Why don't we riot like mad ejits

teR_

You turn on the news and ya see all these countries around us that were/are in the shlt, there all running around like lunatics breaking things and burning stuff.

Here we are and we don't even do the peaceful side of it, am I the only one disappointed in our incapacity to do anythings?

P_1

Because contrary to popular belief we aren't actually mad ejits....

Although TIL the german finance ministry is in the same building that a certain Herr Goering used to occupy

Overheal

go play tropico and see what a placating effect rum has on the population.

sin_city

Why would we be going mad?

Half of us are getting money from the other half for nothing:

Sweet deal that they probably don't get in other countries
http://www.finfacts.ie/irishfinancenews/article_1026476.shtml

spiralism

P_1 wrote: »

Because contrary to popular belief we aren't actually mad ejits....

Although TIL the german finance ministry is in the same building that a certain Herr Goering used to occupy

Not sure why that's much of a fuss. They drive on the Autobahns in that country too and they were designed and built by the Nazis.

Personally im one of those people that would be a lot more comfortable with the Germans running things through Europe than who we've historically put in charge.

Maybe that's why we don't riot, because we kinda know deep down that others may know what's better for us than we do.

sawdoubters

they put something in the water

KyussBishop

spiralism wrote: »

Personally im one of those people that would be a lot more comfortable with the Germans running things through Europe than who we've historically put in charge.

Maybe that's why we don't riot, because we kinda know deep down that others may know what's better for us than we do.

Germany certainly doesn't know what's better for us, only what's better for Germany - they have torpedoed or neutered every opportunity at real economic reform within the EU, that can provide recovery.

Germany doesn't give a toss for any country in Europe except their own - happy to take all the economic benefits the Euro provides to their country (the currency has benefited Germany far more than any other EU country), while blocking the economic measures needed to help other EU countries recover - holding those other countries economies in limbo, such that they are unable to compete with Germany internationally.

If EU countries weren't trapped in the Euro, they would not be held in limbo like this, and would not all have spent so long in crisis; the single currency was a massive mistake, which has now spent almost half of its lifetime damaging countries, by making the policies needed to resolve the crisis, inaccessible.

Freddie Dodge

teR_ wrote: »

You turn on the news and ya see all these countries around us that were/are in the shlt, there all running around like lunatics breaking things and burning stuff.

Here we are and we don't even do the peaceful side of it, am I the only one disappointed in our incapacity to do anythings?

No, no you're not. In fact there are a few more like you who post here who would love to be out burning stuff they never contributed to and who regularly call the rest of us "sheeple" andstupid words like that. One has even posted here already. Another is called mongo something or other...

Thankfully you're in a minority though.

languagenerd

Because rioting like mad eejits and burning stuff doesn't affect the government/EU, it'd only lead to us destroying our own neighbourhoods and businesses, which seems a little counterproductive...

Skatedude

er, the pubs are open. Close them and we would riot. but between a riot and a pint. the irish will always chose a pint

keithclancy

KyussBishop wrote: »

Germany certainly doesn't know what's better for us, only what's better for Germany - they have torpedoed or neutered every opportunity at real economic reform within the EU, that can provide recovery.

Germany doesn't give a toss for any country in Europe except their own - happy to take all the economic benefits the Euro provides to their country (the currency has benefited Germany far more than any other EU country), while blocking the economic measures needed to help other EU countries recover - holding those other countries economies in limbo, such that they are unable to compete with Germany internationally.

If EU countries weren't trapped in the Euro, they would not be held in limbo like this, and would not all have spent so long in crisis; the single currency was a massive mistake, which has now spent almost half of its lifetime damaging countries, by making the policies needed to resolve the crisis, inaccessible.

This is like blaming the tee totaler chick in your house for your raging hangover.

Davarus Walrus

An angry mob.
Smash shít up.
?
?
An Ireland that is perfect.

iDave

What does it achieve

Thoie

We don't have the weather for it. The people who go out today rioting end up spending the next two weeks in bed with pneumonia, thus lessening the effect.

We had our chance last summer when we had a prolonged period of nice weather, but it took us by surprise, and we spent too long wandering around in a daze telling each other it was 10pm and we didn't even need a cardigan.

Don't Chute!

Because contrary to popular belief we have very little to be rioting about.

biko

Why don't YOU riot OP? That's probably the same reason everyone else has.

DirtyBollox

Lets be honest here, the Irish for the most part are a bunch on whingers and complainers. Unless it happens right in front of you chances are you wont do soemthing about it. And even if it does happen in front of you chances are you wont do anything about it.

And yes, I myself am Irish and include myself in the above.

TheDoc

The outlook and social acceptance here is that rioting, protesting and the likes, is a complete waste of time and only disruptive.

When I've looked on this forum during various protests, it's normally people in the majority, complaining how its disrupting their commute home from work. And I agree.

It's not the 60's protests achieve nothing but disrupt the days of normal people, thereby garnishing no support. There is a reason there is little to no public support for public infrastructure strikes and protests.

It's also an excuse for troublemakers, nackers and extreme political enthusiasts to hijack an occasion or just simply cause trouble. I thought that much was obvious at this stage.

teR_

iDave wrote: »

What does it achieve

Stress relief

teR_

biko wrote: »

Why don't YOU riot OP? That's probably the same reason everyone else has.

I have a porn addiction, I'd be arrested for playing with myself in public if I was away from my computer to long. People like me are better off in doors thinking about riots.

Guy:Incognito

teR_ wrote: »

Stress relief

Not for the people whos businesses are on fire.

White Heart Loon

We are a nation of sheep

kult

because we have no balls at all

mathie

At least 80% of humanity lives on less than $10 a day.

Source http://www.globalissues.org/article/26/poverty-facts-and-stats

You can choose not to work in this country and get far more than that.

So we don't have much to be rioting about.

kult

In Iceland, 2008-09 people physically removed corrupt bankers and government out of the buildings. They rewrote constitution , told EU to **** off, and refused paying back debts that banks took in their name. They have balls , but nothing was shown on tv, you know why? Because people would realize it is possible go get countries straight and kick out thieves out of the banks and government... But first, some balls are needed.... many countries did it, but nothing on tv, as tv is being controlled by the same people you go and vote for, and it does not matter what party they are from, they are all thieves, promising things they are never going to fulfill, but people vote for them, because they think they have a choice, yes you have a choice, a choice between one robbing bastard and another one... people do not stand up to that, which only means people like being ****ed up the hole all the time, otherwise they would stand up...

kult

mathie wrote: »

At least 80% of humanity lives on less than $10 a day.

Source http://www.globalissues.org/article/26/poverty-facts-and-stats

You can choose not to work in this country and get far more than that.

So we don't have much to be rioting about.

you are like a politician, compare ireland to poorer countries or worse situations... that's so low, maybe compare to richer countries with higher standard of living, irish people deserve more... if you do not stand up now, some time you will wake up living for 10 dollars a day, but you will still say some people are living on 5 dollars a day....they are taking freedom and bringing economy down slowly...

White Heart Loon

kult wrote: »

In Iceland, 2008-09 people physically removed corrupt bankers and government out of the buildings. They rewrote constitution , told EU to **** off, and refused paying back debts that banks took in their name. They have balls , but nothing was shown on tv, you know why? Because people would realize it is possible go get countries straight and kick out thieves out of the banks and government... But first, some balls are needed.... many countries did it, but nothing on tv, as tv is being controlled by the same people you go and vote for, and it does not matter what party they are from, they are all thieves, promising things they are never going to fulfill, but people vote for them, because they think they have a choice, yes you have a choice, a choice between one robbing bastard and another one... people do not stand up to that, which only means people like being ****ed up the hole all the time, otherwise they would stand up...

Most of what you say above is true, but the truth is that last year Iceland voted the very same party back into power.....

kult

White Heart Loon wrote: »

Most of what you say above is true, but the truth is that last year Iceland voted the very same party back into power.....

name of the party is correct, but people are different , I was there that time, bankers got many years in jail and there are still trials going on there... do you really thing people in the "new" party would risk it again??? Iceland already showed that they are able to do it again, and once they did it, the second time will be easier and easier...

conorhal

TheDoc wrote: »

The outlook and social acceptance here is that rioting, protesting and the likes, is a complete waste of time and only disruptive.

When I've looked on this forum during various protests, it's normally people in the majority, complaining how its disrupting their commute home from work. And I agree.

It's not the 60's protests achieve nothing but disrupt the days of normal people, thereby garnishing no support. There is a reason there is little to no public support for public infrastructure strikes and protests.

It's also an excuse for troublemakers, nackers and extreme political enthusiasts to hijack an occasion or just simply cause trouble. I thought that much was obvious at this stage.

The velvet revolution, that Arab spring and those pesky French disagree with you.

Guy:Incognito

kult wrote: »

In Iceland, 2008-09 people physically removed corrupt bankers and government out of the buildings. They rewrote constitution , told EU to **** off, and refused paying back debts that banks took in their name. They have balls , but nothing was shown on tv, you know why? Because people would realize it is possible go get countries straight and kick out thieves out of the banks and government... But first, some balls are needed.... many countries did it, but nothing on tv, as tv is being controlled by the same people you go and vote for, and it does not matter what party they are from, they are all thieves, promising things they are never going to fulfill, but people vote for them, because they think they have a choice, yes you have a choice, a choice between one robbing bastard and another one... people do not stand up to that, which only means people like being ****ed up the hole all the time, otherwise they would stand up...

Have they not been in the media saying how no one will buy their bonds now..................

Jonny7

kult wrote: »

In Iceland, 2008-09 people physically removed corrupt bankers and government out of the buildings. They rewrote constitution , told EU to **** off, and refused paying back debts that banks took in their name.

No, no they didn't. Also, we're in better shape than Iceland - we also have over 20 times the population

kult

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Have they not been in the media saying how no one will buy their bonds now..................

and now they are one of the fastest growing economies in the world, having under 3% unemployed people... **** the bonds , they are doing well

kult

Jonny7 wrote: »

No, no they didn't. Also, we're in better shape than Iceland - we also have over 20 times the population

Iceland is in better shape than us, population does not matter, and if it does matter to you, then divide Ireland into 300k sectors and do the same..

Guy:Incognito

kult wrote: »

Iceland is in better shape than us, population does not matter, and if it does matter to you, then divide Ireland into 300k sectors and do the same..

This economics stuff, its all so easy isn't it.
Presumably your next idea is to tax the rich at 90%?

kult

Abolish income tax, to create employment. Never tax rich, as it does not make sense. Economics by Freidman might be difficult for you alright.

Guy:Incognito

kult wrote: »

Abolish income tax, to create employment. Never tax rich, as it does not make sense. Economics by Freidman might be difficult for you alright.

Are you sure you didn't mean that I to be a 2nd e?:)

kult

If you abolish income tax, people have more money to spend, which creates jobs. Lets say you need to buy shoes, go to the town, take bus, give bus driver job, pay vat on the ticket, buy shoes, give manufacturer, shop assistant, delivery guy job and more and you pay vat on that, everyone benefits from it. But if we are being punished by income tax for good work and lazy bastard on social are being awarded with my taxes for doing **** all day then economy is what it is...

UCDVet

Everyone wants *something* to be done. The problem is nobody can agree on what that is.

The truth is people won't take to the streets until they feel they have nothing to lose. And as much as it sucks to be on the dole; it's still pretty good compared to a lot of places. And if you have the right mentality it can be pretty decent. When the government is paying for your health care, your transportation, your rent, and your beer money - exactly how much rage can you muster for the revolution? Not a lot.

The lower-paid, but working folk, have it pretty good by international standards. Minimum wage is high and the amount of protection/job security/benefits the law mandates are a lot better than many countries.

The 'middle' class in Ireland don't fare as good as the middle class in some other countries - I'm thinking CA and the US - but whatever. Taxes are pretty high for them....but so what. These are people with good jobs, good education, a nice place to live and a nice car if they want it. They aren't going to protest because they need to be at work and they'd rather worry about their next holiday. Yes, tax increases are hurting them a bit - but it's not like they aren't still buying new iPhones each year.

The 'rich' people are....rich. They are a small percentage of the population with all the political clout in the world. They won't riot, they'll just pay the people they need to pay to get things the way they want it.

And even if you did get enough people together for a riot....what would your goal be? Good luck finding one everyone would agree with. Half the people would be fighting to lower their taxes so they could keep their money instead of paying someone else's healthcare and lost of living. The other half would be fighting for higher taxes so they could afford a higher standard of living while not working. Half the people would want immigrants to stop stealing jobs, the other half would want it to be easier for Ireland to get the workers it needs.

You'd end up with a bunch of unhappy people standing around expressing their unhappiness and general ideas they don't like. 'Booo! We don't like corrupt politicians! Boo! We don't like unfair taxes! Booo! We don't like rich bankers!' but that's about it.

PizzamanIRL

Riot.
Break stuff.
Government implements a new tax to pay for the the repairs.
Now you're worse off than before.

kult

PizzamanIRL wrote: »

Riot.
Break stuff.
Government implements a new tax to pay for the the repairs.
Now you're worse off than before.

stupid people destroy stuff, smart people like in iceland destroy just government, riot does not have to be bad like they show on tv, attack government not own people, that's the difference... it was done in Iceland, can be done here and anywhere else, but people have no balls and are stupid enough to believe another promises on tv etc

Friend Computer

kult wrote: »

If you abolish income tax, people have more money to spend, which creates jobs.

And how do you propose public services are funded?

lazy bastard on social are being awarded with my taxes for doing **** all day

And you were doing so well! Didn't take long for you to open up about what this is actually about.

Duggy747

Nothing gets people to side with protests more than to call them stupid and sheeple....

UCDVet

kult wrote: »

If you abolish income tax, people have more money to spend, which creates jobs. Lets say you need to buy shoes, go to the town, take bus, give bus driver job, pay vat on the ticket, buy shoes, give manufacturer, shop assistant, delivery guy job and more and you pay vat on that, everyone benefits from it. But if we are being punished by income tax for good work and lazy bastard on social are being awarded with my taxes for doing **** all day then economy is what it is...

I have to say - as a foreigner - once I hit that 51% tax rate or whatever it is - I really did sort of go, 'Well, screw this'. I work in an industry where annual bonuses are common and knowing that I can work hard, put in extra hours, and do a good job in the hopes of getting 49% of some bonus.....' really doesn't motivate me.

I don't expect any sympathy or anything, but it is how I feel. I stopped caring about doing better and started counting down the time until I leave. My goal went from 'Be awesome' to 'Try not to get fired'. A year or so and I'll move to another country where I'll get paid more and pay less taxes

Which, coincidentally, is why I won't be rioting anytime soon.

kult

Friend Computer wrote: »

And how do you propose public services are funded?

And you were doing so well! Didn't take long for you to open up about what this is actually about.

public services should be private, if I want to go to hospital I pay for it, if I want pension I pay for it IF I WANT, and if I do not want it is my problem. Public services are being paid from usc, levy, property tax, vat and many more different taxes!!! income tax was intorduced in 1913 and since then economy falls... people were living well with no income tax , a 1 single man working , wife and 5 kinds and they were ok, now 2 parents are working and cant pay for 2 kids!!! income tax is a scam which creates employment!!!

and it is not actually only about social system, but if I work hard and I do I am being taxed, punished for my hard work and the money is given to people who do not work, to the government is stealing my money in order to give it to someone else, and by the way they take cut of it too...

kult

UCDVet wrote: »

I have to say - as a foreigner - once I hit that 51% tax rate or whatever it is - I really did sort of go, 'Well, screw this'. I work in an industry where annual bonuses are common and knowing that I can work hard, put in extra hours, and do a good job in the hopes of getting 49% of some bonus.....' really doesn't motivate me.

I don't expect any sympathy or anything, but it is how I feel. I stopped caring about doing better and started counting down the time until I leave. My goal went from 'Be awesome' to 'Try not to get fired'. A year or so and I'll move to another country where I'll get paid more and pay less taxes

Which, coincidentally, is why I won't be rioting anytime soon.

rich should not be taxed higher at all, there is small percentage of rich people and even if you tax them at 90% it will not fix the big problem, but politicians use this argument to get voters to vote for him...manipulation tool and idiots go and vote for it!!!

kult

kult wrote: »

public services should be private, if I want to go to hospital I pay for it, if I want pension I pay for it IF I WANT, and if I do not want it is my problem. Public services are being paid from usc, levy, property tax, vat and many more different taxes!!! income tax was intorduced in 1913 and since then economy falls... people were living well with no income tax , a 1 single man working , wife and 5 kinds and they were ok, now 2 parents are working and cant pay for 2 kids!!! income tax is a scam which creates employment!!!

and it is not actually only about social system, but if I work hard and I do I am being taxed, punished for my hard work and the money is given to people who do not work, to the government is stealing my money in order to give it to someone else, and by the way they take cut of it too...

I WAS MEANT TO SAY "WHICH DOES NOT CREATE EMPLOYMENT" I am sorry for mistake

Jonny7

kult wrote: »

Iceland is in better shape than us, population does not matter, and if it does matter to you, then divide Ireland into 300k sectors and do the same..

The pop of Iceland is about the size of a large town - it's easy to affect regulation and change among such a tiny population

Fast growth? GDP grew 1.4% last year, that's not exactly large growth. They are still recuperating the contraction of their economy.

There is very little external investment, and Iceland's economy is still at a much higher risk than ours

Guy:Incognito

kult wrote: »

If you abolish income tax, people have more money to spend, which creates jobs. Lets say you need to buy shoes, go to the town, take bus, give bus driver job, pay vat on the ticket, buy shoes, give manufacturer, shop assistant, delivery guy job and more and you pay vat on that, everyone benefits from it. But if we are being punished by income tax for good work and lazy bastard on social are being awarded with my taxes for doing **** all day then economy is what it is...

Do you reckon that with 350,000 more people working and zero income tax take, the country will run itself at a profit?

What do you do with the people that cant work? ( I assume your getting rid of social welfare) Then theres the lazy bastards as you call them that probably wont want to work.


EDIT. So I see we're privatising everything. What happens when it costs more for the lower paid to get medical treatment than they earn? Kill them?

pctosh

We still have it good.

kult

GDP is not great indicator, I would take as an indicator that employment went down from 11% to 3% in few years... little country, so divide Ireland onto 12 small regions and do the same. Iceland's economy is at lower risk than ours, because they are not with EU... and risk is good for economy, economy if it's steady then declines, risk is a factor which has to be taken into consideration, not risk no progress ( loss or gain ).

The easiest way is to look for excuses , small population, different economy etc. Not easier to just do the job and stop looking for excuses?

Guy:Incognito

If the system is so good and surely will end up with a happy population seeing as they are paying no tax, whats to lose for the government that brings it in. Surely they are guaranteeing themselves re-election for many years?