to blame because it's expensive and I can't afford one. Any arguments against this and I'll remind you to think of the children.

That's basically what the Daily Mail article says, and it appears to the be argument in use by some on this thread.
And of course there's the, "He must have been speeding, because he's driving a powerful car. Even though I have zero proof that he was speeding, I will insist that you prove he wasn't".

These cars are light. The wheels leaving the ground is not proof of excessive speed. If anything the relatively small amount of damage to all of the vehicles and how quickly the Lambo came to a rest is proof that he wasn't driving at a particularly high speed. If the Mazda's view was obscured by the bus, he shouldn't have pulled out. The height of the Lambo may have exacerbated the Mazda's inability to see him, but it's still the Mazda's fault.

Voodoomelon

Whist the Aventador was not the cause of the accident, its speed was certainly a contributor to it occurring.

bmwguy

My take on it is that there are 2 bad drivers here, the mazda pulled out when it wasnt clear and the Lambo was driving too fast for a city centre, as i probably would if I had that car too. I watched it with sound off, the Lambo still looked too fast and that was my first reaction. Can speed at impact be proven from a youtube video? If so, lambo might be in trouble also. If not, the only certainty is that the Mazda didnt give right of way.

BMJD

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Whist the Aventador was not the cause of the accident, its speed was certainly a contributor to it occurring.

this is true in the sense that if it were completely stationary, it may not have hit the Mazda

BMJD

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.493774,-0.158068,3a,75y,348.21h,69.52t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s_H9MZoFEUj9jYcFhcBv2yA!2e0

no excuse for pulling out there without looking properly

also, I wonder if the woman in the streetview got flattened :eek:

mb1725

I think people are confusing acceleration with speed. Bit like a motorbike, acceleration is not illegal ( up to a point!), but is difficult to control in emergency.

Idbatterim

pity that he just clipped the bm too! I can only imagine the eye watering repair bill! He appears fairly calm given what just happened to his car. I can only imagine the bystanders seeing a young man get out of a lambo with a woman, thinking "it was obviously his fault" without having even seen the accident :rolleyes:

guttenberg

Two questions: Would the Aventador have managed to get so much air if it was a 30mph impact? was the Mazda driver the fella in red, who ran to check on the blonde passenger but didn't seem to care about the male driver?:D Mazda at fault, but Lambo driver not completely innocent IMO.

dantastic

Why are people only blaming the lambo's speed?
The Mazda didn't stop in time either so he must have been driving too fast as well! Or does that argument not apply to non super/sports cars?

guttenberg

guttenberg wrote: »

Two questions: Would the Aventador have managed to get so much air if it was a 30mph impact? was the Mazda driver the fella in red, who ran to check on the blonde passenger but didn't seem to care about the male driver?:D Mazda at fault, but Lambo driver not completely innocent IMO.

As I and another poster pointed out the reason for the lambo being launched was a combination of the wheel of the mazda creating bit of a ramp and also the motion of the mazdas wheel in the forward direction would tend to make the lambo "kick" into the air.

You will see this effect in F1 quite often where a car gets launched into the air when wheels meet, often when the cars are not moving very fast.

dr.fuzzenstein

dantastic wrote: »

Why are people only blaming the lambo's speed?
The Mazda didn't stop in time either so he must have been driving too fast as well! Or does that argument not apply to non super/sports cars?

The problem is that in Ireland doddery old idiots that pull out 10 yards ahead of you are never to blame.
Haven't you seen the RSA ads? Speed Kills! Nothing else!
So as long as you drive everywhere at 20 km/h, you can pretty much do anything you want, because we're only interested in the speed you're doing. Other that that, bumper car rules apply.

the_syco

dantastic wrote: »

Alright, being as far out the road as the Mazda was. This is the last he saw before he decided to commit to turning out.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.493864,-0.158094,3a,75y,182.61h,61.16t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sy_Hqc_Z7JYD5u2i4NeMcfA!2e0

Incorrect. Looking at 00:54 in the video, there is what looks like a line of parked cars on the left side of the road, to the left of the Mazda.