€130,000- What can I build?

begod

I have mortgage approval of €130,000. I haven't a clue what size home or type or quality of home I could build for this.

Could anyone give me examples of what kind of one off house (Bungalow/Dormer bungalow) I could build for this amount of money. Pictures, square footage would be great.

Take it that the site, planning permission, drawings etc. are already paid for.

Thanks in advance.

sydthebeat

begod wrote: »

I have mortgage approval of €130,000. I haven't a clue what size home or type or quality of home I could build for this.

Could anyone give me examples of what kind of one off house (Bungalow/Dormer bungalow) I could build for this amount of money. Pictures, square footage would be great.

Take it that the site, planning permission, drawings etc. are already paid for.

Thanks in advance.

bog standard house by contractor, to turn key finish... you MIGHT get a 1000-1100 sq ft house. That would typically be a modest 3 bed.

the site will dictate what the design should be

vinnie13

just a rough guide but and i stress the BUT it can depend on how you want it finished marble counters gold tps etc

http://www.geograph.ie/photo/1300319
really you have all the hard work done building the house is easy.

if you can manage the project yourself you will save a good bit to.
get pictures from the net of what you would like to build and get architect to maybe create something for you

BryanF

Assuming all professional fees & planning fees are excluded from the 130k..

BryanF

vinnie13 wrote: »

just a rough guide but and i stress the BUT it can depend on how you want it finished marble counters gold tps etc

http://www.geograph.ie/photo/1300319
really you have all the hard work done building the house is easy.

if you can manage the project yourself you will save a good bit to.
get pictures from the net of what you would like to build and get architect to maybe create something for you

New regs mean the OP will struggle to do what your suggesting

vinnie13

BryanF wrote: »

New regs mean the OP will struggle to do what your suggesting

whys that?im doing it for my build starting in a few weeks.
theres nothing in the regs to say you cant organise the build and the contractors yourself.
the new regs requre the architect to visit the site to assure it is been done properly

sydthebeat

vinnie13 wrote: »

whys that?im doing it for my build starting in a few weeks.
theres nothing in the regs to say you cant organise the build and the contractors yourself.
the new regs requre the architect to visit the site to assure it is been done properly

The regs say you have to appoint a competent builder.

vinnie13

sydthebeat wrote: »

The regs say you have to appoint a competent builder.

and how will that stop op doing what i said?

sydthebeat

vinnie13 wrote: »

and how will that stop op doing what i said?

I was just clarifying for you because you forget to mention it

begod

sydthebeat wrote: »

The regs say you have to appoint a competent builder.

Thanks for the replies, but just to note that it is a council mortgage so they have told me I have go with a registered contractor.

sydthebeat

begod wrote: »

Thanks for the replies, but just to note that it is a council mortgage so they have told me I have go with a registered contractor.

And so it starts

hexosan

With a registered contractor and all the associated professional fees you'll get next to nothing in a new build for your €130k. Something along the lines of a dog box. You'd be far better off buying a second hand house, saving yourself a ton of hassle. This is from someone building at the moment.

begod

hexosan wrote: »

With a registered contractor and all the associated professional fees you'll get next to nothing in a new build for your €130k. Something along the lines of a dog box. You'd be far better off buying a second hand house, saving yourself a ton of hassle. This is from someone building at the moment.

We were planning on buying but then we got a site for free in a location we like.

"a dog box" That's depressing, I was thinking we wouldn't be able to build anything special just a simple bungalow but not the equivalent of a dog box!

kkelliher

This is an impossible question to answer as you will need to factor in so many variables.

Site
Drainage requirements
sewage requirements
Water requifements
Esb/eircom etc
Planning costs.
contributions (which could be 10% of your budget alone depending on location)
Professional fees
Site tests
boundary treatments and site lines
And then the house
and then the entrance
And then the driveway
and then the patio
And then the shed
An so on

And dont forget the tax man will take another 13.5%

And thats not including furniture etc

And after all that your next door neighbour puts their house on the market for 100k less than you just spent.

In my opinion 130k will not get alot built when you take off planning fees, professional fees and contributions alone

begod

kkelliher wrote: »

This is an impossible question to answer as you will need to factor in so many variables.

Site
Drainage requirements
sewage requirements
Water requifements
Esb/eircom etc
Planning costs.
contributions (which could be 10% of your budget alone depending on location)
Professional fees
Site tests
boundary treatments and site lines
And then the house
and then the entrance
And then the driveway
and then the patio
And then the shed
An so on

And dont forget the tax man will take another 13.5%

And thats not including furniture etc

And after all that your next door neighbour puts their house on the market for 100k less than you just spent.

In my opinion 130k will not get alot built when you take off planning fees, professional fees and contributions alone

130k for just:

1.House build alone with (bungalow with modern standard insulation) built to plastered finish with all fixtures and fittings etc.

2.Normal septic tank

3.Fitted kitchen

4.Solid fuel stove and oil connection


Exclude everything else.

We have all the furniture all ready.

All the rest paid for from savings.( Planning, site work, connections etc.)

Anyone have any examples of houses and square footage "I built this for this amount of money" for example?

kkelliher

begod wrote: »

130k for just:

1.House build alone with (bungalow with modern standard insulation) built to plastered finish with all fixtures and fittings etc.

2.Normal septic tank

3.Fitted kitchen

4.Solid fuel stove and oil connection


Exclude everything else.

We have all the furniture all ready.

All the rest paid for from savings.( Planning, site work, connections etc.)

Anyone have any examples of houses and square footage "I built this for this amount of money" for example?

Hope you have lots of savings.
You cant possibly know what the septic tank requirements are without tests and you will get a mountain of answers to your last question if you do a search on boards but the trouble is if you can believe everything you read and whats included in the price. As someone who does this everyday, a budget of 130k will not build you a home of more than 1000ft2 and even at that it will be a struggle and you will be finishing and decorating it for a long time after

shedweller

This is depressing me! He'd be better off buying a finished house for the same amount and it would be bigger, no hassle with building, no bullsh1t taxes just because you're building...
Altogether better to just buy a house! I'm in a doer upper at the mo and have a normal enough mortgage on it but the house is worth maybe a third what i paid for it. To do it up would cost as much as a finished house today. Depressing.
Carry on!

kkelliher

shedweller wrote: »

This is depressing me! He'd be better off buying a finished house for the same amount and it would be bigger, no hassle with building, no bullsh1t taxes just because you're building...
Altogether better to just buy a house! I'm in a doer upper at the mo and have a normal enough mortgage on it but the house is worth maybe a third what i paid for it. To do it up would cost as much as a finished house today. Depressing.
Carry on!

Couldn't agree more.
I just finished a refurbishment project with a client who spent 360k and house on road for sale asking 235. Client had no intention of ever leaving buts its still hard to justify

mandy gall

We are starting a self build of a bungalow 2800 sq ft with a budget of 150,000 and will have change out of that! Our home will be of high spec and highly efficient. So have hope you just need to research and use your head with every decision. These new regs will change everything though!

kkelliher

mandy gall wrote: »

We are starting a self build of a bungalow 2800 sq ft with a budget of 150,000 and will have change out of that! Our home will be of high spec and highly efficient. So have hope you just need to research and use your head with every decision. These new regs will change everything though!

For clarity "With a budget of" does not equal what it cost and it also does not detail inclusions, exclusions, free labour, supervision, cost of own time etc

mandy gall

If all you have is 150,000 then you HAVE to build your home for 150,000. Just saying it can be done. We have family who are living in fine homes built for 150,000. You have to be willing to give every spare minute to it. The Government are trying to take rights away from the self builder - outrageous.

kkelliher

mandy gall wrote: »

If all you have is 150,000 then you HAVE to build your home for 150,000. Just saying it can be done. We have family who are living in fine homes built for 150,000. You have to be willing to give every spare minute to it. The Government are trying to take rights away from the self builder - outrageous.

Just because you have to does not mean you can. Also giving every spare minute has a cost which most people have to pay for and therefore 150k is not a true cost. People believe what they read and people will believe you can fully build a 2800ft2 house for 150k as you have stated when the reality is you cant unless you add in free labour to an unquantified amount of work.

have2flushtwice

mandy gall wrote: »

If all you have is 150,000 then you HAVE to build your home for 150,000. Just saying it can be done. We have family who are living in fine homes built for 150,000. You have to be willing to give every spare minute to it. The Government are trying to take rights away from the self builder - outrageous.

Well done mandy gall, almost every post on the thread so far has been shooting down the op, that the op hasnt got a hope of doing it. Good to see positivity, and a can do mentality.

have2flushtwice

Kk, how do u put a value on your time doing research into the build, whether u go contract or self build? If u go direct and trust an engineer to manage your next 30 years of investment, and expect not to be involved, eg hes being paid so it will be done right attitude, is that value?

I know a 2850 sq ft house built for 273k, knock off d big garage and ur 150k is bang on the money, they shopped around, bought some material well before time to use it, and were smart about making decisions.

kkelliher wrote: »

Just because you have to does not mean you can. Also giving every spare minute has a cost which most people have to pay for and therefore 150k is not a true cost. People believe what they read and people will believe you can fully build a 2800ft2 house for 150k as you have stated when the reality is you cant unless you add in free labour to an unquantified amount of work.

mandy gall

Yes its all about using your head and shopping around for materials and if at all possible avoiding the building contractor!! And i know you cant put a price on your time but if a man wants to spend his time building a home for his wife and kids i dont think any of them will count his hours days and months spent doing it - its done for love.

bee06

mandy gall wrote: »

Yes its all about using your head and shopping around for materials and if at all possible avoiding the building contractor!! And i know you cant put a price on your time but if a man wants to spend his time building a home for his wife and kids i dont think any of them will count his hours days and months spent doing it - its done for love.

OP has already said he has to use a contractor because he's getting a council mortgage so avoiding one isn't an option.

antiskeptic

Could OP not sell the site he got for free and add the proceeds to the mortgage so as to buy something unencumbered by the new regs. I'm sure a way around the new regs will be found in time but for now...

mandy gall

I hope he gets a decent price. Everyone has the right to own property. There's great satisfaction in watching your home evolving from the ground up. Good luck in the future of house-building in Ireland! It should be most interesting. By the way be sure to ask the contractor for a breakdown of the price incl materials! Also ask him if you can do the shopping around for materials? Its your money after all!

BryanF

mandy gall wrote: »

The Government are trying to take rights away from the self builder - outrageous.

please take read of forum charter before post again. Note this is not politics forum. Thank you (ie cut out the ranting thank you)

Happyman42

BryanF wrote: »

please take read of forum charter before post again. Note this is not politics forum. Thank you (ie cut out the ranting thank you)

How's about cutting out posts like this

BryanF wrote:

New regs mean the OP will struggle to do what your suggesting

The OP ddn't specify any 'type or size' of house. Are you seriously saying he couldn't put any structure up when the planning, drawings and site are paid for?
This forum is getting next to useless with all the 'ah jaysus, yeh can't be doing that' posts. He asked for very particular advice, give it or leave it to those who want to give it.

galwaytt

mandy gall wrote: »

We are starting a self build of a bungalow 2800 sq ft with a budget of 150,000 and will have change out of that! Our home will be of high spec and highly efficient. So have hope you just need to research and use your head with every decision. These new regs will change everything though!

Sorry, but there's no way you will build a house of that size, to meet regs etc for that budget. Btdt, have the T-shirt.

have2flushtwice wrote: »

Well done mandy gall, almost every post on the thread so far has been shooting down the op, that the op hasnt got a hope of doing it. Good to see positivity, and a can do mentality.

Don't confuse positivity with naivete. No one has put down OP. He asked what his budget would get and he's been told what. There is no put-down.

have2flushtwice wrote: »

Kk, how do u put a value on your time doing research into the build, whether u go contract or self build? If u go direct and trust an engineer to manage your next 30 years of investment, and expect not to be involved, eg hes being paid so it will be done right attitude, is that value?

I know a 2850 sq ft house built for 273k, knock off d big garage and ur 150k is bang on the money, they shopped around, bought some material well before time to use it, and were smart about making decisions.

What spec, size and when, and to conform to new March 1st regs ?

mandy gall wrote: »

Yes its all about using your head and shopping around for materials and if at all possible avoiding the building contractor!! And i know you cant put a price on your time but if a man wants to spend his time building a home for his wife and kids i dont think any of them will count his hours days and months spent doing it - its done for love.

Can't avoid contractor from March 1st......

begod wrote: »

I have mortgage approval of €130,000. I haven't a clue what size home or type or quality of home I could build for this.

Could anyone give me examples of what kind of one off house (Bungalow/Dormer bungalow) I could build for this amount of money. Pictures, square footage would be great.

Take it that the site, planning permission, drawings etc. are already paid for.

Thanks in advance.

110sq is my estimate. If you avoid dormer's and hip roof's your money will go further. Build something contemporary with a monopitch roof and it'll go further still. Contemp doesn't have to mean plain or boring either btw.

hexosan

mandy gall wrote: »

We are starting a self build of a bungalow 2800 sq ft with a budget of 150,000 and will have change out of that! Our home will be of high spec and highly efficient. So have hope you just need to research and use your head with every decision. These new regs will change everything though!

Your living in dreamland with statements like this,
Is €150,000 your budget for everything, planning, architect, engineer, solicitor, stamp duty, valuations for mortgage, council contributions, site insurance, percolation , groundwork,
All of that is before there's even a block laid & remember a bungalow is more expensive per sq ft to build as it requires larger foundations (so more Filling, steel, concrete, insulation, labour) it also requires a larger roof (more timber, insulation, slates, labour)

I'm in the middle of building at the moment and I "shop around" for ever single element and there's no way you can make the savings people claim on this site, labour has come down considerably and money can be saved here but cheapest is not always best. The trades I've used so far I've had to wait for because their flat out working so your not going to beat a guy like that down on price. A lad that can quote low and start next week is someone you should watch out for. I'm on site every single day that there's work been done and it eats up every spare minute I have also include the hours & hours that disappear researching & researching every single thing online. Prepare to have no life whatsoever for the duration of the build.

materials have increased in price and are still going up.
Once you include higher levels of insulation (legal requirement of the building regs) (plus if you cut corners here your only fooling yourself) triple glazed windows, doors there's next to nothing left out of that €150k budget so don't be making statements backed up by nothing other than a finger in the air sure we can build for that and still have change at the end.
Can you provide a breakdown of your estimated costs because all the people that come on here claims build costs like your ALWAYS fail to do so.
The only part of your statement that's true is ALL YOU'LL HAVE AT THE END IS CHANGE IN YOUR POCKET to go along with an empty bank account and a nowhere near fully finished house.

kkelliher

have2flushtwice wrote: »

Well done mandy gall, almost every post on the thread so far has been shooting down the op, that the op hasnt got a hope of doing it. Good to see positivity, and a can do mentality.

Why be positive for the sake of it? The facts dont lie and you can have all the can do mentality you want but that does not pay for materials, labour, plant, equipment, etc etc

kkelliher

have2flushtwice wrote: »

Kk, how do u put a value on your time doing research into the build, whether u go contract or self build? If u go direct and trust an engineer to manage your next 30 years of investment, and expect not to be involved, eg hes being paid so it will be done right attitude, is that value?

I know a 2850 sq ft house built for 273k, knock off d big garage and ur 150k is bang on the money, they shopped around, bought some material well before time to use it, and were smart about making decisions.

My god i hope you put alot more effort into your budget calculation than the above.

I also hope all your documents are perfect and all fully detailed so you dont have any changes onsite and additional costs like the majority of projects as most have a 20-30% overspend.

In respect to your engineer what you expect, what you get and what you pay for are three different things and the level of supervision and involvement comes down to your agreement.

jigsaw50

For a house in south Leinster circa 3000 sq foot.

Build costs all in €77.9
With council fees €79.7
With professional fees € 82.28

Should help with your budget.
Shop around, and use the magic 3 quotations for all pricing, also invest in a very detailed specification, pre tender, and a builder you like, you will be talking with him/her every other day for the bones of 8 months.

straight

You can get a builders finish for under 60 euro per square foot...

DOCARCH

straight wrote: »

You can get a builders finish for under 60 euro per square foot...

When was that?

With new(ish) building regulations (i.e. Part L), new building control regulations and new health and safety regulations, I think getting a build at E60/sq.ft. may be pie in the sky (these days)!

sydthebeat

straight wrote: »

You can get a builders finish for under 60 euro per square foot...

Maybe in the nineties with a bog standard finish.

I wish people would include EVERYTHING when giving examples like this.

Council development charges, connection fees, professional fees, insurances etc all could constitute as much as 10-15% of the ops budget. ...

kkelliher

sydthebeat wrote: »

Maybe in the nineties with a bog standard finish.

I wish people would include EVERYTHING when giving examples like this.

Council development charges, connection fees, professional fees, insurances etc all could constitute as much as 10-15% of the ops budget. ...

And items like kitchens, wardrobes, tiles, decoration generally do not normally come included in "builders finish". External works requirements including septic tank, entrance, boundary etc can vary widely from site to site and also usually no account taken of cost of windows over and above upvc and this is why cost per ft2 is a complete waste of time.

vinnie13

Awful lot or negative responses or jealousy to op's question.
Don't mind it op you can build a nice house for the cash you have.
After all tradesmen are 10a penny these days
Septic tanks are a thing if the past
Go to bord Na Mona their engineer is 500 to inspect your plot and suggest a treatment plant
Foundations get a digger in for a day 500
Concert is about 100 m2 plus 1500 steel
Now it's blocks or timber frame shop around
Then roof and Windows
Next step there is a lot happening plumbers chippys sparks etc again shop around
After they finish it's a paint and furnish
Can't stress shopping around enough prices vary dramatically but labour is cheap.
With materials shop around but go to these personaly and look for a deal if you buy from them most will give trade discount because of how much your spending avoid chain diy stores go to a independent supplier

kkelliher

I have just received back 5 tenders for a new build in dublin region for a house of 2700 ft2 and the build cost excluding any site purchase costs, excluding professional fees, excluding contributions and any connection fees but including a fully finished house with all boundary walls, pavings, entrance, drainage works and topsoil (excludes planting) has come back with a lowest tender of over €175/ft2. This is a one off with an existing house to be demolished. It meets all current regs and includes costs of a garage.

There is no chance that it can be "built" to a builders finish or any other made up form of finish for anything close to the costs that are being quoted on this forum and anyone setting out on the process should not be hoodwinked into fairyland to believe it can. Ireland needs to wake up and stop the constant belief that anyone can build and that anyone should be entitled to build their own home with their own hands. Its not allowed in any other country unless under direct building control supervision and the likes of priory hall etc should always be in mind. If you pay peanuts you get monkeys and a figure that sounds too good to be true generally is

kkelliher

vinnie13 wrote: »

Awful lot or negative responses or jealousy to op's question

Jealousy ? Of a person who has asked for advise and has received same which clearly indicates that they do not have a large enough budget to build a property as big as they clearly wanted.

if you dont like the answers dont ask the questions. You can always pay for professional advise in a private setting.

kkelliher

vinnie13 wrote: »

Awful lot or negative responses or jealousy to op's question.
Don't mind it op you can build a nice house for the cash you have.
After all tradesmen are 10a penny these days
Septic tanks are a thing if the past
Go to bord Na Mona their engineer is 500 to inspect your plot and suggest a treatment plant
Foundations get a digger in for a day 500
Concert is about 100 m2 plus 1500 steel
Now it's blocks or timber frame shop around
Then roof and Windows
Next step there is a lot happening plumbers chippys sparks etc again shop around
After they finish it's a paint and furnish
Can't stress shopping around enough prices vary dramatically but labour is cheap.
With materials shop around but go to these personaly and look for a deal if you buy from them most will give trade discount because of how much your spending avoid chain diy stores go to a independent supplier

For what size house? 1500 for steel irrespective of size?

Materials have never being as expensive as they currently are. Timber is now more expensive for the manufacturers to buy from a forest than we used to pay the merchant. Concrete, quinnlites have both gone up 6-8% this year and labour is already in short supply in alot of trades. Siptu are already gearing up for pay rises. Building is getting more expensive day by day and with new regs on a yearly basis that will not change

vinnie13

Pay no attention op fools and their money are easy parted,
Lads we were taking about a average 3bed (like the one in kink I posted earlier had someone had taken a min to read it with my reference to the steel)
I also said in a earlier post it all takes into account the finish required marble counters etc.

I really wish people would read whole threads instead of just the last few comments.

FYI the 3bed Simi in the average housing estate built in the boom that sold for 350k+ were built including the tarmac street lighting etc for 60k
Not including site purchase

Op I googled log cabins and seen a few really nice ones erected within your budget obviously a transport cost but still worth looking at if it's your thing

vinnie13

kkelliher wrote: »

For what size house? 1500 for steel irrespective of size?

Materials have never being as expensive as they currently are. Timber is now more expensive for the manufacturers to buy from a forest than we used to pay the merchant. Concrete, quinnlites have both gone up 6-8% this year and labour is already in short supply in alot of trades. Siptu are already gearing up for pay rises. Building is getting more expensive day by day and with new regs on a yearly basis that will not change

Iv to timber yards beside me that haven't changed price in years go's up a couple of cents then down wouldnt have a huge effect on a house around me

kkelliher

vinnie13 wrote: »

FYI the 3bed Simi in the average housing estate built in the boom that sold for 350k+ were built including the tarmac street lighting etc for 60k
Not including site purchase

You can compare a house in an estate where multipal units are built at once with a one off. It also depended on location, spec of finish and house style. Some estates have mains connection others their own system and costs vary wildly as a result.

Having worked on the construction of over 300 units in the years 2003-2007 we never built any unit for less than €160/ft (plus vat) when all costs were factored in excluding site but we did build decent spec houses with granite countertops, cills, natueral slate etc and all paved areas with cast iron light posts etc.

No two houses are the same and no two sites are the same and i have never seen (in over 16 years of actual knowledge of what the costs of ALL parts are) two houses with the same final costs

BryanF

vinnie13 wrote: »

Pay no attention op fools and their money are easy parted,
Lads we were taking about a average 3bed (like the one in kink I posted earlier had someone had taken a min to read it with my reference to the steel)
I also said in a earlier post it all takes into account the finish required marble counters etc.

I really wish people would read whole threads instead of just the last few comments.

FYI the 3bed Simi in the average housing estate built in the boom that sold for 350k+ were built including the tarmac street lighting etc for 60k
Not including site purchase

Op I googled log cabins and seen a few really nice ones erected within your budget obviously a transport cost but still worth looking at if it's your thing

This sums up this debate nicely. The post starts ( and I paraphrase)'don't listen to QS & others who are recommending the OP needs realistic expectations'
'you can build what you want for your budget'
the second paragraph, continues with 'this is what I claim I finished a house for'.(new regs in their current form, make this a problem for the OP as the self build option now means having a main contractor)
Then final post suggests ' you can do this! Google suggests it can be done'

vinnie13

OP check this site out it will have mote skilled help and better informed answers cutting out all the builder bull

http://selfbuildinireland.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=2342ab3b0b2112109dfcdc8f19ae00d9&

mandy gall

Kkeliher To what countries are you referring to that you cant self build??? The uk have enshrined self builds and of course when an inspector comes and sees something wrong it must be rectified. Rightly so. Its funny you should mention monkeys as im beginning to think it was monkeys who drew up these new regs. We WILL build a top spec house with 150,000 and will show you how pics and all! You got a quote for 175 euro sqft in dublin but dont ye have the Luas there? The prices we are talking are for rural ireland.

893bet

mandy gall wrote: »

Kkeliher To what countries are you referring to that you cant self build??? The uk have enshrined self builds and of course when an inspector comes and sees something wrong it must be rectified. Rightly so. Its funny you should mention monkeys as im beginning to think it was monkeys who drew up these new regs. We WILL build a top spec house with 150,000 and will show you how pics and all! You got a quote for 175 euro sqft in dublin but dont ye have the Luas there? The prices we are talking are for rural ireland.

Have you started your build yet?

mandy gall

Waiting to see what happens with these regs