Genetic diversity

leonidas83

Isn't genetic diversity generally considered a good thing? The Irish are a pretty hearty lot because, over the last few centuries, they tended to screw anything that moved. Otherwise I think you just end up with a lot of genetic in-breeding, like a race of French poodles.

Khannie

OK

danniemcq

Sorry but whats the point?

Is there an arguement against it?

There is a reason the Icelandic had to make an app to stop cousins getting with cousins.

AnonoBoy

Generic diversity is so bland these days - it's all the same.

iDave

leonidas83 wrote: »

Isn't genetic diversity generally considered a good thing? The Irish are a pretty hearty lot because, over the last few centuries, they tended to screw anything that moved. Otherwise I think you just end up with a lot of genetic in-breeding, like a race of French poodles.

Don't tell the church that

leonidas83

danniemcq wrote: »

Sorry but whats the point?

Is there an arguement against it?

There is a reason the Icelandic had to make an app to stop cousins getting with cousins.

Well, a lot of cultures, religions are very much against it, Judaism for example. There is a sense that their DNA may be diluted or destroyed, possibly that their way of life may not be preserved.

I'm of the opinion that a strong argument could be made for & against it & was curious to see if anyone could put forward valid points either way

Matt_Trakker

leonidas83 wrote: »

Isn't genetic diversity generally considered a good thing? The Irish are a pretty hearty lot because, over the last few centuries, they tended to screw anything that moved. Otherwise I think you just end up with a lot of genetic in-breeding, like a race of French poodles.

We live on an island, a whole ton of interbreeding went on here in the past.
Indeed, some scientists believe it's where red hair comes from. And Ireland is way ahead of the world average on red hair....a court social worker once told me that the North West of Ireland has the highest cases of insestual rape in Europe per head of population.

Ireland's native pop doesn't have much genetic diversity at all at all.

TeddyTedson

I have ancestors from Oz and the UK. I thought great, I'm not the result of years of inbreeding. Then my family decided to look as far into the family tree as they could. Both sides were traced back to the west of Ireland. Talk about bad luck. :mad:

April O Neill

I'd say the Irish are fairly inbred, TBH.

iDave

April O Neill wrote: »

I'd say the Irish are fairly inbred, TBH.

Speak for yourself

April O Neill

iDave wrote: »

Speak for yourself

Well, we're all a great big population pool. And AFAIK, we do suffer from a relatively high incidence of genetic illness. As does Iceland, actually.

Pumpkinseeds

We have a huge rate of genetic disposititon to various diseases in this country, higher than many other European countries so I'd have to disagree OP.

ScumLord

leonidas83 wrote: »

Isn't genetic diversity generally considered a good thing? The Irish are a pretty hearty lot because, over the last few centuries, they tended to screw anything that moved. Otherwise I think you just end up with a lot of genetic in-breeding, like a race of French poodles.

We did our riding in other countries though. The local population had it's genetic diversity reduced through centuries of emigration. Although for some reason we seem to be able to hit above our weight in many respects like in sport and art so we still have good genes in there.

We'll have to get the most out of the boom though, it was one of the first times in history we had a large influx of genes, some of the best too, Polish and Brazilian.

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

Indeed, some scientists believe it's where red hair comes from.

I thought red hair was Viking not Irish, we just ended up riding a lot of vikings.

And Ireland is way ahead of the world average on red hair....a court social worker once told me that the North West of Ireland has the highest cases of insestual rape in Europe per head of population.

Were'd she get that information from?

Call Me Jimmy

leonidas83 wrote: »

they tended to screw anything that moved.

Anything that wasn't... nailed down?

YEEEOOWWW or whatever the meme is

Paramite Pie

I'm from the West of Ireland (both my parents are from rural Mayo) and my Aunt traced back our family tree on my Dad's side to a French soldier from 1798.

My Mam's side looks very Mediterranean but no one knows where that originates from. (my great great grandmother was from Sligo but I doubt that's it:cool:)

So thankfully I'm not totally inbred and I'm regularly mistaken for being Spanish or something. So it seems a bit of diversity can last a good few generations.

ScumLord wrote: »

We'll have to get the most out of the boom though, it was one of the first times in history we had a large influx of genes, some of the best too, Polish and Brazilian.

So your saying we should ride lots of Brazilian and Polish people? Won't find many complaints here I'll tell you....:pac:

Ush1

Believe Croatia is the most homogeneous country in Europe and the women are tayyyyyshy!

kneemos

I'm sorry but when the sister wears those shorts I just can't help myself.

TeddyTedson

Ush1 wrote: »

Believe Croatia is the most homogeneous country in Europe and the women are tayyyyyshy!

I guess there is no point is destroying perfection

Yeah, you don't need much of a population in reality to have a healthy gene pool population.

oldrnwisr

Paramite Pie wrote: »

I'm from the West of Ireland (both my parents are from rural Mayo) and my Aunt traced back our family tree on my Dad's side to a French soldier from 1798.

My Mam's side looks very Mediterranean but no one knows where that originates from. (my great great grandmother was from Sligo but I doubt that's it:cool:)

So thankfully I'm not totally inbred and I'm regularly mistaken for being Spanish or something. So it seems a bit of diversity can last a good few generations.

There was a large influx of Sephardic Jews from Spain and Portugal following the expulsions at the end of the 15th century. This would explain the mediterranean complexion found here. It does seem to be especially concentrated in the west. My dad's side of the family is from Galway and there is a preponderence of mediterranean looks there, especially on my paternal grandmother's side.

ScumLord

TeddyTedson wrote: »

I guess there is no point is destroying perfection

Yeah, you don't need much of a population in reality to have a healthy gene pool population.

We're all the descendants of about 50,000 early humans. apparently our species came close to the verge of extinction. So that kind of shows the diversity of our genome that we could go on to adapt into so many different variations and then have more or less 7 billion healthy people on the planet.

Muise...

oldrnwisr wrote: »

There was a large influx of Sephardic Jews from Spain and Portugal following the expulsions at the end of the 15th century. This would explain the mediterranean complexion found here. It does seem to be especially concentrated in the west. My dad's side of the family is from Galway and there is a preponderence of mediterranean looks there, especially on my paternal grandmother's side.

haven't heard that before, and that's my turf (though I've reddish hair and freckles). The usual story is that survivors of the Spanish Armada are responsible for the dark Connacht people, but that's not true as those who made it ashore were either carted into Galway for a ransom or clubbed over the head so their rings could be stolen.

As well as the wine trade between Galway and Spain, there are genetic connections between the Irish and the Basques going way back to the end of the Ice Age, so we have probably always had a fancy for the swarthy foreign sailors.

ScumLord

oldrnwisr wrote: »

My dad's side of the family is from Galway and there is a preponderence of mediterranean looks there, especially on my paternal grandmother's side.

It can pop up randomly too. I have a friend who's family is classic Irish with White skin, blue eyes, black hair. Then the sister looks like cleopatra.

old hippy

ScumLord wrote: »

We'll have to get the most out of the boom though, it was one of the first times in history we had a large influx of genes, some of the best too, Polish and Brazilian.

I wasn't aware of a best genes league table

ScumLord

old hippy wrote: »

I wasn't aware of a best genes league table

Brazilians can kick a football and your ass all at the same time. I don't think anyone can really argue with their sporting prowess.

Surveyor11

Vikings took all our good looking wimmin, which explains the Nordic stunners

donegal__road

I participated in a DNA project with distant relatives in the USA; they requested that I provide a sample of DNA to see if I was a match. I was the only Irish male with the surname to participate, and I turned out an exact match with 5 other males with the same family name who took part in the project... all based in the US.

Ilyana 2.0

My mother is English but she, her dad and brother all could pass for Spanish. We still don't know the reason for that, although I did hear talk of an African influence somewhere down the line (how likely that is, I'm not sure). Also, my Dad has been likened to Nicholas Sarkozy and Jose Mourinho looks-wise, and his mother definitely had a French ancestor, who married an Irish man in Wales apparently.

So we're probably not inbred, but we still all look a bit Mediterranean.

oldrnwisr

ScumLord wrote: »

It can pop up randomly too. I have a friend who's family is classic Irish with White skin, blue eyes, black hair. Then the sister looks like cleopatra.

Of course it could be chance, but there are other reasons why I think it is due to population migration.

Firstly, Sephardi Jews are one of the groups to be afflicted by a disease called Familial Mediterranean Fever which involves a mutation of the MEFV gene on chromosome 16. This also happens to be where the gene for red hair is. Now as much as we think that red hair is a Viking holdover, that's not really the case. Firstly, there are some very early records of red hair from places too far to be accounted for by Viking raiding parties. Thracians in Greece, Tocharians in Asia and even some Polynesian tribes were known for being red-haired. In Europe, red hair was seen as a stereotypically Jewish trait in the middle ages and still is in certain parts of eastern Europe. It is possible that the concentration of red hair now found in Ireland and Scotland was due to the movement of people in response to the Black Death. There is a similar correlation, for example, in cases of cystic fibrosis on the fringes of Europe which is an evolutionary repsonse to the Black Death (similar to the relationship between sickle cell anaemia and malaria).

All in all, while it could be chance I think it is just as likely that some of these traits are the result of major migrations over the last thousand years or so.

Paramite Pie

oldrnwisr wrote: »

There was a large influx of Sephardic Jews from Spain and Portugal following the expulsions at the end of the 15th century. This would explain the mediterranean complexion found here. It does seem to be especially concentrated in the west. My dad's side of the family is from Galway and there is a preponderence of mediterranean looks there, especially on my paternal grandmother's side.

I've heard of this but I thought they mostly settled in the East or something. That might explain my thick hair, the ease at which I tan and general appearance. Once when I was in America someone asked if I was Jewish!!

I've also been told that I look like Aladdin... maybe I'm an Arab Jew:D

ScumLord wrote: »

It can pop up randomly too. I have a friend who's family is classic Irish with White skin, blue eyes, black hair. Then the sister looks like cleopatra.

The milkman did it....:P

Galwayguy35

The Irish and British look very similar and until they start to talk you wouldn't know the difference, it's easier to tell if someone is from Eastern Europe, although they are white they look a bit different.

donegal__road

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

The Irish and British look very similar and until they start to talk you wouldn't know the difference, it's easier to tell if someone is from Eastern Europe, although they are white they look a bit different.

I just heard a few days ago, that 70% of school children in London are non-white..

Galwayguy35

donegal__road wrote: »

I just heard a few days ago, that 70% of school children in London are non-white..

And your point is?

_Redzer_

TeddyTedson wrote: »

I have ancestors from Oz and the UK. I thought great, I'm not the result of years of inbreeding. Then my family decided to look as far into the family tree as they could. Both sides were traced back to the west of Ireland. Talk about bad luck. :mad:

Ah sure don't feel too bad. Every human on earth is 99.9% identical, with the remaining 0.1% percent accounting for only about a 3 million individual differentiation between the rest of our billions of shared genes. Genetically we're all pretty much the same as a species.

General General

Poodles, I was surprised to find out, are actually very intelligent.

Nodin

General General wrote: »

Poodles, I was surprised to find out, are actually very intelligent.

....you reckon we should breed with them?

Legs.Eleven

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

The Irish and British look very similar and until they start to talk you wouldn't know the difference, it's easier to tell if someone is from Eastern Europe, although they are white they look a bit different.

I could easily spot an Irish person without talking to them. Hard to put words to as the difference is very subtle but the Irish often (not always, of course) have a look that distinguishes us from other nations - a certain complexion and features you only really find here. Spotted an Irish fella today at work without even talking to him, in fact (and I don't live in Ireland). That happens all the time.

johnr1

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

The Irish and British look very similar and until they start to talk you wouldn't know the difference, it's easier to tell if someone is from Eastern Europe, although they are white they look a bit different.

Id disagree with this strongly. There is a common Irish "look" which English dont seem to have in as much abundance. Also, take a look at an English rugby team, -and I use this example as they would largely come from a background without any irish heritage, and youll see faces which you would never see in a Galway jersey or a Clare one.

I see a difference in the faces from home,- Kerry, and the faces I see in Armagh for example. My ex from there also noticed it when she came to Kerry.

Some dentists from the USA told me of the phenomenon of "Big German teeth in a small Irish jawbone" something they see all the time apparently.

I think lack of or abundance of genetic diversity produces new "looks" within ten or so generations. Think of the part African American part Hispanic look which is now common in the melting pot of the US.
People in the West of Ireland would have had little "foreign" influence in their genetic makeup over the last few hundred years, and as such it isn't surprising that they would look quite different to say French.

Galwayguy35

johnr1 wrote: »

Id disagree with this strongly. There is a common Irish "look" which English dont seem to have in as much abundance. Also, take a look at an English rugby team, -and I use this example as they would largely come from a background without any irish heritage, and youll see faces which you would never see in a Galway jersey or a Clare one.

I see a difference in the faces from home,- Kerry, and the faces I see in Armagh for example. My ex from there also noticed it when she came to Kerry.

Some dentists from the USA told me of the phenomenon of "Big German teeth in a small Irish jawbone" something they see all the time apparently.

I think lack of or abundance of genetic diversity produces new "looks" within ten or so generations. Think of the part African American part Hispanic look which is now common in the melting pot of the US.
People in the West of Ireland would have had little "foreign" influence in their genetic makeup over the last few hundred years, and as such it isn't surprising that they would look quite different to say French.

Not seeing it myself, take for example Owen Farrell and Brian O Driscoll, are you saying you could tell which of them are Irish and English if you didn't know?

MadsL

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

The Irish and British look very similar and until they start to talk you wouldn't know the difference, it's easier to tell if someone is from Eastern Europe, although they are white they look a bit different.

Dem cheekbones...

johnr1 wrote: »

Id disagree with this strongly. There is a common Irish "look" which English dont seem to have in as much abundance.

Square heads?

Ilyana 2.0

I think there are many Irish people who look very similar to each other. There's one girl I know who I think I see everywhere because her look is very typical for Irish women. Not exactly empirical evidence but anyway :pac:

On the other hand, my sister and I have been told that we don't look particularly Irish, and we have one non-Irish parent.

donegal__road

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

And your point is?

I know what you meant when you referred to English people looking like Irish people, my post was more of a comment on what does a British person actually look like?
Very soon Britain's ethnic majority will not be white Caucasian.

Galwayguy35

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

I could easily spot an Irish person without talking to them. Hard to put words to as the difference is very subtle but the Irish often (not always, of course) have a look that distinguishes us from other nations - a certain complexion and features you only really find here. Spotted an Irish fella today at work without even talking to him, in fact (and I don't live in Ireland). That happens all the time.

But are the Irish not decended from the original peoples who lived in Britain who crossed over?

Would that not make us the same race of people?

Galwayguy35

MadsL wrote: »

Dem cheekbones.

As always a sterling contribution to the thread.

Nodin

donegal__road wrote: »

I know what you meant when you said English person looking like an Irish person, my post was more of a comment on what does a British person actually look like?
Very soon Britain's ethnic majority will not be white Caucasian.

Define "very soon".

seenitall

Ush1 wrote: »

Believe Croatia is the most homogeneous country in Europe

Er, no.

Starscream25

I'm half irish half Maltese and willing to spread my seed to any willing women.

donegal__road

Nodin wrote: »

Define "very soon".

at a guess, 30/40 years

Ush1

seenitall wrote: »

Er, no.

No to what?

Ush1

seenitall wrote: »

Er, no.

No to what?

seenitall

It isn't the most homogenous country in Europe. By a mile.

Nodin

donegal__road wrote: »

at a guess, 30/40 years

....I doubt it.