Ethnically Catholic...

Ghost Buster

omega666 wrote: »

Just as i thought, there seems to be a load of a la carte atheists around also.
Ignore the fact the only reason your getting those holidays is because of religion. For those working tomorrow enjoy the overtime and spare a though for the reason your getting it.

Do you hide in a hole on Thursday or do you follow Norse religious beliefs?

omega666

Nodin wrote: »

Thats a collection, not a tax. A tax is not a voluntary matter.

Same thing. In fact a tax reaches a wider audience so could be a cash cow for the church. Not a bad idea.

krudler

omega666 wrote: »

We already have a church tax. It's collected in a basket every Sunday. The atheists don't even have pay it and still get the holidays. Win win for them

That's not a tax in fairness.

Just as i thought, there seems to be a load of a la carte atheists around also.
Ignore the fact the only reason your getting those holidays is because of religion. For those working tomorrow enjoy the overtime and spare a though for the reason your getting it.

What on earth is an a la carte atheist? the only thing that would make an atheist not an atheist is believing in a god.

Nodin

omega666 wrote: »

Same thing. In fact a tax reaches a wider audience so could be a cash cow for the church. Not a bad idea.

Other than "waah, I don't like the atheists" its a bit hard to work out what your general point is.

coffee_cake

ejmaztec wrote: »

I don't know much about this but aren't Catholics only compelled to go to church once or twice a year, and it's up to them whether they want to attend for the rest of the year?

You're in a state of something-sin if you miss a weekly mass.

What you're thinking of is the a la carte catholics who go at xmas and think shur it's grand :rolleyes:

krudler

omega666 wrote: »

Same thing. In fact a tax reaches a wider audience so could be a cash cow for the church. Not a bad idea.

yeah that's what the church needs, more money to not pay tax on.

twinQuins

omega666 wrote: »

Just as i thought, there seems to be a load of a la carte atheists around also.

Considering atheism is merely 'a lack of belief in any god or gods'... I really don't understand your point. As long as these people still don't hold any belief in any god there's nothing a la carte about it.

Did you mean secularism? Because the two are different things.

COYW

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I'd add church weddings and Christenings to that list too. A couple we know never go to Mass. But they wanted (and had) a church wedding at a pretty little church 'because it was the thing to do. Plenty of others on that list too.

To each his own, I guess even though I think it's hypocritical.

I have a load of friends who fall into this category. I get told it's tradition. One of my friends had to get his uncle, the priest, drunk to get him to agree to marry him and his wife. Baffles me why people do things like this.

krudler wrote: »

What on earth is an a la carte atheist? the only thing that would make an atheist not an atheist is believing in a god.

I'm guessing he is talking about people who consider themselves atheist but go to church for their wedding etc.

starlings

Seachmall wrote: »

In fairness I've never seen an atheist pulpit-preach. The only times I hear about atheists forcing there views on others is on AH, which is a discussion forum known for it's repetitive and drawn out threads after all.

Right now there are multiple repetitive, drawn out discussions on whether or not to scrap the Irish Language Commissioner, on whether the US are gonna kick off with North Korea, on whether or not Pistorious is guilty and whether or not the Gardai were in the right to walk out. Welcome to AH.

Preaching atheists are like the PC Brigrade, they exist only in the mind of Boardsies.

I do think there are preaching atheists, but that may well be my reception rather than the signal. When I listen to or read Dawkins, preaching is what comes to mind. While I tend to agree with a lot of what he says, he says it in such a hectoring, antagonistic, tone that I think of him as every bit as sanctimonious as his opponents.

I fully share krudler's wishes for full separation of church and state, non-religious education, abortion rights and gay marriage rights and a tolerant society. I'm sure if I met krudler I'd like him very much. It's simply a question of tactics: I prefer persuasion and practical proof to polemic.

Bobeagleburger

I would say the actual practising Catholic adults is < 5%

COYW

rarnes1 wrote: »

I would say the actual practising Catholic adults is < 5%

I live very near a RC church and there is a tailback every Sunday in that area. Sure the numbers are down but to suggest that less than 5% of adult RCs go to mass is inaccurate.

Duggys Housemate

Dawkins is a cultural Anglican. His followers are "Protestant atheists", including his Irish followers. It's a matter of cherry picking history: ranting about the crusades rather than the British empire, whining about cultural Catholics but smiling benignly at Anglican a la Carte believers, being sanguine about Bishops in the Unelected Upper House but opposing Catholic schools, downplaying evangelical Protestantism by making Catholicism the "second most evil religion", remarking on the (protestant) Martyrs outside his Office in ( Catholic founded) Oxford while ignoring the 10,000 times as many Catholic victims of Establishmentarianism, accusing Catholic Spain of a more racist imperialism than the British Empire when the opposite is true, harking on about the inquisition and ignoring England's severe anti-Catholic laws, thinking Nazi Germany was Catholic, and blaming Northern Ireland's problems on Cathlolic schools rather than Protestant sectarian imperialism.

Given all that, I am proud to call myself a cultural Catholic, though I haven't believed since I was 8.

awec

omega666 wrote: »

Should atheists be forced to work on religious holidays?
I mean i've never heard an atheist complain about having no work on good friday or easter monday? Complain when they are getting drunk on Paddy's day? Or stuffing their face on Christmas day?

Surely if they were dedicated to the cause they would be out protesting
and boycotting these holidays, demanding the Government cancel them as it's clearly wreaking thier lives.

Those aren't Christian holidays to me, they're just days off work.

Bobeagleburger

COYW wrote: »

I live very near a RC church and there is a tailback every Sunday in that area. Sure the numbers are down but to suggest that less than 5% of adult RCs go to mass is inaccurate.

Sure that's only part of the gig.

Practising Catholic:

No contraception
No sex before marrage
Mass
etc


Probably < 1% tbh

gcgirl

omega666 wrote: »

We already have a church tax. It's collected in a basket every Sunday. The atheists don't even have pay it and still get the holidays. Win win for them

Have a look at Germany they operate a religious tax instead of sprouting the same stuff every time you post something

krudler

starlings wrote: »

I fully share krudler's wishes for full separation of church and state, non-religious education, abortion rights and gay marriage rights and a tolerant society. I'm sure if I met krudler I'd like him very much. It's simply a question of tactics: I prefer persuasion and practical proof to polemic.

http://images.wikia.com/adventuretimewithfinnandjake/images/e/ea/Oh_stop_it_you.png

starlings

krudler wrote: »

http://images.wikia.com/adventuretimewithfinnandjake/images/e/ea/Oh_stop_it_you.png

see? persuasion ftw.

Nodin

rarnes1 wrote: »

Sure that's only part of the gig.
Practising Catholic:
No contraception
No sex before marrage
Mass
etc
Probably < 1% tbh

O there's more to it than that...

An unnatural sexual act is any type of sexual act that is not unitive and procreative. Examples of unnatural sexual acts include oral sexual acts, anal sexual acts, and manipulative sexual acts (i.e. masturbation of self or of another).

http://www.catechism.cc/articles/QA.htm

You don't get carte blanche once ye've tied the knot....

anna.fun

gcgirl wrote: »

Let operate a church tax, if you pay your church tax you have you holy days off if you don't you don't have them off, but in fairness i see very few willing to pay a church tax

gcgirl wrote: »

Have a look at Germany they operate a religious tax instead of sprouting the same stuff every time you post something

everyone in Germany gets off on public Christian holidays though... even though not everybody is paying the religious tax (you are only taxed if you are a member of one of the churches that choose to collect their money this way)...so there's no advantage of paying this tax in regard to holidays

in fact you have to pay 3% of what you pay in income tax to the church, which can be quite a lot... (it's one of the reasons so many people are leaving church)...

Grayson

anna.fun wrote: »

in fact you have to pay 3% of what you pay in income tax to the church, which can be quite a lot... (it's one of the reasons so many people are leaving church)...

It's fair though. If you can't pay 3% you really don't believe that much.

Imagine if every time you went to mass everyone was required to stand at the front and denounce gay marriage and pre-marital sex.

Numbers for those under the age of 60 would drop instantly.

Nodin

Grayson wrote: »

It's fair though. If you can't pay 3% you really don't believe that much.

Imagine if every time you went to mass everyone was required to stand at the front and denounce gay marriage and pre-marital sex.

Numbers for those under the age of 60 would drop instantly.

O not just pre-marital sex. Oral sex within marriage. On either partner. Orgasm that doesn't involve penetration. The whole list.

And transubstantiation. Thats a winner too.

gcgirl

anna.fun wrote: »

everyone in Germany gets off on public Christian holidays though... even though not everybody is paying the religious tax (you are only taxed if you are a member of one of the churches that choose to collect their money this way)...so there's no advantage of paying this tax in regard to holidays

in fact you have to pay 3% of what you pay in income tax to the church, which can be quite a lot... (it's one of the reasons so many people are leaving church)...

Exactly if people are leaving because of 3% could you realistically see what would happen here

Nabber

People join
People leave
People believe people don't believe

I'm happy we live in a country where we can express ourselves freely.

Alot of people here, particularly the younger folks have a complete dislike to religion.

My belief is that our moral compass has been shattered due to the Celtic tiger. We could have it all, so we took it all.

People turned their back on not just the church, but morals. Human morals.
Regardless of your beliefs, the right to life should be first. We are slowly slipping away from that. Even are state is involved in denying life. The state should never be involved with taking life.

In my opinion we are on slippery slope. If you don't believe in a higher power, you must believe in something. Justice? A system designed by rich and powerful to protect the rich and powerful.

VinLieger

Nabber wrote: »

People join
People leave
People believe people don't believe

I'm happy we live in a country where we can express ourselves freely.

Alot of people here, particularly the younger folks have a complete dislike to religion.

My belief is that our moral compass has been shattered due to the Celtic tiger. We could have it all, so we took it all.

People turned their back on not just the church, but morals. Human morals.
Regardless of your beliefs, the right to life should be first. We are slowly slipping away from that. Even are state is involved in denying life. The state should never be involved with taking life.

In my opinion we are on slippery slope. If you don't believe in a higher power, you must believe in something. Justice? A system designed by rich and powerful to protect the rich and powerful.

Waa waa waa. Not a good job at hiding your youth defencey propaganda in there, please dont bring abortion into this and whether its right or wrong, that has nothing to do with this discussion at all and will only help completely derail the topic as it does whenever else it is introduced into a discussion.
Oh and to address your 2nd point of people leave, actually the catholic church changed that rule a few years ago so once you are baptised your in it for life which in my opinion is as bad as the mormons baptising people without their knowledge and even after they are dead

Duggys Housemate

VinLieger wrote: »

Waa waa waa. Not a good job at hiding your youth defencey propaganda in there, please dont bring abortion into this and whether its right or wrong, that has nothing to do with this discussion at all and will only help completely derail the topic as it does whenever else it is introduced into a discussion.
Oh and to address your 2nd point of people leave, actually the catholic church changed that rule a few years ago so once you are baptised your in it for life which in my opinion is as bad as the mormons baptising people without their knowledge and even after they are dead

What's wrong with the Mormon practice? Hurts nobody.

ScumLord

I was watching a documentary on the Roman Empire last night and it showed that Christmas was a pagan Roman holiday that later got attached to the birth of Christ. None of these holidays are Christian the church just hijacked them to appease the people of the time.

These holidays really belong to people that eat as many revolve around the farming season and it's produce.

Duggys Housemate

ScumLord wrote: »

I was watching a documentary on the Roman Empire last night and it showed that Christmas was a pagan Roman holiday that later got attached to the birth of Christ. None of these holidays are Christian the church just hijacked them to appease the people of the time.

These holidays really belong to people that eat as many revolve around the farming season and it's produce.

.

We aren't talking about Christmas, nor Easter. But ... Neither Easter or Christmas were celebrated in Ireland pre Christianity. The Winter festival was Samhain.

shopaholic01

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

.

We aren't talking about Christmas, nor Easter. But ... Neither Easter or Christmas were celebrated in Ireland pre Christianity. The Winter festival was Samhain.

ScumLord is correct, I saw that documentary too. Here's a link that explains it:

http://www.nvcc.edu/home/lshulman/rel232/resource/RileyPaper.htm

Duggys Housemate

shopaholic01 wrote: »

ScumLord is correct, I saw that documentary too. Here's a link that explains it:

http://www.nvcc.edu/home/lshulman/rel232/resource/RileyPaper.htm

No he's not. Every sub educated half wit knows that Saturnalia was pre-Christian. I didn't say it wasn't. I said that neither Easter or Christmas were Celtic. therefore Christianity brought those traditions here. The major Celtic festivals were Baltac, Bealtaine , Lunasa, and Samhain. Yule was Saxon.

That link is appalling. It seems to indicate that Christianity picked up festivals from the Aztecs - Europeans didn't meet the Aztecs for centuries after Christianity.

shopaholic01

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

No he's not. Every sub educated half wit knows that Saturnalia was pre-Christian. I didn't say it wasn't. I said that neither Easter or Christmas were Celtic. therefore Christianity brought those traditions here. The major Celtic festivals were Baltac, Bealtaine , Lunasa, and Samhain. Yule was Saxon.

That link is appalling. It seems to indicate that Christianity picked up festivals from the Aztecs - Europeans didn't meet the Aztecs for centuries after Christianity.

ScumLord mentioned Christmas, not Celtic festivals.