Temporary Closure of Section of Lough Atalia Road from 23rd March to May, 2015

Storm 10

GekkePrutser wrote: »

The bigger question is why does the harbour not get moved outside the town centre? If they're redeveloping they should totally do this. They can keep the old docks for pleasure crafts.

I've never understood why it is still in the town. It doesn't add any value being there. Just causes problems with trucks in places where they don't belong.

The plans are to build a new harbour outside the City and have a Marina in the docks hopefully it will happen

galwaycyclist

Storm 10 wrote: »

The plans are to build a new harbour outside the City and have a Marina in the docks hopefully it will happen

Uh no thats not correct. The plans are to expand the docks on its current site.

galwaycyclist

Storm 10 wrote: »

No way could you restrict traffic from the docks , coal lorries, fuel tankers, bitumen tankers, Bus Eireann buses and City link buses are all down there, you could not restrict them just because of cyclists, the economy has to keep on the move and when ships are in they have to be unloaded asap.
,

Uh no. Activities that require HGVs have no place in a town centre.

Mrs OBumble

Storm 10 wrote: »

The plans are to build a new harbour outside the City and have a Marina in the docks hopefully it will happen

Indeed - but what route will the HGVs from the new port take?

As for cyclists complaining about a pedestrian guard rail - get over it! No reason why pedestrians should not have protection. And from driving under there this morning, the cycle lane looks generously wide.

what_traffic

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Indeed - but what route will the HGVs from the new port take?

As for cyclists complaining about a pedestrian guard rail - get over it! No reason why pedestrians should not have protection. And from driving under there this morning, the cycle lane looks generously wide.

In the planning submission for the port HGV's were to use Lough Atalia Inbound and Outbound. Not via the two main public transport hubs on the Fairgreen Road.

You are very much mistaken if you think these pedestrian rails can protect pedestrians. That is NOT their function. I think you are mistaking them for crash barriers.

Iwannahurl

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

As for cyclists complaining about a pedestrian guard rail - get over it!

No reason why pedestrians should not have protection.

A very unfortunate choice of words.

There is an inherent problem with guard rail in such situations. If guard rail is supposedly required in a given location to protect pedestrians from motorised traffic, then self-evidently it is possible that cyclists will come between the vehicles and the guard rail.

The danger arises because the cyclists literally can not get over the guard rail if a vehicle comes too near them, and are therefore exposed to a much greater risk than if there was no guard rail at all.

In the UK there have been several tragedies where cyclists were crushed against guard rail, typically by large vehicles such as HGVs or buses. Pedestrians should have protection, just not at the expense of cyclists. I sincerely hope that is not what is happening at Lough Atalia Road, though I haven't seen the new layout yet so I have to reserve my opinion.

http://www.cycling-embassy.org.uk/dictionary/guard-rail

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/woman-cyclist-crushed-to-death-by-lorry-as-she-turns-corner-6887847.html

http://crapwalthamforest.blogspot.ie/2010/03/crushed-to-death-in-hackney.html

http://www.hackneygazette.co.uk/news/hackney_cycle_safe_campaign_lorries_in_the_frame_1_817202

https://www.tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/guidance-assessment-pedestrian-guardrail.pdf

GalwayMagpie

Aside from the HGV issue, are people in favor or against the new arrangement ?

Do people think this will improve or dis-improve traffic congestion in the city?

littleteapot

I'm not a fan of the new arrangement. I went out from town under the bridge yesterday (saturday) at around 7pm and it was mayhem with all the traffic criss-crossing on fairgreen to get into the right lanes. It just doesn't make sense. I imagine that it will be a disaster during rush hour traffic.

GalwayMagpie

Coming down from prospect hill is no different, coming up from Lough Atalia could be better. I think if the temporary barriers were removed from the center of the road, switching would be easier.

I have been going from Renmore to College Rd at 6:30pm, several evenings a week for the past month, occasionally someone gets caught in the wrong lane and causes issues, but this has been less frequent with time. Last week I had no issues at all.

littleteapot

But with the new set up everybody coming out from town by going under the bridge is going to start out in the wrong lane and has to switch. Same deal with everybody who is headed to eyre square. The only route I can see that doesn't result in wrong lanes/lane switching is the one you're doing Galway magpie

GalwayMagpie

For those coming in Lough Atalia, there is enough space on that road to have 2 right turning lanes going up Fairgreen, so everybody is in the correct lane going up the hill (except for queue jumpers). I am not sure if there is enough space on the outbound route for 2 left turning lanes - but I'm sure some engineer could find the space/solution.

Iwannahurl

GalwayMagpie wrote: »

Aside from the HGV issue, are people in favor or against the new arrangement ?

Do people think this will improve or dis-improve traffic congestion in the city?

It will rearrange traffic congestion in the city.

crusier

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It will rearrange traffic congestion in the city.

We'd still be driving through shop street as the main route through Galway if some people got their way, its now a great improvement for HGVs and the port and subsequently for Galway, if there has to be minor tweaks at a later stage soo be it, cyclists begruding pedestrians a safety railing for Christ sake!

ratracer

I would think the railing is necessary there as the footpath is about 18" higher than the road.

galwaycyclist

crusier wrote: »

, cyclists begruding pedestrians a safety railing for Christ sake!

A likely outcome of road design that is hostile for cyclists is that some of them start cycling on the footpath. This reduces the amenity and value of the footpath for the lawful users.

Pedestrians benefit from road designs that take account of the likely presence of cyclists.

(Simply marking a token cycle lane is not the same thing as taking account of the likely presence of cyclists.)

Galwayguy1985

One way system along College Road and Lough Atalia Road will be an utter disaster as
1 traffic is travelling far in excess of permitted speed limit and the dual carriageway encourages overtaking at excessive speed and "ratracing". This is extremely dangerous especially on college road which is a densly populated residential area.
2 Numerous times i have witnessed traffic travelling down the wrong way. With so many tourists stayinying in b&bs on college rd the risk of tourists unfamiliar with one way set up greatly intensifies.
3. Implementing a one way system is very unfair on the residents of college rd and lough atalia road as there will be excessive noise pollution from speeding cars and a very circuitus route to access their properties. There is also greater risk of collision as they access and egress Their properties.
4. It is utter madness to divrt HGVs up college road from Galway port. The most direct and safest route would be along l.a. road. These heavy goods vehichles carrying oil, and other dangerous materials up fairgreen road which transects the train bus and coach station yeats private school and the private residences at college road is completely wrong due to risks of collision risk to cyclists as the hgv makes a turn and noise pollution to the residents.
5. Cyclists will use footpath to travel kn to town allng college rd with risk of injury to pedestrians.
6.the bicycle share depot at city hall will be rendered sterile As nobody will use it to travel kn to town.
7.many motorists avoided this route during works to bridge.
in view of the foregoing valid concerns i fail to see how the current situation could pass a safety audit. It takes just one car to exit the housing estates or private residences on college road and turn the wronh way for a fatal road traffic collision. The speed at which traffic is travelling will most certainly result in fatalities. Also remember with the planned expansion of galway harbour it is predicted that hgv traffic will double. It would be utter madness to divert yhis traffic up fairhreen rd forster st and college road when lough atalia road would be the safest option and most direct route.

Zzippy

Also - the one-way system won't be on GPS/satnavs used by tourists, so very easy to see someone being directed to turn left/right on College Road towards Eyre Square leaving their B&B and head against the flow of traffic. Easy for residents to remember but there is a very large number of transient visitors staying in that area, unfamiliar with the road layout, already unfamiliar with driving on the left, and could have a satnav pointing them into a head-on collision.

the untitled user

crusier wrote: »

cyclists begruding pedestrians a safety railing for Christ sake!

For good reason. See post #397.

Galwayguy1985 wrote: »

1 traffic is travelling far in excess of permitted speed limit and the dual carriageway encourages overtaking at excessive speed and "ratracing". This is extremely dangerous especially on college road which is a densly populated residential area.

I've seen this mentioned a few times in the thread, but I assure you this is nothing new. Late night in particular the cabbies would bomb along college road at over 100km regularly on their way back into town to catch the next fare. Had some particularly nerve wracking experience with buses and HGVs too on Lough Atalia careering along at off peak hours.

Galwayguy1985 wrote: »

5. Cyclists will use footpath to travel kn to town allng college rd with risk of injury to pedestrians.

Contraflow cycle lane should fix it pretty quickly, as you see in most European cities. I'm pretty sure the road is wide enough for it as it is.

Zzippy wrote: »

Also - the one-way system won't be on GPS/satnavs used by tourists, so very easy to see someone being directed to turn left/right on College Road towards Eyre Square leaving their B&B and head against the flow of traffic. Easy for residents to remember but there is a very large number of transient visitors staying in that area, unfamiliar with the road layout, already unfamiliar with driving on the left, and could have a satnav pointing them into a head-on collision.

Come on, it'll only be a few weeks before most of the major maps systems are updated. That's hardly a valid reason, and good signage should combat it.

Zzippy

the untitled user wrote: »

Come on, it'll only be a few weeks before most of the major maps systems are updated. That's hardly a valid reason, and good signage should combat it.

Just pointing out a possibly dangerous situation. Most people very rarely update their satnavs. I've only done mine once and it's 2 years old. I'm sure I'm not the odd one out of thousands...

Francis1995

No, the speed of traffic along Forster Street and College Road has intensified greatly since the one way system along both lanes was implemented. ( College Road only begins at the top of the hill.) Ditto for speeding at Lough Atalia Road. This is only to be expected when effectively what is a dual carrideway is in my opinion recklessly allowed to operate by Galway City Council. Cars are overtaking at high speed on both lanes.Naturally Pedestrians are very fearful walking the pavement on College Road with cars travelling at such excessive speeds. Please remember that this is a residential area with a private school, Yeats College. The students of the latter school congregate on the pavement during break times as there is no off-street facilities available to them. The parents dropping off their children and collecting them have no place to park but illegally park on the street which will add to the risk of a fatal collision, especially considering there is a dangerous turn before one approaches this school. The students at this school also play football on the street. Their lives are put at risk with the excessive speeding vehichles on College Road with the present dual carrigeway.

The point about there being many transient visitors to the numerous B&Bs on College Road heightens the risk of them travelling the wrong way when exiting a premises. Ditto for Glenmore & The Green housing estates also located on College Road.
I also agree that it is most unfair to the established residents on College Road and Lough Atalia Road to foist upon them what is essentially a dual carridgeway outside their front doors. Just think of the noise pollution with the excessive speed not to mention the risks when accessing or exiting their properties and the roundabout way will have to access their properties. It seems wrong to me.

It also seems proposterous to have such a heavy concentration of traffic using the Fairgreen Road ( at the side of Radisson) at the same time, as rightly highlighted earlier, this will include 6 axel HGVs traffic carrying hazardous waste from the port, together with articulated lorries and coaches. All of this HGV traffic passing by a road which intersects CIE Bus & Train Station and the private Coach station. This is particularly hazardous for cyclists as the HGVs make a left hand and right hand turn, not to mention the risk to pedestrians. Wouldn't it make alot more sense for this HGV traffic to travel east along Lough Atalia Road eastwards as it has done since time immemorial without incident.

Also I would disagree with an earlier poster who incorrectly stated that it would be possible to put a cycle lane running against traffic down the hill from City Hall towards Eyre Square. This would be impossible as the road is too narrow to allow a cycle lane. In fact the pavement at points is so narrow only one person at a time can walk on it. Therefore the earlier point is quite valid viz. cyclists wishing to travel towards Eyre Square will cycle on the footpath at College Road / Forster Street and endanger the lives of the pedestrians, especially down the hill where the pavement is quite narrow and cyclists will be travelling at speed.

With the expansion of Galway Port it is outrageous to divert HGVs towards Forster Street and College Road i.e. densely residential areas. The harbour redevelopment plan was based upon HGV traffic using Lough Atalia Road and not College Road, I would call upon Galway City Council to see sense and reinstate the road as it was in the interests of safety alone.

As mentioned by an earlier contributor how can GCC say this is a valid 3 week trial of one way system when they have removed some of the traffic lights and pedestrian crossings as existed hitherto?

what_traffic

In todays Connacht Tribune
http://connachttribune.ie/decision-due-this-month-on-galway-port-redevelopment-091/

galah

A few well placed permanent speed cameras should put a stop to the speeding quite efficiently, i'd like to think.

It amazes me that local and central government are usually very good at fleecing the populace, but havent yet implemented this brilliant, easy cash generating tool yet...(with the added benefit of making our streets safer).
between speed cameras and red light cameras the city could make a fortune off all the crappy drivers out there!:pac:

Zzippy

galah wrote: »

A few well placed permanent speed cameras should put a stop to the speeding quite efficiently, i'd like to think.

It amazes me that local and central government are usually very good at fleecing the populace, but havent yet implemented this brilliant, easy cash generating tool yet...(with the added benefit of making our streets safer).
between speed cameras and red light cameras the city could make a fortune off all the crappy drivers out there!:pac:

Unfortunately the city doesn't have the power to enforce any motoring laws except those related to parking, and can't collect revenue from speed cameras. It all goes into a central pot. I'd imagine red light cameras, in particular, would be particularly profitable in Galway!

WallyGUFC

Surely they could just throw a GoSafe van on both Lough Atalia and College Road? It would actually be serving it's purpose for once, reducing speed (instead of shooting fish in a barrel).

Francis1995

Isn't it unfair on the residents of College Road and Lough Atalia Road to make it one way. Also what about the hazards involved in diverting HGV traffic from the port up Fairgreen Road and Forster Street and College Road... all densly populated areas. It also seems madness to have so much traffic converging on Fairgreen Road.

Francis1995

One way system with no public consultation. Incidentally does anybody know if Planning Permission is required to change a road to a one way system? Certainly the lack of public consultation is a breach of natural and administrative law and possibly the Aarhus Convention.

Julabo

Why not give it the 3 weeks, and then make up our minds?

dloob

WallyGUFC wrote: »

Surely they could just throw a GoSafe van on both Lough Atalia and College Road? It would actually be serving it's purpose for once, reducing speed (instead of shooting fish in a barrel).

You need to have had several collisions and possibly a fatality in the last the 5 years for a route to be added to the GoSafe scheme.
The vans can't be used outside the designated zones.

death1234567

dloob wrote: »

You need to have had several collisions and possibly a fatality in the last the 5 years for a route to be added to the GoSafe scheme.
The vans can't be used outside the designated zones.

The private vans can't but the Garda vans/Speed guns can go wherever they like. I have seen the gardaí out checking for speeding on lough atalia before, both motorbike Gardaí and Speed van.

dloob

death1234567 wrote: »

The private vans can't but the Garda vans/Speed guns can go wherever they like. I have seen the gardaí out checking for speeding on lough atalia before, both motorbike Gardaí and Speed van.

Yeah the Guarda can go where ever they want.
Their vans are usually more subtle too without all the stickers of the gosafe vans.