Thinking about it... Reading and learning so I have couple of questions.

arleitiss

Hey, so I live in Dublin city center (in case that would affect possibility of being granted firearms license). I am 19. I've been doing Airsoft before, but I got bored of it. So I started looking into target shooting.
If anyone thinks why did I start looking from Airsoft into target shooting here is the list:
1) It's not shooting someone - you shoot someone in airsoft = they pretty much become your enemy or start making hate towards you.
2) Not as painful (unless of course you manage to shoot yourself into foot for being a retard (In which case you shouldn't even have license)
3) I love shooting targets, I was even loving to shoot targets with airsoft gun but it didn't feel too realistic (because it's not, after all it's just a small .20 plastic pellet).

So anyway, here are the questions:

1) What is this insurance required? is it insurance for person or what?
Do you get it like car/home insurance? or is it given/granted by club/range?

2) After spending a day reading, this is what I understood the procedure of starting to shoot is:
i. Find a club to join to (not exactly join yet, but just find and know about it?)
ii. Decide what firearm you want and where to get it. Get it's model/serial number/details.
iii. Get gunsafe at home, bolt/fix it to the solid wall.

iv. Fill out a firearms license form from Garda (specify in which club/range you are planning to shoot, specify weapon details (serial, model etc..), specify reason you need it and other parts of form.
v. Submit form and wait for it to be approved/declined.
vi. if approved: you can buy that firearm after confirmed/ gun safe is inspected maybe and apply for membership.

Is that correct?

3) Where do people buy guns in Ireland? or do they import them from abroad (which again will be imported only if you have license for it)? I mean I am sure people don't just buy guns form some black market /drug dealers somewhere in Dublin. There must be some kind of shop or so?

4) Is it true that it's easier to get licensed for a shotgun rather than for handgun/pistol? if so: Where is the logic? why?

5) What kind of weapons can you get and are allowed to use or in other words what kind of weapons can you get license for?
I've seen people shooting only shotguns mostly (not seen but heard).
Can you import and use weapons like:
Glocks (even 18 the fully auto one), M9 pistol, rifles (m4, ak 47 etc..), any benelli shotguns? mp7? and others... let's just in other words say: "Modern firearms used by police/military". Or are those banned completely from being licensed for? I am not saying I want any of them (except glock perhaps) but just to know why and what?

6) Are shells/ammo considered as firearm too? I mean if you were at range and somehow left 1 round in your pocket, then you get searched by police one day and they find it, would they consider it as firearm with you?

See the thing is, I really like the modern firearms. For example:
I have held many weapons in airsoft and since in airsoft all guns are meant to replicate the real guns as close as possible even by weight, you can kind of get a feel of holding/using specific gun without shooting, because shooting obviously is different, even though it might be silly mistake to be comparing airsoft made guns with real ones, but the weight of them is really the same in most cases because they are meant to replicate real.

I heard from one friend in states, he said benelli m4 is one of the best shotguns he has ever shot, he dropped it lots of times it never went off yet always let him down.
Glock is reliable of what I've heard AND I've held many pistols in airsoft (glocks, 1911, m9, five seven, usp and others) I have always prefered glock. Also I checked out of curiosity: Real glock 17 is around 660 grams (could be without mag though) while in airsoft glock 17 is around 750 grams (with mag), I always loved how firmly the glock grip feels.

So yes, I hope someone can help answering these
Also: is it possible to get everything done and ready to go for first-timer (get license, memberships, guns etc..) for under 900 Euros (if I either go for pistol, or some simple shotgun or so)?

Cass

Welcome to the shooting forum. I presume this is your first visit/post/thread?

arleitiss wrote: »

1) It's not shooting someone - you shoot someone in airsoft = they pretty much become your enemy or start making hate towards you.
2) Not as painful (unless of course you manage to shoot yourself into foot for being a retard (In which case you shouldn't even have license)
3) I love shooting targets, I was even loving to shoot targets with airsoft gun but it didn't feel too realistic (because it's not, after all it's just a small .20 plastic pellet).

The frst thing you need to do is understand that airsoft is airsoft. It in no way reflects anything that can be done with a real firearm. As obvious as that sounds the best you can do is forget everything you have done, and start from scratch. Even mentioning "shooting at people" on this forum will raise eyebrows. The gun laws in Ireland are very, very strict. Rightly so (to an extent). They are not toys, and a simple mistake may cause serious injury or death.

1) What is this insurance required? is it insurance for person or what?
Do you get it like car/home insurance? or is it given/granted by club/range?

If target shooting is your choice then when you join a range you automatically receive insurance through that range. However you can also get individual insurance.

2)Is that correct?

When applying for a firearm you must show a good reason. If your reason is for target practice then you must be a member of a range already. To say you want it for target shootin, but not be a member is a fraudulent application, plus t's on the FCA1 application form that you must fill out the details of the range you are a member off.

Other than that most it seems okay, but may do with a little more elaboration which can done later in the thread.

3) Where do people buy guns in Ireland? or do they import them from abroad (which again will be imported only if you have license for it)? I mean I am sure people don't just buy guns form some black market /drug dealers somewhere in Dublin. There must be some kind of shop or so?

I'm assuming your knowledge base is almost non-existent based on your "black market/drug dealer" assumption. There are numerous gun shops around the country. We even have a list of the shops which can be found by following this link. All firearms MUST be bought through a licensed, and registered firearms dealer. Part of the FCA1 is that you provide the dealer's details, RFD number, and a letter from them describing the firearm you intend to buy.

4) Is it true that it's easier to get licensed for a shotgun rather than for handgun/pistol? if so: Where is the logic? why?

Legally - no.

Realistically - Probably.

Handguns are still a "new thing", and as such they are treated as being more dangerous", and as such an application for a pistol would come under stricter scrutiny than other firearms.

5) What kind of weapons can you get and are allowed to use or in other words what kind of weapons can you get license for?

Firstly they are not weapons. Not on this forum. They are firearms. We use them for sporting purposes, and as such they are firearms.

I've seen people shooting only shotguns mostly (not seen but heard).
Can you import and use weapons like:
Glocks (even 18 the fully auto one), M9 pistol, rifles (m4, ak 47 etc..), any benelli shotguns? mp7? and others... let's just in other words say: "Modern firearms used by police/military". Or are those banned completely from being licensed for? I am not saying I want any of them (except glock perhaps) but just to know why and what?

The laws are long, and boring, but to sum it up;

• Pistols - Anything other than a .22 rimfire or air pistol cannot be licensed. So 9mm, 40cal, 45s, etc, etc are out of the picture. Will not happen.
• Rifles - Most any caliber you want. However anything semiauto in centrefire (will explain that some other time) or a ,22lr capable of holding more than 10 rounds is restricted. This does not mean you cannot get a license it merely means you must apply to the Chief Super rather than the Super for your license. It requires you show why this firearm, above other non-restricted firearms, is necessary. Design also plays a role. So anything military or Police or tactical in design may be restricted even though in another format it would not be.
• Shotguns - Anything can be licensed, but depending on the design or if it holds more than 3 shots (semi auto) is is classed as restricted, and like the rifle needs a license from the Chief Super.

6) Are shells/ammo considered as firearm too? I mean if you were at range and somehow left 1 round in your pocket, then you get searched by police one day and they find it, would they consider it as firearm with you?

When you get your firearm license you are granted an ammunition limit. This tells you, and any Garda the amount of ammunition you may have/own at any given time. So if your license states 100 rounds then you may on your person, a home, in the car, etc 100 rounds maximum. It is also worth noting that an empty or fired round/case is classed in the same manner as a live round. So if you have 51 fired, and 50 unfired you are in breach of your license conditions.

As for carrying any ammo that you do not have a license for you would/could be charged with being in possession of ammunition for which you do not hold a license. This carries a hefty fine, and/or prison time.

I heard from one friend in states, he said benelli m4 is one of the best shotguns he has ever shot, he dropped it lots of times it never went off yet always let him down.
Glock is reliable of what I've heard AND I've held many pistols in airsoft (glocks, 1911, m9, five seven, usp and others) I have always prefered glock. Also I checked out of curiosity: Real glock 17 is around 660 grams (could be without mag though) while in airsoft glock 17 is around 750 grams (with mag), I always loved how firmly the glock grip feels.

Any firearm capable of full auto is prohibited. Meaning you cannot own it. My advice to you would be, as above, forget your airsoft background, and start into this new endeavour afresh. Also do not look to America too much as their laws are non existent when compared to ours. A lot of stuff there is simply not going to happen here, or at least not as easily.

That is not a chastisation, but some friendly advice.

Also: is it possible to get everything done and ready to go for first-timer (get license, memberships, guns etc..) for under 900 Euros (if I either go for pistol, or some simple shotgun or so)?

Yes.

New or second hand. All depends on the range/club you join, the type of firearm, and the type/brand of gun you go for.

juice1304

+1^

You would pay for the insurance in the club it's 50yoyo's a year it's public liability insurance to cover an accident.
It is easier to licence a shotgun because you can't really stick a shotgun with 30" barrels down your bags and go walking around with it. You also can't own a pistol other than a .22lr with the mag restricted to only accept 5 rounds unless you had one before they changed the laws. It is possible to licence the types of firearms you like but the chances are more like winning the lotto you have to make the application to the cheif superintendent instead of the super and you need an actual reason why you need that specific "firearm" (that is what we call them they are not weapons because we don't shoot people) and the reason can't be because i like it. You would need to prove you can't shoot a target with the same caliber in an unrestricted form and they don't like to give them out, most people who have restricted firearms licences have to go to court to get them so you obviously need a real reason to argue your case with the judge. So no semi automatic centerfire, No tactical shotguns so no pistol grip stocks, no mag capacity more than 2 no barrel length less than 24" etc.... Even if you have a gun that "looks" like the type of firearms you are talking about they can deem it needs a restricted licence. They don't like anything "tactical" They also don't like pistols that look like duty pistol they have a list of target pistols that were given to them as guideline but read it as gospel.
You might find it hard licenceing a pistol as your first firearm they prefer you to get something like a shotgun first to prove yourself. You will find it hard in my opinion to get set up for 900 first years club membership will be around 400 for most places bar courtlough which might suit you being in north county dublin they cater for .22lr rifle and shotgun.
Most ranges can only cater for the same unless you want to travel to the midlands and if you are going to be shooting a bigger caliber you would want to have a MUCH larger budget also centerfire rifle ammunition is very expensive like 30 euros for 20 rounds.
So i would advise you to either get a .22lr rifle or a shotgun. you will also need to do a competency course. I think you could pick up a second hand .22 rifle and membership, safe etc.. if you were in courtlough their membership is around 200 otherwise you might need to strech the budget slightly more.
So sorry to dance on your parade but no glocks or m9's or benili m4's mp7's or ar's. also yes you need a licence for ammunition even the spent cases so if you were at a range and brought home cases you were'nt licenced to have you would be in possession of unlicenced ammunition.
And you buy guns in gun shops there are plenty of them around the country if you know where to look. there is a sticky somewhere with a list of most of them. I would forget about the airsoft completely when it comes to real firearms.
Your best bet and my advise to you would be arrange to go shooting in courtlough and see if you like it if you do well and good join and start the process if not then you have'nt spend loads on everything.:)
If you have any more questions i would be happy to answer them the best i can. I started around the same age as you a few years ago and also live in dublin, I had to go for an interview etc.. for my first licence i wanted a rife they did'nt want to give it to me and asked me to get a shotgun instead:rolleyes: i declined. It took them 9 months to sort out my licence i think they were testing me to see how annoyed i would get.:pac:

arleitiss

Oh, alright ,also for a reference: The only way I was relating to airsoft is that it uses pretty much samel look/weight guns so you can feel which you like, and you had to treat it pretty much same as real firearm in public (no displaying in public, don't leave a bag with it anywhere etc...). But yes target shooting is what I like.
But sure I heard there are Glock versions that are 22. and mags that don't hold much rounds? Would that not qualify?
Also as suggested going and seeing how it is if I even can shoot: Are most member clubs/ranges walk-in possible? I mean you don't need to go through signing up etc.. just to try and see if I like it?

P.S - As Cass said: even empty shells are treated like unfired ones. So I assume there is some place you can dispose of them at?
No wonder then that when police once checked my car and found two shotguns shells they were pretty dodgy after that, didn't know that even empty treats as full. But I guess it makes sense: He has empty shells = he must have firearm too then.

Witcher

arleitiss wrote: »

Oh, alright ,also for a reference: The only way I was relating to airsoft is that it uses pretty much samel look/weight guns so you can feel which you like, and you had to treat it pretty much same as real firearm in public (no displaying in public, don't leave a bag with it anywhere etc...). But yes target shooting is what I like.
But sure I heard there are Glock versions that are 22. and mags that don't hold much rounds? Would that not qualify?
Also as suggested going and seeing how it is if I even can shoot: Are most member clubs/ranges walk-in possible? I mean you don't need to go through signing up etc.. just to try and see if I like it?

P.S - As Cass said: even empty shells are treated like unfired ones. So I assume there is some place you can dispose of them at?
No wonder then that when police once checked my car and found two shotguns shells they were pretty dodgy after that, didn't know that even empty treats as full. But I guess it makes sense: He has empty shells = he must have firearm too then.

There are no .22 Glocks that are worth having...they're usually a converted centrefire Glock and the super might not wish to licence it. Best off getting a dedicated .22lr pistol if you want one.

If you go to a range like Courtlough in Balbriggan you can try a .22lr and a shotgun. Courtlough don't shoot pistol and I don't think any range here will allow someone to walk in and use one.

You can dispose of brass at the range.

arleitiss

Blay wrote: »

There are no .22 Glocks that are worth having...they're usually a converted centrefire Glock and the super might not wish to licence it. Best off getting a dedicated .22lr pistol if you want one.

If you go to a range like Courtlough in Balbriggan you can try a .22lr and a shotgun. Courtlough don't shoot pistol and I don't think any range here will allow someone to walk in and use one.

You can dispose of brass at the range.

Oh, nice one. So basically firearms licensing works like: You can be granted something bigger if you had good previous history and no incidents?

How much is it in Courtlough? do they have website?

IRLConor

arleitiss wrote: »

Hey, so I live in Dublin city center (in case that would affect possibility of being granted firearms license).

It shouldn't make a difference. I live in the city centre too.

To be honest, the biggest problem with living in the city is finding an apartment that had a useful wall to bolt a safe to. An awful lot of city centre places (especially newer ones) don't have many solid walls. For example, I couldn't get a safe in my previous place since the only spot I could put a safe was in the kitchen or living room.

Witcher

arleitiss wrote: »

Oh, nice one. So basically firearms licensing works like: You can be granted something bigger if you had good previous history and no incidents?

How much is it in Courtlough? do they have website?

You can get bigger calibre rifles as your first gun but with pistols it works differently. You could be the Dalai Lama but you're not getting anything bigger than .22 in a pistol.

Never been to Courtlough so I've no idea really..just Google 'Courtlough' and it should come up.

arleitiss

IRLConor wrote: »

It shouldn't make a difference. I live in the city centre too.

To be honest, the biggest problem with living in the city is finding an apartment that had a useful wall to bolt a safe to. An awful lot of city centre places (especially newer ones) don't have many solid walls. For example, I couldn't get a safe in my previous place since the only spot I could put a safe was in the kitchen or living room.

I wonder would it be good to bolt it inside of a closet, I have a closet attached to a solid wall and inside it seems like would be pretty secure/hidden place.

IRLConor

arleitiss wrote: »

I wonder would it be good to bolt it inside of a closet, I have a closet attached to a solid wall and inside it seems like would be pretty secure/hidden place.

It's not a bad idea, just make sure the safe is attached to the wall not the closet.

Having it hidden from view is a good thing and some Gardai will insist on it.

arleitiss

IRLConor wrote: »

It's not a bad idea, just make sure the safe is attached to the wall not the closet.

Having it hidden from view is a good thing and some Gardai will insist on it.

Ah yeah it's a solid concrete wall not a plaster one.

Cass

Just to be 100% clear. No pistol (cartridge one) other than a .22 rimfire can be licensed. At all. You need to have held a license for anything bigger before 2008, and as you are new to it you would be excluded.

As Blay said, forget the Glock. There are far better and more accurate pistols in .22lr for far less money that will not only work, but keep you competitive.


Gardaí usually prefer you start out smaller in terms of rifles, but there is no law to say you must. A friend of mine started out with a .308 rifle, but he was a member of a long distance range, and had a valid reason for getting it. He had no issues when it came to getting the license.

arleitiss

Pistols like what? Any specific models as you say "competative".

Witcher

Browning Buckmark, Hammerli Xesse, Ruger Mk II or MkIII, S&W 22a..there are others too

BattleCorp

If you are going for a pistol for target shooting, you will struggle to do it all for €900.

€400 approx for the first year range membership.
€500 approx for a second hand pistol that's ok for target shooting.
€100 approx for extra magazines (maybe).
€60-€200 approx for hearing protection.
€100-€200 or more for a holster, belt and mag holder.
€20 very cheap cleaning kit.
€80 firearm certificate.

All the above are estimates, but they won't be a million miles out.


Then there's nice things to have such as binoculars, a stopwatch, maybe a red dot sight, a range bag, and the euromillions to buy enough ammo to make you into a top competition shooter.




Don't forget as it's your first licence, the Gardai might want you to do a competency course too.

egan04921

here's a good video to help with picking out a .22 pistol. the guy only shoots 22 and does trick shots. well worth a look.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rQWyog_Vic