Bringing back species, engineering humans, altering plans, are we playing god?

Galwayguy35

Would be nice to see them bring back the Irish wolf, seeing as that scumbag Cromwell was responsible for killing them off it would be poetic justice to have them back and him still in a hole in the ground.

Sadly it won't ever happen as Ireland is a different place to what it was when the wolf roamed around 300 years ago.

steddyeddy

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Would be nice to see them bring back the Irish wolf, seeing as that scumbag Cromwell was responsible for killing them off it would be poetic justice to have them back and him still in a hole in the ground.

Sadly it won't ever happen as Ireland is a different place to what it was when the wolf roamed around 300 years ago.

You're right it would be nice to re-introduce the wolf but as you said Ireland is a different place now. We havent got the forests we used to have. There was talk of some animal rights groups releasing them illegally like they did the wild boar but that wouldnt be a great idea.

Ruudi_Mentari

Playing god?! mother nature you mean.. I'd like to remove billy wind's lungs, for starters. But I wouldn't fiddle with the lifeforms, might reintroduce / cull some things but that's it

smash

First dibs on a T-Rex!

smileyj1987

First dibs on a trip to jurassic park !

steddyeddy

Ruudi_Mentari wrote: »

Playing god?! mother nature you mean.. I'd like to remove billy wind's lungs, for starters. But I wouldn't fiddle with the lifeforms, might reintroduce / cull some things but that's it

Well "we need culling" mentality has resulted in the extinction of the thylacine and the passenger pigeon. The fear of wildlife has lead to the poisoning of our own endangered species, the white tailed eagle by sheep farmers. Fishermen are also calling for the culling of seals as our fish populations have declined (nothing to do with fishermen of course)

It is fiddling with nature and scientists are then the ones who have who have to clean up the mess because some halfwits believe fairystories about eagles attacking sheep or what not.

steddyeddy

Sorry for bumping this thread but the conference for de-extinction has now happened and this ted talk was put on youtube. This is one of the best talks I have ever heard and I know that this is a turning point in science and we will see the wooly mammoth sooner than we think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKc9MJDeqj0

To qoate the speaker, Stewart brand "The fact is humans have made a huge hole in nature in the last ten thousand years. We have the ability and moral obligation to repair some of the damage. Some species we have killed off totally.........we could consider bringing back to a world that misses them."

Mark my words this speech above will be famous. It marks the beginning of scientific de-extinction.

af_thefragile

But what about when the Dinosaurs turn on us?!?!!!

steddyeddy

af_thefragile wrote: »

But what about when the Dinosaurs turn on us?!?!!!

We unfortunately haven't the ability to bring back dinosaurs . Sabertoothed tigers are on the list though!

My name is URL

steddyeddy wrote: »

To qoate the talker Stewart brand "The fact is humans have made a huge hole in nature in the last ten thousand years. We have the ability and moral obligation to repair some of the damage. Some species we have killed off totally.........we could consider bringing back to a world that misses them."

What real 'moral obligation' do we have to bring species back from extinction? And saying stuff like "consider bringing back to a world that misses them" almost sounds more like a spiritual sort of endeavor than a scientific one.

In what way does 'the world' actually miss say, Pied Ravens? Will we also bring back hominids? What happens then.. are they kept in labs / zoos?

1ZRed

steddyeddy wrote: »

Sorry for bumping this thread but the conference for de-extinction has now happened and this ted talk was put on youtube. This is one of the best talks I have ever heard and I know that this is a turning point in science and we will see the wooly mammoth sooner than we think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKc9MJDeqj0

To qoate the talker Stewart brand "The fact is humans have made a huge hole in nature in the last ten thousand years. We have the ability and moral obligation to repair some of the damage. Some species we have killed off totally.........we could consider bringing back to a world that misses them."

Mark my words this speech above will be famous. It marks the beginning of scientific de-extinction.

Makes it a good time to want to get into genetic engineering anyway!

steddyeddy

1ZRed wrote: »

Makes it a good time to want to get into genetic engineering anyway!

Are you thinking of doing it?

Corkfeen

One concern that I have is that bringing back certain animals could have potential negative consequences for the ecosystem(wiping out other species in the process), if they're to be released into the wild that is. Plus if there's no ecosystem suitable for the animal. But I guess this is going to be analysed to such a large degree anyway. I personally want to see a woolly mammoth...

1ZRed

steddyeddy wrote: »

Are you thinking of doing it?

Yeah, genetics and DNA manipulation always interested me I'll follow that route I'd say.

Artful_Badger

Nothing against certain species being brought back if they can play a positive role in an ecosystem, as long as they wont be brought back to be exploited. They shoudlnt be brought back to stick them in a zoo to entertain slack jawed gawkers. Bringing back Neanderthal though is just stupid.

steddyeddy

1ZRed wrote: »

Yeah, genetics and DNA manipulation always interested me I'll follow that route I'd say.

Cool. I'm researching epigenetics at the moment so let me know if that's something you are interested in. Are you currently studying?

Truncheon Rouge

Maybe necessity can be the judge.
Real necessity, not just 'I'd like a mammoth skin hat' type necessity.

Engineering which affects the whole globe significantly should be regulated for everyones benefit. (Uranium..great stuff)

I don't see the benefit in bringing back species, except on occasion for specific questions on their anatomy. Lets not do it just for fascination and to poke it with a stick.

steddyeddy

Corkfeen wrote: »

One concern that I have is that bringing back certain animals could have potential negative consequences for the ecosystem(wiping out other species in the process), if they're to be released into the wild that is. Plus if there's no ecosystem suitable for the animal. But I guess this is going to be analysed to such a large degree anyway. I personally want to see a woolly mammoth...

The animals that are being brought back are generally keystone species that have completely changed the ecosystem by being made extinct in the first place. Wooly mammoths would be one of the easiest ones to do!

Truncheon Rouge

Artful_Badger wrote: »

They shoudlnt be brought back to stick them in a zoo to entertain slack jawed gawkers.

I read this and collapsed on a sundial.

shedweller

Steadyeddy, you mentioned "ecosystem" and i thought about how much damage we are doing to it. Consider how many species are being wiped out in south america where deforestation is taking place at a phenomenal rate. Not only that but the removal of said forest can only mean a reduction in oxygen manufacture.

So on the one hand we are wiping out species and on the other, we are planning on bringing some back.

Its like trying to drive a car with the handbrake on!

Oh, and what are the odds this bringing back of species will end up being abused? We better tread very carefully here or we'll end up in our own movie!

Corkfeen

Truncheon Rouge wrote: »

Maybe necessity can be the judge.
Real necessity, not just 'I'd like a mammoth skin hat' type necessity.

Engineering which affects the whole globe significantly should be regulated for everyones benefit. (Uranium..great stuff)

I don't see the benefit in bringing back species, except on occasion for specific questions on their anatomy. Lets not do it just for fascination and to poke it with a stick.

Bringing an animal back because of necessity is exploiting animals just as much as prodding them with a stick. Bringing back animals should not solely be for our benefit. We have wiped out species so bringing back what we have destroyed, is paying reparations to the planet that we constantly exploit and damage.

steddyeddy wrote: »

The animals that are being brought back are generally keystone species that have completely changed the ecosystem by being made extinct in the first place. Wooly mammoths would be one of the easiest ones to do!

Boo Yeah!

crazy cabbage

Didn't watch the video yet but I will.

Question though.

I see a majour problem in trying to reintroduce something back into the wild. We can't even reintroduce most animals that were kept/born in captavity into the wild. If we bring back an animal there will be no parent that will show that animal how to hunt or survive or anything. How do we get around this? It isn't all about nature. Alot of it comes down to nuture. Nature provides the tools to hunt and whatever but the nuture of another member of the same speices provides the ability use these tool.

Im sure smarter people than me have though about this and there is proberly something really simple im missing so will someone enlighten me?

steddyeddy

crazy cabbage wrote: »

Didn't watch the video yet but I will.

Question though.

I see a majour problem in trying to reintroduce something back into the wild. We can't even reintroduce most animals that were kept/born in captavity into the wild. If we bring back an animal there will be no parent that will show that animal how to hunt or survive or anything. How do we get around this? It isn't all about nature. Alot of it comes down to nuture. Nature provides the tools to hunt and whatever but the nuture of another member of the same speices provides the ability use these tool.

Im sure smarter people than me have though about this and there is proberly something really simple im missing so will someone enlighten me?

Good question. They are going to use homing pigeons to raise passenger pigeons and elephants to raise mammoths! It's risky but should work.

shedweller

And then you have poachers. I imagine a thylacine or mammoth head would look good on my mantelpiece!

Or said mammoths willy could make some serious medicine!

Truncheon Rouge

Corkfeen wrote: »

Bringing an animal back because of necessity is exploiting animals just as much as prodding them with a stick. Bringing back animals should not solely be for our benefit. We have wiped out species so bringing back what we have destroyed, is paying reparations to the planet that we constantly exploit and damage.

Right but don't you think things have moved on a bit since then.

Bringing back one species might affect the other species which has become commonplace in the meantime.
You don't just alter one part of the ecosystem.

On the other hand if you bring them back on occasion for study of anatomy or behavior you can learn something relevant.

Just like nuclear power, it can be very beneficial, but if you play around with it for a larff its not so good.

1ZRed

steddyeddy wrote: »

Cool. I'm researching epigenetics at the moment so let me know if that's something you are interested in. Are you currently studying?

I've actually read an article on epigenetics and how certain traits can be passed down that aren't necessarily dictated by DNA itself, like homosexuality -which rightly should not exist if the gene doesn't get passed on to the next generation. It was interesting, and AFAIK, epigentics it's a relatively new area of genetic study.

ATM though, I'm not studying anything.

WoollyRedHat

I like it in theory, but I'd be scared of wacky scientists bringing back pterodactyls and flying over here and terrorizing our villages and all that.

But in saying that, I'd love to be able to fly a pterodactyl, much better than the bus, so **** it, yeah why not!

Artful_Badger

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

I like it in theory, but I'd be scared of wacky scientists bringing back pterodactyls and flying over here and terrorizing our villages and all that.

Farmers in the west would just poison them like they do to the eagles.

WoollyRedHat

Artful_Badger wrote: »

Farmers in the west would just poison them like they do to the eagles.

Perhaps, but most of these lads will be shooting arrows from the sky, so the farmers will probably be killed before they get to do that, unlike eagles who have no arrow shooting ability.

Mal-Adjusted

Obligatory JP lunch scene