Second Captains

corwill

yosser hughes wrote: »

Well AS I said, I habe cancelled my subscription. I haven't complained that much before actually.
Are people not allowed to critique?

Just blandly writing off what people have to say as left wing witterings, as though there's no question at all as the their incorrectness, is not a critique, it's little better than namecalling.

yosser hughes

corwill wrote: »

Just blandly writing off what people have to say as left wing witterings, as though there's question at all as the their incorrectness, is not a critique, it's little better than namecalling.

Oh FFS. Do you really want people to go in to detail?
Whatever man. I'll leave you to it.

yosser hughes

lawred2 wrote: »

ah now but you are though... and that's fine.

This thread is littered with your complaints about Ken and the left wing leanings of the lads in general..

I mean - seriously - surely you're not going to say that you're not!?

Why do you keep upsetting yourself with content that you don't like nor want to listen to?

I like other sections of the pod and I actually enjoy his descriptive stories on his journeys.
I'm not upset at all.I subscribed for quite a while and it is great value, as overall their output is great. I'm just voicing my opinion. Is that not allowed?

corwill

yosser hughes wrote: »

Oh FFS. Do you really want people to go in to detail?
Whatever man. I'll leave you to it.

It's entirely up to you, but some sort of detail would at least allow others to figure out what you're on about. An ongoing absence of rationale from criticism could lead one to infer non-existence, but that's entirely a matter for yourself.

dulux99

The fact of the matter is Ken is clearly bored of reporting on football and wants to report on something more "important". That's fine, that's up to him. But at the end of the day it's a sport/soccer podcast and their coverage of the actual soccer leading up to this world cup has been pathetic. No research, no proper previews, no group breakdowns, just over and over and over with the Putin stuff. The only interesting bit of preview they had was when they phoned Tim Vickery and gave him 15 minutes or so to tell a great story. There should be more of that kind of thing. Are they even looking forward to the world cup? It sure doesn't sound like it. I went back to the Totally Football podcast and finally got some good previews into my ears by journalists who sounded enthusiastic about what they're reporting. The SC podcasts were actually sapping my excitement for the world cup.

Ken is just obsessive at times and it's to the detriment of the podcast. First it was Mourinho, then it was Neymar, and now it's Putin. I think everyone likes second captains as they can blend sport itself with other aspects surrounding the sport, but they so rarely cover anything on the actual field anymore, it's just not good enough. I've said it previously in the thread but compare their soccer coverage with their rugby coverage - the rugby coverage covers details in games brilliantly with nuanced observations on things that happened in the match. Their soccer coverage now just consists of "and some extraordinary comments from (insert manager here) after the game....."

Pete Moss

"A Ken Early Political Podcast - World Cup Edition" should have been produced in advance of the tournament.
It would have given him the right platform to examine and comment on the social/political backdrop of the competition. I'm not saying he shouldn't pass comment on these issues on the regular pods, but at least a bulk of the issues could have been discussed on a standalone pod. Leaving the teams and tournament to be discussed at greater length in the SC Football Podcast.

From a football perspective, yesterday's pod wasn't that bad, it just wasn't that great either. I've heard better build up on SC prior to an average weekend of PL football. Considering this is supposed to be the biggest football tournament of them all, I expected SC to offer something better.

Cienciano

yosser hughes wrote: »

The roadshow? With Ronnie Whelan etc. Jesus! How tired is this roadshow thing?
Ken's not a 'genius' either.

Come on, you might not like the pod much these days, but don't say things like that.

Say Your Number wrote: »

Suppose they'll have US Murph prattling on about his beloved bleedin' Warriors this week.

He better. I reckon the Brian Colangelo story from the 76ers will get some airtime. US Murph won't go into enough detail, but it's a great story. The latest episode of the Reply All podcast covers it well. Second half of the show.
Basically the manager was caught setting up fake twitter accounts criticising players he didn't like.

corwill

Cienciano wrote: »

Basically the manager was caught setting up fake twitter accounts criticising players he didn't like.

Now that's a story I want to hear, maybe get a local journo on about it.

Arghus

I thought it was a bit much of Ken to spend basically the first twenty minutes or so of yesterday's pod defending his article in the Irish Times. And by "defending" I mean essentially repeating the article all over again from start to finish.

I love Ken, I love how he's able to bring the world outside of football into discussions about the game in a way that almost no other current football journalist can and his insights and imagination are amongst the best in the business. But lately, the last twelve months say, I think there's been a drop off in the overall quality of what he has to say about football. I would have never listened to Ken for in-depth tactical analysis, but he brought something different to the table: he had a knack of revealing something about the football World through a - let's say - slightly askew way. As lame as that sounds.

But now certain parts of his shtick are in danger of becoming the entire act and I can't think of the last time I listened to him and thought, yeah, I never thought of that before. A lot of the time I know what angle he's going to take before he even starts to talk on a given subject; it feels a bit tired. And it isn't his political leanings: I'm with him all the way on that.

I really hope this isn't a World Cup given over to endless coverage of what managers and players say in press conferences. Though Ken tends to be good when he's sent out travelling: at least it gives him some new material.

There's an element of the pot calling the kettle black with this post: this is about the third or fourth time I've written some variation on this, but yesterday was so illustrative of the point. I couldn't believe it, "He's actually going to read the entire article - all over again?" and the article itself - which I had previously read - was just okay, at best. He'd decided to go with this Cold War having echoes of our time angle, but it was a bit belaboured and the counter point he wanted to make - about how people could end up being pleasantly surprised by the tournament - was rushed in the final piece and felt thoroughly half baked and tacked on.

I was defending the honour of Jonathan Wilson here a few days ago. I'd like to take this opportunity to admit that I may not have been wholly correct in my assessment of him. He really is a Negative Nelly. His tone of depressed self-pity when he was talking about whether he was looking forward to the Cup or not pissed me right off.

The guy writes about football for a living. Now, I'm sure it's not a piece of cake and it must be a pain in some ways, but aside from actually playing football for a living or being a groupie bangin', coke-sniffin' rockstar there must be few more privelleged ways to make a living. I'd literally give a ball to be able to do that and I'd never stop being thankful. Not once. Let me experience the jet lag and crazy deadlines in Russia Jonathan and you can have the soul sapping drudgery of my everyday. At least Tim Vickery could see the validity of cynicism in the face of the tournament, but was wise enough to know that if you let it override all the joy, well, then, you may as well give up altogether.

Dots1982

Resubscribed for the World Cup, I think I’ll be out again after it.

The World Cup can’t start quick enough as Ken is clearly bored in his unimpressive pre-tournament observations: Neymar is good, no ****.

tomwaits48

Dots1982 wrote: »

Resubscribed for the World Cup, I think I’ll be out again after it.

The World Cup can’t start quick enough as Ken is clearly bored in his unimpressive pre-tournament observations: Neymar is good, no ****.

Please try and be balanced in your comments this time around, no one wants to read threads of endless moaning.

Dots1982

tomwaits48 wrote: »

Dots1982 wrote: »

Resubscribed for the World Cup, I think I’ll be out again after it.

The World Cup can’t start quick enough as Ken is clearly bored in his unimpressive pre-tournament observations: Neymar is good, no ****.

Please try and be balanced in your comments this time around, no one wants to read threads of endless moaning.

Seems since I was subscribed last, there’s a lot more than me moaning.

kippy

Dots1982 wrote: »

Seems since I was subscribed last, there’s a lot more than me moaning.

There are literally thousands more not moaning. Sub's are well up since you left so they are doing something right.

Dots1982

kippy wrote: »

Dots1982 wrote: »

Seems since I was subscribed last, there’s a lot more than me moaning.

There are literally thousands more not moaning. Sub's are well up since you left so they are doing something right.

Absolutely, I’ve qualified any criticism I’ve made in the past by saying their figures grow & grow but the commentary on here is more negative than I can remember it and even if it wasn’t I’m not going to censure myself because I’m in the minority. It’s a discussion forum; thems the rules.

kippy

Dots1982 wrote: »

Absolutely, I’ve qualified any criticism I’ve made in the past by saying their figures grow & grow but the commentary on here is more negative than I can remember it and even if it wasn’t I’m not going to censure myself because I’m in the minority. It’s a discussion forum; thems the rules.

The thing is you will generally only ever see the negatives in a forum like this. Have a look around. Praise for anything is in scarce supply.
That's not changed.
Carry on voicing your opinion. Just don't think it's a widely held one or any more widely held than a few months ago.

Gbear

Arghus wrote: »

At least Tim Vickery could see the validity of cynicism in the face of the tournament, but was wise enough to know that if you let it override all the joy, well, then, you may as well give up altogether.

I thought his dodge about the politics of it were pretty weak to be honest.

You don't need to be a professional political commentator to have some opinion.
I think it'd be fairer to say that he'd rather pretend there's no political element because it makes him uncomfortable.

As we've seen today, human trashbag and leader of the Chechen government Ramzan Kadyrov was spotted being pally with Mo Salah at the Egyptian training camp based in Grozny.

So you have a guy who is alleged to have created detention camps for homosexuals, and has said they're not human, using photo ops with international stars to promote himself and give himself more legitimacy.
I'm sure this won't be the only example of Russians laundering their image over the course of this competition.

I don't expect these guys to go on strike in protest or whatever, but burying their heads in the sand about it isn't the only alternative.

snotboogie

Cienciano wrote: »

Come on, you might not like the pod much these days, but don't say things like that.



He better. I reckon the Brian Colangelo story from the 76ers will get some airtime. US Murph won't go into enough detail, but it's a great story. The latest episode of the Reply All podcast covers it well. Second half of the show.
Basically the manager was caught setting up fake twitter accounts criticising players he didn't like.

It was his wife who started and operated the accounts. Zach Lowe did a good breakdown on his pod last week.

Arghus

Gbear wrote: »

I thought his dodge about the politics of it were pretty weak to be honest.

You don't need to be a professional political commentator to have some opinion.
I think it'd be fairer to say that he'd rather pretend there's no political element because it makes him uncomfortable.

As we've seen today, human trashbag and leader of the Chechen government Ramzan Kadyrov was spotted being pally with Mo Salah at the Egyptian training camp based in Grozny.

So you have a guy who is alleged to have created detention camps for homosexuals, and has said they're not human, using photo ops with international stars to promote himself and give himself more legitimacy.
I'm sure this won't be the only example of Russians laundering their image over the course of this competition.

I don't expect these guys to go on strike in protest or whatever, but burying their heads in the sand about it isn't the only alternative.

Yeah, to be fair, he did seem remarkably naive about why there could be geo-political tensions going on in the world right now. I couldn't really understand that, particularly because he's usually great at bringing all those aspects together when he talks about the wider societal impact of football - he's quite insightful on the BBC World Football Phone In.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Dots1982 wrote: »

Seems since I was subscribed last, there’s a lot more than me moaning.

To be fair to you SC has gone stale. I'm really looking forward to kens take on the World Cup, it's worth keeping the sub for one more month anyway.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Say Your Number

That was an interesting interview with Shaun Patton on the differences between being a LOI and intercounty goalie.

I was aware of "The Catch" and the lore around it, didn't know Dwight Clark was such an underdog story, the way US Murph was describing it, it had a big social impact like Italia 90 here.

threein99

Say Your Number wrote: »

That was an interesting interview with Shaun Patton on the differences between being a LOI and intercounty goalie.

I was aware of "The Catch" and the lore around it, didn't know Dwight Clark was such an underdog story, the way US Murph was describing it, it had a big social impact like Italia 90 here.

I thought he was really dull

Cienciano

threein99 wrote: »

I thought he was really dull

Yeah, same here. I normally like us murph, but I ended up skipping to the end. And after watching "the catch" after them build it up to be this unbelievable play made it worse. It's a bog standard play purely as a piece of football.

MercuryBoy

Gotta say I agree with a lot of the "complainers" on here, Ken Early's obsession with Mourinho , Putin etc has become totally tiresome, we get it, time to move on!

The World Cup previews produced by FW, TFS etc really showed it up...

MercuryBoy

MercuryBoy wrote: »

Gotta say I agree with a lot of the "complainers" on here, Ken Early's obsession with Mourinho , Putin etc has become totally tiresome, we get it, time to move on!

The World Cup previews produced by FW, TFS etc really showed it up...

the BW and DTV ones are even better

Utopia Parkway

Pete Moss wrote: »

"A Ken Early Political Podcast - World Cup Edition" should have been produced in advance of the tournament.
It would have given him the right platform to examine and comment on the social/political backdrop of the competition. I'm not saying he shouldn't pass comment on these issues on the regular pods, but at least a bulk of the issues could have been discussed on a standalone pod. Leaving the teams and tournament to be discussed at greater length in the SC Football Podcast.

From a football perspective, yesterday's pod wasn't that bad, it just wasn't that great either. I've heard better build up on SC prior to an average weekend of PL football. Considering this is supposed to be the biggest football tournament of them all, I expected SC to offer something better.

Dare I say it but Ken often gets too much air time. World Cup preview show and the first half of it is Ken droning on again before Vickery and Wilson join them. Why not have the lads on from the beginning and give them the full hour?

I'm as entertained by Ken as the next man put sometimes it feels like they need to reign him in a bit.

dulpit

Is there anything to be said for recognising that second captains is a different type of show? It's not there for the in-depth analysis of games/etc, it's more for the broader view with their specific slant on things. I prefer that personally. If the whole show became an in-depth deep dive into the tactics of team a versus team b I'd die of boredom. There are shows for that though, but don't try to make this that.

threein99

dulpit wrote: »

Is there anything to be said for recognising that second captains is a different type of show? It's not there for the in-depth analysis of games/etc, it's more for the broader view with their specific slant on things. I prefer that personally. If the whole show became an in-depth deep dive into the tactics of team a versus team b I'd die of boredom. There are shows for that though, but don't try to make this that.

That's why I like it

Salvation Tambourine

threein99 wrote: »

That's why I like it

I agree, there were plenty of pods offering team by team and group by group previews. I only listened to a couple of them, couldn't be bothered listening to the rest.

lawred2

dulpit wrote: »

Is there anything to be said for recognising that second captains is a different type of show? It's not there for the in-depth analysis of games/etc, it's more for the broader view with their specific slant on things. I prefer that personally. If the whole show became an in-depth deep dive into the tactics of team a versus team b I'd die of boredom. There are shows for that though, but don't try to make this that.

100%.... overdoing the tactical stuff is for kids and anoraks