Rory McIlroy - 4 Time Major Winner

FixdePitchmark

Big piece in indo yesterday with Kimmage, used to like Kimmage , but have found him way too cranky in his old age.

Anyway very long piece and more to come.

Only thing new is him almost saying why he sacked JP, referring to some events in year, but not saying.

Anyway, he is basically saying , he says stuff in the moment that he didn't really feel. Your then reading a piece going , well fool me once.

I do admire Rory , he tries to be Open , but fundamentally your listening to a young man say whatever is in his head on a particular day . He seems to lack any consistency in thought or mind.

Still like him....

Bubbaclaus

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

I do admire Rory , he tries to be Open , but fundamentally your listening to a young man say whatever is in his head on a particular day . He seems to lack any consistency in thought or mind.

Still like him....

So he's just like pretty much everyone else on the planet then?

Martin567

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

So he's just like pretty much everyone else on the planet then?

That's a strange comment. I would say most people are not like that at all.

Scott Tenorman

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Big piece in indo yesterday with Kimmage, used to like Kimmage , but have found him way too cranky in his old age.

Anyway very long piece and more to come.

Only thing new is him almost saying why he sacked JP, referring to some events in year, but not saying.

Anyway, he is basically saying , he says stuff in the moment that he didn't really feel. Your then reading a piece going , well fool me once.

I do admire Rory , he tries to be Open , but fundamentally your listening to a young man say whatever is in his head on a particular day . He seems to lack any consistency in thought or mind.

Still like him....

That's exactly why i don't like him- he's a *******

MOD NOTE : As per the Charter No Personal Abuse

Mantis Toboggan

Rory goes back to number one. Took a while longer than expected. I wonder if Brooks still doesn't consider him a rival. He didn't exactly set the world alight with his 17th place finish in Saudi.

Dav010

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

Rory goes back to number one. Took a while longer than expected. I wonder if Brooks still doesn't consider him a rival. He didn't exactly set the world alight with his 17th place finish in Saudi.

Hasn’t Keopke just come back from a couple of months out with a serious knee injury?

I’m pretty sure Keopke was talking about the majors when he said he wasn’t too worried about him as a rival.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.golfchannel.com/news/brooks-koepka-downplays-notion-rivalry-rory-mcilroy?amp

Bubbaclaus

Martin567 wrote: »

That's a strange comment. I would say most people are not like that at all.

Really? So you think everyone greatly considers everything they are about to say and its consistency with stuff they have said throughout their entire lifetime?

I dont know what circles you mingle in, but I doubt people put that much thought into what comes out of their mouth.

abff

In fairness to Rory, he irritates me at times, but he's an amazing talent and everything he says seems to be scrutinised and parsed to the Nth degree. He's kind of in a 'no win' situation regarding the Irish/British issue (apologies if this breaches the charter) and I think it should be a dead duck at this stage and not worthy of further comment. Unfortunately, not everyone feels the same way about this.

But regarding the comment about consistency, I guess people in the public eye are under greater pressure to be consistent in what they say, but we're all human and very few of us posses perfect recall and we're all entitled to change our views over time.

Anyway, for what it's worth, I'm very pleased to see an Irish sportsperson ranked as number 1 in the world at his/her particular sport (regardless of any comments he/she might have made about any allegiances he/she feels).

Martin567

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I dont know what circles you mingle in, but I doubt people put that much thought into what comes out of their mouth.

I wouldn't be too interested in spending a lot of time with people who don't put much thought into what they say. Talking for the sake of talking doesn't do a lot for me.

People can of course change their opinions but flip flopping all over the place can be a bit annoying!

FixdePitchmark

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Really? So you think everyone greatly considers everything they are about to say and its consistency with stuff they have said throughout their entire lifetime?

I dont know what circles you mingle in, but I doubt people put that much thought into what comes out of their mouth.

I dont agree with you, people who I hang around with, if you lack consistency and authenticity. You will be pulled up on it. If you treat people like fools , it will catch up with you.

Yes people fundamentally change with age and that is fine, but , knowingly saying stuff to please others or to justify something at that moment , eventually catches up with you . The best tip in life is be authentic.

The Olympics
The Irish thing
The golf psychology thing
The I donf like links golf
The Irish open stuff
The JP is my friend stuff

to name a few..........

He just seems to have completely flipped on these issues.

I still like the bloke , and agree, should anyone scrutinise anything anyone says in these daft interviews and when these guys are so young and often answering for the 100 th time.

And on top of all that , are golfers that interesting, rounded and deep ? It is a pretty mind numbing boring process , practicing that much.

xgronkjabv6pcl

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

Rory goes back to number one. Took a while longer than expected. I wonder if Brooks still doesn't consider him a rival. He didn't exactly set the world alight with his 17th place finish in Saudi.

It's good to see player's taking a competitive line opposed to the standard "I have great respect for their game etc".

That said, its obviously ridiculous to think Koepka actually believes what he said, not only is Rory tied with him for majors at approx the same age but during the stretch Koepka has dominated Rory has had five top 5s and eleven top 10s out of 23 tournament's.

Does Koepka see Speith as his rival?

bamayang

I’d say I’m in the minority, but I actually really like him. He comes across as 100% genuinely honest in the kimmage interview.
He says some very silly things, but I don’t know anyone who doesn’t. Just because he’s outrageously gifted with a stick, doesn’t mean he automatically should be just as strong diplomatically.

Mantis Toboggan

Yeah much prefer him having a personality and saying what he is thinking at that particular time rather than a PR company coaching him and writing out his answers.

GreeBo

I think it would be much more preferable if he just said one thing and then stuck with it.

Its infuriating when he "lies" to say one thing and then says something different the next time he is asked the same question. Either refuse to comment or pick one answer and stick with it, if you change your opinion then explain why, but trying to please everyone by giving tailored answers in these days of global media just doesn't work, you get caught out and look silly.

Raisins

I don’t agree with some of his stances but that’s not the same thing as criticising his personality in making them public. I think his candid nature is great. I like the fact that he’s pretty open about his mistakes and he’s definitely not media managed.

Even little things like him admitting the Augusta blazer telling him on the tee “we really hope you finally get it done today” and rory’s reaction being “f***”. He has no problem admitting his vulnerabilities, which is a great thing and is ironic given how long it takes for him to admit they exist in the first place. His putting is an example of that. That paradox is why he’s often misunderstood IMO.

xgronkjabv6pcl

GreeBo wrote: »

I think it would be much more preferable if he just said one thing and then stuck with it.

Its infuriating when he "lies" to say one thing and then says something different the next time he is asked the same question. Either refuse to comment or pick one answer and stick with it, if you change your opinion then explain why, but trying to please everyone by giving tailored answers in these days of global media just doesn't work, you get caught out and look silly.

No one in their 20s has ever said something and then thought better of it so in turn changed their opinion :rolleyes:
It's laughable that one would expect someone-athlete or otherwise- to say one thing and never change their mind. It's quite literally the antithesis of growth.

Perhaps you could offer some examples of "when he "lies" to say something and then says something different the next time he is asked the same question"

The way in which you have phrased your assertion is that he has preemptively lied to appease one audience and in turn changed his opinion immediately afterwards.
Do you have any examples of this?

Dav010

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

No one in their 20s has ever said something and then thought better of it so in turn changed their opinion :rolleyes:
It's laughable that one would expect someone-athlete or otherwise- to say one thing and never change their mind. It's quite literally the antithesis of growth.

Perhaps you could offer some examples of "when he "lies" to say something and then says something different the next time he is asked the same question"

The way in which you have phrased your assertion is that he has preemptively lied to appease one audience and in turn changed his opinion immediately afterwards.
Do you have any examples of this?

Though by no means exhaustive, a couple of examples might be the Zika Virus excuse, feeling more British than Irish statement about who to represent, the debacle with Conor Ridge that cost him a 22m settlement, claiming the engagement breakup was “mutual and amicable” when it was done by text message days after invites were sent out.

Bubbaclaus

Isnt it great to see so many posters on here that have never changed their opinion or said something contradictory in their lives.

xgronkjabv6pcl

Dav010 wrote: »

Though by no means exhaustive, a couple of examples might be the Zika Virus excuse, feeling more British than Irish statement about who to represent, the debacle with Conor Ridge that allegedly cost him a lot , claiming the engagement breakup was “mutual and amicable” when it was done by text message days after invites were sent out.

Unsurprisingly, none of that answers my actual question.
This was my question

The way in which you have phrased your assertion is that he has preemptively lied to appease one audience and in turn changed his opinion immediately afterwards.
Do you have any examples of this?

None of the examples you have given demonstrate a preemptive effort to lie to one audience to appease them and subsequently change that opinion immediately when confronted with another.

The fact that anyone would actually care about what happened with his pending nuptials and actually use that as a point in this discussion is beyond silly.

I'm not even going to make comment on the nationality because it's of as little interest to me and to most as his nuptials. It's quite pathetic that they're raised at all.

Unsurprisingly, little of what you have mentioned is related to golf which is what should be discussed.

GreeBo

Raisins wrote: »

He has no problem admitting his vulnerabilities, which is a great thing and is ironic given how long it takes for him to admit they exist in the first place.

If he had no problem admitting them, then surely it wouldn't take him so long to admit them?

It feels more managed to me, on some occasions he toes the party line and then on others he goes totally off piste and says something else.

Like why does he suddenly need a "no holes barred" interview if he is always so open an honest with everyone? If he was honest then we'd already know all these answers and the interview would be pointless?

GreeBo

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

No one in their 20s has ever said something and then thought better of it so in turn changed their opinion :rolleyes:
It's laughable that one would expect someone-athlete or otherwise- to say one thing and never change their mind. It's quite literally the antithesis of growth.

I literally said that he was free to change his opinion if he explained why it changed.

Here, I'll post it again for you.
"if you change your opinion then explain why"

You don't need to change your mind to grow, that's a false statement and purports that everyone is inherently incorrect with their first opinions on everything, which is clearly nonsense.

As for posts not being golf related, I suggest you go back and review your multiple pseudo intellectual posts on this forum.

xgronkjabv6pcl

GreeBo wrote: »

I literally said that he was free to change his opinion if he explained why it changed.

Here, I'll post it again for you.
"if you change your opinion then explain why"

You don't need to change your mind to grow, that's a false statement and purports that everyone is inherently incorrect with their first opinions on everything, which is clearly nonsense.

As for posts not being golf related, I suggest you go back and review your multiple pseudo intellectual posts on this forum.

No you don't need to change your mind to grow, it's not a prerequisite for growth but the ability to change ones mind is indicative of growth. The preference -as you mentioned- for one to "say one thing and stick with it" is antithetical to growth. I believe criticising someone for changing their mind is ridiculous just because you're not happy with their explanation. I see very few people unhappy with McIlrorys explanation for changing his mind. Most applaud him for his willingness to do so and his candid attitude.

LOL, what statement? Can you highlight where I said you need to change your mind to grow. I'll help you, I never said it so moot point as is standard.

Yes, my pseudo science where I actually provided evidence, you know that thing you do to actually back up a point?

GreeBo

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

No you don't need to change your mind to grow, it's not a prerequisite for growth but the ability to change ones mind is indicative of growth. The preference -as you mentioned- for one to "say one thing and stick with it" is antithetical to growth. I believe criticising someone for changing their mind is ridiculous just because you're not happy with their explanation. I see very few people unhappy with McIlrorys explanation for changing his mind. Most applaud him for his willingness to do so and his candid attitude.

LOL, what statement? Can you highlight where I said you need to change your mind to grow. I'll help you, I never said it so moot point as is standard.

Yes, my pseudo science where I actually provided evidence, you know that thing you do to actually back up a point?

I said "pseudo intellectual" not "pseudo science", please try to read what other people actually say rather than what you think they have said.

I am criticising someone for frequently changing their mind when clearly they have no business giving their opinion in the first place, since they haven't spent enough time thinking about it.

The Olympics is a nice example of everything I have said.

- I'm British
- Eek! Zika virus
- Actually no I'm Irish.

Zika was a lie he told everyone to hide the fact that he didnt know who to play for at the time. If he was a candid as you think he is, then thats what he would have said, or handled it like McDowell who was asked the same questions, "I'll play for anyone who will have me, I just want to be an Olympian"

Toothgate is another example, 7 over after 8, dumps a shot into the water and then just walks off the course without any explanation.

“There’s not really much I can say, guys,” McIlroy told reporters who followed him to his car. “I’m not in a good place mentally, you know?”

He said there was nothing wrong physically and when asked about his swing, the Holywood star replied: “Yeah, I really don’t know what’s going on.”

An hour later the wisdom tooth is mentioned. Call me crazy but that would seem to be scripted and managed?

Now I'm sure you are going to bring up that this was almost 7 years ago, but it was in the middle of his 4 major wins, so if others can constantly bring up those wins then I can equally bring up those excuses.

Also, I believe you were looking for examples of mental weakness earlier in the thread? See above!

xgronkjabv6pcl

GreeBo wrote: »

I said "pseudo intellectual" not "pseudo science", please try to read what other people actually say rather than what you think they have said.

I am criticising someone for frequently changing their mind when clearly they have no business giving their opinion in the first place, since they haven't spent enough time thinking about it.

The Olympics is a nice example of everything I have said.

- I'm British
- Eek! Zika virus
- Actually no I'm Irish.

Zika was a lie he told everyone to hide the fact that he didnt know who to play for at the time. If he was a candid as you think he is, then thats what he would have said, or handled it like McDowell who was asked the same questions, "I'll play for anyone who will have me, I just want to be an Olympian"

Toothgate is another example, 7 over after 8, dumps a shot into the water and then just walks off the course without any explanation.

“There’s not really much I can say, guys,” McIlroy told reporters who followed him to his car. “I’m not in a good place mentally, you know?”

He said there was nothing wrong physically and when asked about his swing, the Holywood star replied: “Yeah, I really don’t know what’s going on.”

An hour later the wisdom tooth is mentioned. Call me crazy but that would seem to be scripted and managed?

Now I'm sure you are going to bring up that this was almost 7 years ago, but it was in the middle of his 4 major wins, so if others can constantly bring up those wins then I can equally bring up those excuses.

Also, I believe you were looking for examples of mental weakness earlier in the thread? See above!

As ironic as the highlighted above is, I'll just say; Obviously the only way in which you could conclude I'm a pseudo intellect is if you believe it was pseudo science, given that various things I shared referred specifically to sport. I hope you can understand but your ad hominem efforts to discredit an unrelated argument are infantile so you're better off trying to stay on track so lets try get back to the current point.

As I said previously, I have zero interest in discussing nationality, it's a difficult discussion and chastising the 2nd highest profile athlete in a sport for putting the feelings of people over his own desire to play is admirable to me. Obviously McDowell is a horrifically terrible example because Rory actually had a choice, McDowell didn't, that is a terrible false equivalence. McDowell would have taken anyone because he was not remotely as coveted as Rory, quite mond boggling you would even compare the two.

Yes, I'll concur and call you crazy on the wisdom tooth, that seems like an unsurprisingly bias conclusion you have once again reached. A little tin foil hat to immediately jump to scripted.

No, mental scarring was what I was looking for but again great effort on the ad hominem, you should try playing the ball and not the player, repeatedly bringing up previous discussions to discredit a current discussion does nothing more than raise doubts about your own points

GreeBo

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

As I said previously, I have zero interest in discussing nationality, it's a difficult discussion and chastising the 2nd highest profile athlete in a sport for putting the feelings of people over his own desire to play is admirable to me. Obviously McDowell is a horrifically terrible example because Rory actually had a choice, McDowell didn't, that is a terrible false equivalence. McDowell would have taken anyone because he was not remotely as coveted as Rory, quite mond boggling you would even compare the two.

It's not a discussion on his nationality, its an example of him changing his mind and not saying what he is actually thinking, unless you really believe that he was worried about the Zika virus?

McDowell had the exact same issues as McIlroy had, a complicated background, but the same question was asked off both. The players respective golf rankings are not relevant to the question or the answer, only the reaction to it.

I seem to remember similar sentiment about the Ryder Cup that he has since backpedaled away from.
“World championship or Ryder Cup? Win a world championship.”
"In the big scheme of things it's not that important to me."


Again changing your mind is not the issue, its coming out with ridiculous, unthought out statements initially that grates on people.

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

Yes, I'll concur and call you crazy on the wisdom tooth, that seems like an unsurprisingly bias conclusion you have once again reached. A little tin foil hat to immediately jump to scripted.

So what conclusion did you reach? Perhaps that he did in fact have a sore tooth but just forgot to mention it to anyone when asked why he was walking off in the middle of a round?

Charleigh Inexpensive Electricity wrote: »

No, mental scarring was what I was looking for but again great effort on the ad hominem, you should try playing the ball and not the player, repeatedly bringing up previous discussions to discredit a current discussion does nothing more than raise doubts about your own points

Its the same thread on the same topics about the same player, quite how you can label that as a "previous discussion" is beyond me.

xgronkjabv6pcl

GreeBo wrote: »

It's not a discussion on his nationality, its an example of him changing his mind and not saying what he is actually thinking, unless you really believe that he was worried about the Zika virus?

McDowell had the exact same issues as McIlroy had, a complicated background, but the same question was asked off both. The players respective golf rankings are not relevant to the question or the answer, only the reaction to it.

I seem to remember similar sentiment about the Ryder Cup that he has since backpedaled away from.
“World championship or Ryder Cup? Win a world championship.”
"In the big scheme of things it's not that important to me."


Again changing your mind is not the issue, its coming out with ridiculous, unthought out statements initially that grates on people.


So what conclusion did you reach? Perhaps that he did in fact have a sore tooth but just forgot to mention it to anyone when asked why he was walking off in the middle of a round?



Its the same thread on the same topics about the same player, quite how you can label that as a "previous discussion" is beyond me.

McDowell was never going to be asked to play for the UK given the plethora of players in front of him. McIlroy had the potential to be asked by both so clearly McDowell could declare exactly what he did without ever any fear of having to make a choice, quite unbelievable you can't see the stark difference between the situations tbh.
McDowell was 72nd in the world in April 2016, there was 9 English, 1 Scottish and 1 Welsh player in front of him in OWGR, do you know how many were ahead of Rory? Have a guess :pac:

Perhaps he didn't feel like mentioning it at the time, you specifically said his responses were scripted, I believe they were more likely reactive.

You really can't see how the previous discussion not with you and this current discussion with you is different even though their on the same thread?
If you can't see the difference and how vastly unrelated they are then I can't help you.
Do you honestly believe a previous discussion on how to determine a players mental scarring is relative to a discussion about what you refer to as McIlory's lies is relevant? Do you actually believe that? Perhaps you could connect the dots outside of them being about the same person? Mind boggling stuff.

What you actually tried to do which is quite clear to anyone reading this, is that you were trying to discredit my current points with an unrelated previous discussion but again your efforts do not surprise anyone.

FixdePitchmark

By the way , on the article.

I felt fairly underwhelmed.

Like, would be open if he discussed

What is his relationship with home is like now.
How often does he go home.
What is home.
Why did he declare for Ireland.
How has that gone down with family and community.
Does he ever want to move back.

By the way, Northern Ireland is a very strange place , I personally would not like to have grown up there .

He has done remarkably well and when he could , he got the hell out of there.

FixdePitchmark

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

By the way , on the article.

I felt fairly underwhelmed.

Like, would be open if he discussed

What is his relationship with home is like now.
How often does he go home.
What is home.
Why did he declare for Ireland.
How has that gone down with family and community.
Does he ever want to move back.

By the way, Northern Ireland is a very strange place , I personally would not like to have grown up there .

He has done remarkably well and when he could , he got the hell out of there.

The article is being published over 3 weeks so there is more to come (without knowing what that is).

Raisins

Dav010 wrote: »

Though by no means exhaustive, a couple of examples might be the Zika Virus excuse, feeling more British than Irish statement about who to represent, the debacle with Conor Ridge that allegedly cost him a lot, claiming the engagement breakup was “mutual and amicable” when it was done by text message days after invites were sent out.

Lowry used the zika excuse, as did loads of others. The British then Irish line represented his feelings at the time. He wanted to break from them, got advice from Desmond, sued Ridge and settled his case. The engagement thing I know nothing about but strikes me that’s it’s worked out for him very well. I just don’t see those changes in direction as sticks to beat him with but each to their own, there’s no right or wrong answer in discussing an athletes likeability.

Dav010

Raisins wrote: »

Lowry used the zika excuse, as did loads of others. The British then Irish line represented his feelings at the time. He wanted to break from them, got advice from Desmond, sued Ridge and settled his case. The engagement thing I know nothing about but strikes me that’s it’s worked out for him very well. I just don’t see those changes in direction as sticks to beat him with but each to their own, there’s no right or wrong answer in discussing an athletes likeability.

I wouldn’t say they are sticks to beat him with, they are however the examples requested. Though Mud28 may say they are not golf related, they are. The Zika and nationality were topical at the time he was being questioned about representing Ireland in the golf tournament at the Olympics, the Conor Ridge issue related to his sponsorship and PR representation as an elite golfer, and text issue came up when he was discussing his need to focus on his golf.

I appreciate other golfers also used the Zika excuse, no doubt that would be discussed on their thread. Personally I like him too.