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Doctors reject abortion motions

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24567…10

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    #32
    whatdoicare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭whatdoicare


    goose2005 wrote: »
    I don't see the problem - if you believe a foetus is a full human being then that belief can hardly change based on how he/she was conceived.

    I wouldn't object to "abortion on demand" but surely it's ludicrous to say that killing a foetus is murder, but killing a foetus conceived by rape/incest isn't murder.

    A foetus isn't a full human being - it can't survive on it's own outside the womb until at least 24 weeks gestation and not without considerable medical intervention. (I am pregnant and 26 weeks gone - my baby was not considered a "viable baby" by medical standards until two weeks ago, it was my consultant who informed me of this fact) Before this, if I die or my body decides to expel the foetus for whatever reason, the foetus dies and doctors can't do anything to save it.


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    #33
    Clandestine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,466 ✭✭✭Clandestine


    I'm sorry, I thought this was 2013


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    #34
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,704 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    cassi wrote: »
    I've said it on other treads an ill say it again, the term "abortion on demand" is a terribly innacurate way of describing what women are looking for. No one is demanding an abortion, they are requesting it for a litany of reasons that most often are not made easily.

    Abortion by request much better represents what people are looking for in thi country!
    Same result though, no matter how you dress it up in temperate language.


    A dead baby.


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    #35
    Turtyturd
    Registered Users Posts: 28,394 ✭✭✭✭Turtyturd


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Same result though, no matter how you dress it up in temperate language.


    A dead baby.

    Oh the irony.


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    #36
    Clandestine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,466 ✭✭✭Clandestine


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Same result though, no matter how you dress it up in temperate language.


    A dead baby.
    lel


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    #37
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,704 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Turtyturd wrote: »
    Oh the irony.
    No irony from me, just the harsh reality of abortion.


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    #38
    Paramite Pie
    Registered Users Posts: 1,312 ✭✭✭Paramite Pie


    I wonder how many of those doctors will ever need an abortion in their life time?:rolleyes:
    whatdoicare wrote: »
    A foetus isn't a full human being - it can't survive on it's own outside the womb until at least 24 weeks gestation and not without considerable medical intervention. (I am pregnant and 26 weeks gone - my baby was not considered a "viable baby" by medical standards until two weeks ago, it was my consultant who informed me of this fact) Before this, if I die or my body decides to expel the foetus for whatever reason, the foetus dies and doctors can't do anything to save it.

    While I believe in legalizing abortion I do think a foetus is still human even if it can't survive outside the womb. A new born baby would not survive either without at least one person to look after it. I do not think it's about viability.

    The tricky part is when does this foetus become self-aware or truly alive... and the truth is that's probably a gradual process...

    However I would not deny someone an abortion if I were a doctor/legislator.


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    #39
    Turtyturd
    Registered Users Posts: 28,394 ✭✭✭✭Turtyturd


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    No irony from me, just the harsh reality of abortion.

    Plenty of irony when you criticise someone for the language they use while using inflammatory language in the same post.

    And you obviously have no idea of the reality of abortion.


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    #40
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,413 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Wasn't it specifically the wording they disagreed with? Not necessarily the whole concept?


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    #41
    whatdoicare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭whatdoicare


    Paramite Pie wrote: »
    I wonder how many of those doctors will ever need an abortion in their life time?:rolleyes:



    While I believe in legalizing abortion I do think a foetus is still human even if it can't survive outside the womb. A new born baby would not survive either without at least one person to look after it. I do not think it's about viability.

    The tricky part is when does this foetus become self-aware or truly alive... and the truth is that's probably a gradual process...

    However I would not deny someone an abortion if I were a doctor/legislator.

    That's the crucial thing though, isn't it - alot of this is being left to peoples beliefs when it should be decided on facts. None of this should be based on a doctors personal thoughts. It needs to be laid down clearly and without room for doubt in the law.

    I'm pregnant - this is a very much wanted, planned and longed for baby. I would never in a million years abort this baby unless my life was in danger. I have a huge amount of support available to me from my husband, family, work and friends both financially and emotionally. I have sailed through my pregnancy and have had zero problems. I am the ideal of what pregnancy should be.

    Saying all of that, I would never, ever, ever expect another woman to go through what I am going through against their will. Not for any reason.
    It is very hard emotionally, physically and financially before the baby is even born and that is when everything is going perfectly.

    I am also very uncomfortable with the realisation that doctors, even after the salvita case, still regard the foetus' life as more important than mine in every scenario.

    Things need to change and fast - there needs to be clear rules and noone should be left in any doubt about what those rules mean for the health and wellbeing of mothers to be.


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    #42
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,704 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Turtyturd wrote: »

    And you obviously have no idea of the reality of abortion.
    Don't you for one second think you know about my idea of the reality of abortion.

    OK?


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    #43
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,704 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Pride Fighter wrote: »
    The IMO are a bunch of corrupt, misogynistic bigots. They are a discredited organisation and the doctors need a new vehicle to represent them.
    Any examples?


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    #44
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Don't you for one second think you know about my idea of the reality of abortion.

    OK?


    Why?


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    #45
    Turtyturd
    Registered Users Posts: 28,394 ✭✭✭✭Turtyturd


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Don't you for one second think you know about my idea of the reality of abortion.

    OK?

    Cool, But just for future reference, if you put up a simple and sensationalist view of abortion it's going to give people the impression that you hold a simple and sensationalist view of abortion.

    OK?


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    #46
    Morag
    Registered Users Posts: 8,423 ✭✭✭Morag


    Very disapointed at this,

    These are what they voted to reject


    38 - This meeting calls on the IMO to support regulation in relation to the provision of abortion services where there is a “real and substantial risk” to the life of the mother)

    39 - The IMO calls on the Government to legislate for women who become pregnant as a result of a criminal act that they would be allowed access to legal termination within Ireland and

    40 The IMO calls on the Government to legislate for the provision of abortion services for women who are pregnant with non-viable fetal anomalies who choose to proceed with an abortion.

    Fair play toDr Mary Favier & Dr Mark Murphy of Doctors for Choice for proposing the motions. The IMO are now out of line with the majority of Irish people who think women should have the right to an abortion here in Ireland under those provisions.


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    #47
    Paramite Pie
    Registered Users Posts: 1,312 ✭✭✭Paramite Pie


    whatdoicare wrote: »
    I am also very uncomfortable with the realisation that doctors, even after the salvita case, still regard the foetus' life as more important than mine in every scenario.

    Things need to change and fast - there needs to be clear rules and noone should be left in any doubt about what those rules mean for the health and wellbeing of mothers to be.

    No matter how religious people claim to be, then they cannot regard one life as more important, so it's hypocritical of them anyways to put the foetus first.

    I would never judge anyone for having an abortion even if I don't think I'd consider one myself. However you never know until your put in those circumstances.

    The case of Savita was particularly horrifying. I didn't know her but I lived near Doughiska in Galway so it was the talk of the town.

    In some parts of the world, doctors have gotten excommunicated for carrying out abortions, even on teenage rape victims. I can't comprehend such heartless opposition.


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    #48
    opinion guy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,001 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Don't you for one second think you know about my idea of the reality of abortion.

    OK?

    Why don't you tell us then ?


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    #49
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Morag wrote: »
    Very disapointed at this,

    These are what they voted to reject


    38 - This meeting calls on the IMO to support regulation in relation to the provision of abortion services where there is a “real and substantial risk” to the life of the mother)

    39 - The IMO calls on the Government to legislate for women who become pregnant as a result of a criminal act that they would be allowed access to legal termination within Ireland and

    40 The IMO calls on the Government to legislate for the provision of abortion services for women who are pregnant with non-viable fetal anomalies who choose to proceed with an abortion.

    Fair play toDr Mary Favier & Dr Mark Murphy of Doctors for Choice for proposing the motions. The IMO are now out of line with the majority of Irish people who think women should have the right to an abortion here in Ireland under those provisions.

    It's really hard to fathom how somebody could have a problem with that.


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    #50
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    My name is URL wrote: »
    Only 75 people bothered to vote... out of a membership of what, over 5000?

    Depressing stuff

    Perhaps it was only practical for 75 doctors to be there, given its all the way down in Killarney. You know medics might have other commitments too, like jobs and families.


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    #51
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,704 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Nodin wrote: »
    Why?
    Personal reasons.


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    #52
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    Perhaps it was only practical for 75 doctors to be there, given its all the way down in Killarney. You know medics might have other commitments too, like jobs and families.


    ...out of supposedly over 5,000 members....?


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    #53
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Pride Fighter wrote: »
    The IMO are a bunch of corrupt, misogynistic bigots. They are a discredited organisation and the doctors need a new vehicle to represent them.

    If you're going to make such a big claim please give us examples of corruption, misogyny and bigotry, thanks.


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    #54
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Personal reasons.

    Thats nice. Others have personal reasons that make them believe that abortion should be available.


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    #55
    opinion guy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,001 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Personal reasons.

    Oh sorry you are right.

    ATTENTION IRELAND - do as padd says because he has personal reasons.


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    #56
    volauvent
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 35 ✭volauvent


    C'mon did you see the average age there ( front page of times) They are dinosaurs.
    If you think you can draw conclusions about how doctors feel about abortion based on that, you would be pissed off with the medical profession on unfair grounds.
    Many many doctors are pro choice.



    http://www.irishtimes.com


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    #57
    otto_26
    Registered Users Posts: 518 ✭✭✭otto_26


    pablomakaveli wrote: »
    You have to be a special kind of sadistic c**t to expect a women to carry a baby to term in those circumstances.

    Your post says a whole lot more about you


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    #58
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    otto_26 wrote: »
    Your post says a whole lot more about you

    How so?


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    #59
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Nodin wrote: »
    ...out of supposedly over 5,000 members....?

    Yeah, I've been in sports clubs with huge membership too and only a handful ever turn up for AGM's. Doctors too have lives and other commitments, I can easily understand why so few can give up a can give up a couple of days to attend this in Killarney - the end of the country.

    I cared about my own old profession but would never be bothered to attend an AGM because generally I have better things to be doing, like many doctors.


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    #60
    Pompey Magnus
    Registered Users Posts: 5,406 ✭✭✭Pompey Magnus


    whatdoicare wrote: »
    Before this, if I die or my body decides to expel the foetus for whatever reason, the foetus dies and doctors can't do anything to save it.

    The record for survival of premature birth is 21 weeks and 5 days, well before when it would be deemed "viable". Is there a specific reason why, if her mother died whilst in medical care, this child could not survive the operation to remove it?


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    #61
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    Yeah, I've been in sports clubs with huge membership too and only a handful ever turn up for AGM's. Doctors too have lives and other commitments, I can easily understand why so few can give up a can give up a couple of days to attend this in Killarney - the end of the country. Doctors have to be members of the IMO, its not a choice.

    I cared about my own old profession but would never be bothered to attend an AGM because generally I have better things to be doing, like many doctors.


    Forgetting about the whole abortion thing, you'd have thought there'd be a higher attendance given the ex-CEO etc. Them membership fees aren't small, afaik.


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