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what is the big thing about the Lions?

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    #92
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    alphamule wrote: »
    well then you are also a knob!
    alphamule wrote: »
    If only you could see what I said to the mod after he bans me :)

    It wasn't really that good at all.... :/

    Banned.


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    #93
    patmac
    Registered Users Posts: 7,567 ✭✭✭patmac


    gosplan wrote: »
    It's a different experience, players enjoy it and get well paid which is nice for a change, fans enjoy it.

    I mean why would someone have a problem with it?
    Apart from player welfare etc, I don't have a problem with it, it's just the hype etc, as I said before I'd trade a 6 nations win over a Lions win any day.


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    #94
    almighty1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,183 ✭✭✭almighty1


    totallegend wrote: »
    So what's next? Winning a Rabo Pro12 is ahead of winning a Lions series?

    Possibly.


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    #95
    totallegend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭totallegend


    almighty1 wrote: »
    Possibly.

    Get up the yard. You don't believe that and neither do I. I'm out.


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    #96
    A2LUE42
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭A2LUE42


    WorldRugby99 wrote: »
    i have never said lions tour isnt an event-it is-im watching and following like everyone else but to compare it to a world cup is simply in my opinions rubbish and is buying into the sky hype.
    what would you prefer honestly-ireland to win world cup with massive homecoming parade in dublin or sexton,o driscoll and o connell to play their part in beating a pretty mediocre aussie team in this lions series?

    martin johnson,francois pienaar,lawrence dallaglio,nick farr jones and richie mccaw have all stated winning world cup biggest thing of their rugby careers-i have read so probably many others too.although granted pienaar never played the lions.

    The same Martin Johnson who said that one of the biggest regrets of his career was losing the 2001 test that he felt they should have won.


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    #97
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,237 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    A2LUE42 wrote: »
    The same Martin Johnson who said that one of the biggest regrets of his career was losing the 2001 test that he felt they should have won.

    Well it may very well have been the biggest regret of his career because, after all, he won everything ****ing else there was to win!


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    #98
    patmac
    Registered Users Posts: 7,567 ✭✭✭patmac


    totallegend wrote: »
    Get up the yard. You don't believe that and neither do I. I'm out.
    From a fans perspective would you rather your province/team won the Rabo or the Lions won the test series?


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    #99
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    patmac wrote: »
    From a fans perspective would you rather your province/team won the Rabo or the Lions won the test series?

    Depends really. For example, I thought BOD shouldn't have been risked if he wasn't 100% for the final this year as there was a Lions tour around the corner.

    I suppose ask yourself the same question, but replace Lions test series win with Irish six nations win?

    The Lions is a massive thing for the players, a premium test for the elite players of the home nations that only rolls around once every 4 years. It's massive for them, it can be the making or breaking of players. So if it's that big for them, then it's big for me too.


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    #100
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    How about this: can someone make a case for the Lions without boring me about tradition and falsely claiming that it is still the greatest potential honour for an Irish Rugby player?

    "Can anybody make a case for the Lions without mentioning two of the biggest things that fans love about the Lions?".

    G'way out of that.


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    #101
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    patmac wrote: »
    From a fans perspective would you rather your province/team won the Rabo or the Lions won the test series?

    These things are not mutually exclusive.

    How about both?


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    #102
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,836 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    So your saying that Warren Gatland's opinion gets to be the ultimate arbiter of an Irish player's career? Hmm, I would disagree on that.
    The highest honour an Irish player could achieve is starting a World Cup Final in a green jersey and winning it.

    But starting in a RWC final is completely based on one person's opinion as well.

    Being selected as a test Lion is the greatest individual honour that a player can get.


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    #103
    Birroc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    patmac wrote: »
    From a fans perspective would you rather your province/team won the Rabo or the Lions won the test series?

    As a Connacht fan I am torn! Explain how are we going to win the Rabo and then I'll decide.


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    #104
    ArmaniJeanss
    Registered Users Posts: 13,340 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    Podge_irl wrote: »
    Being selected as a test Lion is the greatest individual honour that a player can get.

    Being selected in the official Team of the World Cup would be logically way ahead surely, as you get selected ahead of the whole world rather than effectively being selected ahead of 3 other players.


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    #105
    patmac
    Registered Users Posts: 7,567 ✭✭✭patmac


    Birroc wrote: »
    As a Connacht fan I am torn! Explain how are we going to win the Rabo and then I'll decide.

    As a Connacht fan surely you would take the Rabo could you imagine the crack in Galway!


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    #106
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Birroc wrote: »
    As a Connacht fan I am torn! Explain how are we going to win the Rabo and then I'll decide.

    By Dan Parks kicking every point in your season? :P


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    #107
    Rightwing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,101 ✭✭✭Rightwing


    ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
    Being selected in the official Team of the World Cup would be logically way ahead surely, as you get selected ahead of the whole world rather than effectively being selected ahead of 3 other players.

    Only downside is, you'd never get to play on that team!


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    #108
    Birroc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    patmac wrote: »
    As a Connacht fan surely you would take the Rabo could you imagine the crack in Galway!

    It would be nice but first we would have to prevent scummy Leinster and Munster stealing all our best players and even passing some of them back with zero confidence after many months warming the bench!


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    #109
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,237 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    Teferi wrote: »
    "Can anybody make a case for the Lions without mentioning two of the biggest things that fans love about the Lions?".

    G'way out of that.


    But, as pointed out on this thread already, those aspects don't hold true with respect to the Lions anymore. It is not representative of the tradition and history of 19th / 20th century touring anymore and it is no longer the biggest prize / stage in World Rugby. If you reckon that's all it's got going for it then I'd be forced to conclude there isn't a whole lot to it anymore.


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    #110
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,836 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    If you reckon that's all it's got going for it then I'd be forced to conclude there isn't a whole lot to it anymore.

    Yet fans and players still undeniably love it. Which is all that really matters.


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    #111
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    But, as pointed out on this thread already, those aspects don't hold true with respect to the Lions anymore. It is not representative of the tradition and history of 19th / 20th century touring anymore and it is no longer the biggest prize / stage in World Rugby. If you reckon that's all it's got going for it then I'd be forced to conclude there isn't a whole lot to it anymore.

    As pointed out by people like yourself who are against the Lions those aspects don't hold true.

    Which are just opinions, not facts.

    Ones with the majority don't agree with it seems.


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    #112
    matthew8
    Registered Users Posts: 9,599 ✭✭✭matthew8


    Do the players get paid for touring?


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    #113
    Duggys Housemate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,298 ✭✭✭Duggys Housemate


    The problem here is that there are newbie Rugby fans who don't really get Rugby. I see that on twitter where the Heineken cup is a bigger deal than the Lions, judging by number of posts per game. Well that will never be the case for the players.

    The order of preference of wins for players ( in the home associations):

    1) World Cup
    2) Lions
    3) 6 N
    4) Heineken
    5) Other tournaments not the Heineken.

    The WC - a relatively new competition which doesn't really do it for me - speaks for itself. The others show, in ascending order, how good the player who competes in them is. If you are playing for a team competitive in the Heineken cup you are clearly a good player but you may not be called up for the 6N, and if you are you may not be called up for the Lions.

    Which is why they all love being called up for the Lions, and of course winning as a Lion.

    Any other argument is nonsense, its not really understanding rugby tradition or human nature.


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    #114
    Duggys Housemate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,298 ✭✭✭Duggys Housemate


    ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
    Being selected in the official Team of the World Cup would be logically way ahead surely, as you get selected ahead of the whole world rather than effectively being selected ahead of 3 other players.

    Its an honour but not a team which plays anywhere, its clearly not comparable to a team which tours.


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    #115
    Duggys Housemate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,298 ✭✭✭Duggys Housemate


    MrDerp wrote: »
    I'm sure plenty of players would take a world cup medal or a H-cup medal over a lions cap.

    I doubt the latter. Its a club competition played every year, where the competition for places is clearly easier than any given Lions tour.


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    #116
    Rightwing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,101 ✭✭✭Rightwing


    matthew8 wrote: »
    Do the players get paid for touring?

    Well paid!


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    #117
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,237 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    Duggys Housemate wrote: »
    The problem here is that there are newbie Rugby fans who don't really get Rugby.

    Ha, nicely condescended sir. I'm not a newbie fan nor someone who doesn't 'get' rugby. Some of us can simply see through the hype and bull****. There was a time when playing for the Barbarians was a big deal (I remember a particularly memorable defeat of South Africa at Landsdowne Road in the early nineties). But time moves on and it became ever less relevant in the pro era. The Lions is front and center because it's profitable, no other reason. All that history and tradition will be shoved to one side if a more profitable summer option ever rears its head.


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    #118
    Rightwing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,101 ✭✭✭Rightwing


    Duggys Housemate wrote: »
    I doubt the latter. Its a club competition played every year, where the competition for places is clearly easier than any given Lions tour.

    Would S Williams swap his recent cap for a H cup medal? I think so.


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    #119
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    Ha, nicely condescended sir. I'm not a newbie fan nor someone who doesn't 'get' rugby. Some of us can simply see through the hype and bull****. There was a time when playing for the Barbarians was a big deal (I remember a particularly memorable defeat of South Africa at Landsdowne Road in the early nineties). But time moves on and it became ever less relevant in the pro era. The Lions is front and center because it's profitable, no other reason. All that history and tradition will be shoved to one side if a more profitable summer option ever rears its head.

    OK you don't like it, we get it, but there is clearly a massive market for it (hence why it's so profitable as you point out) and I would say the overwhelming majority of 'rugby fans' don't share your view. If/when your opinion becomes the majority it's relevance may be in question but there is absolutely no sign of that happening any time soon


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    #120
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 36,237 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    matthew8 wrote: »
    Do the players get paid for touring?

    Of course, it's the professional era. No way they'd trek out to Australia and put their bodies on the line without being paid for it. Now, if they still all went down for free I think the arguments about history, tradition and ultimate stature would ring much more true.


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    #121
    almighty1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,183 ✭✭✭almighty1


    Duggys Housemate wrote: »
    The order of preference of wins for players ( in the home associations):

    1) World Cup
    2) Lions
    3) 6 N
    4) Heineken
    5) Other tournaments not the Heineken.

    That's purely your opinion and one that alot of people would disagree with. Me being one


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